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Quick Gameplay Thoughts: September 26

RiotMeddler··1 votes·42,694 views

Morning all,


Usual Disclaimers

These posts will often contain talk about future work we're doing, or planning to do, that isn't yet guaranteed to ship. The nature of the work could change or, depending on what we discover, projects mentioned may get put delayed or even stopped. If you'd like to see a Tweet whenever a new one of these posts goes up: https://twitter.com/RiotMeddler

Runes on PBE inc!

Short post today since, all going according to plan, we should have Runes and at least some other pre-season content hitting PBE shortly and we're working on both making sure that goes smooth/talking about all of those details. It's worth mentioning again that what hits PBE is still work in progress. Numbers especially are likely to change, particularly those on Runes themselves, but also potentially things like style bonuses, which additional base stats champs get, some early item stats etc. We'll have Runes on PBE for 3 cycles, rather than the usual 1, so a far longer period for things to change over as well.


Probably tweaking Jaurim's Fist along with Sterak's

Most likely adjustment is to pull some of its stats forward a bit, make them there from purchase, rather than as dependent on building up stacks so that it's gold efficient relative to component items (Long Sword/Ruby Crystal) quicker.


More pre-season stuff coming to PBE over the next few weeks

Runes is the biggest piece of gameplay content for pre-season by a huge margin. There are some other smaller bits and pieces also coming though that aren't all ready yet. Expect to see some of them show up over the next few weeks as they get to a ready enough state.

http://ddragon.leagueoflegends.com/cdn/6.24.1/img/champion/Ziggs.png

265 Comments

World Ender12 votes

I've noticed a lot of complaints about there not being a Keystone Rune similar to DFT that fits DOT mages or Battlemages very well. All of the keystones seem to either focus on basic attacks or burst damage instead of sustained magic damage.

Do you have plans to add something for old DFT users? I understand that DFT felt really uninteractive and wouldn't really work as a keystone, but I'd like to see something that focuses less on burst and more on AP sustained damage.

RiotMeddler14 votes

We wouldn't want to add something exactly like DFT given its proven to be very mandatory on some champs without offering enough gameplay. Having said that if some of the DoT/sustained spell casting champs that currently use it end up struggling we'd certainly want to get something in that fills its niche, just in a better way. That's one of the more likely candidates for a not too long after launch additional Rune (4th Sorcery Keystone potentially).

HenzoAF6 votes

I'm currently in doubt about what to take with Malzahar

warpenguin5551 votes

This is what I'm taking for sorcery. Ignore the secondary path I had to fill it in to get a direct link. http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/preseason-update/8200-8229?build=21200361

I do agree that battle mages aren't getting much though

HenzoAF1 votes

I don't like to use CDR on Malz, I go for more damage like: item 3151 item 3020 item 3116 item 3089 item 3135 item 3146 Hextech for sustain

Cosmic Warper1 votes

{quoted}

I don't like to use CDR on Malz, I go for more damage like: item 3151 item 3020 item 3116 item 3089 item 3135 item 3146 Hextech for sustain

cdr is necessary on malz. Without cdr once you use your abilities you're a sitting duck in a teamfight. You have to keep casting to be useful.

HenzoAF2 votes

I have never faced a situation where I wasn't doing something in a TF, Malz damage comes from his E, and CDR don't help you use your E more often because it don't stack on top of another E, so, I don't use CDR.

SzGamer2275 votes

Aha! It's a case of two different players with different playstyles taking different runes!

sit kid3 votes

How about adding some AP ratio (adaptive ofc) to precisions Press The Attack?

Could seem like a really good sustained damage tool for mages like Azir, Teemo, Karthus, Cass ect... and allow them to really shine at sustained damage

RiotMeddler9 votes

We're testing just that at the moment. Not a guaranteed thing yet, but showing some promise.

Naqel3 votes

Speaking of making the Precision tree more compatible with AP based characters, could we maybe get some AP items based on: item 2015 The energized status is currently tied completely with marksmen, and it'd be nice to get some extra flexibility in that regard.

For example: item 2015 + item 3145 = Hextech Supercharger <stats> Passive: Moving and attacking will make an attack Energized UNIQUE Passive - Magic Bolt: Your Energized attacks deal ( <level scaled> + <AP scaling> ) bonus magic damage and apply spell effects. UNIQUE Active - Supercharge: Your next attack immediately becomes Energized (40 second cooldown, shared with other Hextech items).

dershanksi9 votes

Hey Meddler!

