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[SUG] Support income line mini-rework

CoolKnightST··18 votes·10,177 views

We have been sitting on the last support income rework for a few patches now. Well, time for another review about it. With this mini-rework I want to focus on 3 things:

  • Option of choice: You don't endup with the same buildpath, champion and playstyle every time
  • Adaptive: Able to adjust towards the situation
  • Role Focus: Able to highlight more elements from your role in your build

I start with the biggest change:

#Spellthief Line

The idea is to make spellthief's edge adaptive with the option to build it in both an AD as an AP item. T'is allows more supports from pickup up this item. Will it be Leona that wants the ad for an all-in or maybe an marksmen or bruisers in the support role, who knowns. Hey we we Pyke now. But let's not limit it to untradtional supports. Many traditional supports like AD as well. Don't forget it's adaptive so a support starting off with no AP will start with AD (unless riot change the default for that specific champion). It would be nice on Nami for example. Having that early AD will give some nice early power. Another example could be Blitzcrank where I really like to stick with his adaptive AD early. Maybe even go so far to get a sheen and have some fun. And I still have that option to go AP when I get really really fed. I just buy one AP item and boom, playing AP now boys. I would like to see this concept on edge as the offensive option for supports:

##item 3310 Spellthief's Edge

  • Cost: 350 gold
  • 25% Base Mana Regen
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • Unique: 10 Ability Power or 6 Attack Damage (adaptive)
  • UNIQUE – TRIBUTE: Grants a charge every 10 seconds, up to 3 charges. Damaging spells and attacks against champions and buildings consume a charge, up to one per attack or cast. Consuming a charge deals them "13 bonus magic damage" or "(20)? bonus physical damage" (adaptive) and grants 10 gold. Before quest completion, killing a minion or non-epic monster pauses Tribute generation and the passive gold generation for 12 seconds per unit slain.
  • Quest: When you compleet the quest you now have 1 ward charge until you upgrade to item 3098 where you get back 3.

Extra: When Spellthiefs adapts to AD it's color changes to red: https://i.imgur.com/m2IBlOv.png

##item 3098 Frostfang

  • Cost: 1000 gold
  • Build from: item 3303 (350) + item 1052 (435) + 215
  • 40 Ability Power
  • 50% Base Mana Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – TRIBUTE: Grants a charge every 10 seconds, up to 3 charges. Damaging spells and attacks against champions and buildings consume a charge, up to one per attack or cast. Consuming a charge deals them 18 bonus magic damage and grants 20 gold. Before quest completion, killing a minion or non-epic monster pauses Tribute generation and the passive gold generation for 12 seconds per unit slain.
  • Quest: Unchanged

##https://i.imgur.com/rejgDm2.png Bloodfang

  • Cost: 1000 gold
  • Build from: item 3303 (350) + item 1036 (350) + 300
  • 25 Attack Damage
  • 50% Base Mana Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – TRIBUTE: Grants a charge every 10 seconds, up to 3 charges. Damaging spells and attacks against champions and buildings consume a charge, up to one per attack or cast. Consuming a charge deals them (25)? bonus physical damage and grants 20 gold. Before quest completion, killing a minion or non-epic monster pauses Tribute generation and the passive gold generation for 12 seconds per unit slain.
  • Quest: Unchanged

##item 3092 Remnant of the Watchers

  • Cost: 2000 gold
  • Build from: item 3098 (1000) + item 1028 (400) + 600
  • 200 Health
  • 50 Ability Power
  • 50% Base Mana Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – TRIBUTE: Grants a charge every 10 seconds, up to 3 charges. Damaging spells and attacks against champions and buildings consume a charge, up to one per attack or cast. Consuming a charge deals them 18 bonus magic damage and grants 20 gold. Before quest completion, killing a minion or non-epic monster pauses Tribute generation and the passive gold generation for 12 seconds per unit slain.
  • Quest: Unchanged

