There was a time where Trinity Force was 130% damage. Why is it now 200%? Isn't that a little TOO strong, especially after later you decide "Hey let's give it attack speed instead of crit since everyone wants attack speed and crit is a little specific"?
I mean Lich Bane is 75%, Iceborn is 100%. Why is Trinity Force DOUBLE that of Iceborn?
Yautja wannabe2 votesIt's designed to be a mid-game item. It's really strong initially, but falls off as the game goes on since it only scales off of your base AD. Just be glad they removed the interaction between 
&
. Steracks used to actually increase your base AD, meaning that the spellblade passive from the triforce would be doing 250% of your base AD rather than the usual 200%. Overall, it's a strong item, but it's also a very reasonable item. Sure, it's super strong, but it falls off, has a weird build path, and it's the most expensive item in the game. So in conclusion, I say it doesn't need nerfing.
VoraciousX2 votesIt's designed to be a mid-game item. It's really strong initially, but falls off as the game goes on since it only scales off of your base AD. Just be glad they removed the interaction between
Your base AD increases as you level, and that's not true as most Trinity Force users are doing better late game than early-mid, including Irelia, who is specifically MEANT to be an early-mid game champion. She has a 55% win rate 40+ minutes, 53% 35-40 mins, and 49% 0-25. I forget what 25-35 was but I think it was like 50-51%. Garen is even doing better with this item, despite it not initially being for him. Darius is building it, also despite it not initially being for him. If champions who aren't initially meant to use it are using it as their core build isn't it a problem? Or can we go back to Iceborn Gauntlet Ekko and Fizz?
Btw to also add to the early-mid thing, Garen only loses around .60% win rate at 40 minutes from 0-25 minutes, Darius is at a 53% win rate 40+ minutes but weak everywhere inbetween except 30-35 minutes. Gangplank is the only one I'm seeing dip late game, which is weird because he used to be super strong late game and super weak early. I guess it's the changes in builds people are running with him.
Hammermancer1 votesYour base AD increases as you level, and that's not true as most Trinity Force users are doing better late game than early-mid, including Irelia, who is specifically MEANT to be an early-mid game champion. She has a 55% win rate 40+ minutes, 53% 35-40 mins, and 49% 0-25. I forget what 25-35 was but I think it was like 50-51%. Garen is even doing better with this item, despite it not initially being for him. Darius is building it, also despite it not initially being for him. If champions who aren't initially meant to use it are using it as their core build isn't it a problem? Or can we go back to Iceborn Gauntlet Ekko and Fizz?
Btw to also add to the early-mid thing, Garen only loses around .60% win rate at 40 minutes from 0-25 minutes, Darius is at a 53% win rate 40+ minutes but weak everywhere inbetween except 30-35 minutes. Gangplank is the only one I'm seeing dip late game, which is weird because he used to be super strong late game and super weak early. I guess it's the changes in builds people are running with him.
to be fair, it's still healthier than old infinity edge
Yautja wannabe1 votesYour base AD increases as you level, and that's not true as most Trinity Force users are doing better late game than early-mid, including Irelia, who is specifically MEANT to be an early-mid game champion. She has a 55% win rate 40+ minutes, 53% 35-40 mins, and 49% 0-25. I forget what 25-35 was but I think it was like 50-51%. Garen is even doing better with this item, despite it not initially being for him. Darius is building it, also despite it not initially being for him. If champions who aren't initially meant to use it are using it as their core build isn't it a problem? Or can we go back to Iceborn Gauntlet Ekko and Fizz?
Btw to also add to the early-mid thing, Garen only loses around .60% win rate at 40 minutes from 0-25 minutes, Darius is at a 53% win rate 40+ minutes but weak everywhere inbetween except 30-35 minutes. Gangplank is the only one I'm seeing dip late game, which is weird because he used to be super strong late game and super weak early. I guess it's the changes in builds people are running with him.
I saw iceborn fizz and ekko and immediately had flashbacks to my days in 'nam
VoraciousX1 votesI saw iceborn fizz and ekko and immediately had flashbacks to my days in 'nam
Lol, ikr.
Anyways I'm not saying the item needs to go back to 130% damage. 75-100-125 would normally make sense as how the damage is going up, but I'd be happy for 150%.
ZephyrDrake1 votesLol, ikr.
