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Quick Gameplay Thoughts: March 15

RiotMeddler··1 votes·138,418 views

Hi folks,

Usual Disclaimers

These posts will often contain talk about future work we're doing, or planning to do, that isn't yet guaranteed to ship. The nature of the work could change or, depending on what we discover, projects mentioned may get delayed or even stopped. If you'd like to see a Tweet whenever a new one of these posts goes up: https://twitter.com/RiotMeddler

Keeping the game pretty stable for a bit

We're hitting a point in the year now where we'll generally be keeping things pretty stable. We feel preseason followup and other recent work like crit itemization have ended up in pretty good places. Ranked and Pro play are both well underway and benefit from having some periods of comparatively low change. Upcoming patches for a while will be lighter on systemic changes as a result, barring some unexpected problems cropping up. As previously mentioned we won't be doing a midseason patch this year either. That means there won't be a shake up of things and corresponding need for follow up half way through the year, or at least not one in response to a large patch from us.

Champion balance changes will still be a regular thing of course. On that front we're hoping we'll be able to focus a bit more on tuning and polish rather than as many sets of larger changes to problem champs. We'll also still be working on non champion content like items too, though that will be more at the individual piece of content level. We'd like to do some work on Corrupting Flask and Dark Seal for example, but aren't planning anything on the scope of the Crit item work just been or the AP item changes last year.

In terms of what that means for these posts for the moderate future, probably means some will be a bit shorter given there's less to talk about, and that there'll be more focus on other topics than SR balance at times.

Neeko

Looking at Neeko's performance since her hotfix this week it looks like we've hit her a bit too hard. We'll be putting some of the removed power back in as a result, with her AS per level going back up to 2.5% to help out her on hit build in particular a bit. As mentioned previously our goal wasn't to kill the build (the on hit damage is there for a reason!) but to bring it down given it was the strongest thing in the game at the time by a decent margin.

http://ddragon.leagueoflegends.com/cdn/6.24.1/img/champion/Ziggs.png

173 Comments

Mezo19 votes

Can we get some serious changes for these items item 2065 item 3905 item 3116 ? like making them more efficient on mages support. Also give us some reasons to buy this itemitem 3092 because there is no point of doing that..

Häxel1 votes

I would maybe agree on 3 out these 4 items, but Rylais really doesn't need a buff right now. it is allread quite strong ona few champions, mid or support. And a buff could kill mid and even toplane/jungle balance. Like we see even Ryze Players building Rylais second.

Mezo2 votes

Because Rylai's is giving you 90 ap, which is should be around 70~75. Ryze used to build 2 mana items without any cdr before the ap itemization rework in 8.4, now he can get 20% cdr and 15% from runes without getting item 3173 , so he is open to get any items he wants without putting himself behind. Rylai's need some changes in the build's path and the slow duration imo, And lose some ap in return.

Queš12 votes

Does this mean no work on Aatrox ?

RiotMeddler14 votes

He'll get some work still, whether as a larger balance change or as one of the smaller number of larger functionality changes we'll still be doing. Will share details whenever I've got some to share.

Queš5 votes

Are you happy with his current build/playstyle (Full dmg)?

If not,can you guys consider pulling him closer to juggernaut/sustain fighter style he was originally supposed to be ?

JakeParkbench9 votes

Hey Meddler,

I am curious if you can do another breakdown of percent queues for roles similar to last year, and how changes have impacted or failed to impact this over time.

And I guess if possible data on percent champion types (marksmen, tank, etc) being played over time.

I feel like player/community perception has a large impact regardless of win rates towards these two at times and would like to hear how you guys feel about this.

Thanks as always for you time doing these,

JakeParkbench

RiotMeddler13 votes

Sure, I'll get some data into an upcoming post, does seem like a good time to revisit.

AIQ8 votes

Hey Meddler, The crazy Shyvana main is back. ;)

It's been a few Patches now. Can we have Shyvana scale with elder?

Is it possible to remove the decay on her W, also since AP Shyvana took the W ratio can AD Shyvana gain total AD on it's ratio?

Can we please have her ult cool down work while dead?

Is Shyvanas passive up for a rework potentially before her actual?

DCYOUNG8882 votes

I feel like the w decay removal is fine but I feel like she needs her q ad ratio back than remove w decay because it was nerfed due to press the attack adjustments.

