Xerath always called the most powerful champion in lore-wise but Bard has came. So, what do you think about them?
I pick Xerath because may be he cant manipulate time and space but he still has more overwhelming power I believe.
Tesla Effect3 votesEventually, he will top them all off 
. (Nobody expects the Ascendant Shrimp)
SEKAI1 votesPower wise, ofc Gods are always the most powerful, the only problem is they probably won't or can't use their power for destruction purposes for whatever reason, personal or otherwise.
But if we simply evaluating sheer power with everything considered, Bard is the more powerful. He can travel between space with ease bro, like literally severe the dimensions, reattach them in some way to create a portal and it's even stable enough for everybody to use it. And manipulation on time itself too.
Xerath just has loads of energy (still the amount is leagues lower than Bard's) and has nothing to do with them besides throwing them around, pretending to be bad arse.
Imo, between the 2, Bard is stronger.
Fasmodey1 votesPower wise, ofc Gods are always the most powerful, the only problem is they probably won't or can't use their power for destruction purposes for whatever reason, personal or otherwise.
But if we simply evaluating sheer power with everything considered, Bard is the more powerful. He can travel between space with ease bro, like literally severe the dimensions, reattach them in some way to create a portal and it's even stable enough for everybody to use it. And manipulation on time itself too.
Xerath just has loads of energy (still the amount is leagues lower than Bard's) and has nothing to do with them besides throwing them around, pretending to be bad arse.
Imo, between the 2, Bard is stronger.
Bard is not omnipotent, as a spirit he can be banished, powerful magics could potentially imprison him, and a force of equal power could possibly end him.
It's what they said about Bard by Riot. This explain shows a powerful entity can kill him.
SEKAI2 votesI think they are more in line with the idea that Gods can lose in a fire fight, but not killed imo, they are like immortal and they don't die.
I can see Bard losing in a fight since his power, prob like Soraka's, have restrictions on them. So he really can't put up much of a fight if he is engaged, however just on the idea of comparing actual power/capability instead of only the ability to destroy, I still personally think that Bard is still ways ahead of most everybody else.
Because what he can casually do is something nobody can achieve in grasping the slightest idea, let alone wield or even control it.
But after all, just imo.
Ebonmaw Dragon3 votesBard is not omnipotent, as a spirit he can be banished, powerful magics could potentially imprison him, and a force of equal power could possibly end him.
This can be applied to all the champions. Even Xerath.
So, All the champions can be destroyed with magic (Except Zilean).
If you ask me, Bard is way more powerful. For 2 simple reasons:
Bard uses the power from the cosmos and the stars in other hand Xerath obtained power from a Sun Disc, the Sun Disc uses power of the Sun, the Sun is a small star of the cosmos.
Bard creates a physical body to interact with the mortal world. Xerath changed his physical body in order to obtain his new magical body.
And im not even talking about the power of the Meeps.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2015-03-28T12:05:19.199+0000)
This can be applied to all the champions. Even Xerath.
So, All the champions can be "killed" with magic.
If you ask me, Bard is way more powerful. For 2 simple reasons:
Bard uses the power from the cosmos and the stars in other hand Xerath obtained power from a Sun Disc, the Sun Disc uses power of the Sun, the Sun is a small star of the cosmos.
Bard creates a physical body to interact with the mortal world. Xerath changes his physical body in order to obtain his new magical body.
And im not even counting with the Meeps.
Xerath can't be killed until a champion came to league as real god. And I dont think a real god will come to league. Because Xerath can't be killed with magic, he is pure energy. You can control and imprison energy but you can't destory it.
Also Sun Disc is not only source of Xerath's power. He corrupted the ritual. As you see, he doesn't have anything about sun.
Ebonmaw Dragon3 votesXerath can't be killed until a champion came to league as real god. And I dont think a real god will come to league. Because Xerath can't be killed with magic, he is pure energy. You can control and imprison energy but you can't destory it.
Also Sun Disc is not only source of Xerath's power. He corrupted the ritual. As you see, he doesn't have anything about sun.
