Nero, The Ancient

Bultz··6 votes·1,408 views

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CPl9pVKUkAAB-5l.jpg

A galactic being who crosses the never ending, in search of truth.

He is a weird mix between AD and Ap

He flies like a superhero, using very dynamic movements and very aerodynamic. His basic attacks are punches.

It needs work, but here is a basic kit for him.

*Updated Passive

he would be able to mark a champion, like kindred does when she chooses someone to hunt, and if they are in range, his passive opens a galactic portal near them, sort of like Illoai spawns a tentacle, then can use his E to send his fist through, marking the opponent and allowing him to use his E and force pull/push the champion.

*Updated Q: Speed punch

Allows him to quickly cast three punches. Basically an enhancer, doing three auto attacks in the time of doing 1.

*Updated W: Projectile punch

Launches three balls of energy at the opponent. Casts a burn. It is a skill shot, a narrowed cone which would have the energy balls explode when either they met their target or meet their range. Think Kassadins Q, but one liner ball and two side ways shots which bend but unlike Kass it is a skill shot and not locked on.

*Updated E: Gravity punch

A punch which marks the opponent for 5 seconds, allowing Nero to either pull the champion back to him or charge at the marked opponent. Slows down opponent for 2 seconds. The punch marks the opponent, slowing them so they can't run too far if they try, at the point the champion can repel the enemy if he wishes, or if the enemy flashes away, force pull them back to him. If no one is market, he can cast it of himself and charge at the enemy in skill shot form, dealing maybe a few points extra damage. Combined with his passive.

R: Astro punch

https://lovelace-media.imgix.net/uploads/1192/bc389360-7c38-0134-ce03-0aec1efe63a9.gif?w=740&h=266&fit=max&auto=format

He can punch the life out of a champion, meaning when he punches someone, they leave their body and enter a protoplasmic form. For opponents it knocks them back and out of their body, having their body slowly draining their life force away until they reenter it, or they are killed.

If used on an ally, it allows them to leave their body and run, being invisible. They will lose half their current hp, but wont die even if their body does, giving them 6 seconds of invisibility to run before becoming corporeal again.

28 Comments

Atinizer3 votes

So is this guy a diver? Is he a support? Is he a jungler? I don't really see a particular place he fits because he has no CC in his kit which would make people not want to play him top lane because he has nothing to tank with either, he doesn't have an AoE so his jungle clear would be garbage, the best thing I can see is him being a bruiser type support given that his W is good poke and his E is a decent gap-close so that your ADC can wham 'em.

Passive: Ripped straight from Jax. Jax already gains more attack speed with every hit

Q: Is this an auto-attack enhancer? Is it a point click? How does it scale? I can't tell if this just triples his damage for one attack or not.

W: Pretty basic but what kind of line is the skill-shot? Is it all in one line or is it a cone shape? This just kind of lacks any flavor and detail

E: So it's like Thresh Q but a slow instead of a stun...and if it's a punch is it point blank? Because that would just be redundant.

R: No complaints here, I really like this idea.

Overall his kit is really weak and doesn't seem to work well together because his Q kind of removes the point for his passive and the E is so weak you'd never be able to use it properly. The only thing I really love is the ult, the W has some kind of synergism with it because you can hit the dude even when they run but why would you do that when you could just beat into the still body? Also about how much damage conversion would there be?

Bultz2 votes

{quoted}

So is this guy a diver? Is he a support? Is he a jungler? I don't really see a particular place he fits because he has no CC in his kit which would make people not want to play him top lane because he has nothing to tank with either, he doesn't have an AoE so his jungle clear would be garbage, the best thing I can see is him being a bruiser type support given that his W is good poke and his E is a decent gap-close so that your ADC can wham 'em.

But he has plenty of CC? His ultimate is cc and his E. As for where he would go, he could really go anywhere if played correctly. No different then Teemo going to any lane. He has an Auto attack in his Q. His W gives him range, meaning he has poke for top, bot, and mid. Now bare in mind, as I stated earlier, the champion and this kit are simplistic and I haven't gone into great detail. Aside from that tweaking his kit is not a matter of if, but rather when. Nothing suggested is ever even 50% usable until tested and researched. As for an Aoe and jungle clear, his Q triple hit would give him fairly decent jungle clear. With increasing attack speed and the Q, he would do fine Jungle. As for concern of mid and top You poke till they are low then, gap close, ult them, and you have a kill. Same with almost all lanes.