##https://i.imgur.com/ZZzcyj0.png Remnant of the Bloodwatchers

  • Cost: 2000 gold
  • Build from: https://i.imgur.com/rejgDm2.png (1000) + item 1028 (400) + 600
  • 200 Health
  • 40 Attack Damage
  • 50% Base Mana Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – TRIBUTE: Grants a charge every 10 seconds, up to 3 charges. Damaging spells and attacks against champions and buildings consume a charge, up to one per attack or cast. Consuming a charge deals them (25)? bonus physical damage and grants 20 gold. Before quest completion, killing a minion or non-epic monster pauses Tribute generation and the passive gold generation for 12 seconds per unit slain.
  • Quest: Unchanged

#Relic Line

The relic becomes the defensive start for supports. Focussed on tankness in the early to midgame by providing them with the strongest defensive combination out their. I have tried to keep the stats as fair as possible but some of them probally need some more tweaks to get them just right.

##item 3302 Relic Shield

  • Cost: 350 gold
  • 50 Health
  • 25% Base Health Regen
  • 1 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – SPOILS OF WAR: Unchanged (small change, minions that can be excuted with your current auto attack are marked)
  • Quest: When you compleet the quest you now have 1 ward charge until you upgrade to item 3097 where you get back 3.

##item 3097 Targon's Steel Brace

  • Cost: 1000 gold
  • Build from: item 3302 (350) + item 1029 (300) + 350
  • 100 Health
  • 25 Armor
  • 50% Base Health Regen
  • 1 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – SPOILS OF WAR: Unchanged
  • Quest: Unchanged

##item 3097 Targon's Leather Brace

  • Cost: 1000 gold
  • Build from: item 3302 (350) + item 1033 (450) + 200
  • 100 Health
  • 25 Magic Resistance
  • 50% Base Health Regen
  • 1 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – SPOILS OF WAR: Unchanged
  • Quest: Unchanged

##item 3401 Remnant of the White Aspect

  • Cost: 2000 gold
  • Build from: item 3097 (1000) + item 1028 (400) + 600
  • 275 Health
  • 35 Armor
  • 150% Base Health Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 1 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – SPOILS OF WAR: Unchanged
  • Quest: Unchanged

##item 3401 Remnant of the Black Aspect

  • Cost: 2000 gold
  • Build from: item 3097 (1000) + item 1028 (400) + 600
  • 275 Health
  • 35 Magic Resistance
  • 150% Base Health Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 1 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – SPOILS OF WAR: Unchanged
  • Quest: Unchanged

#Coin Line

The coin line is often just an hit or mis situation. So I want to push it into a direction where the benefits are greater the longer the game goes:

##item 3301 Ancient Coin

  • Cost: 350 gold
  • 5 Movementspeed
  • 25% Base Health Regen
  • 5% Cooldown Reduction
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – Favor: Unchanged
  • Quest: When you compleet the quest you now have 1 ward charge until you upgrade to item 3096 where you get back 3.

##item 3096 Nomad's Medallion

  • Cost: 1000 gold
  • Build from: item 3301 (350) + item 1027 (350) + 300
  • 200 Mana
  • 10 Movementspeed
  • 50% Base Health Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – Favor: Unchanged
  • Quest: Unchanged

##item 3096 Wanderer's Medallion

  • Cost: 1000 gold
  • Build from: item 3301 (350) + item 1028 (400) + 250
  • 200 Health
  • 10 Movementspeed
  • 50% Base Health Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – Favor: Unchanged
  • Quest: Unchanged

##item 3069 Remnant of the Ascended

  • Cost: 1700 gold
  • Build from: item 3096 (1000) + item 1028 (400) + 300
  • 200 Health
  • 400 Mana
  • 10 Movementspeed
  • 125% Base Health Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – Favor: Unchanged
  • Quest: Unchanged

##item 3069 Remnant of the Decended

  • Cost: 1700 gold
  • Build from: item 3096 (1000) + item 1028 (400) + 300
  • 400 Health
  • 10 Movementspeed
  • 125% Base Health Regen
  • 10% Cooldown Reduction
  • 2 Gold per 10 seconds
  • UNIQUE – Favor: Unchanged
  • Quest: Unchanged

#Updates

  • 10/06/2018 - Fix Frost Fang ability stat typo (10 + 25 = 35, not 30), (30 > 40 ap)
  • 10/06/2018 - Fixed typo with coin line, sorry for the miscommunication (5% > 5 ms; 10% > 10 ms; )

So what do you think?

