Tank update didn't address their feast/famine nature

Big Lincoln··21 votes·1,214 views

it's been this way for a while now that tanks have to get fed to enjoy high durability in the mid game, and also make a big impact with said lead before the carries start coming online. They're weak early, they all do well mid game, and then they drop off late. This makes for a power curve that frustrates tanks because they don't like not feeling tanky late game, and ADCs hate that tanks jump in their face and stat-check them to death before they have the items to even think about beating them.

The tank update didn't really address this problem, and IMO the Sunfire nerf has only made it a lot worse, because that was an item a lot of tanks relied on for softening their mana costs while pushing or just helping them push faster (Shen), and also providing a little bit of extra damage if they needed to fight. Now, a lot of tanks are rushing a mana component so that they don't OOM while shoving, which makes them a lot weaker on first back than a Bami's would be. In addition the health loss in items has not been made up for with the gain in resists, so tanks are just squishier at every stage of the game, which compounds if they're not ahead of their opponents.

Now, of course, this is a little too soon, because Riot's planning to buff the tanks that are struggling directly to make up for Sunfire joining Ohmwrecker in the trash bin, but that still kinda leaves us with the same issue we started off with; tank items give a too-high power spike early and drop off too hard late, as well as being too strong when ahead and not good enough when behind.

23 Comments

Ralanr3 votes

Though it does feel like they considerably cut the early power spike.

Big Lincoln2 votes

yeah I've just been getting hybrid items on my tanks first because the HP+damage is really nice and gives me a better opportunity to trade/fight for my lane than Sunfire does now

Ralanr2 votes

I'm pretty much going to make Steraks core on Sion now. Hell I might even take up grabbing IBG over FH again (the AS slow is often very useful).

kasfas2 votes

I rush one of 4 items now. Frozen heart, dead mans, spirit visage or steraks. Every other item is trash in lane phase. "Campfire bib" is just so shit that it might as well not exist anymore.

Ralanr3 votes

I gotta rush a health item in lane first usually. Sion's base is so low that I feel uncomfortable getting just armor.

kasfas3 votes

So do I, but I also need mana pretty badly

Spoofghoul1 votes

Why? you don't need much mana on sion at all And you can grab dorans ring or corrupting pot

Personally my current build looks like this Fervor 35 scaling ad 27 scaling resists

and then i grab item 3047 item 3748 item 3071 item 3812 item 3065 item 3083

You can get like 400 ad that way and just nuke people while running around with tons of hp and decent resists due to DD as well as strong sustain

oSEXYPLATYPUSo2 votes

yet people called me stupid cuz i said the reworks were failure up to this point.

Ralanr1 votes

To be fair, you're asking to do a bunch of damage on Maokai when he's got enough damage to help him early and mid.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo2 votes

that was just a rant... his rework is trash... we all know it and the only form of damage he has E people are crying over and already getting nerfed

Ralanr1 votes

His E isn't broken at all imo. It follows similar counterplay to Teemo and Shaco boxes. Aka: Don't facecheck bushes.

I prefer the avoidable %health damage E over the unavoidable %healtg damage W.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

yet it has nerfs on PBE and every one is banning him now cuz of it cuz people are playing him full ap support and no one knows how to deal with it

Ralanr1 votes

Maokai: the muscle wizard!

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

i mean dont get me wrong i still play him like 85% of the time. and i played him in every role but adc... i dont like the rework...

his auto for his passive is clunky it use to be one of the fastest autos /auto resets in the game. his W damage is trash... the root duration sucks at lvl 1 its 1sec and and max rank its 2 but only goes up to 1.1 at level 2... so there is no point in maxing it. his ult is still to slow, its cool down is way to long.

and even after the rework his over all win rate still sits at 46% with the only role he has a + 50% win rate is ap support.

here are what i would do to render what i find wrong about him :

change the auto attack for his passive back give him slightly higher base ad and attack speed so he can farm early and have decent early trades with autos slightly increase the duration of root on W where it is worth putting points into like lets say scaling from 1 sec to 2.5 at max currently its 1.0 second to 1.4 seconds only going up by .1 per rank i dont like the 13 sec cd with it that scales 13 -12-11-10-9 but if they gave the duration longer and better scaling ill deal with it make his ult have a better travel speed and lower the cd on it about 15 seconds on all ranks his current cd on ult is 120-110-100 so reduce by 15 seconds at all rank to 105-95-85 seconds

as you see im not asking for any more damage on any ability just let him do what they are trying to design him to do...

Skias1 votes

{quoted}

To be fair, you're asking to do a bunch of damage on Maokai when he's got enough damage to help him early and mid.

Personally, I like him the way he is. He feels pretty good at the moment, maybe some small tweaks. I like his rework the most of the 3.

Meep Man2 votes

I like how people are talking about Tanks being frast or famine, yet Sunfire's jncreased damage to minions and monsters gives you the gold you need to buy items. What should be done is Sunfire Cape should be a hell of a lot cheaper, like 2300 or so gold instead of the current 2800 gold.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

well i would agree if they lower the cost of it then ok... but at its current cost its to pricey to invest into when there are better items now

Ralanr13 votes

Or just increase the radius range.

Theorchero1 votes

{quoted}

Or just increase the radius range.

No. It's not meant for dueling champions and increasing the radius makes it do too much damage in fights without appropriate risk.

Ralanr1 votes

Its damage is shit against champions now. Especially with the increase in MR. It wouldn't help with duels that much.

Big Lincoln8 votes

iirc the radius was nerfed which makes it hard for some tanks with particularly big hitboxes (or impossible, for chogath etc) to actually use it

Nymzo1 votes

That will never solve itself for one good reason: items.

If they need multiple items to be a tank, then the feat or famine will never fix itself.

FireDrizzle1 votes

Everything in league is feast or famine, the tanks with lots of cc are not (relatively) very feast or famine.

I knew the reduced hp on armour items was a nerf, like even with a nerfed black cleaver, if a bruiser with built in armour shred and BC attacks you, you have no armour.

Everyone keeps saying "tanks should do no damage" but then you have champs with lots of damage and cc. Tanks without damage work, but not in a solo lane AlistarBraum Leona. And to jungle you need damage for the camps. Like if a tank is doing no damage he needs a massive amout of utility.

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