Passive: Ripped straight from Jax. Jax already gains more attack speed with every hit

The passive is similar yes, I mean I can change it and make it more complex, but I just wanted a simple passive. My original one was that he would be able to mark a champion, like kindred does, and if they are close to him, he opens a galactic portal near them, sort of like Illoai spawns a tentacle, then can use his E to send his fist through, marking the opponent and allowing him to force pull the champion. But I felt that this was complex and people might not like it.

Q: Is this an auto-attack enhancer? Is it a point click? How does it scale? I can't tell if this just triples his damage for one attack or not.

Basically an enhancer, doing three auto attacks in the time of doing 1.

W: Pretty basic but what kind of line is the skill-shot? Is it all in one line or is it a cone shape? This just kind of lacks any flavor and detail

It is a skillshot, I was originally going to do it as a narrowed cone which would have the energy balls explode when either they met their target or meet their range. Think Kassadins Q, but one liner ball and two side ways shots which bend. I guess think dragon ball z skillshots.

E: So it's like Thresh Q but a slow instead of a stun...and if it's a punch is it point blank? Because that would just be redundant.

The punch marks the opponent, slowing them so they can't run too far if they try, at the point the champion can repel the enemy if he wishes, or if the enemy flashes away, force pull them back to him. If no one is market, he can cast it of himself and charge at the enemy in skill shot form, dealing maybe a few points extra damage. I didn't really expect anyone to read this so I didn't explain it well.

R: No complaints here, I really like this idea.

Sweet!

Overall his kit is really weak and doesn't seem to work well together because his Q kind of removes the point for his passive and the E is so weak you'd never be able to use it properly. The only thing I really love is the ult, the W has some kind of synergism with it because you can hit the dude even when they run but why would you do that when you could just beat into the still body? Also about how much damage conversion would there be?

Given we can always change the passive, I kept it simple as not to overload his kit . The point of his E isn't to be a chain like thresh. He is mostly melee champion. What do you mean by conversion?

Atinizer2 votes

Okay, so what I meant by conversion is that the spirit Illaoi pulls only has a portion of the max health of the target she hits, not all of it otherwise that would be too unfair for ADCs after they get hit by it.

A new problem with the Q arises on the fact that you now have clarified they are just tripling your auto-attack, if you decided to go jungle with this guy and buy Blood Razor and BORK you'd deal 12% of their max health with one ability and that's just with blood razor, each attack would do less % health damage from the BORK since it scales with current health but that's still a nightmare in one ability so you go from being really weak (if it only did like 20% AD) to really strong.

With the W that clears up my complaints on the lack of uniqueness department, thanks!

For his E I think that it's kind of cool with the update passive but if I'm picturing it correctly it opens a gate that skill-shots can be teleported through? And his E is a skill-shot since it has range to go through the portal? Also is the teleport like Bard's journey or an instant thing?

I hope you understand I'm not trying to flame you or say your ideas are garbage, I actually want to see this idea improve into something that people would like playing. My advice would be to scrap the Q for something new and try to improve on his more super-hero dynamic since we kind of have an astral being in the form of AurelionSol He can still punch for his abilities because I think that's very super-hero like but something that has a little more wonder to it.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

Okay, so what I meant by conversion is that the spirit Illaoi pulls only has a portion of the max health of the target she hits, not all of it otherwise that would be too unfair for ADCs after they get hit by it.

The ult only knocks the spirit out of the person, maybe doing a little damage, but not a ton, The major damage comes if you get sloppy and don't get back into the main body while taking damage from the opponent champion. If the champion is below say 15% health, then if they return to the main body within the first 3 seconds of being knocked out, they will regain a portion of their max health, but that is only if it turns out too strong.

A new problem with the Q arises on the fact that you now have clarified they are just tripling your auto-attack, if you decided to go jungle with this guy and buy Blood Razor and BORK you'd deal 12% of their max health with one ability and that's just with blood razor, each attack would do less % health damage from the BORK since it scales with current health but that's still a nightmare in one ability so you go from being really weak (if it only did like 20% AD) to really strong.

I can't promise anything until or unless the ability were to be developed. It could be too strong and some limits might be put on it, or it could need buffs. It could come down to cool down time or it could need to only do two hits per auto attack. Considering attack speed has a limit on it, it would never be faster than that. but if lifesteal is the issue, mortal reminder is always there to stop it.

With the W that clears up my complaints on the lack of uniqueness department, thanks!

Sweet!

For his E I think that it's kind of cool with the update passive but if I'm picturing it correctly it opens a gate that skill-shots can be teleported through? And his E is a skill-shot since it has range to go through the portal? Also is the teleport like Bard's journey or an instant thing?