24 Comments

DontTouchMyBall4 votes

Im personally unhappy with the open bot thing. I main support, I dont like the top or mid experience. I wanted to avoid laning against Renekton and LeBlanc and Darius and now they're all BOT. Supports are squishy, have 2 engagers down there and we'll have a feeding lane.

Im happy with what your suggestion to relic shield, the early choice to build some Armor or MR is neat and I find it so appealing I wished it wa already in the game.

Spellthieves seems decent too but special congrats on the coin line, I am impressed with how it turned out, I knew it'd be the most difficult to get things right.

I personally think we need an overhaul of the supports items after this open "bot thing" (more like screw bot) or I will srsly consider to main Jungle instead.

Some items are broken and others dont even exist, like an ardent censer for AP casters. While I'd rather not deal with non-supports and non-adcs down bot, I allways loved the variety of items I could build from the support role. (Reason why I HATED the Ardent meta)

Yet I have little faith after they release the 2 new bruiser items. Getting free attack for building defensive and vice-versa is straight out creating an obligatory hard to balance item.

CoolKnightST1 votes

{quoted} Im personally unhappy with the open bot thing. I main support, I dont like the top or mid experience. I wanted to avoid laning against Renekton and LeBlanc and Darius and now they're all BOT. Supports are squishy, have 2 engagers down there and we'll have a feeding lane.

I think this would be a situational situation and I agrea that champions that are not designed for that role shouldn't be seen in botlane. Add least not from a linair perspective.

Botlane should be a role that is still focussed arround pairing one resource depended champion in the carry role and one supportive champion that makes sure he get's them. The fact that this concept is currently limited to pairing an marksmen with a warden or enchanter is a little bit disappointing and hard to overcome when a meta is litterly build arround it. Marksmen, Skirmishers, Artillery Mages and some hybrids. That should be the future carry pool in my opinion. Outside marksmen we could have an crit based Skirmisher like Tryndamere Yasuo or a Artillery Mage like Ziggs that is build arround the concept of finishing the game early. As far hybrids goes, we already have some of them like Varus Kaisa. Than some unique champions can be added to the role like Akali for example. If their is a hyperscaling assasin that would work perfectly in that position it would be her. Offcourse supports will need to change with them as well. We need more supports that would work better with melee champions that for example could cover their lack of artillery that prevent many melee champions from been successfull.

So no, I doubt a Renekton/LeBlanc lane would ever happen unless riot really mess things up. I can see some potentional for Darius when paired with a more melee friendly version of Karma but only as a triangle pick to counter out what would counter the marksmen/enchanter meta.

{quoted} Im happy with what your suggestion to relic shield, the early choice to build some Armor or MR is neat and I find it so appealing I wished it wa already in the game.

Yeah, the goal is to make tank support more adaptive towards the situation. Having health is nice and does the job against both damage types. The problem right now just is that it's to strong when ahead or otherwise to weak when behind and the fact %health damage is extreemly common now it's only going backwards. You might all have played out this situation: You are playing Braum and in one game you get really fed. You become unkillable and even when you start to play poorly you win the game. When your behind however, it's a compleet different story. You get onehotted by a midlane that got his peneration early while you litterly are doing your job and played that out perfectly. This feels really unrewarding from a play perspective and you can't exactly build armor/resistance in your build when you are still sitting on compleeting your sightstone quest. Also as a result of having that big powerspike after your first armor/resistance item tanks supports are nerfed over and over again. Right now a tank support feels as squishy as a AP support (yikes).

