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[Rework Concept] Aatrox, the Darkin Blade

SSmotzer··3 votes·2,854 views

https://i.redd.it/95wblt2yamj31.jpg

Passive - Blood Well: Aatrox fills his Blood Well when damaging enemies with his abilities, twice as fast when damaging with the edge of the Darkin Blade, which decays while out of combat. When the Blood Well is filled, Aatrox enters the Deathbringer Stance for 4 seconds as the Blood Well drains. While in the Deathbringer Stance, dealing or taking damage against enemy champions or neutral monsters will completely fill the Blood Well and refresh Deathbringer's duration.

  • Deathbringer: Aatrox's basic attacks gain bonus range and deal a portion of the target's maximum health as bonus physical damage on-hit, healing him for 100% of the bonus physical damage dealt.

Q - Darkin Blade - First Cast: Aatrox cleaves the area in front of him, dealing physical damage in a cone, which deals bonus damage at the edge.

  • Second Cast: Aatrox slams his sword down in a line, dealing physical damage in a line, which deals bonus damage at the edge.

  • Darkin Flight - Third Cast: Aatrox takes flight, and after a brief delay he will crash down in a target direction, dealing physical damage and knocking up enemies at the center of the area.

W - Infernal Chains: Unchanged.

E - Umbral Torment - Passive: Aatrox periodically stores a Umbral Torment charge, up to 2 stored at once.

  • Active: Aatrox consumes all his charges of Umbral Torment, dashing in a line. If both charges were consumed, he increases his dash range and spirals forwards with his blade, dealing physical damage to enemies in his path. This ability can be cast while casting Darkin Blade to dash as he slashes or Darkin Flight to extend it's range.

R - World Ender: Aatrox unleashes his true demonic form for 10 seconds, gaining bonus movement speed, which decays over time, and fearing nearby enemy minions. While transformed, Aatrox gains increased size and bonus attack damage, and heals when dealing physical. If Aatrox kills an enemy champion, he will begin his Massacre.

  • Massacre: Aatrox gains a Magic Shield, equal to his Blood Well, which only blocks magic damage, and instantly breaks from 1/2/3 tower shots. If Aatrox takes lethal damage while the Magic Shield is active, he will revive over 3 seconds, during which he is untargetable, pacified, and slowed by 99% while healing for 1/3 of his maximum health.
Physical damage doesn't pop the shield, meaning he revives. Magic damage pops the shield, meaning no revive.

16 Comments

Pumpedhero2 votes

So all u did was merge oldtrox and aatrox.. no.

SSmotzer2 votes

{quoted}

So all u did was merge oldtrox and aatrox.. no.

Mostly. I did tie his revive to a spell shield, since Aatrox was sealed by magic I think it makes sense it would be his weakness. I also gave him a new spiraling dash on his E.

FlameHalbrdOkido5 votes

{quoted}

So all u did was merge oldtrox and aatrox.. no.

can we just appreciate, that the OP not just complaining like other people who liked the old aatrox?

Tho, it should probably be taken into account that the old Bloodwell wasn't the best system for him, im not sure its the best mechanic to try to modernize. Just because it was "working" before the final rework doesn't mean it was balanced, but, i'm willing to hear a defense on it

i DO like the new Q a LOT tho, many people had issues with Aatrox's new Q, being similar to Riven's (idk WHY they really arent that similar) This new Q does a lot to differentiat it, so its gud in that regard. I also think its pretty interesting how the range now gets LONGER instead of shorter, i think that works wonders for a melee champion bc riot has been trying to work on making ways for them to not be so one dimensional in how they just run up on a targets and stick to them.

Im liking pretty much everything i see here, except i think the spiral dash is redundant. The dash will already be extending the range at which he can cast Q's at and Q's are already a great source of AoE dmg, so i don't see the point of it being anything MORE than a dash.

