Boards›Gameplay

How weak is Support really?

Eedat··8 votes·1,373 views

I'm curious how much of this issue is supports being weak and how much of it is people perceiving supports to be weak.

It's no secret. Look at any other game or MMO. People hate playing supportive roles. There are always far fewer healers than there are DPS. Despite this, healers and other supportive roles are immensely powerful. EVERYONE loves a good healer, but few want to be the healer.

This same philosophy transfers over into League. How weak is support really? How much of it is that people just want to be carries? Everyone wants "MUH DEEPS" and make "LC$BIGPLAYZ". Is that really the only way to play the game correctly? Why is this the only way people perceive as "carrying"?

Let me present a hypothetical situation. What would happen Aphromoo was dropped into your average game? Would he be "weak"? Would you call him worthless? Would you doubt his ability to carry a game? Hell no. I don't think there is anyone here that would question Aphromoo's ability to climb out of low ELO as support only. So honestly there has to be something here.

For example, its no surprise that champions like Janna and the summoner summoner 3 can completely nullify the even the most fed of enemies. Sure, they might not be the ones that actually kill them, but they're the ones who pacify them and allow them to be easily dealt with. People still will not perceive this as "carrying" though. We perceive whoever killed the enemy as the one carrying, even though they would be dead if it wasnt for the support. So who is carrying who?

We further perpetuate this line of thinking by actually calling damage dealers "carries". Why does nobody admit tanks and supports can carry? Honestly, it's quite far from the truth. ADC mains know that a good support can carry a lane. Why are the damage dealers the "carries" and not the ones that allow them to do the damage?

There is also an extremely potent aspect of the game that we are neglecting here. VISION. Supports have more impact in this crucial element that doesnt get the recognition that it deserves. My theory on this is we only see what happens, but we don't see what could have happened. How many times a game do you avoid a bad situation because of vision? How many picks are made and avoided? How many objectives secured and bad situations prevented? We pay no mind to things like this and only focus on what did happen.

So is support really weak? Or just viewed as weak? Honestly I think supports are much stronger than we give them credit. Sure, they may not conventionally "carry", but there are many, many ways to play League and going 10/0 in lane is only a single strategy for victory.

Maybe there is room for improvement, sure. Maybe they could use a little love. However, I refuse to acknowledge support as the helpless or useless role many try to make it out to be.

15 Comments

Aptest5 votes

Support role is not "weak" in the sense that it lacks impact.

it is weak in the sense that its impact is gated by your team mates.

since everything you do is gated though your team, you are unable to make independent actions.

this means support has limited agency, or limited means of making decision for the enemy team.

Penns4 votes

Supports arent weak at all and I dont perceive them to be weak. I perceive them to be boring and team reliant so I dont play them lol.

Teridax683 votes

I think the issue isn't that support is weak or even really perceived as weak, it's that the support role is often perceived as much less enjoyable than the others, and with good reason. Supports play with less gold and experience than other roles, are required more than any other role to build several mandatory items, none of which provide amazing personal strength, and some of which are quite boring (namely Sightstone), and are much more constrained relative to other roles with what they can or can't do: they can't cs properly, many are asked not to roam or stay too far from their teammates, but they're also required to go alone and ward/counter-ward for the rest of their team. On top of that, supports rarely get in-game acknowledgment for their achievements, even as kill-focused roles get kill streak announcements. All of these factors combine to make supporting feel like a chore, and the support feel like they have to sacrifice their own personal enjoyment and glory for the sake of their team.

You're right that the support role is almost always the least popular in any team game. Most people want to be independent and deal all the damage in fights, which is why they often go for the roles with the most kill potential; however, that should be an excuse to give supports all of the privileges. Imagine a game where the support had priority on gold and experience, the most free and engaging itemization, and enough authority for the team to follow them wherever they go, plus in-game recognition whenever they make a great save or assist: the support role would still likely be minoritary, but it would be so much more popular, even to support non-mains, because supporting would be tons more enjoyable, and supports would feel like leaders, not servants. Instead, we're in a situation where the least popular role in gaming is also being made explicitly less fun than other classes by being saddled with the most restrictions, which is why so many people are dodging matches sooner than accepting being filled into support. Effectively, the way supports have been treated has been pretty backwards this whole time, and as long as that continues, League will still have a drought of supports, and autofill will still encounter large role imbalance-related issues.

Hinagiku332 votes

This sums it up well. Support isn't weak at all, it's just god-awful to play.

The team's Jungle has to buy a special jungle item just to play the role effectively, otherwise they get terrible experience for clearing camps. These are seriously overloaded items but they kinda need to be in order to work, especially if the Jungle has to keep them around all game. At least there is some variety so the Jungle can start with one of two parts, then combine them into one of three items each with special active abilities. On top of that, for being stuck with this mandatory item is the Jungle gets the ability to pick a nifty enchantment to boost the item with good combat stats and passive abilities.

The team's Support is not nearly so lucky. They are required to pick a gold-income item to lane with, otherwise they get basically no gold at all. These items are also pretty overloaded, but while jungle items are geared towards helping fight neutral monster camps the Support isn't expected to fight anything or CS at all. This means the items do almost nothing to help do the Support's job better - just reward them with a little gold here and there for doing their thing and maybe have % Mana Regen to stay in lane. On top of that, the Support has to pay to upgrade the item twice to get the full gold-income benefit. But then on top of that, the Support also has to buy a Sightstone item to provide vision for the team. And Sightstone has iffy stats and no in-combat abilities so the Support only ever gets to use their base kit, while Jungle gets to turn their Smite into an extra spell on champions. Sightstone and Gold items can at least combine into the new Eye items so they don't take up two item slots, but that's still a huge set-back in terms of gold and there is no real option to change the path you started with the way a Jungle can combine any tier 2 jungle item with any enchantment.

