Melee/ Juggernaut Carries: What I've learned.

Szunray·1/6/2016, 2:50:53 AM·7 votes·1,846 views

http://art-of-lol.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/1ba0c5d4861125fa54b3593a86e8a8a3.jpg Hey Guys, I know this won't get much attention but I just thought I'd throw it out there, and maybe spread some new Ideas around.

People have been commenting lately, especially with the Pre-season changes, that ranged ADCs have never been bad, and in fact that they've been essential since the beginning of League as we know it. Mordekaiser came to prominence briefly before vanishing, and it seems like a ranged markmen will always be vital to any teamcomp. I'm making this to argue otherwise. Thing is I've been playing a lot of league lately, and I've been taking melee champions bottom lane, and I thought I'd share what I'm doing because I've had such good results from it, that I actually prefer it to a normal, Meta, ranged carry.

So as a starting point, "Who do I take Bot Lane to carry with"? These guys: Darius Garen

It's a bit surprising. These guys aren't exactly nimble, and when you think "melee carry" you usually think of Tryndamere or Yasuo, someone with strong auto attacks. The reason I say take Darius and Garen bottom (to start with) is for an easier, less stressful laning phase. Anyone who's fought these guys knows they can be hard to shift out of lane. They have free sustain and high base damages, so winning trades and even getting kills is possible early on, even without building any damage items.

Which brings us to the next point: What do I build on these guys? I've played a lot of games lately, trying to nail down a good, melee carry build and I've played a lot of melee champions bot lane as carry. Here is a good build for Darius and Garen, one that provides enough defense to let them participate in teamfights, and enough offense to be the main source of attack damage for their team:

I start the game with item 1029 item 2031 : Helps mitigate poke early game. You rely on base damages from skills and masteries early on. Grab item 2053 and item 1001 early on for more sustain, armor and movement speed.

From here, you'll try and complete a item 3056 item 3078 and item 1306 . You'll be tanky enough to fight at or near the frontlines of any teamfight, fast enough as to be unkitable (and uncatchable when splitpushing), and between your amor, speed, health and Ohmwrecker active, turrets will provide your enemy with no safety whatsoever.

But at this point you're not really doing AD carries level of damage. The next two Items I build on these characters when I play melee carry is item 3031 and item 3508 . By this point it's lategame, you've built 5 of your six items, and you're wondering what this will actually look like come level 18. I can tell you that you can become a monster, but I'll actually give the math if your interested. This is assuming you have 255 in health runes, and 4.5% movement speed quints: item 3031 + item 3508 + item 3078 : That's 60% Crit chance and 155 AD item 3056 + item 3078 : That's 550 in health, and 50 armor

Garen : Will frequently break 500 movement speed, and cruise around with just under 3000 hp. Should Garen isolate an enemy, and crit (which is likely), his Judgement (E) will do 3750 in damage before reductions.

Darius : Darius will have just over 3000 hp and just under 500 movement speed. Once Darius gets Noxian Might (from killing an enemy with his ultimate) he will get a bonus 200 AD (496 AD, no runes or masteries). At this point he'll usually crit with his W (1,718 damage before resistances) before dunking whoever he just hit (1,344 True damage), and then doing that to every other enemy in the area.

So Why play melee carries instead of a ranged one?:

  1. They hit like a truck
  2. They are durable (You'll be glad you're Garen/Darius when that Rengar gets fed, and your support will have enough time to actually heal you in a fight)
  3. They can really shut down a carry (If you get ahead with an ohmwrecker on Garen, your enemy might as well not come to lane).
  4. An ohmwrecker on an aggressive team can be a massive advantage.

It's as fun and ridiculous as it sounds, and I urge everyone who bothers to read this to give it a try. It takes a bit of getting used to, but it's a fun, do or die, way of playing league, and it's effective enough that, should I be forced to ADC in ranked, I pick a melee carry every time.

TL: DR Here's a new way to piss of BOTH teams: Yours at champion select, their's at 30 minutes.