It opens up like an Illoai tentacle, meaning maybe more then one at a time and only at the one spot, unlike bards, which allows only his fist to go through for the E, but if that turns out useless we could always send out his W through it as well and maybe other champions skillshots.

I hope you understand I'm not trying to flame you or say your ideas are garbage, I actually want to see this idea improve into something that people would like playing. My advice would be to scrap the Q for something new and try to improve on his more super-hero dynamic since we kind of have an astral being in the form of AurelionSol He can still punch for his abilities because I think that's very super-hero like but something that has a little more wonder to it.

No No, I understand and welcome the attention and feed back lol. I have to think about the Q. I wanted a basic attack for his q so it could do on hit effects. If you have any ideas please share!

Atinizer1 votes

For a more super-hero-esque thing I would think something like he strikes the enemy twice (not on hit-effects) and then after a slight delay they take damage and lose armor or get grounded. I'm thinking like those cliche things you see in fist fights where the villain doesn't realize how hurt they are until a few moments after the strike and then the visible wounds appear and that kind of cliche super-duper thing.

Kukan Seishin2 votes

Interesting, I think his ult could troll his allies like tahm though because you make them lose HALF their health :/ interesting concept though!

Bultz1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jargon Wan,realm=NA,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=v1mdeMp5,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-02-25T01:09:11.740+0000)

Interesting, I think his ult could troll his allies like tahm though because you make them lose HALF their health :/ interesting concept though!

Thank you! And true, but unlike Tahm's, Nero's can't control you after the initial hit, so if you need to, you can back. Also it most likely will have a higher cd so wasting it would leave him fairly disadvantaged.

Kukan Seishin1 votes

So, for enemies, it acts like a Illaoi E? Like, you Push the spirit of them out and you can damage it while they hopelessly struggle to get back in it because they are in your team? And is it a complete 100 - 0 ability? Like, you ult someone, if you kill their "clone" they die too? Or is it LIKE Illaoi E and only "some" of the damage is transfered?

Bultz1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jargon Wan,realm=NA,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=v1mdeMp5,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2017-02-25T01:32:39.932+0000)

So, for enemies, it acts like a Illaoi E? Like, you Push the spirit of them out and you can damage it while they hopelessly struggle to get back in it because they are in your team? And is it a complete 100 - 0 ability? Like, you ult someone, if you kill their "clone" they die too? Or is it LIKE Illaoi E and only "some" of the damage is transfered?

Almost, but the complete opposite. Illaoi grabs their spirit, damaging it, while the main body is running free. This hits the spirit out, letting it run free for the opponent, while their main body is still there auto attacking. If the main body dies, the spirit dies. If they get back to the body before it dies, they have time to escape or attack back. Idk if that would be overkill, if so they could always get a life percentage back, like 20% of current or max, when they return to their body.

Kukan Seishin1 votes

So if ANYONE were to dive in Nero could ult them and make them useless cause their body is in the middle of your team...

Bultz1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jargon Wan,realm=NA,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=v1mdeMp5,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-02-25T02:23:39.033+0000)

So if ANYONE were to dive in Nero could ult them and make them useless cause their body is in the middle of your team...

I don't think that it is any different then diving in and getting stunned in the middle of his team. Plus its not like the opponent will stand there taking the hits, he will jump back into the body which would take barely 2 seconds to do if they hurry, it just disables the player from casting spells and running. The only thing that would really hurt them is if they get hooked and their body is moved away from the spirit.

That aside, I am very much for stopping the diving meta which is basically a, in and out one hit move for champions like talon. Plus this is an ultimate to be fair. Look at Illoai's ultimate, that thing can have 5 people dive you and all five will die.

Kukan Seishin1 votes

I SEE, although my best anti dive champ is Camille it's like, you wanted in and out? How about in, and die, cause you can't leave.

Anyway, I think it is a pretty cool concept now that I understand it more.

THE RlVER KlNG2 votes

It's just sad when concepts like this (that display such a lack of effort) get more attention than others that pour their heart and soul into the project

Bultz2 votes

[{quoted}](name=THE RlVER KlNG,realm=NA,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=v1mdeMp5,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2017-02-26T13:49:02.515+0000)

It's just sad when concepts like this (that display such a lack of effort) get more attention than others that pour their heart and soul into the project

LOL WOW. Butthurt much? Like you needs to calm down m8. Firstly insulting my idea, not cool bruh. Secondly, just because it's simple, doesn't make your ideas or the ideas of others better. Writing 10 pages of material is a persons choice, and not everyone wants to read 60 pages of an idea, I know I don't. People want it simple and to the point on the details and Unique and fun in the kit. On top of that Riot doesn't need me to write 10 pages for the idea, I am sure they have a whole team for that. I just introduce what type of champion I want to main and play and let them consider it. If I wrote 10 pages of lore or detail into the kit, that doesn't mean Riot will look at the idea any differently then what I have here. If people like this idea, let them Like it. No reason to be rude.

midnight oil243 votes

True, but it's also annoying to put in a ton of work only to watch it get insulted, only to the see another person who makes a CONCEPT THAT'S JUST "TAKE ABILITIES FROM YOUR TEAMMATES" GET UPVOTED INTO OBLIVION!