All of this makes Support feel like most of your resources are spoken for and the things you are forced to buy don't actually feel that helpful due to low stats and actives that don't help with combat...something the Support is required to do. Other Support items actually feel pretty good, the problem is that we can't start getting them until ~15 minutes into the game.

I think Supports should have access to combat stats since team fights are a core part of the game and Support is required to participate in them (unless you want to make split-push Support a thing Riot). Their lane items should be more like the jungle items where the Support can buy an enchantment that provides good combat stats like Warrior or Bloodrazor or possibly acts like a mini-version of another item like Cinderhulk and Runic Echoes. Vision items also need to be more dynamic - less like the current Sightstone and more like the old Wriggle's Lantern that is a nice item that also can dispense a Ward periodically.

And would it kill you to let Supports have Wards that restock on a timer instead of forcing them to go back to the shop?

Teridax681 votes

I agree with this, and I think there are a lot of potential answers to this that have been suggested on Boards several times before. Removing Sightstone at this point in time, for example, would take out a large chunk out of supports' mandatory builds without actually putting them at a real disadvantage: since stealth wards aren't purchasable anymore, supports cannot be forced to stock up on anything more than a single Control Ward everyone else can buy, which means they can put their gold into a greater breadth of choice items. If vision ends up too weak overall, that would imply trinkets aren't strong enough for teams to cover themselves without the support relying on Sightstone, an issue that could be solved with trinket buffs.

I also agree that supports should get better access to personal stats, including maybe AP, but I think they probably also deserve another, purely utility-focused stat, one that would boost the strength of their own kit without necessarily leading to more damage (which then avoids conflict with mages). There's already a heal/shield-enhancing passive on a few items, but turning that into a proper, all-encompassing stat would allow supports to shine through more than just their defensive abilities and item actives, the latter of which inevitably end up homogenizing them somewhat come late game.

PrinceOfStorms2 votes

The reason why I tend to dislike playing support at least is because it feels like I have to babysit the ADC while on a starved gold budget. While the gold income items helped, it's nowhere near enough (as if they're good enough to give the support income comparable to at least the jungler, or at best a solo laner it becomes OP on a solo laner) to feel like you're contributing.

If you are behind it's even worse, because you feel like a complete wet noodle that can't make plays.

The other reason is if I pick support as my secondary role I will always get it.

Dracocrash1 votes

Honestly, in theory, you just have to be better than the enemy support to climb as a support.

Tactical Poro1 votes

Brand Weak you say?

thecowley2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tactical Poro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4htkBX8W,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2016-12-04T09:23:42.344+0000)

Brand Weak you say?

Ive always seen him end up carrying teams more then supporting. Its time to admit that APC will soon come into meta. Spearheaded by that man.

Kneelbeforezoth1 votes
  1. riot just wanted to piss people for with this bullshit autofill shit cause i que for support when i wanna try hard and do nothing really i play Nami Sona Soraka TahmKench Annie Urgot Thresh all the time however even when i que for support i get it 60% of the time then my support bitches cause he didnt que for support
Sckullzz1 votes

I used to support a ton, but I quit because I got tired of, "gg supp doesn't ward". Very much for the reasons mentioned above about carries, they only praise what is seen, not what was or could have been. I would keep the area warded for the first whole 10 minutes, but then I roam to help mid get a kill, and my wards go out, bot gets ganked before I can get back, and then I get flamed for "never warding". I really think it would help if everyone viewed vision like the pros do: EVERYONE does it. Before wards stopped being a buy-able item, it was common to see the adc with a ward or two in their inventory at pro level.

Also, what does a support do if their adc is just new and doesn't know how to adc yet? If you try to take farm or kills for gold for strong items, you're a "bad support". If you try to help your adc farm and don't get any extra gold income and fall further behind, it's "bot lane bad gg". If you try to roam to other lanes and get other lanes fed, you're "abandoning adc" which cycles back into being a bad support.

Or at least that's why I stopped. Now I'm so out-of-habit I probably am super rusty lol

GULAG 4 U1 votes

I like playing support champions. Not playing the role.

Umio1 votes

I love playing support because I am great at keeping people alive - however, most of the time, they are to dumb to 1.counter build to sustain themselves, 2. actually attack back when they are being defended,healed,peeled.

I often struggle in ranked between playing support or mid/adc because for some reason, people in ranked think BOT is AttackSpeedCarry instead of attackDamagecarry.

Honestly, you can tell who are strong adc based on if they build AD first or attack speed. If they start attack speed I roam.

TeCoolMage1 votes

yeah we should all play talon and rengar bot.

Umio1 votes

Supports do not need sighstone. I play adc and prefer they do not build it. If support and ADC both keep control wards, you can easily keep your lane warded without that huge investment in gold - I would prefer they invest in items that will keep them alive: to keep me alive. perm vision is much more valuable than temp - additionally your support can stay with you which is what you REALLY need to own your lane.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by Eedat

I'm not "triggered" by you throwing insults.
Player Behavior361 comments
548
votes
This new system REALLY isnt friendly to older players.....
Gameplay220 comments
495
votes
Official petition to restore Thornmail, Randuin's, and Frozen Heart
Gameplay164 comments
336
votes
PSA: Do NOT buy lootboxes with RP
Gameplay60 comments
317
votes
DynamicQ =/= Champ Select
Gameplay86 comments
231
votes
Can we get a redo on Victorious Maokai?
Story, Art, & Sound232 comments
214
votes