Simple Wukong buff idea.

Snowman Arc··55 votes·2,238 views

There is a very easy way to buff Wukong. Simple put his attack speed buff on his Q and his armor reduction on the primary target of his E. There. Problem solved.

Most of Wukong's laning patterns (99% of them) go E into AA into Q, then seeing how the trade goes and how the lane state is etc, you can continue on trading with an attack speed buff and an armor reduction, or back off using W mostly. In this trade, Wukong doesn't take advantage of the armor reduction until AFTER he has used all of his combo damage, which is basically useless. The only way he can actually use the armour reduction afterwards is if he keeps on fighting, which puts him in a disadvantage because the enemy will retaliate with their own combos, or if he has ultimate, which he won't for the first parts of the laning phase.

Instead, getting the armor shred as soon as he E's in means that both his AA and his Q will benefit from it, making his damage output a lot higher.

It's a simple change that will make Wukong feel so much better to play. Other side notes is that since the Q is an AA reset, the extra attack speed doesn't really do anything, so right now you probably lose a small amount of the augment, while having it AFTER you are done with your main combo makes it more rewarding to use.

52 Comments

AmetDeCrypt22 votes

sounds reasonable to me. and I hate the monkey almost as much as akali.

Hayaishi10 votes

Wukong buffs? Sure after they nerf his ridiculous burst damage so i can actually enter a teamfight and stay alive for longer than 1 sec.

TehNACHO9 votes

...they did?

Duskblade nerf. A big chunk of Wukong's damage is purely itemization.

Hibeki2 votes

440% ad on ult

'purely itemization'

[sg-lulu]

TehNACHO6 votes

20 base damage per second rank 1 110% ad per second

If you really think Wukong's Ultimate is such a massive damage threat then you just don't understand Wukong. Or math.

Hibeki2 votes

'math' yea ok dude.

Wukong has good burst. Its just he has no mobility outside of targeted offensive and has no safety precautions and no real cc. Thats the only reason hes not in this meta.

iPooUnicorns7 votes

Not a bad idea, I'd also really like to see his ulti tickrate to be lowered to .5 sec

Rezlac11 votes

This literally tilts me. People can flash out of my ult after zhonyas because "Lol tickrate"

Wukong Airlines2 votes

Actually, if you test him on the training ground, you'd see that his tickrate of the ultimate is 0.5 , you can hear the ultimate ticking 8 times.

Kaioko7 votes

I honestly would rather they give him buffs that are more utlity or tankyness focused. I get that assassin wukong is fun, but honestly it feels very cheap to be hit by an unavoidable combo that gets you insta killed once you have a couple kills while doing an invisibility engage.

LordGeovanni1 votes

Same here and I wished that they gave champions that do have this invisiblity engage A much higher cooldown window on their other abilites. Shaco Talon Kaisa Akali and even though she isnt played like the others Vayne. I think that wu Kong's W and spells are balanced nice (outside of 40% cdr) if he building like a real bruiser with ad and some defense. because the damage portion of his W is often a throw away damage and never hits

big boi edri6 votes

I’ve always wondered why it was setup in such a backwards fashion. Good idea though.

hhaavviikk2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Härd Stuck,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6WmVgaEV,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-03-21T15:52:24.449+0000)

I’ve always wondered why it was setup in such a backwards fashion. Good idea though.

it makes sense in a way,

you jump on them with E then bash em with Q and now got increased attack speed to take advantage of the fact that they got less armor by attacking them quickly before the armor debuff disapears

LordGeovanni2 votes

Its because its to give enemies a chance when he engages allow him to keep his Armor pen up but not the same with his auto attack and so that that combo that op is talking about can come around on the second round of his abilites not the first. but all of this was balanced in a season with less damage and stronger defenses cdr and penetration wasnt as strong either.

Rhai1 votes

Made sense back in season 2 and 3 when he was played as more of an aggro bruiser than a full on caster

Trias0001 votes

Maybe it's to make players think how to set up the most efficient combo, instead of just smashing buttons.