Sorry for asking again, but what do you think about the current state and gameplay of MonkeyKing ? I hope you may take a closer look on our Monkeyking.

I really do love this character, but his gameplay and kit doesnt really match with his idea.

I mean, with item 3147 you really do have an insane Single Target Burst, but like the old Talon , he has that kind of problem that after he found his target -> get in, kill it (maybe) and die as well.

As long as his playstyle will remain like it is, i think he needs some kind of disengage, like a 2nd Decoy with a system like Akali Ult? Just an Idea.

Would be awesome to read what you guys think about him.

Btw, last changes on him were in April 2014. It was a nerf. [zombie-nunu-bummed]

#MakeTheMonkeyKingAgain

Greetings

AoiTheAngry1 votes

Shut. Up. He's. Fine.

Galacius14 votes

This doesn't really help the discussion and frankly would be considered jerkish. Did you have something to add that contributes to the discussion? For example, how is Wukong fine and what makes him not need any buffs or fixes?

RiotMeddler8 votes

Yeah, I'd agree Wukong's playstyle's a bit all in or nothing much of the time and that his theme could support a bunch of cooler stuff. He's not currently on our shortlist of likely immediate next gameplay updates, he is someone we've been talking about as a possible candidate though.

Sun Wu Ryuumoku5 votes

Okay... So can u (riot) at least fix the bug where he stay visible despite using his decoy ?

T3BY6 votes

When are the udyr changes comming back?

RiotMeddler4 votes

Not sure, like a lot of stuff they're on the back burner somewhat as we work on pre-season.

The Last Ballad6 votes

On the twitch stream, some gameplay for "Summon Aerie" was shown and one thing concerns me. It's the fact that Aerie travels at ~200 ms at all points of the game.

Towards the end of the gameplay you could see Aerie lagging behind for 10-30 seconds as Nami ran away from or advanced towards enemies. It makes sense for it to be slow early game so that you there is a reward for taking an aggressive stance and being closer to enemies, but late game most of the supports that would want it are too busy trying to stay away from the enemies that can burst them down to wait 5 seconds for Aerie to wander back.

Maybe having it have a certain distance it has to be within after X number of seconds so it is guaranteed to reach you after 20 seconds(for comparison, Meteor has a cooldown of 20-8 seconds, and Electrocute having 55-25 seconds, both being much more impactful)? Imagine being a Janna, especially after her rework and all of the new % ms boosts she can now get with the runes, and having to wait 40-80 seconds because you hit someone with your w near their base, and they decided to chase you back to yours(and that is if you wait in base, if you had to go bot, then recall to respond to top it could be longer). Or Soraka in the botlane, and the first champ(as dictated by the single-target-effect-if-an-aoe-hits-multiple-people picking routine) happens to be the top laner, on the other side of the map. It would be nice of your keystone to show up to see you again for the next two minutes, wouldn't it?

Having one of the most applicable runes punish you because you are faster than an unmounted kled, especially on a class of champs that all have ms boosts(Soraka's q on hit, Sona's w, Janna's passive/w, Nami's passive, Karma's e, Rakan's w/e/r) and tend to go for item 3117, does not seem to be in line with the other keystones. I know every keystone has an opportunity cost, but having the rune punish you for smart playing on a squishy and defensive class, or for building a near mandatory stat? Late game, if you are moving around like you should be, it has the potentially highest cooldown(which can infinite, if you are actively trying to avoid it for some reason) if you are not in a position to hunt it down.

TL:DR Aerie return is too slow and cannot keep up with champs without boots, let alone champs with them(though the slowness in pre minute 10-15 is understandable). And there are cross map abilities that would screw you out of a keystone for way too long if you have Aerie with you, and the champ affected is far away.

ddoA5 votes

Since Evelynn, Azir and Xin Zhao reworks are done, what are your plans on doing next when it comes to update schedule ? Also when will LeBlanc and Rengar come when it comes to some type of update/rework ? Are they even in plan or not ?

RiotMeddler4 votes

Most smaller update work's currently paused, or progressing slowly, with a lot of people moving onto pre-season stuff instead. LeBlanc's still being looked at, though unclear when that will be something ready to ship. Post pre-season once we've got things settled down more we'll get back into more gameplay update work and see what's looking promising enough to talk about.