Having a mix of armor/mr with health will make them stronger against fed champions and dot's but weaker against normal burst when they are behind or are even with you.

{quoted} Spellthieves seems decent too but special congrats on the coin line, I am impressed with how it turned out, I knew it'd be the most difficult to get things right.

Thx, the coin line changes just popup in my mind after I did the relic changes. I felt that we really needed to keep health in some of the options because health naturally just scales better in the long run. I always wanted to make coin more catcher friendly and I just took the opportunity to make that happen. And with the mindset of making coin more lategame oriënted it just clicked.

I really think it would be an good improvement for Thresh and Blitzcrank users. That already like to go coin. But now that actually get the stats benefits from it as well. The mana road could also open the road for some more mana intensive supports like Zilean for example.

{quoted} I personally think we need an overhaul of the supports items after this open "bot thing" (more like screw bot) or I will srsly consider to main Jungle instead.

If riot manages to make supports worse than jungle than hold my beer because I need to write a clean uninstaller to make sure not a single digit of the game is left on my pc.

{quoted} Some items are broken and others dont even exist, like an ardent censer for AP casters. While I'd rather not deal with non-supports and non-adcs down bot, I allways loved the variety of items I could build from the support role. (Reason why I HATED the Ardent meta)

I have a feeling the main reason why ardent was so problematic was because adc's where overpowered in the earlygame. It really wasn't just the item on it's own. The reason was that riot overbuffed enchanters and when you pair these two together. What do you expect what will happen.

{quoted} Yet I have little faith after they release the 2 new bruiser items. Getting free attack for building defensive and vice-versa is straight out creating an obligatory hard to balance item.

I haven't seen many Trundle & Poppy supports yet so I think it would be alright. I'm curious about MissFortune support but I doubt it will be on the same level.

As far toplane goes. Maybe Jax could potentionally be a little bit strong with the item. But so far I haven't see many gamebreakers yet.

Blakiepug4 votes

The only thing I don't like about your suggestion is that all the support items still ultimately lead to wards as their main functionality. In my opinion, when Riot removed all of the unique actives from the support items and replaced them with wards earlier this season is when the support role really began to feel like your builds had a serious lack of diversity. It feels like my choice of support item really doesn't matter too much anymore because every single item leads back to wards with some mediocre stats. And as a result, the role has become a lot more stale and less fun this season for me personally.

DontTouchMyBall2 votes

{quoted}

The only thing I don't like about your suggestion is that all the support items still ultimately lead to wards as their main functionality. In my opinion, when Riot removed all of the unique actives from the support items and replaced them with wards earlier this season is when the support role really began to feel like your builds had a serious lack of diversity. It feels like my choice of support item really doesn't matter too much anymore because every single item leads back to wards with some mediocre stats. And as a result, the role has become a lot more stale and less fun this season for me personally.

I cant afford to downvote you, I just semi-agree to higly-disagree with ya.

Losing the quests was bad indeed but and it was needed somewhat. Paying "taxes" that was the sighstone every game was boring and now I can freely build to any item I wish much earlier, that's a very good upside for me and we keep the same item slots as we did be4 without missing shurelias or twin shadows.

I still have some hope they'll return the quests in some way. Hopefully this open bot fiesta drives some more variety to optimal items to build into. I eventually build Ardent, I just dont rush it all the time right now, it feels good building mikael's first item for a change when Im up against Brand, Zyra, Ashe or Leona.

Blakiepug2 votes

{quoted}

I cant afford to downvote you, I just semi-agree to higly-disagree with ya.

Losing the quests was bad indeed but and it was needed somewhat. Paying "taxes" that was the sighstone every game was boring and now I can freely build to any item I wish much earlier, that's a very good upside for me and we keep the same item slots as we did be4 without missing shurelias or twin shadows.