Why not? Even with a "body" of pure energy, his spirit (a thing that he cant change) can be destroyed with magic. If you destroy his spirit, he stops his existence. And the energy can be transformed, so, its possible to transform the energy of Xerath in something that he cant control... Even Lulu (who uses a magic from another dimension) can transform him into a normal animal and kill him.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=00010000000100000000,timestamp=2015-03-28T12:26:45.843+0000)
Why not? Even with a "body" of pure energy, his spirit (a thing that he cant change) can be destroyed with magic. If you destroy his spirit, he stops his existence. And the energy can be transformed, so, its possible to transform the energy of Xerath in something that he cant control... Even Lulu (who uses a magic from another dimension) can transform him into a normal animal and kill him.
LoL, did you really say Lulu can kill Xerath? Okay, there is no need to talk now.
Ebonmaw Dragon3 votesLoL, did you really say Lulu can kill Xerath? Okay, there is no need to talk now.
I said that Lulu can kill a squirrel.
And she can turn ANYTHING/ANYONE into a squirrel.
So, guess what?
In a longer explanation: The magics of 
Lulu are from a different dimension (The Glade), a dimension that has different physics: "There the rigid properties of the outside world - things like size and color - changed as frequently and whimsically as the direction of the wind."... Which means that transforming someone or something into another thing/creature is easy with the Glade Magic... it seems that the only thing that you need is imagination and Lulu has a lot of imagination.
Xerath has 0 knowledge about the magic from the Glade or the existence of such place, and 0 defenses against that kind of magic... so he CAN be turned into a harmless flower or animal, and then, killed with ease.
http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120327225831/leagueoflegends/images/b/b9/Great_Hunt_Lulu.jpg
Of course that im not saying that she is more powerful than him, and Xerath can kill her with the same ease... but the fact is, that she CAN kill him.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=0001000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2015-03-28T23:50:51.945+0000)
I said that Lulu can kill a squirrel.
And she can turn ANYTHING/ANYONE into a squirrel.
So, guess what?
In a longer explanation: The magics of
Xerath has 0 knowledge about the magic from the Glade or the existence of such place, and 0 defenses against that kind of magic... so he CAN be turned into a harmless flower or animal, and then, killed with ease.
http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120327225831/leagueoflegends/images/b/b9/Great_Hunt_Lulu.jpg
Of course that im not saying that she is more powerful than him, and Xerath can kill her with the same ease... but the fact is, that she CAN kill him.
Where is turning anyone squirrel? Do you have any proof?
Also magic doesn't work like that. Your magic doesn't work on anyone who is more powerful than you. Lord Soth can kill people with just saying '' die '' but it didn't work on Raistlin. (You can research if you think i'm lying) Because he was more powerful than him.
Your opinion is like Ahri's charm will be affected on Xerath. It's bullshit.
Ebonmaw Dragon2 votesWhere is turning anyone squirrel? Do you have any proof?
Also magic doesn't work like that. Your magic doesn't work on anyone who is more powerful than you. Lord Soth can kill people with just saying '' die '' but it didn't work on Raistlin. (You can research if you think i'm lying) Because he was more powerful than him.
Your opinion is like Ahri's charm will be affected on Xerath. It's bullshit.
Her spell does that. In the canon image that i gave you she is doing that. In her lore she transform people into flowers. In her loading screen she is doing that
Lord Soth is not a character from League of Legends or Valoran. Please give me one example from the lore of this game that says "... And then X guy was unaffected by the magic of Y person because he was more powerful, and therefore: cant be damaged by his magic "
As far i know, "Charm" affects the mind of the people and Xerath still having a human mind. It would make more sense if you say that Ahri's charm will not be affected on Bard, that doesn't care about mortal things or Blitzcrank who is a robot.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=000100000001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-03-29T12:55:57.173+0000)
Lord Soth is not a character from League of Legends or Valoran. Please give me one example from the lore of this game that says "... And then X guy was unaffected by the magic of Y person because he was more powerful, and therefore: cant be damaged by his magic "
As far i know, "Charm" affects the mind of the people and Xerath still having a human mind. It would make more sense if you say that Ahri's charm will not be affected on Bard, that doesn't care about mortal things or Blitzcrank who is a robot.
