Fizz got nerfed.

Cost as in mana cost is probably not what they poster meant. I think he was talking about down time of the spell. Their is little cost in game play to using it.

Either way his statement is poorly chosen.

[{quoted}](name=Sir Galifrey,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=dMeGWddA,comment-id=00020000000000000001,timestamp=2015-01-22T17:58:57.855+0000)

lol wut. Its 90 mana at lvl 1 and 130 at lvl 5. It has a ridiculous cost, more than his ult.

It was in quotes because it doesn't mean mana cost. It means opportunity cost, like how punished the Fizz is for using it. His E has become less about negating harassment in lane while farming and become a "dodge your stun and chain it as apart of a one shot combo" with an incredibly low cooldown and solid damage attached. Even Xypherous stated that Fizz, a champion he helped create, has been able to use E recklessly and get away with it which is the primary problem with the champion. You barely ever get the satisfying feeling of wringing his neck.

Consider Taric's heal, so you can truly understand how meaningless your statement is. His heal starts at about 60 mana, pretty normal. At level 5, it has doubled and added a further 20 mana for a grand total of 140 mana. Keep in mind as well that he probably can't afford (and will get shit for) building mana since his power comes in the buff aura's that he gives off (also his heal does in fact heal quite a bit). Meanwhile, Fizz is building a Lichbane, and probably some other bonus mana/ mana regen item.

I also don't want to hear the "BUT THE COOLDOWN!!!" argument. He get's an improved version of flash every 8 seconds at max rank without cooldown. He can reposition, dodge skillshots, and interrupt targeted abilities chief among them: Syndra's, Vi's, Caitlyn's, Zed's Ult. While he isn't neccessarily interrupting Zed's ult in the usual sense, it stops Zed's entire rhythm forcing him to disengage to safety no matter where he is. Several blown, long cooldown Ultimates, for one, basic, ability.

That is why it is low cost.

{quoted}

Assuming 3 autos with W up. Old Fizz: 1231.75 Base damage + 430% AP scaling. New Fizz: 1254 Base damage + 406% AP scaling.

This is a full burst, including ult, and 3 autos. Base damage was very slightly increased. But Scaling took a 24% hit. Most of this is in his Q. This is also assuming he uses his E for damage and not as an escape. If he doesn't E for damage, his damage is hurt even more. Although I did forget to factor in the fact that W's passive isn't instant damage. The difference in that shouldn't make that huge of a difference to make the gap enough for it to be a buff or nerf vs an ulted target.

But that was never what made Fizz so powerful. What made him so strong was that he could have his W active removed and his ult and he would still be a good assassin. The power he could load into his Q to deal such massive damage on a targeted ability. Mixed with his ability to avoid almost any attack with E made him who he is. Every other assassin generally needs their ult to get kills unless the enemy outplays themselves. For Fizz it's mostly just an added bonus.

Now his damage is much less without his ult. This means that if he's diving you, a tank could actually eat the ult for you. Braum for example could dash in front of you and take the shark. Although he'd probably just block it. This is mainly just an example. I could of used Lee but let's not bring him into a balance discussion.

He was nerfed. Almost gutted because he is so strong because of his ability to not require his ult to get kills. I suspect he'll get a mana cost reduction on his E to make up for this nerf. Making his early game easier.

I don't know where you are getting these values or how you ended up at that AP scaling as you didn't explain anything and it doesn't match up with what it should be. With the amp buff his scaling would actually be a bit higher including Lich, but only very very barely. This isn't factoring in base values though. His total burst would be a bit higher so if it is on a target not hit by Chum it would lose out slightly to old Fizz (excluding the impact of the % base value which could have a hefty boost to his total dmg).

Here, his ult is still just added bonus as the core of his damage remains almost entirely intact. Fizz can still do what you point out and more.

His dmg didn't take a significant hit without the ult as the core of his damage is still Lich + E which were untouched and the total scaling + base values are roughly in line with old ones except he now does more dmg per auto attack later in the match.