Lastly it should be noted that spell shield abilities normally ONLY last a short duration, like 1.5 sec. Item spell shields usually last until HIT by CC. If u want a shield that fits the lore a PHYSICAL shield makes the most sense sense he was beaten by magic, it also makes sense gameplay wise sense he fights a lot of AD champs however i DO appreciate the lengths u have gone to, to try to fix some of his issues, namely his ability to tower dive and not get punished for it due to the old rework ult

SSmotzer2 votes

{quoted}

can we just appreciate, that the OP not just complaining like other people who liked the old aatrox?

Tho, it should probably be taken into account that the old Bloodwell wasn't the best system for him, im not sure its the best mechanic to try to modernize. Just because it was "working" before the final rework doesn't mean it was balanced, but, i'm willing to hear a defense on it

I think it's a thematic way to put counterplay in his kit. Like his rage makes him more powerful, but it lets enemies see him change into a more powerful blade stance giving them the opportunity to back off and let him "cool down." Like with Trynd's fury or Kled's violent tenancies, or Gnar.

FlameHalbrdOkido1 votes

{quoted}

I think it's a thematic way to put counterplay in his kit. Like his rage makes him more powerful, but it lets enemies see him change into a more powerful blade stance giving them the opportunity to back off and let him "cool down." Like with Trynd's fury or Kled's violent tenancies, or Gnar.

ok, but Trynd and Gnar also can't keep their rage on forever, it should have diminishing returns, and taking dmg should benefit less than dealing dmg, like Morde's W passive. taking notes by making it less effective if taking dmg (honestly i'd say get rid of that part entirely) and making it not last forever is a better way to balance it

SSmotzer2 votes

{quoted}

ok, but Trynd and Gnar also can't keep their rage on forever, it should have diminishing returns, and taking dmg should benefit less than dealing dmg, like Morde's W passive. taking notes by making it less effective if taking dmg (honestly i'd say get rid of that part entirely) and making it not last forever is a better way to balance it

Hmm, makes sense.

SSmotzer2 votes

{quoted}

Lastly it should be noted that spell shield abilities normally ONLY last a short duration, like 1.5 sec. Item spell shields usually last until HIT by CC. If u want a shield that fits the lore a PHYSICAL shield makes the most sense sense he was beaten by magic, it also makes sense gameplay wise sense he fights a lot of AD champs however i DO appreciate the lengths u have gone to, to try to fix some of his issues, namely his ability to tower dive and not get punished for it due to the old rework ult

Nah nah nah. If he is killed with physical damage it activates the revive, since physical damage doesn't pop the shield. If he is hit by magic damage, the shield pops, and the revive won't activate.

FlameHalbrdOkido1 votes

{quoted}

Nah nah nah. If he is killed with physical damage it activates the revive, since physical damage doesn't pop the shield. If he is hit by magic damage, the shield pops, and the revive won't activate.

ok, i see, CC should probably deactivate it tho

GreenKnight1 votes

{quoted}

So all u did was merge oldtrox and aatrox.. no.

So that's more than Riot did for old Aatrox players.

Lord Zeta 13131 votes

I had a very similar idea for the passive, just Instead is gave him 10% true damage. It should probably be Empowered Auto --> Benifit as long as blood well holds. So in my case 10% true damage. Giving Aatrox more time to hit his 3rd Q is not a good idea. Most of the skill In Aatrox is hitting your Q's and Giving him extra time for his 3rd Q will just remove that. Plus, that will give Pro's More room to exploit him. And, this idea would require him to have compleatly new animations.

Not sure about the E change, but lets not make Aatrox any harder, since you would have to take into account your Charges during fights. this could very well send you into tower range by accident.

You seem to have a misconception about spell shields. Spell shields do not have a value. They simply exist, and Brake after one Ability. you are thinking of shielding against magic damage only. And Aatrox's Revive should stay gone. It just made him too good in competitive play, and was bad for the game. Also, you seem to have accidently brought back the "Increases ALL healing" effect. This should also stay gone, since that just makes soraka/Yuumi too good with him.