What this guy is saying is that it's annoying that people put work in and don't get recognized, while much simpler ones get told how creative they are and that they're genius incarnate.

Now, on to my actual critique:

He seems boring.

Before you get triggered, let me explain. There are several aspects here: one is that he doesn't fit the idea of an ancient one. He punches, flies like a superhero, and travels through space. None of those fit together. Let me use on of my own champs for comparison: Raven Crowe. He also punches, and is, in turn, also ancient, but the ancient part isn't his main aspect. What you put as the title is their main aspect: Aurelion sol uses stars, Kled is cavalry who's angry, ashe shoots ice arrows, etc. Raven, the Rage of a Dying universe, punches, and gets angry. He destroys areas. He fits the idea of "world-ending berserker". Nero, on the other hand, has a name that implies that he's this ancient being of great strength, yet his skills sound like something out of a superman comic. You could do so much more with this, and this concept is better fit for a superhero type character, not an ancient one.

Bultz1 votes

[{quoted}](name=midnight oil24,realm=NA,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=v1mdeMp5,comment-id=000500000000,timestamp=2017-02-27T22:37:11.380+0000)

True, but it's also annoying to put in a ton of work only to watch it get insulted, only to the see another person who makes a CONCEPT THAT'S JUST "TAKE ABILITIES FROM YOUR TEAMMATES" GET UPVOTED INTO OBLIVION!

Look at it my way, since I created this I have had like 4 people post on it who like the idea and a max of 2-5 likes at any given time. If he is butt hurt over that, he needs to understand his ideas are probably bad. I just made a simple concept, one I want to play. Riot won't notice this, no one will make this champion, I made it for fun and he comes here, the one time I get positive feedback, and calls it shit. This isn't about caring about his idea or trying to put his soul into it, this is him being mad and jealous over 5 likes. How many ideas have I had with a shit ton of detail go down the drain? all of them. Do i attack others for making something people like? no.

What this guy is saying is that it's annoying that people put work in and don't get recognized, while much simpler ones get told how creative they are and that they're genius incarnate.

Not everything has to be complex. People like simple explanations. No one wants to read your term paper style champion concept.

Now, on to my actual critique:

He seems boring.

Before you get triggered, let me explain. There are several aspects here: one is that he doesn't fit the idea of an ancient one. He punches, flies like a superhero, and travels through space. None of those fit together. Let me use on of my own champs for comparison: Raven Crowe. He also punches, and is, in turn, also ancient, but the ancient part isn't his main aspect. What you put as the title is their main aspect: Aurelion sol uses stars, Kled is cavalry who's angry, ashe shoots ice arrows, etc. Raven, the Rage of a Dying universe, punches, and gets angry. He destroys areas. He fits the idea of "world-ending berserker". Nero, on the other hand, has a name that implies that he's this ancient being of great strength, yet his skills sound like something out of a superman comic. You could do so much more with this, and this concept is better fit for a superhero type character, not an ancient one.

*Trigger beams ready

Ancient one is a loose concept. He is a comic book version of it. Think marvel and their universe like silver surfer and galactus. He is an ancient being of great strength. As for him being boring, you seem to being confusing simple design with no fun champion.

midnight oil241 votes

Actually I can appreciate a good simple champ. Look at one of my concepts: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/zHpEA7LU-champ-concept-alfred-exiv-the-king-of-knights (note: this is an exercise. Do not think that I advocate putting licensed characters in here.) He's simple as well.

Problem is, if he's ancient in a comic book sense, he should be called something that implies that, and have a look that reflects that, as opposed to a guy who looks like an ancient guardian. Or at least give him a lore that explains it.

Also, you actually get upvotes and comments. I don't even get many of those.

Finally, you could really prove your reasoning in your abilities. Especially since one of them is basically Illaoi E or a utility ability. Honestly, he still does too much. He gets to pull the enemy in or push them away? That's powerful. He can just do whatever he wants to the enemy cause he can push them around, do ranged attacks, give what should be a melee ability range. Even then, his passive should be a passive on the E, it's a useless passive until you get E.