I still have some hope they'll return the quests in some way. Hopefully this open bot fiesta drives some more variety to optimal items to build into. I eventually build Ardent, I just dont rush it all the time right now, it feels good building mikael's first item for a change when Im up against Brand, Zyra, Ashe or Leona.

Tbh I didn't mind the removal of the quest rewards as much as the actual item actives. Sure they are coming back on other items (except Face of the Mountain's active because Riot hates me :/), but now they take longer to get to than before. My main problem with the change is that everyone keeps saying it saves them having to buy a sightstone separately now, but these support items that are currently the only support items existed before. If you had wanted to get the ward starting item before, you could have! But not as many players were choosing that route as Riot wanted them to so instead they decided to force everyone into buying the ward items by making them the only option.

Believe it or not, there are a lot of players out there who love to play the support role for reasons other than warding. And with the old system supports had the ability to choose what play style they were going to take on that game through their choice of starting item. Now you either get good at warding or suffer a disadvantage which isn't fun. I know there are some players that love warding, but forcing their play style onto everyone else was not the correct path to take in my opinion.

DontTouchMyBall1 votes

{quoted}

Tbh I didn't mind the removal of the quest rewards as much as the actual item actives. Sure they are coming back on other items (except Face of the Mountain's active because Riot hates me :/), but now they take longer to get to than before. My main problem with the change is that everyone keeps saying it saves them having to buy a sightstone separately now, but these support items that are currently the only support items existed before. If you had wanted to get the ward starting item before, you could have! But not as many players were choosing that route as Riot wanted them to so instead they decided to force everyone into buying the ward items by making them the only option.

Believe it or not, there are a lot of players out there who love to play the support role for reasons other than warding. And with the old system supports had the ability to choose what play style they were going to take on that game through their choice of starting item. Now you either get good at warding or suffer a disadvantage which isn't fun. I know there are some players that love warding, but forcing their play style onto everyone else was not the correct path to take in my opinion.

I never thought of how I like or dislike wards, I simply done it and still do, my very high vision score being the stat that highly distinguishes me from every1 else. I even went as far as to get the red Ruby SS when I had FQC. Not saying my way was the right way, but it worked for me.

Considering this large group of ppl that did things differently, I'm all up for a changes, the more options the more fun the role is but I cannot go back to SS 1st item meta now that I had a taste of what freedom feels like.

[{quoted}](name=Weiss Guertena,realm=EUW,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=M54OOEIx,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2018-06-09T15:09:05.431+0000)

As a support main, I feel like binding Sightstone to support items actually increased build diversity. Because, let's be honest - outside of Censer meta, your first two buys were always a gold item and a Sightstone. And there wasn't even much freedom in choosing a gold item; a tank would almost always go with Shield, a mage support would never want anything that's not Spellthief and Enchanters got Medallion with only an occasional Spellthief.

Now, my gold generation item doubling as a Sightstone means I can start with my actual item build, as I'm not forced into spending 800 gold for vision. And If I miss unique actives, I can still buy Twin Shadows or Shurelya's Reverie for exactly the same effect. So, aside from Relic Shield's active being removed instead of replaced, I feel like itemization got improved in every way.

Same.

thaBeast3 votes

{quoted}

I cant afford to downvote you, I just semi-agree to higly-disagree with ya.

Losing the quests was bad indeed but and it was needed somewhat. Paying "taxes" that was the sighstone every game was boring and now I can freely build to any item I wish much earlier, that's a very good upside for me and we keep the same item slots as we did be4 without missing shurelias or twin shadows.