Alzon1 votes

Keep in mind that she can also instantly proc Conqueror with W + AA + Q + E/R. Actually kinda nutty...

DCYOUNG8881 votes

Hold on q can proc conqueror stacks twice like press the attack? I did not know that.

Alzon2 votes

It’s treated as two autos instead of a single spell hit.

DJBlackVoice7 votes

Still nothing to say about Yasuo Vayne ? Realy???

Scarletmeow6 votes

Item work, does this mean a possible second look at support item's and how to counter the general abuse cases? (Non supports taking them for the gold gen and getting the item nerfed) Relic in particular already felt bad before it was nerfed once again (Near impossible to get gold using it past 20 since your team starts one shotting minions before you get a chance to proc) and in general support gold income feels too low compared to other teammates. Especially since they're expected to get items at the same speed while also controlling vision.

RiotMeddler11 votes

Small to moderate sized support item work's a possibility during the year, large overhauls would like be a preseason thing if doing one.

In terms of overall support income it's still around the highest it's ever been and the gold cost of vision for supports around as low as its ever been.

DCYOUNG8886 votes

Any plans for Galio Galio or Swain Swain?

Spideraxe6 votes

Hey meddler even tho it's a bit early but would preseason work this year be larger scope then last year's since you guys cut midseason

RiotMeddler5 votes

Potentially yeah, we've got some early work exploring ideas for the preseason at the moment as patch to patch work slows down a bit.

Star Weàver6 votes

Hi Meddler have you planed anything for item 3030 or Taliyah (in mid lane) ?

BadPiriPiri6 votes

Hi Meddler?

Do you have anything planned for Swain? He was nerfed due to being strong on the bot lane (that is now in a better state9 and now he struggles in the solo lane

Bigsnax6 votes

We'd like to do some work on Corrupting Flask and Dark Seal for example

According to op.gg singed is the 5th worst top laner in the game with a winrate of 47% and pick rate of 2%
The majority of users on the singedmains subreddit are always complaining about how horrible of a champ he has become due to game bugs, lack of itemization and rune options, and direct/indirect nerfs.

Although I'm not a singed main myself I still think he has one of the best and most unique kits in the game and I agree with his subreddit that it feels like you guys are just constantly ignoring him and dont care about how awful he is.

Jenivie5 votes

Thoughts on syndra? she could use some help with her W ;( maybe some bugfixes

YL 6664 votes

Hey Meddler,sorry if i bother you again,but will wukong get VFX changes along with the "mini rework"?

RiotMeddler4 votes

If changes that require new VFX happen then yes. Unlikely we change any of his VFX where gameplay functionality is remaining the same though.

painkills2 votes

So some changes might eventually require new VFX.

XD

Exciting. I'm glad that things like this aren't off the table, because it implies that the work being done on him has game-health as a higher priority than "quick and easy changes".

Linhardt4 votes

Any thoughts on Syndra?

For Senna4 votes

Any plans for rakan?

daraghlol23 votes

Any thoughts on Akali's state at the moment?

Jabalor3 votes

Any comments on the Urgot buffs/changes that are right now on the PBE and overall state of him, Meddler?

antibehroz3 votes

Are you guys considering working on Varus after his planned buffs were cancelled because of the w bug fix?

Sir Rouge3 votes

Hello Meddler! Need your help!

There has a been an important mechanic removal recently for Syndra that has not been mentionned in the patch notes, and it hurt Syndra mains quite a bit.

Could you please go look at the post I made about it in the previous Gameplay Thoughts? You must have not seen it.

Minarde3 votes

If SR balance is going to be relatively stable for a while, could we get some discussion about (and hopefully work on) Twisted Treeline and ARAM? It's been a long time since either map (TT in particular) has gotten balance work. Moreover, both maps have recently been overshadowed by Nexus Blitz and ARURF.

For instance, the Monster Hunter and bounty changes have apparently addressed funneling in SR. However, funneling (aka Hypercarry/Support) still seems dominant in TT. Are there any follow-ups previously considered for SR funneling that could now be adapted for TT?

