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Okay I found Fiora's problem

Jefftiffy··8 votes·933 views

It's the fact her passive is up so damn often combined with her not being able to be CC'd during her dash. Her passive has almost 0 downtime. And the dash anti-CC is a bug. Let's not forget about her low mana costs too.

Also lets not forget how she has an immunity in her kit that can also relfect CC.

So did someone on the balance team just not think at all that her kit is extremely loaded when they make her or did they just go we need to make Fiora be the only lane bully that scales into late game in top lane that has a support like ult. But don't worry guys we have the solution. We just hit her base stats slightly that ought to fix her real problems.

How to fix her. Vitals now have a CD of 3s per champion on proc. The MS boost is now halved (as she should already be able to chase you with her cheap Qs) except during her ult. The AS slow on Riposte is removed and the cast now lasts .5s. Duelist dance heals 20->10+5->6 per level up.

The other route is to make parry cost 60 mana and her Q to start at 25 mana and scale the same and have the CDR 60->40% along with her passive having a CD of 3s upon hitting a mark. Also mana pool 300->280.

17 Comments

Kitten of Evil8 votes

Right, it seems odd that her passive is basically always up (0.5 seconds downtime is nothing!). Compare this to, say, Quinn, whose passive is very buggy and has a long cooldown (Wiki says 10 seconds, and she's "rewarded" by an only 7 second cooldown if she hits it).

BenParadox1 votes

Well, the Fiora's passive coming up again so quickly is for dueling (she is the Grand Duelist after all), and if Quinn's passive was up too often, she'd dominate top lane (probably).

Quinn does need some work though. Maybe the marksman changes coming up will help.

Llanite1 votes

Quinn hits people from range which requires little commitment, you can just hit then run and enjoy free dmg.

Fiora has to start a real fight if she wants to proc it.

Lady Hammerlock1 votes

your forgetting she can quickly evade a trade due to her passive having -sustain -speed boost -truedmg

Llanite1 votes

The health is (20+5xlevel) which is <1 AA at any given level. So no, she's always at a loss. True dmg can't 'evade' a trade, it's a DAMAGE. I have no idea what were you talking about.

Fiora does not have safe harass, it's a fact. If you're ahead, she can't even cs properly.

Yaskamasandwich4 votes

The other problem is the fact that she does her job too too well. She's an anti-tank fighter who beats mosts tanks and melee. Then she scales super well into late game. This should sound familiar because it was the same problem Ryze had. "You're melee? Kay let me just pick Ryzer and win. Early game, midlr game, later game, I winz!" He was then nerfed to the ground sadly for Ryze mains. Most bullies usually drop late game as a price for early game dominance, or have a clutch to not win all game. Unfortunately that trend seems to be changing.

Varalessia3 votes

While I think Fiora is strong, I honestly don't get all of this complaining about riposte. I think it's a fantastically done ability that reflects her theme and isn't overbearing, the entire point of the ability is to outpredict and punish your opponent by blocking a huge spell or an important aa in a down to the wire duel, plus the cd limits it to being used about once per fight.

SuperLuigiLXIV1 votes

The point of the vitals is that Fiora wants to hit them and you want her not to. So you dance and predict and if you do it right, she misses the vitals and you punish her for it.

That's fine early game. She's quite easy to stop early on. I think the issue is that later on, she doesn't get punished as much for missing vitals.

My opinion? She gets a huge CDR boost to her Q if she lands a hit on a champion or a minion. Change it so that she still gets the CDR on minion strike, but only gets it on champion strike if she hits a vital.

Jefftiffy2 votes

{quoted}

The point of the vitals is that Fiora wants to hit them and you want her not to. So you dance and predict and if you do it right, she misses the vitals and you punish her for it.

That's fine early game. She's quite easy to stop early on. I think the issue is that later on, she doesn't get punished as much for missing vitals.

My opinion? She gets a huge CDR boost to her Q if she lands a hit on a champion or a minion. Change it so that she still gets the CDR on minion strike, but only gets it on champion strike if she hits a vital.

It doesn't change the fact that she is a bully all game. And she has a nope button in her kit that adds even more damage and CC to her kit to mix in with her utility.

Also if she is stunned mid dash, she should not be able to use the Q proc.

SuperLuigiLXIV1 votes

No, my point is that it DOES.

She's a bully...IF she lands her vitals. If you can juke her Qs, especially early on, and she misses the vitals, you just have to retaliate to win the trade. Fiora is a lane bully, but if she screws up, it's easy for her to BE bullied as well. It all comes down to who wins the vitals minigame.

WarlockLaw1 votes

How about instead of gutting her we remove the % max health true damage for either physical damage or for flat + scaling true damage?

Llanite1 votes

High skill-cap builds will always dominate the game, that's how video games work.

You can only do 2-button build in easy mode, hard and impossible require more complicated builds that let you do multiple things at the same time. That holds true for both online and offline games.

So yes, Fiora is overloaded, but that's how truly skilled players stand out.

Jefftiffy1 votes

{quoted}

High skill-cap builds will always dominate the game, that's how video games work.

You can only do 2-button build in easy mode, hard and impossible require more complicated builds that let you do multiple things at the same time. That holds true for both online and offline games.

So yes, Fiora is overloaded, but that's how truly skilled players stand out.

No that's now how this game works. That is why LeeSin , Orianna , and Azir have been nerfed time and time again. Riot has said skill cap should have no influence on a champs viability. Every champ should be relatively equal regardless of skill level. Higher skill cap people on the other hand can have a tiny bit more power, but only if it is really hard to obtain that power and there is counter play to avoid it as well.

Llanite1 votes

Assume what you said is true.

Fact 1: A champion's Win rate is the average win rate of everyone playing him/her. Fact 2: Teemo Gnar both have 50% win rate.

Since Teemo is easier to play, lower-level Teemo play still the champ at full capacity and achieve maximum win rate (= 50%) Since Gnar is harder to play, lower-level Gnar cannot achieve his maximum efficiency and hence, have to have less than ideal win rate (<50%)

By these logic, either higher-level gnar has higher than 50% win rate, or the average win rate of 50% cannot be achieved.

Sinister Anubis1 votes

thats not it. How can you couple a problem saying she has it everytime her dash is up how stupid.

Kingopants1 votes

Every ability she has is broken as hell (Passive,Q,W,E,R are all incredibly strong) , but she has a 80% ban rate right now (Probably would be 95% if more people laned against her). So she is next to nonexistent in draft or ranked so just play those.

Cynika1 votes

I wouldn't mind her so much as long as the heal off her ult wasn't so strong for the entire team.

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