I still have some hope they'll return the quests in some way. Hopefully this open bot fiesta drives some more variety to optimal items to build into. I eventually build Ardent, I just dont rush it all the time right now, it feels good building mikael's first item for a change when Im up against Brand, Zyra, Ashe or Leona.

how about we make the thing you get from the quest chosen like if you want the warding stuff you click on something andyou get it and if you want the active you click on something else also to get the old quest for shield battery i think they should make it a rune and it scales with max health out of combat i think it should replace second win or be in the same line as it also to fix the item cdr i think it should be moved to sorcery since the people who would take it used to have sorcery as a primary but its riots game and they already made their money so idk

CoolKnightST1 votes

I miss the quests too. But I have to admit it's really hard to bring them back. I have some ideas tho:

item 3302 (reworked)

  • Spoils of War removed
  • Unique Passive: Shield battery: Now grants you and your nearby ally a permament shield that recharges over time. Damaging the shield will provide you with gold. ~~After taking damage from an enemy champion. The shield will recharge faster for x seconds. ~~

I have a feeling the movementspeed boost should be added to item 3905 but like this: You gain a small ms buff when you auto attack an enemy champion that is slowed by a ghost. I'm not sure the item needs a buff right now tho.

Alternatively it could be added as an assassin item like item 3145 + item 3113

The last one (coin quest) could be an armor enchanter item like:

  • item 2053 + item 3114
  • item 3024 + item 3114
  • item 3028 + item 3024
Weiss Guertena10 votes

As a support main, I feel like binding Sightstone to support items actually increased build diversity. Because, let's be honest - outside of Censer meta, your first two buys were always a gold item and a Sightstone. And there wasn't even much freedom in choosing a gold item; a tank would almost always go with Shield, a mage support would never want anything that's not Spellthief and Enchanters got Medallion with only an occasional Spellthief.

Now, my gold generation item doubling as a Sightstone means I can start with my actual item build, as I'm not forced into spending 800 gold for vision. And If I miss unique actives, I can still buy Twin Shadows or Shurelya's Reverie for exactly the same effect. So, aside from Relic Shield's active being removed instead of replaced, I feel like itemization got improved in every way.

IcyPepper4 votes

Gone are the days of "Report support for no sightstone" and I, for one, am glad for it.

CoolKnightST1 votes

That patch was so good. I still remember the report spam in chat for not having the removed sightstone in my inventory. [sg-miss-fortune]

IcyPepper1 votes

Not to mention that, for some support items, if you don't have wards at X minutes it's not always your fault...

ModKnightsKemplar3 votes

I am imposing my own bias here, big time, but I think Spoils of War really needs to be changed if work is going to get done on support items. And I'd always rather have the extra health than resistances; other support items for tanky supports give resistances (locket, zeke's), but you also need some health somewhere or you're just too squishy.

I'm also unconvinced that we need two versions of the coin and relic lines; I think your idea with adaptive damage on spellthief's is good, but the other two seem like over-complication without much reward.

CoolKnightST1 votes

I can agrea that item 3302 is in a strange spot right now from a design perspective. The hidden power of this items feels really nasty and it's also very team depended (let me last hit that cannon please). Maybe what they can do is this (an example):

  • UNIQUE – SPOILS OF WAR: Grants a charge every 50 seconds, up to 2 charges. Melee basic attacks can consume one charge to execute minions below 50% health. Killing a minion by any means with a charge heals you and the nearest allied champion for 15 (+ 2% of missing health) health and grants them kill gold. Healing is halved if the owner is Ranged role ranged. These effects require an allied champion within 1050 units of the user. Cannon minions below 50% health are automaticly executed when you within 600 range as a melee champion and will function like a charge is consumed. This effect only happends for melee champions.

In terms of having more health on relic. I think it's a flip/coin discussion. In terms of the lategame relic would indeed be better when it has more health. But is that really the direction we want a support item to go? The midgame of a tank support is really important and what use does it have when we give it an item designed for the lategame. Some games are decided before a tank support even get's something like item 3105.

Right now their is really a lot of %health damage in the game and I feel their is really not much you can do about it as a tank support.

As far the two version goes. I think you underestimate how usefull this adaption could be in term of opening the support role. I already give some examples in previous comments like Zilean, Thresh, Blitzcrank and Leona.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

Love that tweak to the passive, but I remain unconvinced about the resistances. I maintain that tank support builds are already short on health; unless that gets fixed first, I don't wanna to see any more pulled out of my build, especially on an item I have to buy.