Aatrox Mechanically is in a good spot for the moment. he just needs buffs.

SSmotzer1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lord Zeta 1313,realm=NA,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=4K8B3r7G,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-12-15T07:06:09.635+0000)

I had a very similar idea for the passive, just Instead is gave him 10% true damage. It should probably be Empowered Auto --> Benifit as long as blood well holds. So in my case 10% true damage. Giving Aatrox more time to hit his 3rd Q is not a good idea. Most of the skill In Aatrox is hitting your Q's and Giving him extra time for his 3rd Q will just remove that. Plus, that will give Pro's More room to exploit him.

Well his skill ceiling is a little low at the moment, with most Aatrox mains being able to dominate for a few patches while they were nerfing him. Personally I just wanted to make it different than Riven's triple hop. Turning it into two basic skill shots and a little hover and crash you can add a dash to just seemed like the right move.

Not sure about the E change, but lets not make Aatrox any harder, since you would have to take into account your Charges during fights. this could very well send you into tower range by accident.

I was thinking it would have a visual effect. Like the second charge would cause his wing banners to pop out, making that ctrl+5 visual flair part of his kit.

you are thinking of shielding against magic damage only. Also, you seem to have accidently brought back the "Increases ALL healing" effect.

Thank you.

Aatrox Mechanically is in a good spot for the moment. he just needs buffs.

Champions being in a good place is irrelevant to them needing a rework. In my opinion if a champion's identity is not fleshed out in their kit then the kit isn't good enough. That is why the revive is in the kit, because it is Aatrox's identity. No matter how many times his body was cut down, no matter how the gods chain him, he will just get back up and fight. So it was either a magic shield or executing a low health allied champion for the revive, the magic shield seemed more practical, and gives him a hard counter in mages, since it was a spell that initially imprisoned him.

Lord Zeta 13131 votes

{quoted}

Well his skill ceiling is a little low at the moment, with most Aatrox mains being able to dominate for a few patches while they were nerfing him. Personally I just wanted to make it different than Riven's triple hop. Turning it into two basic skill shots and a little hover and crash you can add a dash to just seemed like the right move.

I was thinking it would have a visual effect. Like the second charge would cause his wing banners to pop out, making that ctrl+5 visual flair part of his kit.

Thank you.

Champions being in a good place is irrelevant to them needing a rework. In my opinion if a champion's identity is not fleshed out in their kit then the kit isn't good enough. That is why the revive is in the kit, because it is Aatrox's identity. No matter how many times his body was cut down, no matter how the gods chain him, he will just get back up and fight. So it was either a magic shield or executing a low health allied champion for the revive, the magic shield seemed more practical, and gives him a hard counter in mages, since it was a spell that initially imprisoned him.

Okay

  1. Aatrox is not a low skill floor champion. He has to hit 3 small parts of delayed skillshots to deal reasonable damage. Suggesting that he has a low skill floor is absurd. Do you even play Aatrox?
  2. His wing banners are hardly noticable in the middle of a fight, so that's not a good indicator
  3. You changed "increases all healing" to "heals based on physical damage". Giving him another e passive is a direct nerf.
  4. Aatrox's q is different from rivens q. aatrox's is a lot harder to hit, so making it easier to hit his 3rd and most damaging q would not make him harder to play, it would make him much easier. You essentially give him back his second e, which was not fun to play against. 5.did you ever play old Aatrox? His revive was not a major part of his kit. It had a FOUR MINUTE COOLDOWN. The revive wasn't a major part of his kit, drain tanking was. His current kit has enough resemblences to old Aatrox to be passible, and does not need a rework.
SSmotzer1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lord Zeta 1313,realm=NA,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=4K8B3r7G,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2019-12-15T16:51:35.299+0000)

Okay

  1. Aatrox is not a low skill floor champion. He has to hit 3 small parts of delayed skillshots to deal reasonable damage. Suggesting that he has a low skill floor is absurd. Do you even play Aatrox?