UnoGetGoldELO4 votes

dont buff the fucking monkey , he is hell incarnate as he is well played.

CrazyFrogEye3 votes

I dont really play him, but that seems like a great idea to give him a small buff without making him too insanely broken. One of those champions you dont really see a lot.

I approve [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Karn Bishop3 votes

They literally just buffed him this patch how about we see how that goes before demanding more buffs?

big boi edri6 votes

That wasn’t a buff though, it was compensation for Duskblade nerfs.

Karn Bishop3 votes

https://youtu.be/IhH-f5FMoPM?t=27m29s

You are vastly underestimating those changes.

big boi edri3 votes

Mmmmm, the fact that he said “I think Wukong should see pro play in 8.6” tells me he doesn’t really know what he’s talking about. You can say whatever you want abou “OMg he’s challenger” or w/e he is, but he clearly doesn’t understand Wukong’s issues and why he will never see pro play or consistent success in higher elo.

The DB nerf loses around 100 or so damage, the Q buff gives him back just under that loss. Combined with te base AD buff he’s coming out pretty close to what he would’ve got pre DB/Wu changes.

You won’t max Q first, you won’t build Trinity/Strraks or something because of he base AD changes, and his real issues won’t disappear.

It’s not a buff.

Sun Wu Ryuumoku4 votes

"an exeptionnal powerful midlaner" "53%winrate" (intentionnaly not mention the 0.38%pickrate)

Karn Bishop1 votes

Pick rate does not indicate power so why should he mention it? many people pick leesin despite his win ratio yet if we went by your logic leesin should have a very high win ratio.

big boi edri2 votes

He mentioned the pick rate bc Wukong mid is a cheese pick. Its reflected in the pick rate.

notice me Sin pi3 votes

TL;DR: more play rate = more non-mains dragging down champ win rates

it's the other way around. Lee sin's win rate is low BECAUSE many people pick him; not all of the lee sin players you see in your games are actual lee sin mains, so that's expected. On the other side no one except for Wukong mains ever actually play wukong so he appears to have no issue on surface if win rate is the only thing looked at.

LordGeovanni2 votes

If pick rate does not indicate power neither does winrate because those 2 stats only matter within relation to each other and neither matter on the pro scene (out side of pro only stats) only average matchmaking

Karn Bishop1 votes

I genuinely don't understand how you can say with a straight face that this is not a buff! a .8 increase in scaling ad growth might sound small to you but its not at all and will actually make Q even stronger in addition to the buff Q is also getting to its total ratio, this also impacts the damage on wukongs R as well.

I also don't understand why you think its impossible that wukong could shift to mid laner in a patch after all Wukong was often used in the mid lane in the past before a few nerfs that made it impossible.

Seriously champions have become pick and ban for ratio changes much smaller then the ones wukong will be receiving and unlike most duskblade users wukong does actually have other items he could build, this is 100% a buff to wukong as a champion and the stats will show that once the patch has been live for a while.

Sun Wu Ryuumoku1 votes

I also don't understand why you think its impossible that wukong could shift to mid laner in a patch after all Wukong was often used in the mid lane in the past before a few nerfs that made it impossible.

Cause u don't understand how lane work (mainly midlane). Wukong issue isn't his itemization, its his kit.

ChaddyFantome2 votes

Seems reasonable enough a change for the chimp.

Whatevsman972 votes

I can get behind this.

SpecterVonBaren2 votes

Except this might just cause his lanning pattern to become too strong and then result in nerfs.

Bârd2 votes

That's alright as a band-aid, but he still needs a larger rework.

Fear the Kayn2 votes

If they buff him, they need to reduce the power of Assassin wukong. It's cheap and toxic to play against.

Acheron161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Fear the Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6WmVgaEV,comment-id=0013,timestamp=2018-03-22T15:27:16.847+0000)

If they buff him, they need to reduce the power of Assassin wukong. It's cheap and toxic to play against.

