Nemesis Draft Made Me Realize...

Stephenizgod·Feb 12, 2015·58 votes·4,990 views

...that there are no "bad" champs. When trying to decide who to give them we always debate on who is actually bad and who isn't. Take our favorite Gem Knight , if anyone honestly thinks he is bad then you do not understand him at all. He is incredibly strong! Point and Click stun, heals for reals, armor buff to his allies based on his armor, 2 AoE nukes one of which based on his armor the other gives a damage steroid to his allies. He is goooood! Plus you can just give them a bunch of squishy AD champs and stack armor.

Ive only played 2 games so far, but each time i cant ever decided who i would actually want to give them. Once i think long enough im like "oh god no i dont want to fight that..." so i think this Game Mode is really good right now specially with all this talk of OP champions in every game (lookin at you Kat and Zed).

This is just my opinion though, tell me what y'all think.

112 Comments

Leti the YetiFeb 13, 201533 votes

lemme explain something strong and weak are "RELATIVE"

only reason why taric is "bad" because he is weak relative to braum since this is a game mode where everyones bad... all of a sudden, taric doesnt feel so bad

Only Play DariusFeb 13, 20152 votes

second time i played nemesis draft mode, a first time Skarner went 18/3.

Against mobile champs, skarner is weak. But against immobile champs, he's OP.

It's all relative.

SelflessTeammateFeb 13, 20156 votes

And he's fun, too. I mean, using FEEL MY STING under a turret never gets old.

Ah, how I love Skarner. Seriously, I get why he's not considered top-tier due to his lack of mobility, but he's freaking fun.

ZacsRealmFeb 13, 20152 votes

"lack of mobility"

Correct me if i'm wrong but doesn't Skarner have a shield that also gives him a MS boost?

SelflessTeammateFeb 14, 20151 votes

Compared to champs like Lee Sin, Vi, or Nidalee, yeah, he doesn't have quite the same mobility, as he can't "leap" right into a fight from almost anywhere, so to speak.

His W's a little tricky to work with because it's a fairly modest movement speed boost, and you need to also hit your E for your average lane-gank to be successful, and his E doesn't seem to have quite the same range as Nocturne's Q.

Don't get me wrong for a second, I'm not saying he's necessarily inferior, because I don't believe that. I just believe him to be a bit tricky to work with, as he lacks the same sort of in-your-face jumps that other gank-heavy junglers have.

Also, Talisman sadly doesn't work with his ult on Rift, like it does on ARAM. No one seems to have noticed this but me, or no one cares, but it's true. Activate Ghost and the Talisman with your ult and you're pulling them way far back, and it's a guaranteed kill on anyone he chooses to bring back with him. Very nice for people who are guarding a turret, as he can just yank them from underneath it rather safely.

Mandang0Feb 13, 20151 votes

Exactly this.

Killer X 12Feb 13, 201525 votes

There are no bad champs, only stupid summoners.

Major SparklesFeb 13, 20158 votes

But there are bad team comps.

Heal n PeelFeb 15, 20151 votes

And this is what the mode tries to show. Just got out of a game where they gave us all tanks and we gave them ADCs (plus Elise). Having one damage type makes for a bad day.

InsaneSamuraiFeb 12, 201521 votes

I think this goes to show that for balance as a whole nerfing the few top guys rather than buffing the rest is the way to go here. When you ignore the obvious top picks that nobody is going to give each other, there are really a ton of fairly balanced champs to work with. People seem to think that giving Taric, Urgot, or Yorick to the enemy team is a good call, but all of those champs can be extremely powerful, and it usually backfires. Hell even the jungle is better in this mode, because since nobody is giving each other Lee or J4, everyone sucks at farming it(unless someone gives them a Yorick... don't do that :D).

Even though I'm sure it's going to be mostly tank and support teams going at it, I have to say I love this mode. People inherently work together more when you have a chaotic team comp, and nobody rages or throws the game solely because of someone's champ selection. It also seems to have alot less ragers, which is just wonderful :)

I also have a feeling there will be quite a few more Yorick and Urgot players in the world after this :D

Syn ZykanFeb 12, 20155 votes

http://prntscr.com/649kko My jungle Taric disagrees with it being hard to farm >:D

I am loving this game mode so much because I always played "bad" champs for roles, and now I get to shine with people HANDING ME MY CHAMPS And yes I bought Taric just now because of that game >.>

InsaneSamuraiFeb 12, 20155 votes

Once you get going Taric and many many other champs can farm it just fine. When compared to J4 or Lee however, they are really bad at it, particularly the start.

JJ H0GFeb 13, 20151 votes

I'm mostly playing this mode so I can try to get Yorick since he isn't in free rotation.

Also, Lulu jungle OP nerf plz.

BeersteinFeb 13, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=JJ H0G,realm=NA,application-id=LFfTlAky,discussion-id=ykTzYFiw,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2015-02-13T02:19:31.373+0000)

I'm mostly playing this mode so I can try to get Yorick since he isn't in free rotation.

Also, Lulu jungle OP nerf plz.