Jesus is Savior3 votes

Can you "polish" the "monster hunter" debuff? You initially said you want to support "junglers who do not want to complete their jungle item" - but because the monster hunter debuff never "turns off" later in the game, you are still forced to either sell your machete or complete the item. The debuff should be removed completely after a certain amount of cs or a certain amount of game time. So if you opt to not complete your jungle item, you aren't forced to kill monsters at a stage in the game where you really should not be killing monsters. You could even be fancy and turn it off after a certain amount of gold gained. eg: if you have obtained 2775 gold over the course of the game (the cost of bloodrazor + refillable potion), then the debuff turns off regardless of what you buy. Basically: the debuff was meant to stop funneling by stopping a jungler from killing lots of minions in the early game, so it should be polished and fixed so that it does that and only does that, and does not have negative consequences later in the game when funneling is irrelevant.

There's one more use-case where the debuff hurts legitimate jungling. If I kill one camp and level 2 gank, and my ally dies but I am left alive.... I can't tax because one cannon will be enough to trigger the debuff.

True Garen3 votes

[{quoted}](name=I Follow Christ,realm=NA,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=yprUEf5i,comment-id=0057,timestamp=2019-03-15T19:52:23.586+0000)

Can you "polish" the "monster hunter" debuff? You initially said you want to support "junglers who do not want to complete their jungle item" - but because the monster hunter debuff never "turns off" later in the game, you are still forced to either sell your machete or complete the item. The debuff should be removed completely after a certain amount of cs or a certain amount of game time. So if you opt to not complete your jungle item, you aren't forced to kill monsters at a stage in the game where you really should not be killing monsters. You could even be fancy and turn it off after a certain amount of gold gained. eg: if you have obtained 2775 gold over the course of the game (the cost of bloodrazor + refillable potion), then the debuff turns off regardless of what you buy. Basically: the debuff was meant to stop funneling by stopping a jungler from killing lots of minions in the early game, so it should be polished and fixed so that it does that and only does that, and does not have negative consequences later in the game when funneling is irrelevant.

There's one more use-case where the debuff hurts legitimate jungling. If I kill one camp and level 2 gank, and my ally dies but I am left alive.... I can't tax because one cannon will be enough to trigger the debuff.

Just get rid of "Monster Hunter" completely. It's a band-aid that doesn't address the underlying issues.

Samuel Murphy2 votes

Going to shake things up in the winter for preseason or are you moving away from big patches entirely?

RiotMeddler5 votes

Preseasons will still be pretty significant patches, no plans to stop those.

Luxanna Magica2 votes

Does that mean no more preseasons like last year's where it feels like almost nothing changed?

Dark Star Cho2 votes

Is it possible to not do a knee-jerk re-addition of power to neeko? Know you guys have the numbers but I imagine allot of players started picking her up this patch (and even post nerf) off of it's publicity.

Galiö1 votes

I mean. She had a 59.5% winrate bot lane with a good pick rate, wasnt really a knee jerk reaction.

Iota Theta5 votes

{quoted}

I mean. She had a 59.5% winrate bot lane with a good pick rate, wasnt really a knee jerk reaction.

I think they’re referring to the sudden buffing back up her AS per level.

MankeyMadness2 votes

{quoted}

I mean. She had a 59.5% winrate bot lane with a good pick rate, wasnt really a knee jerk reaction.

Hes saying adding power back after the hotfix might be unneeded comsidering people started trying a "busted" (on phreaks own words) build that didn't actually work.

Inventive2 votes

Are you guys working on a fix for Neekos W? Vandiril showed that it is a consistent and impactful one.

Lexand2 votes

Any plans on jungle? We don't like krugs being the only camp worth taking, blue buff doesn't seem that jungle-friendly, but at the same time it's op for midlaners, blue-side jungle doesn't feel worth taking, will you make any changes? maybe mid-season?

Roy Absalom2 votes

Hi Meddler,

Do you know anything about the team that was announced to be working on the optimization of the client ?

In the same vein, are some QOL changes on their way for the client ? (Like keeping the "sort by" in champ select over other champ select : if we sort by favorite, keeping favorite as default for ex)

Thank you

SmileBoyy2 votes

Hey meddler, do u have any thoughts on rumble? He doesn't get any update for a long time

Theorex2 votes

Ryze?

Jonii Shinsu2 votes

Ryze?

True Garen2 votes

Meddler: Regarding Shyvana -

Please fix her passive to scale with Elder Dragons.

Also,I really think that they neglected to change W scaling to total AD (rather than bonus AD) when they removed the AP scaling from it. (Right? That's how it should work for her...)

And let her Ult recharge while she's dead.

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