He has potential, but doesn't explain himself, justify his existence, or have a kit that fits thematically.

midnight oil241 votes

Don't I know the feels.

thefox3331 votes

I really like the idea of blending AD and AP. Depending on how it's done, it could either mean that you need a specific build pattern to play him well, or you could choose to specialize AP or AD. For example, AD would boost his Q and E, while AP would make his W much better. I think his ult would remain mostly the same, maybe dealing a little more damage AP.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

I really like the idea of blending AD and AP. Depending on how it's done, it could either mean that you need a specific build pattern to play him well, or you could choose to specialize AP or AD. For example, AD would boost his Q and E, while AP would make his W much better. I think his ult would remain mostly the same, maybe dealing a little more damage AP.

Yes, something along those line. I know it is hard for riot to mix a hybrid type champion, but I think it could work out.

fugertech2 votes

http://i2.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/021/795/wrongkiddoorigin.jpg

Blending AP and AD, legendarily, is generally a bad idea. Take Tristana for example: She does more damage with half of her abilites if she builds AP, but is a Marksman who goes botlane and has both decent peel and decent engage. Having a champion whose abilities scale with more than one type of damage is bad, but having a champion who can build either type of damage-increasing stat and still excel in their role is never good.

Sure, you can build Jhin AP, but none of his abilities besides two will do any damage.

Sure, you can build Lee Sin AP, but you lose all of your damage and instead gain a mediocre shield.

Sure, you can build Jax full AD, but why do that when two of your abilities half-health them in quick succession?

I'm not saying there are no champions who have abilities that scale with each type of damage stat, but I'm saying it makes counterplay extremely hard. What kind of resistance do you build to counter them? Most ADC's don't have the item slot to waste on anything more than maybe a Guardian Angel or one specific resistance item (Frozen Mallet or Black Cleaver).

If you're dead-set on the idea he needs to be hybrid, make him lock in his damage type. His abilities can scale with both, but make it clear that one type or the other is clearly the superior build. Also, what angle are you going for with his kit? Do you want a Warden, a Vanguard, a Bruiser, a Juggernaut, or something else? Theme and cohesiveness play massive roles in making and breaking champions.

The Real Boop1 votes

This is a very interesting idea. This is a really solid idea and I see a lot of potential but there are just some details that should be worked out. My biggest question though is about the Q ability, I was wondering if all three hits from the ability would apply on hit effects, would it only apply them on the first hit, or just not at all? I ask this because this would kind of define this champions archetype, for example if all of the hits from his Q apply on hit effects he will automatically be an on hit attack speed champion where deathfire touch and hextech gunblade are absolutely nessesary (and might even be a little OP) for this champion. Anyway great concept and keep up the good work! [slayer-jinx-wink]

Bultz2 votes

{quoted}

This is a very interesting idea. This is a really solid idea and I see a lot of potential but there are just some details that should be worked out. My biggest question though is about the Q ability, I was wondering if all three hits from the ability would apply on hit effects, would it only apply them on the first hit, or just not at all? I ask this because this would kind of define this champions archetype, for example if all of the hits from his Q apply on hit effects he will automatically be an on hit attack speed champion where deathfire touch and hextech gunblade are absolutely nessesary (and might even be a little OP) for this champion. Anyway great concept and keep up the good work! [slayer-jinx-wink]

I see what you are saying, but honestly I couldn't tell you without seeing it in action. If it It worked out that it didn't make him op, I would say yes to on hit affectrs to the Q, but if for some reason it would make it grossly strong, we could allways do just the first hit. I don't think it would be op mainly because auto attack champions spam autos fairly fast, such as udyr, and it it don't end up being broken.Thank you!

The Real Boop1 votes

Cool, that was actually really helpful. Thanks for the clarification!

Wrathof3001 votes

I like the idea that he is a inter-galactic being adds flavor to him as a character. Personally I think his kit is a bit linear being all about punching, but interesting nonetheless.

Personal input: what if the ult were AoE, that way he could make multiple of his teammates invisible.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

I like the idea that he is a inter-galactic being adds flavor to him as a character. Personally I think his kit is a bit linear being all about punching, but interesting nonetheless.

Personal input: what if the ult were AoE, that way he could make multiple of his teammates invisible.

It is a bit simple, but always room to grow. I mean he has the autos in q, the range in w, the cc in e, and a bit of galactic magic in his ult. The AoE might not be a bad idea, but in all honestly without a way to test this, I couldn't say if that would be to strong or work well.

Wrathof3001 votes

Regardless it really is an awesome concept.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

Regardless it really is an awesome concept.

Thank you!

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