Anyways I'm not saying the item needs to go back to 130% damage. 75-100-125 would normally make sense as how the damage is going up, but I'd be happy for 150%.
and then what? what are you going to buff of the item? because nobody would bother building it if you nerf the damage proc. Lich Bane also scales off AP vs base AD which you only get by lvling up and Iceborn is more of a defensive item that gives you a bit of an extra oomph to your basic attacks. You literally are saying "make the most expensive item in the game not be worth buying whatsoever" the item gives piss poor stats for how expensive it is. A lot of stats yeah but when you look at how much you get for each stat? it's pathetic when it comes from an item that costs nearly 4k gold
VoraciousX1 votesand then what? what are you going to buff of the item? because nobody would bother building it if you nerf the damage proc. Lich Bane also scales off AP vs base AD which you only get by lvling up and Iceborn is more of a defensive item that gives you a bit of an extra oomph to your basic attacks. You literally are saying "make the most expensive item in the game not be worth buying whatsoever" the item gives piss poor stats for how expensive it is. A lot of stats yeah but when you look at how much you get for each stat? it's pathetic when it comes from an item that costs nearly 4k gold
You realize if they lowered the damage, they'd also lower the price right? Personally I miss the old Trinity Force that had AP in it, but I'm not even sure that could work anymore with how specialized in stats they're making champions now. Everyone's practically being forced to build one way or another. Hell they made AP MF near useless compared to AD thanks to her new passive and all the crit additions. Evelynn used to be a queen of hybrid damage, now she doesn't have a drop of AD ratios.
ZephyrDrake1 votesYou realize if they lowered the damage, they'd also lower the price right? Personally I miss the old Trinity Force that had AP in it, but I'm not even sure that could work anymore with how specialized in stats they're making champions now. Everyone's practically being forced to build one way or another. Hell they made AP MF near useless compared to AD thanks to her new passive and all the crit additions. Evelynn used to be a queen of hybrid damage, now she doesn't have a drop of AD ratios.
ok and? why should I care about old tri force or how old champions used to work? AP MF was never useful and was more of a meme than anything so she not being "good" is meaningless since she never was good to begin with. Eve also due to her hybrid scalings also meant that her damage was all over the place and you could never actually get the most out of her since building armor pen only benefitted her E while magic pen only benefitted her Q and R (with her R not even being able to kill anyone anyways).
Current Triforce is meant to be a one item powerspike that falls off as the game goes on unlike Lich Bane that actually gets stronger the game goes on due to it scaling with something you can actually buy. You can lower the price all you want of the item nobody would bother picking it up when they can just get something else that would give them more damage or actual stats
VoraciousX1 votesok and? why should I care about old tri force or how old champions used to work? AP MF was never useful and was more of a meme than anything so she not being "good" is meaningless since she never was good to begin with. Eve also due to her hybrid scalings also meant that her damage was all over the place and you could never actually get the most out of her since building armor pen only benefitted her E while magic pen only benefitted her Q and R (with her R not even being able to kill anyone anyways).
Current Triforce is meant to be a one item powerspike that falls off as the game goes on unlike Lich Bane that actually gets stronger the game goes on due to it scaling with something you can actually buy. You can lower the price all you want of the item nobody would bother picking it up when they can just get something else that would give them more damage or actual stats
I dunno I was one shotting quite a bit of people as Evelynn with Duskblade Trinity Force quite easily. I didn't even need my ult, just had to W to get close to them and E and they were dead pretty much. But all that MF stuff and whatnot was just me reminiscing, and also AP MF before her rework actually wasn't bad.
Btw if you didn't know, Trinity Force users for the most part are actually doing BETTER IN THE LATE GAME than at any point in the game with Trinity Force. Irelia's best win rate is 40+ minutes with 55% win rate. Darius iirc is 51 or 53, while their early win rates are lower. Same for Garen. The only one I've seen that isn't doing better late game is GP, but I suspect that's because he's going grasp/building tanky now instead. An earlier price point with a weaker proc would likely make their win rates go back to early-mid. Also no one item is going to give you an extra 150% damage on your next auto attack. Name one single item at full build that could make your auto attack go from 500 to 1000. Currently if you had a 500 auto attack, Trinity Force would make your auto attack go to 1500.
