garen with black cleaver = fun time for everyone.

he can just walk away then.

not really, squishy as balls sounds about right tho

But just because you do good on him doesn't necessarily make him a good champ in soloQ. I think honestly there are easier champs. Like 99% of champs with point to click gapclosers because they can actually attempt to not get kited more.

But it's just an opinion. I find him to be worthless 99% of the time and that there are easier champions like Cho Gath or Malphite. Who deal actual damage and have more reliable+stronger CC while being about as tanky as Garen. (Cho W is hard to miss) And also are 100x better in teamfights and harass you can't really walk away from. Just like it's your opinion that he is fine in soloQ and that he is easy. I think he is a bit harder than people give him credit for. Especially against Thresh, Janna, Soraka, Alistar, Lulu, Kalista, and Exhaust that can press their spells towards you. I find champions who can get to the enemy much easier.

Wow no wonder you can't beat him.

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4hMMsPJR,comment-id=0010000000000001,timestamp=2015-06-21T12:11:43.618+0000)

actually i have destroyed every hec ive seen in top lane so far. maybe they werent that good. but im also running ignite top lane, when tp seens to be the standart these days. means i usually have more kill potential than my opponent. plus, i usually rush randuins against a hecarim matchup.

the hardest counter ive seen so far is trundle. he steals your ad, he steals your resistances and health, he deals more damage in longer trades and can prevent you from hit and run trades with his pillar.

I was careful to phrase it as him winning trains due to better sustain during fights. Not Hecarim countering Garen in any way.

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but the immobile mages get to build zhonyas while riven has no item that can help survive garen without being useless. its w.e

Then stop first pick Riven. It's called counterpick. You want to beat Garen? Pick Darius, Trundle, Swain (post 6), Nasus (buy armor fast and farm whole game) etc. Riven main cry about one champion stomping them. hurr durr

btw - Garen is champ that if he won't win top he IS useless. Riven is champ that as soon as she get kill she start snowball.

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Actually, the way you play the Riven match up is just wait for her to go onto you. And then you silence. And then you spin. You can actually only q aggressively if you're ahead and you feel as though riven can't kill you.

she will usually not directly engage on you. just hit you with stun/auto attack then retreat over and over and over, while shes csing. if you then get aggressive shes just gonna e out of range the moment your q hits. there is a short window of decisive strikes animation, where she can activate e for the shield to get out of range, absorb the damage and put your q on cooldown.

you need randuins to pin her at least somewhat down with a slow to beat her.

yea, a riven thats not played very well wil get absolutely get shit on. but if both players are competent, riven vs. garen comes down to a skill matchup. theyre both on equal ground. at least early on.

His W does not speed him up enough to escape Garen's Q from a** short range**, and the second Garen Q's and does his combo Teemo is deleted.

Teemo never fights fair. So don't expect the imaginary match up to be.

I guess you ignored the fact that garen is still getting poked down to shit and wouldn't want to engage anyway because he would have already been too low