I should stop argument with you after this. Really, how much fantastic universe did you see? Is LoL your first one?
You said charm will affect Xerath too, I can't stop laughing.
Your biology sucks too. Because it's not your mind that charmed by a woman body, it's your brain. And Xerath doesn't have a brain because he is pure energy. Really, you're just a fanboy of Bard. I'm not saying bullshit things about Bard. He is of course extremely powerful champion. But you just made Xerath a human. It's your lore knowledge.
Also nice downvotes bro.
Ebonmaw Dragon2 votesI stopped argument with you after this. Really, how much fantastic universe did you see? Is LoL your first one?
You said charm will affect Xerath too, I can't stop laughing.
Im talking about facts of this "fantastic universe", not suppositions based on things from other places.
But well, if you cant accept FACTS, good for you.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=00010000000100000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-03-29T13:04:14.307+0000)
Im talking about facts of this "fantastic universe", not suppositions based on things from other places.
But well, if you cant accept FACTS, good for you.
No, you dont know anything about who is Xerath. You said Lulu can kill him, you said Ahri can charm him. What is next? Talon can bleed him?
Ebonmaw Dragon2 votesNo, you dont know anything about who is Xerath. You said Lulu can kill him, you said Ahri can charm him. What is next? Talon can bleed him?
No, because Xerath has no blood. BUT 
can steal his live force because he doesn't need blood to do such thing (According to the old JoJ)
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesDo you really think Xerath is a living? Do you really think Lulu and Vladimir can kill him? Because you're just looking like a troll.
Even Blitzcrank is considered a living according to the lore... and he is technically a thing.
In his old lore, Xerath was way more powerful than Bard. But in the new lore, Riot really decreased his powers... he was even unable to leave that "tomb" without help from the outside (and in the old lore, Xerath was able to leave a more powerful prison, that limited his powers, without any help) ... and he had an entire millennium (and the help of Renekton) to try escaping.
If Xerath has a soul, he can be killed.
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesGod dammit, sorry for the 3 post in a row, my error
{quoted} Also nice downvotes bro.
I'm not the one who downvoted you, in fact i upvoded your thread.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=00010000000100000000000000000000000000000000000000000001,timestamp=2015-03-29T13:26:07.596+0000)
Even Blitzcrank is considered a living according to the lore... and he is technically a thing.
In his old lore, Xerath was way more powerful than Bard. But in the new lore, Riot really decreased his powers... he was even unable to leave that "tomb" without help from the outside (and in the old lore, Xerath was able to leave a more powerful prison, that limited his powers, without any help) ... and he had an entire millennium (and the help of Renekton) to try escaping.
If Xerath has a soul, he can be killed.
Because he is still in a sarcophagus. Nasus and Renekton imprisoned him. When he ascended he was probably got stunned what to do, doesn't know how to use his powers. By this reason, he got imprisoned easily (Actually not that easily, we're talking about 2 ancient ascendeds). Without sarcophagus, he is still same.
Xerath is not a living, but energy with mind.
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesBecause he is still in a sarcophagus. Nasus and Renekton imprisoned him. When he ascended he was probably got stunned what to do, doesn't know how to use his powers. Without sarcophagus, he is still same.
Xerath is not a living, but energy with mind.
Exactly!
He has a MIND. The mind of a human. And his MIND can be destroyed.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=00010000000100000000000000000000000000000000000000000005,timestamp=2015-03-29T13:35:27.285+0000)
Exactly!
He has a MIND. The mind of a human. And his MIND can be destroyed.
Mind, we're talking about mind of energy, not of a human body. Energy can't be destroyed.
Xerath is not human anymore, you should accept it.
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesMind, we're talking about mind of energy, not of a human body. Energy can't be destroyed.
Xerath is not human anymore, you should accept it.
He is not human, the energy that is his "body" cant be destroyed.
But his mind, soul and spirit cant be changed, and those things can be destroyed (according to Riot)
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=00010000000100000000000000000000000000000000000000000007,timestamp=2015-03-29T13:45:47.990+0000)
He is not human, the energy that is his "body" cant be destroyed.