Lulu everything is op, had one on an enemy team as adc, ugh she wrecked us so stupidly hard even though we managed to get a decent team comp.

PokkuFeb 13, 20151 votes

I recently understood how funny it is to play Lulu, but I couldn't manage to play her that well in the jungle. I'm missing AS runes and I'm also fairly new to jungling so those are probably the reasons. I'll try ADC now that you say she's viable at that :D AD Lulu is much funnier to play than AP to be honest.

Radnar the boldFeb 13, 20152 votes

LULU IS LOCO, i swear if someone gave me lulu in this mode i would laugh because she is a very strong support and can do damage late game.

GaleWinUnleashedFeb 15, 20151 votes

Someone gave me Zac, and I had approximately 8 successful ganks by mid-game. Strong initiations are amazing.

BeatzBoyFTWFeb 13, 201511 votes

When I pick Urgot in normal games:

Team: Omg dun Urgot pls. Wtf man, plz gg report Urgot pick, surr@20/

When I pick Urgot after he was seen in LCS

Team: Oh wow, u got Urgot. Sweet man, take my bot lane :D

Tooo many f'ckwits nowadays....

EarthpineFeb 12, 201510 votes

I almost forgot that Zilean had ever existed. And then someone picked Zilean for me.

At first I was all "oh no I don't know how to play this champ!" and then I realised that he is such a powerhouse. I made the enemy team and my team have lots of fun playing this game, and there were the funny moments of when I accidentally kill someone with a bomb on another champion.

I think I may have found my main

StephenizgodFeb 13, 20159 votes

Who gives Zilean to the enemy team lmfao!!! Thats like giving them Jarvan.

GigglingAngelFeb 15, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I almost forgot that had ever existed. And then someone picked Zilean for me.

At first I was all "oh no I don't know how to play this champ!" and then I realised that he is such a powerhouse. I made the enemy team and my team have lots of fun playing this game, and there were the funny moments of when I accidentally kill someone with a bomb on another champion.

I think I may have found my main

I just got done playing as him, too. The only complaint I have with him is every time I put my ult on someone, they don't make any use of it.
Even when I rush in to put it on them, they instead use their heals and summoner spells to get away ... making my ult useless 3/4 of the time. >.>

Forbidden SirenFeb 13, 20157 votes

I played a game where someone gave me Poppy.

Jokes on them, I know how to play her.

I carry my team to victory. It was awesome.

RozzetaFeb 13, 20155 votes

It's easier to find the enjoyment in the other picks when the OP is out of question.

JambatFeb 13, 201511 votes

{quoted}

It's easier to find the enjoyment in the other picks when the OP is out of question.

This is something that shouldn't be overlooked. When you remove the God tier characters out of the equation, a lot more champions become viable.

cshakesFeb 13, 20157 votes

Oh, you can still get the God tier supports. Janna item 3165 item 3089 item 3115 + more AP Charge a tornado, shield yourself and slap the assholes to death.

SelflessTeammateFeb 13, 20155 votes

If you want to really prove a point, give them nothing but super-squishy ADCs. Nothing else. Throw 'em Vayne, Varus, Sivir, whatever. Watch how that works out for them, because it doesn't.

Killing five top-tier ADCs. I haven't seen it, but I want to, and I know it can happen. Talk about the most satisfying pentakill ever accomplished by anyone in the history of anything ever.

Radnar the boldFeb 13, 20151 votes

Then late game when they manage to do all the damage and push towers faster than you can say "why the fuck did we give them ADC", trust me if you do this then you better win the game under 20 minutes or else you will be eaten shit.

KijinxFeb 13, 20151 votes

Yeah except an all AD team is the easiest team to itemize against. Just don't give them vayne since she cares little for armour and then everybody build thornmail. Claim your victory.

Ryuku CruxisFeb 14, 20151 votes

Just finished a game of give them all adc. Works like a charm.

Important points are to give them ones with no to little escapes, and ones little mixed damage to easier itemize against, as some have a considerable amount of magic damage. Playing this mode made me realize most, if not all, immobile adc have good magic damage in their kit.

Good idea to stay away from Vayne and Corki, they don't care much for armor.

InsaneSamuraiFeb 15, 20151 votes

This usually works really well if Taric isn't banned, since he's gonna be one of the first guys they give you. Then once the whole game is ADCs Taric just runs around with a big troll grin all game :)

WathehellsupdogFeb 13, 20154 votes

There aren't any real bad champs in the game, just bad team comps. I played a game, my team and I thought haha we derped enemy team so hard by giving them all ap damage supports. All we need to do is stack mr and it's a win. How wrong we were. They were the first to get a tower, they were the first to get an inhib. tower, the first to get inhibitor, and they took both nexus turrets (they took all outer turrets and mid inhib was the only one down). The ridiculous amount of cc and utility on that team was going to be our downfall, but luckily we were able to scale into the late game and finish with my split pushing top and team focusing bot. All in all it was a close one, our only saving grace was that they didn't have a lot of ad to take down the nexus quickly enough.