Wukong is so weak that building assassin is his best item path.

Fear the Kayn1 votes

Yes, I'm saying buff him to make him a proper bruiser again, but make his Assassin build unviable somehow.

Acheron161 votes

Wont happen, since that kind of power comes from items.

He really doesn't synergize with classic bruiser tiems outside of Triforce and leveling his Q only gave a larger armor debuff and base damage until very recently.

ValiantKiller1 votes

{quoted}

Wont happen, since that kind of power comes from items.

He really doesn't synergize with classic bruiser tiems outside of Triforce and leveling his Q only gave a larger armor debuff and base damage until very recently.

^ Got to agree, his kit doesn't work well with hp items or defensive items his clone work perfectly with assassin item include duskblade. He got no shield like other bruiser to use that sweet hp increase and mostly black cleaver is better to him than trinity special against tanky champs

Votable Jester1 votes

I think it's a little more interesting to have the shred on Q instead of E though. That way he's rewarded more if he manages to Q someone before Eing them (for instance by hiding in a bush).

Hawthorn Tree1 votes

Actually, though, the attack speed on E makes his auto Q much smoother for me...personally, when I try to auto Q without E's buff, I miss the first auto like 50% of the time. Probably just that I'm way too impatient, but hey...

Snowman Arc1 votes

It's not that big of a attack speed boost to make much of a difference in the early levels, so you are probably impatient. I get that sometimes with Jax when i Q-AA-W, sometimes I miss the AA, but that's because I don't play a lot of Jax lately so I don't know the exact timing. In the meanwhile, I play a lot of Sivir and I do her AA-W combo flawlessly in every stage, with or without attack speed, and even under pressure (like in big teamfights).

LordGeovanni1 votes

should be q e auto q. Id like to see a change to how his w clone acts and applies damage. YOur change either: breaks him because his attack speed is perma buffed. Breaks him because his dash is almost always up Or gimps him because his Q has to get more cooldown to make up for that attack speed buff being on it now or gimps him because his E is on a decently long cooldown so he cant keep up the armor pen or it breaks him because you increase the duration of the armor pen so he can apply it run and let adcs benifit from the penetration with out him having to be in danger to constantly apply it.

Trias0001 votes

[{quoted}](name=Snowman Arc,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=6WmVgaEV,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-03-21T14:14:56.295+0000)

The only way he can actually use the armour reduction afterwards is if he keeps on fighting, which puts him in a disadvantage because the enemy will retaliate with their own combos

And God forbid we'd want any counterplay, right?

Snowman Arc1 votes

I'm not talking about counterplay, but it just seems weird to have armor reduction AFTER you used your damage combo. Keeping on trading after your combo, even with the armor reduction applied will result in a lost trade and no player likes that. Counterplay is always there, you can attempt to fight Wukong after he went all in, and give back a lot of damage, but right now his main combo doesn't deal a lot anyway. If I play top, I usually pick Maokai, so I just try to survive early till I get some armor on my first back and then I'm safe. Even at early levels, his mana costs for his e-q-w are high enough to the point that I can take 2 of his combos and still have half hp, while he's out of mana.

Denims Wrath6661 votes

ok so the e does armor reduction, q is attack speed... and honestly... i think w should be free. i almost think they should increase its effectiveness, but just making it free would help wu out so much. he literally starves for mana if he does his combo two or three times.

Hügö1 votes

This will just lead to a permanent E AA Q W which isn't very interactive as an enemy.

big boi edri1 votes

That's basically the only way he trades now as is. Hitting Q first occurs in like 1/100 scenarios.

Hügö1 votes

The thing is when his armor pen is on his q he has a reason to do more then that, but when the armor pen is on his E he can just Q and W away. I don't say he isn't already doing E Q W, but with that change there is no reason to do more.

Devilreaper XIII1 votes

and in the meanhwile buff him by lowering his abilities ad and his base attack speed!

Master Noct1 votes

I dislike this fucker, but it's actually fair. what do you know.

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