But his mind, soul and spirit cant be changed, and those things can be destroyed (according to Riot)
Where did Riot say this?
Actually, a power that needed for destroying a soul can be changed. Destorying Karthus' soul is extremely hard because he has phylactery that imprisoned his soul. If you dont destory this, Karthus can't die (literally).
If a way to destroy Xerath was possible, Nasus and Renekton could do this but they didn't. I dont think there is a entity that know to destroy an ascended better than this couple (they're also extremely old). They're ascended already, an alien can't know us better than us. (us = humanity)
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesWhere did Riot say this?
As you mentioned, the first thing that i said this topic.
Bard is not omnipotent, as a spirit he can be banished, powerful magics could potentially imprison him, and a force of equal power could possibly end him.
This can be applied to all the champions. Even Xerath.
So, All the champions can be destroyed with magic (Except Zilean).
Riot said in the QaA of Bard that the Spirits (Souls, a thing that every champion has, even Xerath and Karthus) can be "ended"
Actually, a power that needed for destroying an soul can be changed. Destorying Karthus' soul is extremely hard because he has phylactery that imprisoned his soul. If you dont destory this, Karthus can't die (literally).
Yes, its hard, but not impossible.
If a way to destroy Xerath was possible, Nasus and Renekton could do this but they didn't. I dont think there is a entity that know to destroy an ascended better than this couple (they're also extremely old). They're ascended already, an alien can't know us better than us. (us = humanity)
Fair points, but take into account that no one else has done the thing that Xerath did... so they had no idea how to stop him.
And the power of Renekton and Nasus was also diminished after the lore changes.
They were unable to kill RekSai, a "common" creature from the void. So, they aren't that powerful as people thinks... Unless you are going to Say that Reksai has the same or more power than Xerath (and we know that she doesn't).
PS: The space on this text box is soo small... i hate it.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=00010000000100000000000000000000000000000000000000000009,timestamp=2015-03-29T14:16:15.271+0000)
As you mentioned, the first thing that i said this topic.
Riot said in the QaA of Bard that the Spirits (Souls, a thing that every champion has, even Xerath and Karthus) can be "ended"
Yes, its hard, but not impossible.
Fair points, but take into account that no one else has done the thing that Xerath did... so they had no idea how to stop him.
And the power of Renekton and Nasus was also diminished after the lore changes.
They were unable to kill RekSai, a "common" creature from the void. So, they aren't that powerful as people thinks... Unless you are going to Say that Reksai has the same or more power than Xerath (and we know that she doesn't).
PS: The space on this text box is soo small... i hate it.
No, Renekton and Nasus in their old lores were just aliens. They're ascendeds now. They're demigods.
Riot probably wanted to say he is a spirit, doesn't matter how much powerful he is. He is still a spirit. So he can be destroyed. It doesn't means souls can be destroyed. Souls and spirits are different. Spirits are like a race.
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesNo, Renekton and Nasus in their old lores were just aliens. They're ascendeds now. They're demigods.
Riot probably wanted to say he is a spirit, doesn't matter how much powerful he is. He is still a spirit. So he can be destroyed. It doesn't means souls can be destroyed. Souls and spirits are different. Spirits are like a race.
This is an extract from the old lore of Nasus:
"Unfortunately, there were others of his kind that believed they were more than protectors. They were under the egotistical delusion that they** had ascended to become gods**"
Its pretty similar to the "new" lore
And about Bard, if the word "Spirit" were used to describe his race he would be a "Celestial Spirit" instead of a "Celestial Being" (Xerath became an "Arcane Being"). The word "Spirit" is a synonym of Soul.
And you didn't answered: If the Ascendeds are so powerfull... why they cant deal with Reksai?
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=0001000000010000000000000000000000000000000000000000000b,timestamp=2015-03-29T20:57:28.052+0000)
This is an extract from the old lore of Nasus:
"Unfortunately, there were others of his kind that believed they were more than protectors. They were under the egotistical delusion that they** had ascended to become gods**"
Its pretty similar to the "new" lore
And about Bard, if the word "Spirit" were used to describe his race he would be a "Celestial Spirit" instead of a "Celestial Being" (Xerath became an "Arcane Being"). The word "Spirit" is a synonym of Soul.