47 Comments

MorganFreemanBot1/6/2016, 4:35:08 AM3 votes

Kill lanes are a thing, how is this surprising?

Kill lanes have existed since forever, and they're honestly not bad. The problem with the is two fold..

1: They'll leave you weak late game. Scary as Darius or Garen may be, they don't murder towers (or objectives) like an ADC, nor with the safety.

2: They're gimmicky as all fuck. All that the enemy lane has to do is not feed you and they win, and there are a few lane combos which can actively push your face in with relative ease.

ChargeItDownMid1/6/2016, 4:28:40 AM2 votes

[deleted]

Daxanater1/10/2016, 8:56:46 AM2 votes

Vayne will probably crap on both

Drackolus1/6/2016, 3:10:50 AM2 votes

I'd support it.

Alshvarin1/20/2016, 2:48:35 AM2 votes

Hello Szunray - thank you for sharing your findings on Juggernaut Carries in such a concise and informative post.

What surprised me the most, apart from your thesis, is the down votes on a post that is clearly meant to give an account of your personal experience and the conclusions you draw thereof. Why anyone would down vote such a post is baffling as it promotes a healthy discussion of tactics. I can only assume people are down voting out of disagreement, which to me is a misuse of the down vote tool as it should not be used to show agreement/disagreement but rather approval/disapproval for the type of post - the validity of the theory used in the post can be debated in the comments section (as has been done by many). Anyway, just my verbose way of telling you that your post and it's contents is appreciated :)

I have not yet tried it - I mean to soon - but I must say I was as dubious as anyone when I first read your post. I won't make you explain it again, I've read most of the comments, but I have misgivings about Ohmwrecker working. When it first came out, I was 100% on board with it. I tried to find a place for the item in my play, be it as jungler or as proxy Singed, but I finally had to give up due to the fact that there were always more efficient itemisation options out there and I was usually being punished for not using them. That being said, I definitely want to try it, and if not about the Ohmwrecker, you have convinced me that a juggernaut carry bot can be viable.

You've also given me an excuse to do something which we as a community sadly don't do enough of - break the meta ! So few people in this game are willing to experiment. And when they do, if the experiment doesn't work on the first try, they give up and go back to the meta ! It's rather frustrating for people who are trying to come up with an alternative way to play the game.

Thanks again for a fresh insight and I'll let you know how it goes !

P.S: This whole discussion brought to mind my favourite pro game of all time featuring GSG :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRAoZJolrYI Really worth a watch, I just wish things like this happened more in the pro scene !

Muted Summoner1/6/2016, 2:55:25 AM2 votes

You know if I was Garen I'd shit my self when I saw a easily 230+pound guy wearing a full set of thick ass armor that weighs a lot and giant halberd/axe? that easily weighs 40ibs who jumped about 15 feet in the fucking air. If I was the old Garen who would occasionally punch or do a flip slinging my big ass sword being able to summon a giant 2 ton sword from the air, I'd man up.

LatetotheRace1/20/2016, 7:15:51 PM1 votes

What I've learned is that Mordekaiser is a supposed juggernaut without much tank to speak of.

LordGeovanni1/10/2016, 10:11:19 AM1 votes

not saying that these lanes cant work but ap supports are your worst nightmare namely Sona Soraka and maybe even taric if the adc and team are efficent enough to allow taric to build armor and mana first if not a tiny bit of ap

kaykalos1/11/2016, 3:34:47 AM1 votes

range ad >melee ad if both farm

thumbnail91/11/2016, 1:17:01 PM1 votes

But games are over at 20....

My Name Dave1/18/2016, 9:43:16 AM1 votes

why build trinity and essence reaver on garen who has no mana? wouldn't other items synergize better with his kit?

Beldair1/18/2016, 6:26:48 PM1 votes

Eh, I actually like using Urgot bot. I build him like a bruiser or i'll go crit bruiser. Has worked well for me. Now i've seen a J4/Rengar bot dup which surprised me. But it actually worked fairly well.