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@Meddler, I really think we should get a new ''SpellBlade Item'' with Crit Chance on it.

Sahn Uzal·Oct 30, 2016·25 votes·1,488 views

To fill the hole Trinity Force left when it got changed.

I've asked this before, when the Trinity Force changes just hit live. To which Meddler responded, saying the champions who wanted to Transfer Trinity Force into a Crit build is probably a too niche group to make it worth the cost. At that time, and were the only champions relying on it, and being occasional users, they had other options. Now with the Kog'Maw Revert, I think this should be reconsidered.

Both Kog'Maw and Corki are in a pretty bad state. Old Trinity Force used to be a good setup for their itemisation, they could rush it, and get an IE or Phantom Dancer second. (Kog'Maw would probably get a Runaans Hurricane now though) It basically takes these champions an entire item longer for the Crit they're building to pay off.

Do you want to know why Gangplank players started building Youmuus Ghostblade Second instead of Infinity Edge? Not because Ghostblade is broken, or because he does such a great job at abusing the stats. (Gangplank doesn't care nearly as much as the attack speed as Lucian does for example) He gets a Youmuus Ghostblade second because he'll be getting his second item around Level 13. Level 13 is Gangplanks power spike, because that's when he has both Powder Keg and Parrrley maxed out. This is the point where Gangplank wants to start grouping, and make use of the power that he has been farming for. Can you guess where the issue is? Imagine Gangplank building an IE second item. He'd be paying 3600 gold for 70 AD, and 20% Crit chance. Which is COMPLETELY ureliable.

With the old Trinity Force, these champions would have a 2 item build looking like this:

- - Giving him 40% Crit chance, which is reliable enough - http://leaguecraft.com/images/icons/items/item_89.jpg / - Giving him 40% Crit chance, which is reliable enough, or a Bork Second, but that item is shit now. - - Giving him 40% Crit chance, which is reliable enough

So yeah, that'll be all, unless I forgot to mention something...

I sincerely hope this can be reconsidered.

May the wind always be in your sails,

-Tidal Tyrant.

39 Comments

PennsOct 30, 20165 votes

Id rather not have Vayne build that thing tho oO

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20165 votes

She's already abusing Current Trinity Force, and might get some nerfs soon, considering she's quite popular right now, and the stealth changes are a massive buff to her (On top of that, she does a great job at fucking assassins over)

Champion SkinOct 30, 20162 votes

Vayne... the ADC who assassinates the assassins

(Ultimate giving bonus AD with Q + IE crit dealing 420% total AD and potential stun with E)

DracocrashOct 30, 20164 votes

vaynes base AD is too low to properly abuse sheen procs.

The Yetii RiderOct 30, 20163 votes

Gangplank getting crit was the reason it was removed. It wasn't just to synergize with Irelia and Jax better, it was to nerf the power spike GP got off one item.

Honestly if Riot does make a new Spellblade crit item to help Kog and Corki I imagine it will be accompanied by a change to GP making Parrrley unable to crit. They don't want him to do that.

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20163 votes

Source?

The Yetii RiderOct 30, 20162 votes

Obviously Riot isn't going to come out and say something like that. Doesn't mean they don't recognize it was an issue.

Good luck with your push but they made Gangplank into a late game farming champ with the Silver Serpents and the level 13 spike. Giving him so much power off just one item isn't healthy.

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20162 votes

You FEEL like it is, so it is true. Am I getting this right? His current itemisation bends his power curve in a more unhealthy way than old TF ever did. He's shit early on, has a massive powerspike at item 3078 item 3142 , drops a bit when he finishes his item 3031 but crawls back up when he gets item 3087

The Yetii RiderOct 30, 20162 votes

That argument holds no sway for future changes when Youmuu's is losing a huge amount of armor penetration early next patch. It might be a perfectly balanced item on GP after that.

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20162 votes

You're talking like Gangplank is still in need of nerfs...

The Yetii RiderOct 30, 20162 votes

Gangplank sits on a knife's edge of balance. He certainly can't get buffed any more of he'll be pick/ban in competitive again, that's just the nature of global abilities on top laners.

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20163 votes

I agree he shouldn't be buffed, I recently commented that on a ''buff GP thread'' But when something breaks a champion, nerf the champion. That's how balancing works, and Kog'Maw/Corki get to live their lives a bit better

AhristocatsOct 30, 20162 votes

Just do it

DarkRitualOct 30, 20162 votes

Yeah, Ezreal needs a new item to abuse untill it gets nerfed.

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20167 votes

If you can buy it, Ezreal can abuse it.

Jokes aside, Ezreal would probably prefer the regular Trinity Force because he doesn't care for crit

DarkRitualOct 30, 20162 votes

Crit build would be pretty easy to get into though. He has a built-in AS steroid, so Crit isn't even a bad option, his other builds just work better right now. A crit Sheen item could change that though.

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20161 votes

True, but it would ruin his ''Spam Q and be untouchable with my 4 second CD free Flash'' playstyle :P

DarkRitualOct 30, 20162 votes

Not really. He still spams Sheen procs with his Q, but now also does a buttload of damage with Autos inbetween, which come faster by hitting things with Q spam.

Also worth noting, IE is still in a number of his buildpaths.

ToastersaotOct 31, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, Ezreal needs a new item to abuse untill it gets nerfed.

