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Remove Ravenous Hydra, for better Deathes Dance and Warrior

Nhifu··5 votes·4,305 views

item 3074 Offers no real benefit other than a 3500 gold dump and basic amount of lifesteal item 3812 Costs way too much for an item that makes so many champions Viable

Death's Dance current stats +80 attack damage +10% cooldown reduction +15% healing 30% damage taken as bleed

New Death's Dance recipe proposal Tiamat (1200) + Life Sceptor (900) + Long sword (350) + Combination +450 Final cost 2900 +60 AD +15% healing 30% damage taken as bleed With Tiamat activation.

Same can be applied for Warriors enchant, which is very needed for certain Junglers that get popped too easily in fights that play against Tank/Engage comps.

Overall this puts these champions back into the Meta while having no cooldown bonus still provides a window for a weaker power spike as a trade off for being able to survive and duel in lane.

Exclusive first buyers that need it Riven Fiora Tryndamere , Other duelists that don't scale off of health Extra Survivability from Warriors XinZhao Graves JarvanIV Kayn Khazix MasterYi RengarShaco

14 Comments

Beatrice falls4 votes

Doesn't it mean it would also become melee ? You showed Graves too

HaIlMonitor4 votes

Yeah but does anyone care about graves?

Frosted Tips2 votes

Riven would not first item this. She needs CDR first.

Nhifu1 votes

{quoted}

Riven would not first item this. She needs CDR first.

Many players opt nowadays to go TIamat, just to shove the wave for more gold income than it would be from rushing say BC/Ghostblade Then they would buy deathes dance to prevent being popped in teamfights so fast, this in junction with GA. 70% winrate on OP.GG is BC / DD / GA

This also gives an option for rivens to run Sorc sub for the 10% cooldown, and you don't need cooldown when you're already BLOWING UP WAVES and laughing at the other top laner barely keeping up.

Frosted Tips1 votes

Yeah tiamat into DD for CDR and survival and CD boots for CDR she needs early CDR she would never buy that item fully until she had at least 30% CDR

Unlimited Chill2 votes

item 3074 offers wave clear to champions that don't otherwise have it and healing at the same time. The AoE that is provided also applies %50 to lifesteal. It doesn't need to be combined with the deaths dance passive. Even getting rid of the passive AoE on it wouldn't be enough for the damage conversion and tiamat active.

I don't seem to understand what you propose for warrior though. Make it build out of tiamat or have lifesteal?

Tiamat would make it impossible to be built on champs like Kindred and Graves

Giving it lifesteal would make any jungler that went warrior be broken. Each champ you put up there under jungle has no problem surviving in the jg and most of them have self healing. Also the jungle items already give sustain on them.

Nhifu1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Unlimited Chill,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=5hHnLiRn,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-09-15T02:54:44.389+0000)

item 3074 offers wave clear to champions that don't otherwise have it and healing at the same time. The AoE that is provided also applies %50 to lifesteal. It doesn't need to be combined with the deaths dance passive. Even getting rid of the passive AoE on it wouldn't be enough for the damage conversion and tiamat active.

I don't seem to understand what you propose for warrior though. Make it build out of tiamat or have lifesteal?

Tiamat would make it impossible to be built on champs like Kindred and Graves

Giving it lifesteal would make any jungler that went warrior be broken. Each champ you put up there under jungle has no problem surviving in the jg and most of them have self healing. Also the jungle items already give sustain on them.

Ravenous Hydra is highly NOT recommended to be purchased, even on champions that it would be good with. Most champions that buy tiamat in the first place are Jax and such. But they will never complete it.

Meta build currently - item 3077 item 3078 item 3053 and finally item 3748

Essentially what I'm saying is most people that do buy Tiamat, will just use it to shove wave and do a fast recall. Then buy their normal core item. (Meaning the initial 1200 gold investment gives much more gold to these champions, than rushing Triforce first essentially giving them more gold at the end of the day)

Graves Even harder to kill Riven The item is relatively cheap (2900), if the player wants cooldown and goes BC or Ghostblade she gets popped instantly by the jungler, leaving top as a very easy tower first blood from 1 flash play. Many Riven players will grab Death's Dance second or third, simply beause of how much durability it gives AFTER buying BC or before, But then she's behind in terms of shoving the lane for teleport plays, or will struggle to SHOVE lane fast enough for a recall in the first place (enemy laner with tiamat will clear wave and chunk your tower with the jungler himself)

Unlimited Chill1 votes

Agreed completely that item 3074 isn't very good and on Jax it is definitely better to go item 3748 . I just don't know if you get item 3053 before item 3748 though because the auto reset is so valuable on him so I don't even think he would build this version of item 3812

The build would have to change item 3077 item 1053 item 3133 and some gold but then you would have 75 AD on the items to combine into an item with 60 AD.

Idk what the point about Graves is to be honest.

The point about riven though is weird. If you are worried about getting popped then your gold should be spent on item 3047 item 3155 or get both health and CD reduction with item 3067. That final point is kinda redundant because you said that Riven without item 3077 wouldn't have waveclear like a champ with item 3077 and that is obvious.

Ravenous overall does need a change although what it could be

Seer of Mind1 votes

Titanic is being built more often because of the 3-second-fight meta, since the active scales off hp, and it gives more hp, its pretty nice. Whereas Ravenous isn't being built as often because of only having lifesteal.

I still build ravenous over titanic though, Camille

Infernape1 votes

To be fair, Tiamat did use to work on ranged champions. It wasn't always melee only.

Warlord Rhinark1 votes

I'd change the stats a little bit.

Ravenous Hydra.

Cost: 3000 gold.

AD: +60.

Base Health Regeneration: +100%.

UNIQUE PASSIVE: Instantly heal for 15% of all physical damage dealt. Area of effect physical damage only heals 5% for every unit affected.

UNIQUE PASSIVE: Stores 30% of all physical and magic damage received, and is taken as damage over time true damage instead, dealing one-third of the stored damage every second.

UNIQUE PASSIVE – CLEAVE: Basic attacks deal (20% to 60% AD) physical damage to units around your target – (20% AD near the edge) (350 units radius). Life steal applies to 50% of CLEAVE's splash physical damage.

UNIQUE ACTIVE – CRESCENT: Deals (60% to 100% AD) physical damage to units around you – (60% AD near the edge) (400 units radius) (10 second cooldown). Life steal applies to 50% of CRESCENT'S splash physical damage.

Builds out of: item 3077 + item 1036 + item 1037 + 550 gold.

Basically, the only thing I did was let the item keep the +100% Base Health Regeneration, but it now costs 100 more gold.

Lauchmelder1 votes

Only if it changes to melee only. Don't need an unkillable Draven meta again.

0 Hogapu1 votes

nerf the 30% dmg reduction please it is what makes graves so broken, as well as many bruisers.

Bhagswag1 votes

Absolutely not. Leave Hydra alone.

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