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Why's Karma never discussed?

Seenan··2 votes·495 views

Can function as any laner, ridiculous potential team-wide utility, big damage (a Mantra'd Q can practically 1 shot someone if they're AP mid mid-late game), and for some reason, she also gets missing hp % healing on a long-tethered slow/root. Picked in LCS sometimes, her playrate is nearly 8% with a nearly 50% winrate.

Other than ccing her to oblivion or just blasting her before/after she shields (usually with said-cc), she can just keep running away with her shield, kite you with Q/tether...since her Q is also, for some reason, at a max mana cost of 70 with a cd of 5...that gets lower if she hits people.

Am I just doing something wrong? It just seems like there's way too much in her kit. Rivaling Ekko's overloadedness, thanks to Mantra. 'Dodge her Q', yeah, which one? She sends like 20 per 5 minutes...Some being mantra'd which is harder to dodge.

I actually just hate her shield+MS buff, but her Q being stupidly spammable is also annoying. Her tether latches on longer than Leblanc's does, which is..funny.

I don't face her often since I'm mid, but every time I do face her, it's always just annoying and pretty much boring. When I say boring, I mean it's the same shit that I can't really do much about.

15 Comments

Maximum Morde3 votes

I don't know what you want. They've already nerfed the shit out of her to the point that she's virtually a one trick pony. Further nerfs will just delete her.

cute irelia gf1 votes

Ure kidding me? They only removed her shield on minions and lowered the movespeed in early. She is annoying as fuck, she can spam with her abilities as long as she wants because she has low mana costs, you cant escape her because of her W snare and slow on the Q.

Maximum Morde2 votes

So, I wont even go back to her pre-rework state, ill just note what has happened since her rework because after her rework she basically saw a bunch of buffs to get her into a useable state. Originally her R-W and R-E(Shield explosion) both got bonus damage. They took that away, leaving her in a state where you almost always want to R-Q now. They gave some minor compensation buffs because that hurt her pretty badly, buffed her mantra shield a tiny bit, reduced some cooldowns and mana etc, but the underlying result is that her damage dropped. Now they nerfed E, lowering the base shield amount, nerfed early move speed and removed the ability to cheer a minion wave forward to a turret/deny last hits. That move speed nerf is HUGE since usually you don't want to level your shield, especially outside of the support role. It's more important to get your Q/W ranked up for damage , cc, and trading.

I guess, basically I'm bitter that Karma and Heimerdinger got reworked pretty close together and Riot basically said OH LETS GIVE HEIMERDINGER A BETTER VERSION OF KARMA'S ULT WHERE ALL OF THE ULTS ARE GREAT!

Meanwhile, Karma's ults used to all be great, but now two of them are very niche thanks to nerfs. Keep nerfing Karma and she will just disappear from solo lanes and not even be very effective as support cause other champions do what she does better down there.

MisterShameless1 votes

It's funny that before patch 6.6 people made jokes like Karma who?

Example: https://youtu.be/R22CgShfxIw

Now since she is pick or ban in the LCS, people want her head on a stack... She just got a buff and synergies with the improved support items really well (mostly just her shield). People ask to nerf her mana cost, but fail to realize she has really low mana regen when compared to Lulu and Janna.

I actually wanted her shield buff reverted, but the nerf they have her was spot on (however I'm still conflicted about the minion thing). They should have improved her W with the power they took out of R+E and try to give her more reliable hard CC. I'd be fine if they change her R+W to a flat heal and make it have a better CC. It would help her Mid and Sup role a ton.

I will be honest, I wanted Karma to get attention from the community when she had a playrate of 0.8% for sup and mid, but this is too much. I played Karma and Udyr as my mains since late season 4, kinda bitter that both got nerfed, picked often, and complained a lot this season. Like they say, be careful what you wish for because it might not be what you want.

Keepe2 votes

Aaah. Reminds me of old Karma, when her kit was more unique and not just another caster "Support".

Seenan2 votes

{quoted}

Aaah. Reminds me of old Karma, when her kit was more unique and not just another caster "Support".

I don't remember old Karma, but I'd probably rather her than this stupid champ.

Keepe2 votes

I doubt it. =P

https://youtu.be/1CIWW1MEbUY

Seenan1 votes

{quoted}

I doubt it. =P

https://youtu.be/1CIWW1MEbUY

Well, good point. I guess I just hate this entire champ. But at least old Karma looks funner.

Keepe1 votes

She was. She was also a close-range in-your-face character rather than "Poke. Poke. Poke."

Quepha1 votes

{quoted}

She was. She was also a close-range in-your-face character rather than "Poke. Poke. Poke."

Like Annie but with less nuance

Keepe1 votes

Ugh, imagine if OLD Karma had a snare/stun? XD

DoktorKaiser1 votes

Dk man, I played vs a good Karma yesterday, she carried hard. Saving her team, speeding their engage, blowing up squishies and died maybe 2-3 times. She definetely isnt bad, but I dont really think she is broken like Sona was (and still kind of is)...

Swiftstrike41 votes

Any Champion that can provide shields and escapes for teamfights can be strong in the right hands. I actually ban Karma sometimes, because of her ability to protect a team fight comp.

Mobility creep is a problem that riot has had with league recently. They have been trying to mitigate it since the end of last season with several item changes: nerfs to boots of swiftness, the removal of tier 3 boots, the removal of the flat movement speed mastery, and a reduction to movement speed in items. A lot items that grant some movement speed is conditional out of combat move speed.

Due to Karma's high mobility, she is an extremely strong champion if her team is highly coordinated. Otherwise she is relatively weak. It is why she gets significant play at the pro level, because their is a much higher level of coordination by teams than in ranked queue.

Hige1 votes

Most supports have this weird halo or people around them that prevents any meaningful discussion.

The truth is that Karma's W is pretty broken and no one had noticed it until now. The good thing is that having W be this strong actually modifies Karma's gameplay for a much more healthier one which is funny I guess, I rather current W centric Karma than the old Q bot Karma.

MisterShameless1 votes

I was actually hoping for a thread discussing Karma's current status in terms of roles, but nope... It's another "I lost to this XXX champion so they must be broken thread".

Funny when Zyra, Vel'koz, Lulu, Brand, Zilean support dishes out a ton more damage at a safer distance while Zyra, Lulu and Zilean provide better diving potential with their speed boost and ultimates. Zyra, Brand, Vel'koz, Zilean provide better zoning/lane pressure. These five supports are better at harassing and enngaging than Karma.

Karma's Q is at risk of pushing the waves and she needs to have a clear shot since its a mid range skill shot, not a long range skill shot. The other supports can harass without pushing the wave and have long range skill shots (some click n point as well). Now if you're going to say "But her W is click n point", the damage it provides is tiny on top of the fact it also takes 2 seconds for the damage to be completed and can be broken. Since she is also support, she will be squishy so she puts herself at risky that isn't even worth it unless someone is ganking. Another thing, if your getting ganked, Karma's cc has a 2 second delay, so someone like Rengar or Katarina would have probably killed the person she is trying to protect. One thing that helps Karma a lot and makes her kit work out is her shield. Yes her shield is strong (thanks to Riot), but it was the only way to make her viable (along with heavily nerfing other supports). At the end if the day, she is heavily reliant on TEAMWORK (aka your team), which is why she has been picked in the LCS (obviously after her buffs and the nerf to her competition) so often and why she has a 49% (not 50%) win rate in sup/mid for the longest time now, possibly two seasons now.

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