I didn't mean it like that. I meant his ceiling is low. What separates an Aatrox main from a pro Aatrox player isn't all that much. They even made fun of that during a tournament, when the commentator literally demonstrated what pro Aatrox play is like, and he just pressed R and literally rolled his face on the keyboard.

  1. His wing banners are hardly noticable in the middle of a fight, so that's not a good indicator

Riot could add more visual flair. Maybe have a strum from his metal song when it's up.

  1. Aatrox's q is different from rivens q. aatrox's is a lot harder to hit, so making it easier to hit his 3rd and most damaging q would not make him harder to play, it would make him much easier. You essentially give him back his second e, which was not fun to play against.

He doesn't have 2 Es tho, it's a single little dash that upgrades to a longer dash that also deals damage if you wait long enough.

5.did you ever play old Aatrox? His revive was not a major part of his kit. It had a FOUR MINUTE COOLDOWN. The revive wasn't a major part of his kit, drain tanking was. His current kit has enough resemblences to old Aatrox to be passible, and does not need a rework.

That is irrelevant. His lore is that he doesn't die, he just stabs himself into a new body and keeps fighting.

If I had it my way Aatrox would be a champion like Yuumi, and he would need to be carried around like if Shen's sword could actively move.

Lord Zeta 13131 votes

{quoted}

I didn't mean it like that. I meant his ceiling is low. What separates an Aatrox main from a pro Aatrox player isn't all that much. They even made fun of that during a tournament, when the commentator literally demonstrated what pro Aatrox play is like, and he just pressed R and literally rolled his face on the keyboard.

Riot could add more visual flair. Maybe have a strum from his metal song when it's up.

He doesn't have 2 Es tho, it's a single little dash that upgrades to a longer dash that also deals damage if you wait long enough.

That is irrelevant. His lore is that he doesn't die, he just stabs himself into a new body and keeps fighting.

If I had it my way Aatrox would be a champion like Yuumi, and he would need to be carried around like if Shen's sword could actively move.

  1. that was when Aatrox still had his garenteed Revive. Thats gone now. He is a lot more difficult to play. Compare the 0/6 Aatrox who gets in close range and only ever hits his 3rd Crit, to the 12/0 Diamond Aatrox Who hits almost all of his crits and Actually does well.
  2. That would require specificlly programming that in, which they are not going to do.
  3. Its the same final result. When Aatrox had 2 E's there was no way to really dodge his Q's. With this change, he would be able to negate your Flash and, combined with The Q change Would make it way easier to Hit all your crits, Which would also make him less fun to play against since it would be almost impossible to dodge his Q.
  4. The lore is second to gameplay. The Revive Was a bad mechanic. It made him way too good in Competitive. It was for the best that it was removed. And if you look at his animations, he dosn't actually die. His Body just disintigrates and he goes back into the blade. So in reality, he still is immortal. And that idea is so Bad that it would likely cause the majority of Aatrox mains to quit. So yeah, Riot should definitly not do that.
SSmotzer1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lord Zeta 1313,realm=NA,application-id=A8FQeEA8,discussion-id=4K8B3r7G,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-16T22:05:55.333+0000)

  1. That would require specificlly programming that in, which they are not going to do.

What the hell does that mean? Any rework would require specificlly programming in new abilities. Why wouldn't they do any new programming for a rework?

  1. Its the same final result. When Aatrox had 2 E's there was no way to really dodge his Q's. With this change, he would be able to negate your Flash and, combined with The Q change Would make it way easier to Hit all your crits, Which would also make him less fun to play against since it would be almost impossible to dodge his Q.

How is a single dash and two dashes the same thing? The problem was that he was able to Q, E, Q, and then Q, E again. How is that the same result as QQQE? Besides only the final Q is able to knock up, meaning he can no longer spam interrupts.

