Discussion over Juggernauts, pure tanks and Cho's identity

Photos of Ghosts··3 votes·167 views

I've seen people saying that Cho fits in the archetype of Juggernaut. What's a Juggernaut? Someone with high tankiness AND melee threat. Often a lane bully. Cho indeed fits: his passive makes it hard to take him down in lane, and later on he has his ult stacks. His on-hit effect of AoE spikes and ult also make for a considerable melee threat. However, I do not think that is his core identity.

First off, the build. Other Juggernauts tend to build tank + pen/Triforce, Cho is a massive 1v1 threat only if played carry fighter. If played tank or RoA off-tank, he'll have moreless the same damage output as similar tanks like Amumu, Malphite, Maokai... plus an ult dealing massive single target damage in exchange for not dealing minor damage to the whole enemy team.

Secondly, the spells. If Juggernauts can be useful in teamfights, they're not built around teamfighting. Nasus can slow the carry and his DPS, Darius can bounce the frontline on his chest, Garen can silence the mage, Shyvana can massively displace people - but they're all more efficient at picking off or 1v1ing immobile hypercarries, fighters, tanks or supports. Cho has to offer two large AoE CCs, one ultra long ranged and the other fairly long too, that can disrupt hugely the enemy team and don't deal massive single target damage if not built very offensively, while not guaranteeing him to get in melee range. This means he's meant to be a utility plus durability focused champion - thus a classic tank, disrupting for the other members of his team.

So why is a part of his kit revolved around melee range, WHILE he doesn't have any gapcloser? Because he's not an engage tank, he's a bunker. He has disruption in his kit since he'll replace the carries, but stays close to the carries and blocks skillshots and even point and clicks due to his size. His melee strengths are meant to be an answer to the melee threats to his team: he won't engage and dive for the carries, but he'll peel the enemy engage, prevent damage on the carries by mages and ADCs, and hurt a lot the enemy engagers, fighters or Juggernauts who try to get close.

So why is Cho currently more successful as an APC / AP bruiser than in his intended role? Prior to Cinderhulk meta, there was burst meta, with even the ADC being bursty (GRAVES CAN HAVE BURST BUT HE CANT HAVE A CIGAR), and AP heavy Cho has a huge burst while not being particularly burstable, which made him popular. However, Cinderhulk still wasn't even close to metagolem, and as a result full tank cinderhulk Cho still wasn't tanky enough for his intended passive bunker playstyle. Now, with Devourer doubling BotrK, he'd have an even harder time.

This analysis is surely full of mistakes, so feel free to tell me if you disagree with something. Also tell me that I did a good job if that's the case :3

3 Comments

EndlessSorcerer4 votes

The big difference is most likely that Juggernaut's are primarily picked for their durability and damage rather than utility. They are extremely hard to stop and punishing for anything who can't get away from them.

I believe that Cho'gath doesn't really fit the definition of Juggernaut because he provides significant CC and his abilities allow him to threaten targets at a distance.

Also, I wouldn't really say that Cho'gath being played as an APC or AP Bruiser is taking away from his "intended" role. When he was released, Riot didn't really design champions for specific roles. In addition, Cho'gath was designed to be playable as both a mage (good AP ratios and bursty damage) and as a tank (strong CC on abilities, high base damages to stay relevant even without damage items).

TraakSC3 votes

Juggernaut is just a sexy name they used for these 4 champion reworks. Cho, Mundo, Sion, and a few others who are Fighter/Tanks, Tank/Fighters, and Tank/Mages could just as easily be called "juggernauts." I wouldn't put too much thought into it.

Lugg1 votes

The problem with Cho is that while none of his individual abilities and ult are OP on their own; they are OP and mega toxic when you have them on one champion. Add into it his ridiculously OP passive and he is way over the top. His passive literally puts no gates on him at all. He can stay in lane until he needs to buy something.

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