And you didn't answered: If the Ascendeds are so powerfull... why they cant deal with Reksai?
They didn't ascended to become gods, they played god. They tricked humans and controlled them.
A spirit is a celestial being but every celestial being is not a spirit. Celestial being is more blanket. It's like liches are undead but every undead is not lich.
Celestial being > Spirit Undead > Lich
Think like this.
Also, Shurima's real problem is not a void beast. Why Nasus and Renekton should care about a small area? It's like what Bard does, they dont save you, they save Shurima. Nasus and Renekton doesn't care about people, they just care about Shurima. Who said they cant deal with Rek'Sai? Also you talked like Rek'Sai is a basic void beast. Rek'Sai is the most powerful void beast known now. Even Cho'Gath is afraid of her.
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesThey didn't ascended to become gods, they played god. They tricked humans and controlled them.
A spirit is a celestial being but every celestial being is not a spirit. Celestial being is more blanket. It's like liches are undead but every undead is not lich.
Celestial being > Spirit Undead > Lich
Think like this.
Also, Shurima's real problem is not a void beast. Why Nasus and Renekton should care about a small area? It's like what Bard does, they dont save you, they save Shurima. Nasus and Renekton doesn't care about people, they just care about Shurima. Who said they cant deal with Rek'Sai? Also you talked like Rek'Sai is a basic void beast. Rek'Sai is the most powerful void beast known now. Even Cho'Gath is afraid of her.
Good points... even though i still thinking that Riot was talking literally about the spirits and not about a "race".
And about Reksai, she fought against Renekton in the past, and he was unable to kill her, which means that the "normal" acendeds are not powerful as people thinks... or at least, they have a similar power level in comparison with the most powerful void beasts that we know.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ebonmaw Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=0001000000010000000000000000000000000000000000000000000d,timestamp=2015-03-29T21:48:28.195+0000)
Good points... even though i still thinking that Riot was talking literally about the spirits and not about a "race".
And about Reksai, she fought against Renekton in the past, and he was unable to kill her, which means that the "normal" acendeds are not powerful as people thinks... or at least, they have a similar power level in comparison with the most powerful void beasts that we know.
Being unable to kill a strong void beast doesn't make weaker than her imo. İf it was true zilean would be the most powerful.
CarrotGaming31 votesAll matter is made out of energy. Now, what is a brain made out of. Indeed, its made out of matter. So technically Xerath has a brain in another form.
Now, the second thing is that: Ahri's charm is different from attraction. Her charm charms your spirit, not you mind. So Xerath can be charmed by her.
Last but not least. Bard is valorans and the whole universes second strongest spirit after Kindred. Bard can kill anything in it's path. Now, you might think that Xerath is stronger because he literally is arcane magic itself. Then you should think about how Bard works. Bard is the universe itself. He has a magical between it and everything else. Xerath "arcane power" is just a fraction of all the other powers and magics that exists. Bard can literally make Xerath disappear into whatever place he wants.
You may also ask why Kindred is stronger that Bard then here is the answer. Death is the ending of everything. Even Kayle, Morgana, Bard and Xerath. Everything dies except Kindred and because of Kindred.
Fasmodey1 votesAll matter is made out of energy. Now, what is a brain made out of. Indeed, its made out of matter. So technically Xerath has a brain in another form.
Now, the second thing is that: Ahri's charm is different from attraction. Her charm charms your spirit, not you mind. So Xerath can be charmed by her.
Last but not least. Bard is valorans and the whole universes second strongest spirit after Kindred. Bard can kill anything in it's path. Now, you might think that Xerath is stronger because he literally is arcane magic itself. Then you should think about how Bard works. Bard is the universe itself. He has a magical between it and everything else. Xerath "arcane power" is just a fraction of all the other powers and magics that exists. Bard can literally make Xerath disappear into whatever place he wants.
You may also ask why Kindred is stronger that Bard then here is the answer. Death is the ending of everything. Even Kayle, Morgana, Bard and Xerath. Everything dies except Kindred and because of Kindred.