ZephyrDrake1 votesI dunno I was one shotting quite a bit of people as Evelynn with Duskblade Trinity Force quite easily. I didn't even need my ult, just had to W to get close to them and E and they were dead pretty much. But all that MF stuff and whatnot was just me reminiscing, and also AP MF before her rework actually wasn't bad.
Btw if you didn't know, Trinity Force users for the most part are actually doing BETTER IN THE LATE GAME than at any point in the game with Trinity Force. Irelia's best win rate is 40+ minutes with 55% win rate. Darius iirc is 51 or 53, while their early win rates are lower. Same for Garen. The only one I've seen that isn't doing better late game is GP, but I suspect that's because he's going grasp/building tanky now instead. An earlier price point with a weaker proc would likely make their win rates go back to early-mid. Also no one item is going to give you an extra 150% damage on your next auto attack. Name one single item at full build that could make your auto attack go from 500 to 1000. Currently if you had a 500 auto attack, Trinity Force would make your auto attack go to 1500.
wow if only there were champions who had 500 BASE ad... sorry but what? there is not a single champion in the game that has anywhere near that much base AD simple as that. 153 is the highest base AD in the game (
) so it would a triforce hit at most would be dealing a bonus 306 damage that it. There is no 1k extra damage there is nothing else. The most triforce will do is literally 306 that is it's cap. Whatever damage that you are going to take that will proc the spellblade effect you just add 306 AT MOST to that damage and the bare minimum you will add is 143 (if for whatever reason you build it on 
)
Is it a good chunk of damage? yeah but that's pretty much very small when you compare how much actual damage most abilities will deal in the late game. Triforce does not care if your AD reaches 1000 due to items all it cares about is your BASE AD which is something that nothing can actually increase anymore
VoraciousX1 voteswow if only there were champions who had 500 BASE ad... sorry but what? there is not a single champion in the game that has anywhere near that much base AD simple as that. 153 is the highest base AD in the game (
Is it a good chunk of damage? yeah but that's pretty much very small when you compare how much actual damage most abilities will deal in the late game. Triforce does not care if your AD reaches 1000 due to items all it cares about is your BASE AD which is something that nothing can actually increase anymore
First, I was tired, it was late(like 3-4 AM) and I'm sick, so I didn't fully think about what I was saying, however, Trinity Force basically amplifies your base AD for the next auto attack. If your base AD is 100, Trinity Force will make it 300 for that next auto. If the highest base AD is 153, that means that the next auto from trinity force passive will do 459. Now imagine this 3 times, that's 1377+ whatever damage the ability you proc that uses trinity force for you deals. Trinity Force is the largest factor of damage of Trinity Force users, not the weakest. You have to count the actual damage from your actual base AD as well because they proc at the same time. This is why I said it'd be 459. The 153 base damage may not be tied to Trinity Force directly, but Trinity Force amplified it 2 times, changing that number from 153 to 459. Even if you didn't count the 153 base damage, that'd be 918 damage with 3 procs. Even 2 procs is generally more damage than 2 abilities combined. Champions like Irelia aren't doing well because they deal 124 damage from one Q(this is factoring the AD from trinity force and titanic hydra, or 372 from 3 Qs, they're doing well because they're dealing 517 damage from one Q(1551 from 3) due to Trinity Force. It's nowhere near small when you compare the rest of a Trinity Force user's kit, in fact their kit is usually the weakest forms of their damage, which is why they use it, because they don't build the damage to make their kit deal that much.
And again, a lower damage would come with a cost decrease, which would likely spike UP these champions' mid games and lower their late games, which considering most of them are MEANT to be mid game champions, would put them where they were supposed to be. Trinity Force is also a big offender when it comes to strong champions running rampant. Trinity Force users are never bad, but other champions come up and down all the time. I don't think Irelia's been off the top 8 since she was reworked. Garen was literally brought to Challenger because of Trinity Force at one point, and Darius is now building it. If people who didn't originally build the item are now seeing it in their core, it's generally an issue, or again, or did you forget Iceborn Gauntlet Ekko and Fizz?