RavenHusky5 votes

Will the champions' base stat changes be up alongside the runes on the PBE?

RiotMeddler5 votes

Should be yeah, though they're still work in progress, particularly for some classes.

Carnicore2 votes

Oh really? Who's being difficult?

Kaori5 votes

So Karma and Graves are still planned for this upcoming patch?

RiotMeddler6 votes

That's the plan.

PandaNator434 votes

What are your thoughts on Players/Champions being Elusive in League of Legends?

The feeling I’m going for is “Spiderman contorting through a cloud of bullets,” or the fighting style of Aang the last airbender.

This is likely something that should fit under the Domination Path.

My initial take is that the Ruin would add a new active effect on the players boots (just like Hunt of the Blood Moon Ruin) with any of combination of these effects:

  1. Can be used multiple times a battle. I think multiple uses in a fight with small payouts (damage reduction), would feel better than one big payout (like Fizz’s E).
  2. Short range dash, along the lines of the dash on Akali’s W.
  3. % decreased damage taken from single target effects for .5 seconds. (Its easier to dodge a sword than an explosion. Also, this fits the Assassin archetype of combating high damage threats.)
  4. Some other 4th thing :)

I’d love to see something in League of legends fulfill the space for the “Elusive Assassin” fantasy.

RiotMeddler20 votes

I think the fantasy's a cool one that we could do in ways we haven't already in LoL. I'd be much more inclined to do mechanics like that on individual champion kits though rather than on a Rune available to everyone. That's due to some fantasy mismatch with being able to pair such an effect with anyone, difficulty making it feel as good as it should without being able to make character specific animations and some game health/counterplay concerns with giving anyone access to things like significant single target damage reduction and/or a short range dash, especially on a low CD.

PandaNator434 votes

Awesome! That makes a ton of sense. Thanks for the reply, these posts are great!

ImaginesTigers3 votes

Are they going to be any champion balance changes in this upcoming PBE, or will it be entirely devoted to Runes Reforged?

RiotMeddler3 votes

There will be balance changes in the next two patches (7.20 and 7.21). Runes will be on PBE at the same time as those, but will be shipping later (7.22). We're putting the system on earlier than other content normally hits PBE because it's large enough to need a lot more testing/feedback.

iahim985 votes

If the runes come this PBE cycle, wouldn't that affect the balance changes that will be tested in those cycles? As on live we still have runes/masteries and ppl on PBE will test it with the new runes.

RiotMeddler5 votes

Somewhat yeah, and that's an issue we're facing for our internal tests too since almost everything's being played on new Runes at this point. We think that's ok though because it's much better to adjust any balance changes in the context of the system that will be around long term, rather than balancing instead just for the next 4 weeks that will be left in the old system once 7.20 goes live.

Solari Fortune3 votes

Will the Looter (Name pending) Keystone be up along with the other runes or will it be added a little later?

RiotMeddler10 votes

Should be yeah. I think the name that'll be in today is 'Kleptomancy'.

Kowe The Ewok3 votes

Any love for Hecarim with the upcomign changes? He already is in a bad spot - and with runes reworked he will also loose access to movementspeed quints. His clear, which is already horrific will get worse. He might make decent use of the short duration MS bonus effect you add - but as it stand he will only me MORE inconsistent than he already is, with smaller power windows, yet even less average power than he already has making his underwhelming jungle clear even worse.

He desperately needs buffs, or at least a power shift (like taking damage away from his ultimate, but making his Q refund mana upon hitting monsters).

HenzoAF12 votes

PREDATOR Enchants your boots with the active effect 'Predator.'

Channel for 3 seconds out of combat to gain 45% movement speed for 15 seconds. Damaging attacks or abilities end this effect, dealing 60 - 140 (+0.2 bonus AD)(+0.3 AP) bonus adaptive damage.

180 second cooldown. Starts the game on cooldown and goes on cooldown if interrupted while channeling.


SUDDEN IMPACT Using a dash, leap, blink, or teleport grants you 5% additional damage against champions for the next 3 seconds.


PHASE RUSH Hitting an enemy champion with 3 unique attacks or abilities within 2 seconds grants 30 - 60% Movement Speed based on level.

Melee: Additionally, gain 75% Slow Resistance for the duration.