No, even Kindred is going to have an end, it's confirmed. Having an end doesn't make instantly less powerful. Kindred couldn't kill a lot champion, like Xerath, Karthus. They're in same category with Kindred. They will have ends, but it's not going to be dying, like Kindred.
Also, did you really said Ahri can charm Xerath? Ahri's charm can be useless against a strong minded human being, what is her chance to charm Xerath?
You guys really don't how spells work in EVERY FANTASIC UNIVERSE. It's like saying Karthus can be charmed because he has SOUL. Nah, undead are immune to mind spells, control spells, cold etc. I'm pretty sure Xerath has all of them.
Magic has its types, like cosmic magic, arcane magic, black magic, fae magic, fox magic, blood magic etc. Bard is about cosmic magic. So I dont think Bard can use necromancy, which is something dark magic. In directly, it means Bard has no overwhelming control on arcane magic like Xerath. Your argument is invalid.
TL;DR Learn what is resistance, which is something every fantastic universe has. Lulu can't turn Xerath to animal, Ahri can't charm Xerath, Vladimir can't drink Xerath's soul, Nasus can't age Xerath. Xerath has super resistance, we saw it in Shurima Event. Nasus and Renekton couldn't kill him, they're super powerful entities, you know. Not something garbage like Ahri or Lulu or Vladimir.
Narasimha2 votesAhri would not be able to charm Xerath, but Lulu is a different matter altogether. Its not about 'Xerath being stronger', but simply that the magic is too alien for him to block. Raistlin was able to stop Soth because he knew the nature of Soth's death magic (also Fistandantalius's power helped). However, it is extremely unlikely that Xerath has experienced magic from the Glade. And without even knowing what he's going against, how can he stop it?
Fasmodey1 votesAhri would not be able to charm Xerath, but Lulu is a different matter altogether. Its not about 'Xerath being stronger', but simply that the magic is too alien for him to block. Raistlin was able to stop Soth because he knew the nature of Soth's death magic (also Fistandantalius's power helped). However, it is extremely unlikely that Xerath has experienced magic from the Glade. And without even knowing what he's going against, how can he stop it?
Why everyone thinks unknown magic is the most dangerous? Lulu doesn't know Xerath's powers too.
Narasimha1 votesYou are absolutely correct, Lulu doesn't really know Xerath's abilities. However, this only really matters if Xerath was the one attacking Lulu. This basically boils down to a 'First strike' victory. If Lulu goes first, she can polymorph Xerath, and then he's gone. On the other hand, if Xerath gets the first blow, he can definitely wipe Lulu off the face of the planet.
Fasmodey1 votesYou are absolutely correct, Lulu doesn't really know Xerath's abilities. However, this only really matters if Xerath was the one attacking Lulu. This basically boils down to a 'First strike' victory. If Lulu goes first, she can polymorph Xerath, and then he's gone. On the other hand, if Xerath gets the first blow, he can definitely wipe Lulu off the face of the planet.
And I want to ask. Why everyone thinks polymorph is too strong and can be used on anything? I dont think a yordle can kill an ascended just because she has polymorph power.
Narasimha1 votesI don't think Lulu can be classified as just a yordle anymore. You can't just pick up Fae magic like that. Also, its been shown that while Ascended are strong, they are not omnipotent. It was extremely strongly hinted that Renekton ascended to battle against Rek'sai. Seeing as how both are still standing, this means that it is possible to match up against them.
Fasmodey1 votesI don't think Lulu can be classified as just a yordle anymore. You can't just pick up Fae magic like that. Also, its been shown that while Ascended are strong, they are not omnipotent. It was extremely strongly hinted that Renekton ascended to battle against Rek'sai. Seeing as how both are still standing, this means that it is possible to match up against them.
Xerath is not a basic ascended. He is probably the most powerful one of them. He corrupted the ritual.
Also is there any proof that fae magic is extremely powerful?
Narasimha1 votesCorrupted =/= stronger. There is an equal, if not greater, chance that it made him weaker than a normal ascended because it all went wrong.
Also, fae magic in almost any literature is different than 'normal' magic. Fae magic tends to subvert reality, while regular magics are forced to abide by its laws. A better way to put it is that fae falls under 'chaos', while magic by its nature belongs to 'law'. And while chaos does not mean power by itself, it also means that it can impose its own rules, or lack thereof, on a given scenario.