Oathkeeper91Feb 13, 20153 votes

I feel as though this is a pretty decent game mode to see champs that are underrated and not picked very often. I haven't seen a Yorick or Eve in ranked in a long time, but playing this mode gave me the chance to refresh their kits and re-learn some counterplay.

The only real rule I've seen so far materialize is not to give the other team an adc that they can form a comp around. Besides that, it just seems like a circlejerk of support comps with a single caster or bruiser doing damage.

StephenizgodFeb 13, 20154 votes

From what ive seen, if you give them 1 adc you need to give them like 3 more

Truly PridefulFeb 13, 20151 votes

One team gave us a 5 ADC comp. It was a surprisingly fun game. Mostly immobile ones. Fortunately they gave me Ashe, my favorite AD/champion. We gave them tanks / junglers, but they had good enough diving power to keep it interesting.

ShylierFeb 13, 20152 votes

I love this game mode, gives me a chance to play champs that I may not have a chance to play in other modes for fear f dragging my team down. There is always the chance of going against someone that can carry with anything but then there is the same chance of having that person on your own team. As a new player this mode seems to give me a more even chance than in draft or normal where I am always facing people that have played a single champ longer than I have been playing the game.

StephenizgodFeb 13, 20152 votes

I carried a game as Naut, first time in an actual game playing him too lol. I legit hope they keep this as a permanent mode.

RikariFeb 13, 20152 votes

They gave me nocturne and went 12-0 on them LOL first time with him Aalll Aloooone Daaaaaaaarknesssssssssss aaaahahahahhahahhaha

There are no bad champs,but there is a meta and therefore viable champs. Assuming you all selected non meta champs,they would all probably be in the same league.

SelflessTeammateFeb 13, 20151 votes

You should see him as Eternum. imo, easily best Legendary. It's not even close, especially in how much more awesome it makes his global ult.

ZacsRealmFeb 13, 20152 votes

ObliviooooOOOoooooOOOnnn....

Rinky DinkyFeb 13, 20152 votes

Finally someone understands this.

Welcome to the age of enlightenment

Chaotic ReksFeb 13, 20152 votes

nemesis draft made realize why i bought Wild West TwistedFate

StephenizgodFeb 13, 20151 votes

I found out yesterday i had Underworld Twisted Fate for some reason lmfao

KikirinoFeb 13, 20152 votes

You are both wrong and right.

You can see some champions you wouldn't normally see and they are doing well. However, they are only doing well because A) there are no meta teamcomps and B) They are not playing against top tier champions.

They are not bad in this meta but they are bad when being played against traditional top tier team comps.

Think of it this way. No one is weak if you don't make them fight stronger people.

Wînter FoxFeb 13, 20152 votes

~#HealsforReals

I'm stealing this from you OP it's too good

VideoGameHeroFeb 13, 20152 votes

It is team composition that matter. Understand the champions mechanics helps.

KalarepaFeb 15, 20152 votes

I disagree, there are many bad champions. The thing is, they are bad vs meta picks. For example Garen, Volibear, Taric, Mordekaiser are very weak vs all those super mobile Kalistas, Ahris and Lee Sins.
But vs low mobility melee champions, that you get in 90% Nemezis games? Garen or Volibear will be really good.

My point is, just because some champions is doing well in Nemezis, doesn't mean he's not weak in current meta.

StephenizgodFeb 15, 20151 votes

Garen is actually pretty strong against a lot of the Top-tier champions simply because he can just stack resistances against them plus his Silence interrupts their escapes. Volibear is incredible strong against a lot of champions, maybe not Kalista (what melee is good against her...) but if he forces them to run away then that is less damage going to their team. I know they are not the best champions but they certainly are not weak against meta picks. They are strong picks against a lot of them, like how Garen can shut down Riven and has no problems against Lee Sin.

While i agree a lot of these Nemesis Draft picks are not as good as meta picks, it doesn't mean they are weak. Thats what im getting at, we get into this mindset that "Oh Taric is weak because both Braum and Leona are better at CC and can Tank" but then you fight against Taric without these "better" champions and you realize that Taric is not weak at all, in fact he is incredibly strong. Who knows maybe they will learn how to use him and start using him in a way that make him better then Leona and Braum. Everyone keep saying Meta this and Meta that, but the Meta can change and Taric might become top-tier down bot lane if someone can figure out how to do it. I already crush almost any opponent top with Garen, even Lee Sin.

Radnar the boldFeb 13, 20151 votes

EXACTLY! at first its like give them the worst champs, but everyone has diffrent interpretation of who is a "bad champ", for me i dont like galieo, yorick, or urgot, yet others would yell and say they are powerful. This game mode is about making bad team comps rather than giving them champs that you deem "bad".

StephenizgodFeb 13, 20152 votes

Someone the other day tried to give me Jarvan but then someone on their team dodged lol, then my team gave them Volibear and sure enough he rampaged in bot lane lol. Not to say Voli is OP (he totally is, but he is so much fun) but no one knew their champions all that well and Volibear isnt hard to use lol Flip Slow Claw Claw Claw BITE!