why does evelynn have intargetability in her ult?

po crlh sff·Jan 18, 2018·3 votes·1,012 views

I am legitimaly curious why to Evelynn even has an untargetable frame on her ult? Is it even necessary?

I believe she is in no way subpar to the remaining assassins, in fact she might even be overtuned... From a kit perspective she already has plenty of tools, her camouflage gives a her a good way to aproach her targets, her damage is definitly high enough to assassinate, her E gives her the sticking power she needs and she is one of the few assassins with HARD CC, but then there's her ulti... even disregarding the damaging nuke, her Ultimate is ALREADY a very effective disengage that can also double as a gapcloser.

Untargetability is a very powerfull mechanic that shouldn't be given away so freely, she already has the 725 range blink backwards. I think that the untargetable frame is unnecessary power and it makes the ability somewhat overloaded as It serves only to give her excessive safety and remove counterplay against her.

14 Comments

HópeJan 18, 20185 votes

Because she is the most fragile champion in league of legends. She has 0 way to fend for herself. Her Ult is her only ''escape''

po crlh sffJan 18, 20181 votes

Ohh poor little thing...

ZephyrDrakeJan 18, 20182 votes

because every single assassin has a way to get in do their thing and get out. Eve while having her stealth still has no way to actually get out after her attempt to blow up someone. She isn't some sort of tank that deal assassin damage either, she is a squishy champion with no other way to "escape" other than what her ult gives her

po crlh sffJan 18, 20181 votes

Her ult ALREADY gives her a way to escape, she has a 725 range blink attached to it, and 725 units is pretty long for a blink.

The untargetable frame however gives her unneeded power in ways not related at all with escaping, such popping it just to negate tower agro, or a caytlin ult or any other targetted spell for that matter, which is the part I am refering as existing only to negate counterplay.

ZephyrDrakeJan 18, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=po crlh sff,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3IN7zwlj,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-01-18T22:40:09.228+0000)

Her ult ALREADY gives her a way to escape, she has a 725 range blink attached to it, and 725 units is pretty long for a blink.

The untargetable frame however gives her unneeded power in ways not related at all with escaping, such popping it just to negate tower agro, or a caytlin ult or any other targetted spell for that matter, which is the part I am refering as existing only to negate counterplay.

"negate counterplay" that word means less and less each day since it seems counterplay just means "i dont want to do think i want everything to be done for me"

po crlh sffJan 20, 20181 votes

Funny you say that because that is exactly the point I was trying to make.

Eve should actually have to plan her escape, like every other assassin, rather than just have a button with very little room for failure. She can easily escape with the long blink her ult provides, the untargetable frame however is just there to prevent retaliation

Colton147Jan 18, 20182 votes

Ekko

po crlh sffJan 18, 20182 votes

yeah... there's that guy as well... I'm not really going to discuss ekko because his ult is so overloaded that it's not even the untargetable part that bothers me most, but at least with ekko if you were to finish him off with a targeted spell you would fail anyways as he would also heal back. Also it makes thematic sense

PeachyPosteriorJan 19, 20182 votes

It's her escape. If you ult to escape battle and can still get targeted its really not an escape. She's quite squishy and as an assassin she needs a way to sneak in and out of battle.

po crlh sffJan 20, 20181 votes

Then I guess the only other assassins with an actual escape is fizz and ekko (that is if you dont use the escape tool for damage of course) as literally every other assassin is targetable.

I guess putting some distance away from your target no longer makes for a good escape unless it also removes the oponents chances of fighting back...

SangreDeNocheJan 18, 20181 votes

Because the heal, invis, and charm are on a delay. She has to get in melee or practically melee range to do damage. She is squishy. Lastly, her invisibility range makes that part of her kit more balanced than every other invisibility champ in the game. Really, what does twitch's invisibility range tell you when his ult lets him fire from 3-4 times that range away? What good is rengar's when you only see him show up as/after he's using his pounce on his target? Etc.