Fasmodey1 votesCorrupted =/= stronger. There is an equal, if not greater, chance that it made him weaker than a normal ascended because it all went wrong.
Also, fae magic in almost any literature is different than 'normal' magic. Fae magic tends to subvert reality, while regular magics are forced to abide by its laws. A better way to put it is that fae falls under 'chaos', while magic by its nature belongs to 'law'. And while chaos does not mean power by itself, it also means that it can impose its own rules, or lack thereof, on a given scenario.
You really dont know who is Xerath.
GreenLore1 votesBard can't travel through time either,just through space(seriously why is everyone assuming that once you can travel through one of them,you can travel through both?)
If Xerath was unbound,then I'd say Xerath,but I guess they would be even if Xerath was still chained by his sarcophagus.
Tesla Effect2 votesBard can't travel through time either,just through space(seriously why is everyone assuming that once you can travel through one of them,you can travel through both?)
If Xerath was unbound,then I'd say Xerath,but I guess they would be even if Xerath was still chained by his sarcophagus.
Dont think you quite understand what Bard is. He is outside of space and time, he is unbound by such spacial things, we dont really know what is his original form and what is his mind-set. He is totally alien to the world of Runeterra. I would probably even say that he is an enlightened being because he doesnt misuse his powers for selfish goals. He may not save everyone, but he will save everything in general and thats just one of the reasons why he is more powerful. Power doesnt just come from shooting the biggest lightbolts around and saying Im the best, its also knowing how to use that power that is benefitial.
He has more control of his powers than any of the mentioned people, which just crave power for selfish ideals, where as Bard has more noble goals. Ao Shin might top him down, but until then, Bard is the most powerful being.
GreenLore1 votesPlease tell me where it says that bard lives outside the concept of time?No one ever stated that he can travel through time,that is something that many just assume,because why not(similar to how most people think that yasuos master was killed by a wind technique,when it was in fact an ionian elder)
It was said that "Bard traverses all planes that can intersect with Runeterra, so he is certainly linked to that degree, but he's not restricted only to Soraka's plane of origin." but at no point they say anything about him traversing time as well.
Also having great control over your power won't help you if your enemy has enough brute force to overpower you.He is certainly a powerful spirit,but we never saw anything especially powerful from him,so saying he is the most powerful is pretty much without any basis. He certainly has really powerful space traveling abilities,but he might be lacking in terms of actual combat(which would explain why he doesn't participate in giant battles and tends to influence the path of history through other acts)
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesPlease tell me where it says that bard lives outside the concept of time?No one ever stated that he can travel through time,that is something that many just assume,because why not(similar to how most people think that yasuos master was killed by a wind technique,when it was in fact an ionian elder)
It was said that "Bard traverses all planes that can intersect with Runeterra, so he is certainly linked to that degree, but he's not restricted only to Soraka's plane of origin." but at no point they say anything about him traversing time as well.
Also having great control over your power won't help you if your enemy has enough brute force to overpower you.He is certainly a powerful spirit,but we never saw anything especially powerful from him,so saying he is the most powerful is pretty much without any basis. He certainly has really powerful space traveling abilities,but he might be lacking in terms of actual combat(which would explain why he doesn't participate in giant battles and tends to influence the path of history through other acts)
You are right in a lot of things here. We have never seen the true powers of Bard (we have not even seen his real form) but we know that he has total access to the most powerful artifacts from all the planes/worlds/universes/dimensions etc... and those artifacts are more powerful than ANY champion... why?
Because "when the unknowable structure of the universe is threatened, Bard steers all existence away from utter annihilation."
But he never intervened when Xerath reached the Ascension, because he knows that the thing that Xerath did, is nothing compared with the rest of the universe.
Even if Xerath were more powerful than Bard. The "egg" that Bard took in the video of the "Mountain" is more destructive and powerful than any champion... and... guess who has that egg? Bard.