ZephyrDrake1 votesFirst, I was tired, it was late(like 3-4 AM) and I'm sick, so I didn't fully think about what I was saying, however, Trinity Force basically amplifies your base AD for the next auto attack. If your base AD is 100, Trinity Force will make it 300 for that next auto. If the highest base AD is 153, that means that the next auto from trinity force passive will do 459. Now imagine this 3 times, that's 1377+ whatever damage the ability you proc that uses trinity force for you deals. Trinity Force is the largest factor of damage of Trinity Force users, not the weakest. You have to count the actual damage from your actual base AD as well because they proc at the same time. This is why I said it'd be 459. The 153 base damage may not be tied to Trinity Force directly, but Trinity Force amplified it 2 times, changing that number from 153 to 459. Even if you didn't count the 153 base damage, that'd be 918 damage with 3 procs. Even 2 procs is generally more damage than 2 abilities combined. Champions like Irelia aren't doing well because they deal 124 damage from one Q(this is factoring the AD from trinity force and titanic hydra, or 372 from 3 Qs, they're doing well because they're dealing 517 damage from one Q(1551 from 3) due to Trinity Force. It's nowhere near small when you compare the rest of a Trinity Force user's kit, in fact their kit is usually the weakest forms of their damage, which is why they use it, because they don't build the damage to make their kit deal that much.
And again, a lower damage would come with a cost decrease, which would likely spike UP these champions' mid games and lower their late games, which considering most of them are MEANT to be mid game champions, would put them where they were supposed to be. Trinity Force is also a big offender when it comes to strong champions running rampant. Trinity Force users are never bad, but other champions come up and down all the time. I don't think Irelia's been off the top 8 since she was reworked. Garen was literally brought to Challenger because of Trinity Force at one point, and Darius is now building it. If people who didn't originally build the item are now seeing it in their core, it's generally an issue, or again, or did you forget Iceborn Gauntlet Ekko and Fizz?
I didn't knew that triforce made you tankier. All you want is to butcher the item for no reason. After iceborn got it's price reduced the item pretty much disappeared from a lot of champion builds and only a few select tanks (and Ezreal) build it. I don't care how cheaper the item would get (won't be big enough to matter) all it will accomplish is making nobody pick the item and just go for iceborn at that point. Your damage is already going down so might as well bring more utility and get a bit tankier than having a useless item in your inventory
VoraciousX1 votesI didn't knew that triforce made you tankier. All you want is to butcher the item for no reason. After iceborn got it's price reduced the item pretty much disappeared from a lot of champion builds and only a few select tanks (and Ezreal) build it. I don't care how cheaper the item would get (won't be big enough to matter) all it will accomplish is making nobody pick the item and just go for iceborn at that point. Your damage is already going down so might as well bring more utility and get a bit tankier than having a useless item in your inventory
They wouldn't go Iceborn because 150% damage is still 50% more damage than Iceborn Gauntlet. Right now it's literally double. They already build tanky, so they wouldn't need the tank stats from Iceborn, and since They only build Trinity Force and then straight tank, they'd STILL want the extra 50% damage from Trinity Force.
I don't know where you thought I said Trinity Force makes you tankier. I just said that if champions who aren't designed to use Trinity Force are allowed to use it because of it's obvious overpoweredness as an item(the reason why people who aren't designed for it in the first place are abusing it), then that's basically going against what they said about Iceborn Gauntlet Fizz and Ekko, who also, were not designed to use the item and were abusing it. And again, a price decrease with a damage decrease would actually make Trinity Force a mid game item again, because right now the champions who are designed to use it are doing better at 35+ minutes than they are early-mid.
T3rminus2 votesI kinda wish it was more focused on sustained AA damage and less on sudden bursts of huge damage.
Trinity Force
_Recurve Bow (1000) + Sheen (1050) + Phage (1250) + 333 = 3633 _
+30 Attack Damage +30% Attack Speed +10% Cooldown Reduction +250 Health +250 Mana +5% Movement Speed
Unique - Your basic attacks deal (20% Base AD) bonus Physical Damage on-hit.
Unique - Spellblade: After using an ability, your next basic attack within 10 seconds deals (130% Base AD) bonus Physical Damage on-hit (2 second cooldown).
Unique - Rage: Basic attacks (on-hit) grant +20 flat Movement Speed for 2 seconds. Killing a unit grants +60 flat Movement Speed instead. These bonuses are halved for ranged champions.
The Spellblade proc itself does less damage (150% AD total including the initial on-hit part), but you can easily make up the difference by landing some autos.
Something like this, anyway.
For reference, Illaoi at level 18 would deal 30 damage on-hit with that first passive.
Hammermancer1 votesI kinda wish it was more focused on sustained AA damage and less on sudden bursts of huge damage.