As a whole he was definitely buffed against tankier targets and remains almost identical against anything else.

[{quoted}](name=Pudii Pudii,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=dMeGWddA,comment-id=00010001000100000001,timestamp=2015-01-22T22:14:17.960+0000)

I really don't want to be that guy but math or not the old W did a lot more in terms of effectiveness. Contrary to belief league of legends isn't all about numbers. The DoT from the old W once apply is damage that will be done regardless of your position in relevancy to your opponent, free damage per say.

On top of being a DoT it had grieving wounds which reduced the effectiveness of potions and other healing spells this making trades count for even more. With the current fizz if your opponent has sub 250 HP with standard MR at level 3 you can flash E and then Q+W and ignite to finish them off, without auto attack something you can't do with the new one.

The value of damage over time can't be quantified by numbers alone, the fact that you don't have to be at risk of damage anymore. I'm not saying ranking should be used as a means for indiciating if you knownwhatbypur talking about but I'm 90% sure most Fizz mains would agree that relying on Ult and a non DoT W is a HUGE nerf especially in ranged matches up.

The new W should be a godsend against melee champions but ranged will kite you around for days before you even get off your second auto. Didn't bother looking up your rank but in plat you throw a max range/semi max range ult in plain sight and it's going to miss 80% of the time unless they don't have flash.

You still get some DoT damage that isn't too far from the old one but a much more potent auto attack buffing his total burst/DPS potential. Grievous wounds is the only real nerf to it but I would argue its value was pretty low mid-late game when he could burst you hard enough that it often didn't matter and most mid laners don't carry heal so early game it is often non-issue. Fizz commonly carries ignite, too. The grevious wounds only lasted for 3 seconds out of 15 so it really didn't mean much against anything except Soraka and Heal summoner. Q applies the W so that doesn't really matter though considering he has a double gap closer he can always get an extra auto off so this makes it even more effective, roughly twice so. Note that your ignite + E are doing the majority of the damage to that 250 HP target and Q + W are dealing ~78 damage after Mres at level 3. The new Q + W will do ~58.8 (both cases assuming 40 AP and no autos with 600 max hp target). This puts old W slightly ahead, very very slightly until you start ranking up W. The difference is small enough to completely ignore it early-mid game and late-mid and late game it is a huge advantage in favor of new Fizz. Against targets that stack HP early it is also a much larger advantage, particularly if they decide to rank W before Q which may now become a thing. W is also much better for non-AP builds.

You have to be at risk to go in and place that extremely weak DoT that is often much weaker even at rank 5 then almost any lv 1 ability in the game. The trade off is not worth it in that sense. The DoT does not add any value here. The DoT's only real value is finishing targets that would have survived with say... 5-15 hp or to slightly negate a potion for 3 seconds during a fight where, again, they would have survived with extraordinarily low health values.

The ranged champions will be the same as before, a rough early game in most cases unless you can get an early blue buff due to the mana cost on E. The on-hit is the core follow up Fizz has for trading with a ranged champ, not the DoT. The Ult is fairly accurate at about 50% of its max range which isn't hard to close and early game can reliably be done with Q to guarantee a hit and followed by E thus possibly evading some reaction damage and dealing an amp'd hit. With a double dash if you can't reach the ranged champion it is safe to say you are OOM or afk. If you are missing Fizz ult 80% of the time at semi-max/max range then this is an error on your end. It is far more troublesome to land Anivia's Q and a few other skill shots then Fizz ult and even those are pretty easy. You can abuse terrain to force it to hit except when they have a strong blink or flash. Using flash to evade a Fizz ult is the same as claiming it makes the skill impossible to hit for any other important skill shot in the game. It isn't a viable excuse and you can always hold Chum until they burn their flash if need be. I have covered why it can be applied at close range and still be effective for the amp purposes. It is especially easy to hit if you are at ~50% Chum's max range or less.