GreenLore1 votesActually there is a constellation in the skies about shurimas downfall implying that bard did intervene with it to some extent(possibly preventing an even bigger catastrophe?) or that he merely failed to do anything(same goes for the shadow isles).
You are right about him having access to extremely powerful objects,but we don't know if he is willing to use them(and then there is the question how you define strenght,I mean if the weapon itself is so immensly powerful,then I find it hard to say its user is the powerful one,even though some champs get a large amount of their power from their weapon,none are even close to the egg from the trailer)
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesActually there is a constellation in the skies about shurimas downfall implying that bard did intervene with it to some extent(possibly preventing an even bigger catastrophe?) or that he merely failed to do anything(same goes for the shadow isles).
You are right about him having access to extremely powerful objects,but we don't know if he is willing to use them(and then there is the question how you define strenght,I mean if the weapon itself is so immensly powerful,then I find it hard to say its user is the powerful one,even though some champs get a large amount of their power from their weapon,none are even close to the egg from the trailer)
Well, this was mentioned in the Bard Q&A
Hi Blood Mefist,
- Although those events certainly were catastrophic, especially in a localized sense, Bard's intervention, from his point of view, was not required in the specific way you may be thinking of. I don't want to include spoilers, I'll just say Bard was witness to those events.
....
Bard traverses all planes that can intersect with Runeterra, so he is certainly linked to that degree, but he's not restricted only to Soraka's plane of origin.
Runeterran magic has many different aspects, origins, and foci. Bard exists and journeys across many realms and planes, which is the difference in his concept of "celestial" as compared to the specific focus of each of your examples. It certainly makes sense to see things like Shurima's sun-disk as an attempt to tap into one part of a celestial power.
He saw those events, but he didn't intervene.
And the second quote should put the final nail to this thread: The acendeds use a small part of the celestial power. Bard uses celestial power directly. Therefore: Bard has more power than Xerath.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Tesla Effect,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2015-03-28T12:49:50.654+0000)
Dont think you quite understand what Bard is. He is outside of space and time, he is unbound by such spacial things, we dont really know what is his original form and what is his mind-set. He is totally alien to the world of Runeterra. I would probably even say that he is an enlightened being because he doesnt misuse his powers for selfish goals. He may not save everyone, but he will save everything in general and thats just one of the reasons why he is more powerful. Power doesnt just come from shooting the biggest lightbolts around and saying Im the best, its also knowing how to use that power that is benefitial.
He has more control of his powers than any of the mentioned people, which just crave power for selfish ideals, where as Bard has more noble goals. Ao Shin might top him down, but until then, Bard is the most powerful being.
So being noble and knowing control your power makes you the most powerful. Is it what did you want to say?
And yes, power is shooting and destroying. Power is not saving people.
Tesla Effect2 votesSo being noble and knowing control your power makes you the most powerful. Is it what did you want to say?
And yes, power is shooting and destroying. Power is not saving people.
You are wrong and its not the only thing I was talking out.
Nameless Hero1 votesYou don't understand power
True power is to be able to change the lives of other people despite opposition. True power is to have the freedom of choice without consequences.
Xerath may be able to destroy things but he is unable to break out of his sarcophagus and he was powerless to stop the destruction of Shurima.
Bard meanwhile can choose the fate of the world.
Fasmodey1 votes[{quoted}](name=Nameless Hero,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ZdLzXRoX,comment-id=0002000000010001,timestamp=2015-03-30T05:16:03.807+0000)
You don't understand power
True power is to be able to change the lives of other people despite opposition. True power is to have the freedom of choice without consequences.
Xerath may be able to destroy things but he is unable to break out of his sarcophagus and he was powerless to stop the destruction of Shurima.
Bard meanwhile can choose the fate of the world.
He actually broke his sarcophagus. A sarcophagus of ascendeds. Not a basic thing. Also choosing fate is not power. We're not doing philosophy.
Nameless Hero1 votesIf you define power in terms of destruction and damage then I guess that Xerath is more powerful. Equivalent: The pure energy of an atomic bomb.
If you define power in terms of being able to influence the lives of millions then Bard is more powerful. Equivalent: The hand that chooses if the atomic bomb is launched or not.
Also, check out my other post called Speculation Time.