po crlh sffJan 20, 20181 votes

While I'm not saying twitch is a good example of an healthy champion, at least twitch has a clear weakness. With twitch if you let him engage
on you, you are dead (along with your team) HOWEVER, if you engage on him, he has very little chances of surviving unless the support is nearby or he is extremely fed. Evelynn however doesget punished by this, her cc may be delayed but she doesnt need to expose herself in harm's way unless she wants to, and when she does she has A LOT of all in power as an assassin. Yet, while her ability to sneak up and stick on you is very good, if she is the one getting sneaked up on, she has one of the best disengages on the game. I'm not complaining that she has a 725 range blink (long ass range btw) attatched to a massive nuke, I think the mobility it gives is necessessary for her to be functional. I'm complaining about her UNTARGETABILITY as it gives her unesessary power to a already very good spell, it makes her escape way better than it should, as it prevents retaliation, revenge killing and even some stuff it should't even prevent, for example a caytlin ult after being spoted out of position, or a veigar ult who wanted to revenge kill her, perhaps even a delayed damage ability such as a fizz ult or a khartus ult. All of this are stuff she gets to negate for free on top of already having a very consistent kit

Also I'm not mentioning rengar here because he is garbage atm

SangreDeNocheJan 20, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=po crlh sff,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=3IN7zwlj,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-01-20T00:26:22.131+0000)

While I'm not saying twitch is a good example of an healthy champion, at least twitch has a clear weakness. With twitch if you let him engage
on you, you are dead (along with your team) HOWEVER, if you engage on him, he has very little chances of surviving unless the support is nearby or he is extremely fed. Evelynn however doesget punished by this, her cc may be delayed but she doesnt need to expose herself in harm's way unless she wants to, and when she does she has A LOT of all in power as an assassin. Yet, while her ability to sneak up and stick on you is very good, if she is the one getting sneaked up on, she has one of the best disengages on the game. I'm not complaining that she has a 725 range blink (long ass range btw) attatched to a massive nuke, I think the mobility it gives is necessessary for her to be functional. I'm complaining about her UNTARGETABILITY as it gives her unesessary power to a already very good spell, it makes her escape way better than it should, as it prevents retaliation, revenge killing and even some stuff it should't even prevent, for example a caytlin ult after being spoted out of position, or a veigar ult who wanted to revenge kill her, perhaps even a delayed damage ability such as a fizz ult or a khartus ult. All of this are stuff she gets to negate for free on top of already having a very consistent kit

Also I'm not mentioning rengar here because he is garbage atm

Shaco (who has invisibility on top of leaving the map as he blinks elsewhere and his ult is almost this since there are two targets), Not talking exclusively invis you have Ekko (untargetable when ulting, has his aoe stun which is waaaaay stronger than eve charm, and a dash), Zed (2 blinks), LB (2 dashes and a long af root after a delay (seriously flashing and dashing together does nothing depending on the champ)), and Zoe (Everyone knows what's broken about her at this point).

Also mention rengar because he's gonna go back to being broken and you know it.

po crlh sffJan 20, 20181 votes

Shaco's blink is a very good tool, but it only serves either a gapcloser or as an escape as it has a long cooldown, and while his ult CAN be used defensively (it has an invulnerability frame), its hardly an escape, best case scenario he can use it along with his boxes to stall long enough so his Q comes back online, but that is FAR from a free escape.

Ekko's ult while probabably being an even better escape than Eve's ult does make you CHOOSE between escaping or trying to damage the oponent, aditionally while an AOE stun does sound more powerfull than a single target charm, ekko's W is a lot more telegraphed, delayed and harder to apply, like it or not ekko requires a lot more PLANNING AHEAD to be played at full potencial.

As for zed and leblanc, just like evelynn they also have way to get in and out of battle and guess what, their escape is ALSO a blink, just like evelynn!! Their escape blink however DOESN'T come with free untargetability... which means that a in a clutch 1v1 if both targets are low, they actually RISK dying, unlike eve.

Against Zoe you can fight back just like a zed or a LB as her ult doesnt grant her an untargetable escape. Sure she has a lot of other issues, but I dont actually have a sugestion on how to easily make her kit healthier without ruining the champ, its the entire concept of her kit that makes her somewhat problematic atm.

Anyways now that I've adressed the champs individually, you might notice a pattern here... every single champ listed has to MAKE A CHOICE (shaco either engages with q or disengages with it, ekko either uses ult to escape or to burst; and as for zed, lb and zoe while having an engage and disengage they ALLOW you to FIGHT BACK). Evelynn just DOESN'T have to choose, she has the best of both worlds, her ult bursts, disengages and prevents fighting back, which is the point of all this, removing the untargetable frame wouldn't make eve useless at all, it would just bring her closer to the remaining assassin's level.

Lastly, regarding Rengar, I have NO IDEIA if he is going to be back to being "broken" but I really hope so, I'm looking forward to his next changes