  1. The lore is second to gameplay. The Revive Was a bad mechanic. It made him way too good in Competitive. It was for the best that it was removed. And if you look at his animations, he dosn't actually die. His Body just disintigrates and he goes back into the blade. So in reality, he still is immortal. And that idea is so Bad that it would likely cause the majority of Aatrox mains to quit. So yeah, Riot should definitly not do that.

I say nuts to that. The reason the revive was bad was because he could tank as many tower shots as he needed and was just able to revive. Tell me, how is the toxic revive that negated the tower and a revive that is disabled after getting hit by a single tower shot just as toxic?

None of your arguments hold any water. You say this kit is just as bad as reworked post nerfed Aatrox, when this kit literally takes into account everything that made post nerf Aatrox bad and addresses them.

His lifesteal is limited to a window of opportunity. His dashes are now a single dash that can be ungraded to a longer one with more visual flair over time. His revive can now be completely disabled by towers and mages.

I don't understand what you are complaining about when you say he is exactly the same.

Lord Zeta 13131 votes

{quoted}

What the hell does that mean? Any rework would require specificlly programming in new abilities. Why wouldn't they do any new programming for a rework?

How is a single dash and two dashes the same thing? The problem was that he was able to Q, E, Q, and then Q, E again. How is that the same result as QQQE? Besides only the final Q is able to knock up, meaning he can no longer spam interrupts.

I say nuts to that. The reason the revive was bad was because he could tank as many tower shots as he needed and was just able to revive. Tell me, how is the toxic revive that negated the tower and a revive that is disabled after getting hit by a single tower shot just as toxic?

None of your arguments hold any water. You say this kit is just as bad as reworked post nerfed Aatrox, when this kit literally takes into account everything that made post nerf Aatrox bad and addresses them.

His lifesteal is limited to a window of opportunity. His dashes are now a single dash that can be ungraded to a longer one with more visual flair over time. His revive can now be completely disabled by towers and mages.

I don't understand what you are complaining about when you say he is exactly the same.

  1. I mean that they would have to isolate the Sound Bite, And Program in the Interaction. Most changes involve tweaking the Base code, not adding anything new. And i have to say that having that as an idicator is not a good idea Its easily Ignored in the chaos of teamfights. And honestly, People just prefer the banner wings as they are. Tying them to His e would just reduce the enjoyment.
  2. A single long dash is Often as Good as two short dashes. the pattern with this seems to be QWQEQ. And while that might not seem so bad on the surface, the Dash length would just make it impossible to escape him. You dash away, and he just follows you, giving up nothing. Aatrox's Main Counter is mobility, and you're suggesting removing that. In order to truly Evaluate the dash i need to know 2 things: 1. Is it locked or Flexible (I.E: do you have to dash all the way, or can you only go 1/2 of the way), and how long is the dash. Without this information, i am forced to work off of assumptions based Off of what else you have said. and based off of that, I concluded that it was about 3 of his current E's Length. If i am wrong, Just say.
  3. His ult was not only for tower dives. Sure it helped, but that was not the only thing. You couldn't gank him because he would just R. In teamfights the enemy had to kill him twice, and had to waste 3-4 seconds waiting for him to revive before killing him, in which his ADC could get significant ground. Ask Any pro player why Aatrox's Revive was good, and the only Answer will not just be "Free turret dives".

And yes, My arguments do hold water. His Lifesteal is already tied to a window, which is his ult. The E Is up for debate wether it would be good or bad, I just don't have enough information, and Having a shield that is based off of an arbitrary Ammount (His blood well) Would just be straight up confusing. Does it refill and drain with his blood well? Because if it does then it basiclly makes him immune to magic damage, since dealing any damage just refills it. And I did not say that New Aatrox and Old Aatrox were exactly the same. I said they were SIMILAR. Honestly, if your just going to fabricate things that "i" said, and Just claim that i don't have any valid arguments, then i am done here. Several of my points You have just straight ignored, and yet you still claim you are in the right here.

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