Duration: 3 seconds Cooldown: 15 seconds


CELERITY Gain 3% increased Movement Speed and add 8% of your Bonus Movement Speed to your AP or AD, Adaptive (based on level).


WATERWALKING Gain 25 Movement Speed and up to +30 Ability Power or +21.0 Attack Damage, Adaptive (based on level) when in the river.


FLEET FOOTWORK Attacking and moving builds Energy stacks. At 100 stacks, your next attack is Energized.

Energized attacks heal you for 5 - 50 (+0.10 Bonus AD, +0.20 AP) and grant 30% increased movement speed for 1 second.

Adalvar3 votes

Is the Evelynn rework hitting the PBE today?

YourSh4dow11 votes

its already on PBE u just cant see it...

Cyber HeroXL6 votes

{quoted}

its already on PBE u just cant see it...

it's a simple meme, but it works.

RiotMeddler3 votes

Should be.

Lord Dolan3 votes

Do you believe that sorcery may be too strong as a side path due to minor runes that in general seem to out value those in other trees such as gathering storm and ultimate hat?

Isn't dominance hindered by the fact that the first line of minor runes are mainly support based? Considering its a tree for mainly assassins I find it strange to see little benefit there. The take down reward on eyeball collection in general seems pretty meh.

Are number changes apparent for obvious offenders or is it still being tested?

RiotMeddler6 votes

It's possible some trees will be too appealing, or too weak, as secondaries, even if they're appropriately balanced as primaries. If that's the case we'll use the style bonuses (stats you get from a combination of trees) to balance that out.

We don't believe vision's purely a support power, with assassins, junglers, and other champs who roam/hunt also benefiting a lot from being able to place or remove it. That's one of the reasons it's found in the domination tree. Another is that the trees aren't intended to map directly to classes. Domination should be appealing to assassins, but it's not the assassin only tree, inspiration's probably going to appeal to a lot of supports but it's not the support tree etc.

I'm more suspicious Eyeball collector's too strong than too weak. It doesn't look that large at first glance, but numbers add up especially in longer games.

Numbers are all subject to change.

Flemman1 votes

how do you feel about the vision rune in the dominance tree especially?

To me, I fear that as a support I will be forced to take it for vision controle despise the fact it's effective as a first path only for damage dealer support.

For the other, you are kinda bound to the the tree as secondary with little to no effective combo, aka you take one vision rune and either the 8% ms or 1% item cdr. That all there is there for support and it feels pretty bad as enchanter for exemple

The Last Ballad1 votes

So 5 runes that can appeal to a support in a damage focused tree isn't enough?

also its +8 out of combat ms(up to 48 total out of combat ms) and +1%(up to 31%) item active cdr, both of which stack upon unique champion takedowns, which includes assists.

Steelflame3 votes

Yea. If you get the Insight mastery (+5% item CDR, overcap CDR, CDR, and summoner CDR) you'll hit 36% CDR on items. That can easily be the difference between having your items up between teamfights, especially with things like Redemption's 2 minute CD.

Also, I can see a very... interesting setup for Zhonya's loving mages such as Fiddle or Kat, or mages aiming to try and counterpick high threat AD assassins such as Zed in lane. http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/preseason-update/8100-8112?build=10001326

That setup gives you a grand total of 51% active item CDR for Zhonya's. That puts Zhonyas on a 58.8 second Cd, and you get one free Stasis cast at 6 minutes, before you'd have access to Zhonya's normally, in time for the level 6 powerspike to counter it on Zed or the likes.

HenzoAF2 votes

Will there be other active on effects on boots like Predator? I think this ideia is so innovative that we need more keystones like this.

RiotMeddler6 votes

Possibly. We wanted to avoid adding a lot of extra buttons through the runes system, especially given the increase in average active items per champ over time. We made an exception for Predator though because its used in circumstances that don't overlap with as much other stuff going on (before combat/while moving strategically around the map). Other boot enchants like that would certainly be possibilities, would be much more critical of mid combat ones.

Glory ln Death2 votes

How concerned are you that Evelynn will go through the PBE in a Runes Reforged environment, and then be released into the current Runes and Masteries environment? I know the PBE isn't used primarily for balance purposes, but it seems like there could be pretty significant problems coming from that.

RiotMeddler8 votes

Not concerned. Might mean her release balance is slightly off for a couple of patches, makes much more sense IMO to balance her for the system that will be live long term rather than one she'll only briefly interact with.

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