Ezreal will still just build item 3025 , since Ezreal doesn't like to auto a lot, making crit not as good. The reasons why he take new item 3078 sometimes is because of the stronger sheen proc. Still, the ARMOR coming from Iceborn Gauntlet is so strong in bot lane. And the high mana it gives makes his item 3042 stronger, meaning that he doesn't lose that much offense for a ton of defense.

SlashStrikerOct 30, 20162 votes

item 3122 + item 3086 + item 3057 = spellblade with crits? fk yeah!

30 AD 30% AS 30% crit chance 200 mana 10% cdr 5 % movement speed Spellblade: After spellcast next basic attack does 50% AD bonus damage and gives 15 % movement speed 2 sec

DarkRitualOct 30, 20165 votes

Waaaaaaay too many stats. Don't use Zeal, use item 1018 + item 3057 + item 3133 . Crit, Sheen stuffs, and some CDR + AD.

YumaS2AstralOct 30, 20161 votes

I would kill to have another crit item that gives AD but not AS

DarkRitualOct 30, 20163 votes

item 1038 + item 3057 + item 1051 is another option, for a more AD heavy item with fewer component stats. This would save some power room for the Spellblade and maybe another passive.

EcchiOtakuTMOct 30, 20162 votes

The only champion who suffered is corki though. It'd be better to just completely change corki's AAs to magic damage to help his build. His E would only shred magic resist.

This way void staff would actually be a better item on him, he would still build AD to actually do good AA damage and it'd be more unique.

GP is just fine without crit on triforce, and kog could just be changed to apply on-hit effects twice per AA, which is much more balanced than attacking twice which broke rageblade thus hyper breaking on-hit effects.

VivaLaKittenOct 30, 20162 votes

heres an idea, stop changing it and just make a separate item for champs like Kog'Maw and Corki

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20164 votes

That's.... litterally what I suggested. I suggest you re-read the thread.

VivaLaKittenOct 30, 20162 votes

and? I didn't care to read the thread, and just made a suggestion now you're going to get mad at me over it?

RebonackOct 30, 20162 votes

I'm still partial to item 3122 + item 3086 + item 3057 if only because it very nicely mirrors the old crit-based Trinity with no HP and a higher crit chance.

That, and I really want to see Hatchet back in the game. It's OnCrit bleed effect is sexy.

MimyOct 30, 20161 votes

I saw older Phantom dancer as the picture....

I miss old Phantom dancer. Not the dodge chance one but like.. the one that allowed movement though UNITS...

YumaS2AstralOct 30, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I saw older Phantom dancer as the picture....

I miss old Phantom dancer. Not the dodge chance one but like.. the one that allowed movement though UNITS...

This one still allows movement through units.

Just that you now need to be near an enemy champion.

MimyOct 30, 20161 votes

{quoted}

This one still allows movement through units.

Just that you now need to be near an enemy champion.

Not too helpful when you have to be in someone's attack range...

BesthunterjkOct 30, 20161 votes

Nah, let's rather not do that.

Gangplank is good enough with his current items, no need to make him broken again.

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20162 votes

Gangplank is good enough with his current items, no need to make him broken again.

The change to Trinity force was a buff in his overall power actually, the extra 10% cdr really helped him out. But it's definetly not healthier.

BesthunterjkOct 30, 20161 votes

That makes no sense at all.

Also, Gangplank is never healthy just poking from behind his barrels and even getting gold to do so

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20162 votes

I have multiple threads disagreeing with Gangplanks bandit abuse.
Gangplank used to take a lot of CDR in his runes to hit that 40%(or 45%). The removal of crit would've been a nerf, but he could bypass it by getting a Ghostblade second, allowing him to be strong when he needs to be.

ErockandrollOct 30, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tidal Tyrant,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3kUHTw7U,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2016-10-30T15:16:49.327+0000)

The change to Trinity force was a buff in his overall power actually, the extra 10% cdr really helped him out. But it's definetly not healthier.

maybe if you only considering TF as a one item power spike. But you might be forgetting that ER exists. Gangplank, (as well as the ADCs you've mentioned) An extra 10% CDR on one item? I would rather have the extra 40% CDR on two. Especially when those two items give me 50% crit chance in total, along with a mana regen mechanic that allows me to spell spam with impunity.

The ultimate problem with the champions you have mentioned are, they were balanced around the (perhaps inappropriate) synergy between TF and ER. Which is why the changes to TF molding it to it's bruiser users, hypothetically Dumpster thous champions. But those champion's status, isn't going to excuse that level of synergy. If you want sheen proc, build sheen proc, if you want crit chance, build crit chance. But chances are, Riot isn't going to reintroduce an item that serves both, or even if they did, it wouldn't be anywhere close to the old TF.

Sahn UzalOct 30, 20162 votes

Fun Fact, a lot of Gangplank players stopped using Essence Reaver on him before the TF changes even. Gangplank players used to get item 3078 item 3158 item 3031 item 3087 item 3046 item 3036 after Tobias Fate invented that build. It had a higher winrate than the ER build for a few patches on Champion.GG before the TF changes even hit live.

ToastersaotOct 31, 20161 votes

Don't forget Shaco . It wasn't absolutely necessary, but it gave him a good amount of burst with his Q proccin

Terminus EdgeOct 31, 20161 votes

Wicked Hatchet would be really stupid on Jhin, for the record.

Guaranteed (60% Bonus AD) burn every 4th shot, never mind other crits in between.

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