The Spellblade proc itself does less damage (150% AD total including the initial on-hit part), but you can easily make up the difference by landing some autos.
Something like this, anyway.
For reference, Illaoi at level 18 would deal 30 damage on-hit with that first passive.
I really really disklike that.. like I really really really hate it, it would blatently buff irelia, ezreal and camille and nerf other triforce users like jayce
how about after casting a spell the next auto deals damage, and after autoing your next spell gets bonus damage or pen or some shit?
Warlord Rhinark1 votesI kinda wish it was more focused on sustained AA damage and less on sudden bursts of huge damage.
The Spellblade proc itself does less damage (150% AD total including the initial on-hit part), but you can easily make up the difference by landing some autos.
Something like this, anyway.
For reference, Illaoi at level 18 would deal 30 damage on-hit with that first passive.
This is a really good concept, although the on-hit damage should probably be increased to 25% of base AD to warrant buying it over something like Blade of the Ruined King.
The Spellblade proc can be lowered to 125% to compensate (meaning it still deals 150% base AD total when proccing due to the on-hit passive).
WoΘxer1 votesBecause of scaling?
VoraciousX1 votesBecause of scaling?
Explain? Because scaling is just a term used for increasing damage based on a stat, and Trinity Force only SCALES with base attack damage, which only scales with level, so I don't understand what the increase in damage from 130% to 200% has to do with scaling.
Hammermancer1 votesIceborn is 200%, it does the bonus damage on the AOE zone to the target too, it just has two overlaying damage effects which are additive against the primary target
UNIQUE – SPELLBLADE: After using an ability, your next basic attack within 10 seconds deals (100% base AD) on-hit bonus damage (1.5 second cooldown).
So there's the initial but
UNIQUE – ICY ZONE: Triggering Spellblade also deals (100% base AD) physical damage to enemies surrounding the target and creates a icy zone for 2 seconds, which Slow icon slows enemies within by 30%. The zone has a radius of 180 (+ 55% bonus armor) units.
The damage hits the primary target, test it on dummies
VoraciousX1 votes[{quoted}](name=T3H UB3RN07,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=25Zlggk4,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-09-24T06:48:58.888+0000)
Iceborn is 200%, it does the bonus damage on the AOE zone to the target too, it just has two overlaying damage effects which are additive against the primary target
It's 100%, but in addition to a basic attack that would be considered 200% on your next basic attack.
It was 150% though. It has only been 130% for a short period of time back in season 1. And it has been 200% for a longer period of time than it was 150%.
But wouldn't this be considered part of damage creep? Also 75-100-200 is a huge leap.
DearPear1 votesIt was 150% though. It has only been 130% for a short period of time back in season 1. And it has been 200% for a longer period of time than it was 150%.
Warlord Rhinark1 votesReducing it to 150% should be good enough but 130% might make the item a bit too weak.
Hammermancer1 votesHonestly triforce is too important of an item, maybe nerf the champions that are abusing it by hitting their base ad? instead of just nerfing every single triforce user for the problems of irelia and darius
Hammermancer1 votesI wish i could combine it with a 
for pentaforce
Hammermancer1 votes[{quoted}](name=T3H UB3RN07,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=25Zlggk4,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2018-09-24T07:07:28.199+0000)
I wish i could combine it with a
And then ornngrade it
Yautja wannabe3 votes[{quoted}](name=T3H UB3RN07,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=25Zlggk4,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2018-09-24T07:07:28.199+0000)
I wish i could combine it with a
That would be the most expensive and overloaded item to have ever existed. I hope you're memeing lol
Hammermancer1 votesThat would be the most expensive and overloaded item to have ever existed. I hope you're memeing lol
Like I am... but i'm not
I want rito to meme it
think of it as the thing to sell your boots for >.>
Irelia Bot1 votesIf it gets the 12% movement speed and all other stats buffed back to season 2 levels I would be fine with this.
VoraciousX1 votes[{quoted}](name=Irelia Bot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=25Zlggk4,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2018-09-28T04:21:47.254+0000)
If it gets the 12% movement speed and all other stats buffed back to season 2 levels I would be fine with this.
I mean it was honestly probably weaker then. It only had 10 more AD, less CDR, and less attack speed. In fact, did it even have CDR back then? I'm not even sure it did.