CoolKnightST2 votes

Yeah your right, we don't have many health items for the support role. We have item 3109 and it pretty much stops their. I would like to see an 2200 gold version of a item 3083 like item or something to cover out the health problem like item 3801 + item 3067.

Health, Mr or Armor, their will always be a tradeoff. But in term of living through a fed enemy champion, armor/resistance will help a lot more until they get % peneration.

Eeyore1 votes

I feel like the alternate items could have names that are lore-appropriate. For example, instead of White and Black Aspect, it could be Remnant of Protector and Remnant of the Warrior.

CoolKnightST1 votes

Good suggestion, I haven't really thought about the names with much detail yet. Their are also the eye of name variants so their is work to be done [sg-poppy]

flibitydoo1 votes

I feel like even with these changes, what makes a champion a support is still going to stay the same (their scalings, their utility, their base values). The thing about the current support line up is they aren't trying to get competitive stats like ap or ad or max mana to stay relevant, it's not a statstick race like it is in midlane, so those stats don't really matter. At best, the items get abused by non-supports in non-support roles, which is what gets the support items nerfed in the end.

I feel like if we were to ever encourage more diversity, doing something to make non-adcs viable would be the way to go. Things like relic shield execute being %max health heal so tanks can feel good botlane. Or ancient coin restoring ally mana to make mages feel better being played botlane.

CoolKnightST1 votes

It was also not my intention to compleetly rebuild the entire botlane meta from scratch. That would be a terrible idea. That's why I listed it as a mini-rework and not a full scale one. It will help some picks like Pyke Thresh Blitzcrank Zilean Leona but not on a level it will compleetly shakeup the meta. In terms of impact the change won't be that extreem.

The intention of the suggestion is to build a better foundation for every champion in the support role. Allowing to have option and diversity. An Alistar support for example could start his first game with item 3301 and upgrade it into the health version item 3096. Than in his second game he builds item 3302 and goes for the armor version item 3097. Than in his 3th game the enemy has more AP and he builds item 3302 and builds it into the mr version of item 3097. Than in his 4th game he get's item 3301 again and for some reason he's feel like he's roaming a lot. The mana issues are anyoing so he builds the mana version of item 3096. That are 4 different games with 2 different playstyles and 4 different builds and that is what league is all about. Games can be decided really early right now. And having the option to become adaptive will distinct the good with the bad players.

Rathar Dashing1 votes

I don't think I approve of the coin line getting %movement speed instead of flat. On a champ with 330 movement speed, that changes the +10 to a +33, or a +35/37 if you have boots (and another +1 if they're magical or swifties!). Would be very broken on Janna.

CoolKnightST1 votes

Fun thing is that it was a typo and I realise it just now. I should correct it [sg-zephyr]

PaffWasTaken1 votes

"Support itemisation rework #306, day #10's log: junglers, midlane assassins and toplane tanks started to build support items again for the 80th time, currently working on the 307th rework, which will also include tower nerfs and enchanters buffs"

CoolKnightST1 votes

Their are many reasons why the abuse is happening like that. I give the main ones:

  1. Starting items are shit. You have item 1055 item 1054 and item 1056. Nice diverisity, still waiting on the attackspeed starting item that riot announced like haf a season ago.
  2. Jungle items are shit. Until they finally decide to release different componements depending on the role they are playing. This will remain a problem. Their is still no alternative for the vision they lost. Why the plan of having a refillable controle ward is still not on the table I have no idea.
  3. Support income items need to have great stats and solo lanes are abusing this. Riot litterly need to invent random requirements just to prevent things like Gangplank Evelynn from picking it up.

Support items are not overpowered in the hands of a support. They are overpowered in the hand of a solo laner. Junglers just doens't have anything better right now. When your forced to support. Your better off just building that way.

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