Why isn't uncompetitive behavior in solo queue being addressed?

Yenn·Dec 29, 2014·8 votes·1,981 views

When is Riot going to respond to problems with ranked?

This has been a serious problem since S4 began, and there's been no official response on what is being done to deal with this, or even acknowledgement that it's a problem.

It's so bad that I can count the number of days in S4 that I didn't have someone 'AFK,' troll, or intentionally feed on one hand. I even documented some of these games in a thread on the old forums. It has 120-some upvotes.

I've tried to continue this thread on these forums, as I'm seeing even more of this behavior in the pre-season, but moderators have deleted them for 'calling out other players,' even though no names are visible.

The closest thing to a response that I've received is Lyte responding to others asking about my thread, and implying that I see so much of this because I'm toxic, while you can see I had no communication with the player behaving poorly, which is another problem all together.

Why aren't we receiving any communication regarding this problem?

78 Comments

EleshakaiDec 31, 20144 votes

AFKing is a problem that needs to be dealt with(since it's a show of disrespect and that's not acceptable), and to an extent is being dealt with... but people 'not playing well' is not punishable.

I actually feel the opposite... I think people are taking this game way TOO seriously and they need to take a step back and remember that it is, in fact, just a game. That isn't to say they shouldn't try their best, because what's the point of doing anything if you're not going to give it your all, but rather that people need to remember that this game has no real impact on 99.9% of our lives. There's the top 0.1% if not less who are going to be competing for pro... but even for them solo queue is essentially practice so doesn't REALLY matter.

I think if people could take the game a bit LESS seriously we'd probably all have a better time... and probably have better games too.

YennJan 1, 20153 votes

{quoted}

AFKing is a problem that needs to be dealt with(since it's a show of disrespect and that's not acceptable), and to an extent is being dealt with... but people 'not playing well' is not punishable.

I actually feel the opposite... I think people are taking this game way TOO seriously and they need to take a step back and remember that it is, in fact, just a game. That isn't to say they shouldn't try their best, because what's the point of doing anything if you're not going to give it your all, but rather that people need to remember that this game has no real impact on 99.9% of our lives. There's the top 0.1% if not less who are going to be competing for pro... but even for them solo queue is essentially practice so doesn't REALLY matter.

I think if people could take the game a bit LESS seriously we'd probably all have a better time... and probably have better games too.

That's what normals are for.

Not playing well, and not playing well and then intentionally feeding because your team won't surrender are two different things. I think something should be done to punish consistently poor play, as the current state of balance lets many champions get away with it, but that's a different topic.

RaptameiJan 1, 20152 votes

{quoted}

I think something should be done to punish consistently poor play, as the current state of balance lets many champions get away with it, but that's a different topic.

You just said people should be banned for picking easy champions. This undermines your entire argument.

MindspeakerJan 1, 20152 votes

{quoted}

That's what normals are for.

that statement is just wrong. Riot has not stated there is any difference between normal and ranked other than you get prizes in ranked.

YennJan 1, 20152 votes

{quoted}

that statement is just wrong. Riot has not stated there is any difference between normal and ranked other than you get prizes in ranked.

Tryndamere posted that solo queue was intended for players who want to play in a competitive environment, when it was introduced prior to season 1, on the old forums. I've linked to it in past posts there.

I just had a 1-5-2 Wukong say 'ff and let us go to another game.' I said 'Or you can play better in this game,' and he said 'or i can play better in the next game,' and started running into the enemy team when the surrender failed. This should result in an automatic ban, period.

MindspeakerJan 1, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Tryndamere said solo queue was for players who want to play in a competitive environment, when it was introduced prior to season 1.

I just had a 1-5-2 Wukong say 'ff and let us go to another game.' I said 'Or you can play better in this game,' and he said 'or i can play better in the next game,' and started running into the enemy team. This should result in an automatic ban, period.

really is that the best you can do ...is say someone said something before the the first season had even started

...how many seasons have past since then ? I think the fact that your making this thread speaks more of their position than one comment.

...really your stretching even if this comment ever existed.

that example deals with bannable behavior such as intentional feeding and negative attitude . so yes in that case your right

someone who is just having a bad game, playing someone new or is honestly trying with no intention to grief your wrong.

Everyone has the right to ranked no matter their skill level. Again its just a video game . If you want to be ocd and take it "serious"

stay out of solo que and form your own team.

Even If you have the worst player in the history of lol on your team ** but they are honestly trying with no abusive intent nothing should be done .**

SachabotJan 3, 20151 votes

The top post is about people not being competitive by flaming, leaving, and trolling, versus not playing well.

EDIT: Apparently it is about not playing well in addition to everything else. That is stupid.

Everyone has the right to ranked

You say this and then tell him to not play ranked because he doesn't play the way you think he should:

If you want to be ocd and take it "serious" stay out of solo que and form your own team.

Kinda hypocritical.

Now. If a player is just having a bad game, I don't think they deserve to be reported. But this guy isn't saying "report people for not playing well" he's saying "Why bother going into ranked if you aren't there to try?" Admittedly, he's not conveying that very well.

But that's a mentality I agree with. I'm not a pro, and I never will be. But that doesn't mean I don't want to be in Challenger. And you think that because I, and the people like me, want to be in Challenger and try hard, we should all just stay away from the system designed to reward us for trying to get better? I mean, really. If you aren't in the competitive bracket to be competitive, why don't you just play Normal Draft Pick, or Team Builder?

EleshakaiJan 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

The top post is about people not being competitive by flaming, leaving, and trolling, versus not playing well.

You say this and then tell him to not play ranked because he doesn't play the way you think he should:

Kinda hypocritical.

Now. If a player is just having a bad game, I don't think they deserve to be reported. But this guy isn't saying "report people for not playing well" he's saying "Why bother going into ranked if you aren't there to try?" Admittedly, he's not conveying that very well.

But that's a mentality I agree with. I'm not a pro, and I never will be. But that doesn't mean I don't want to be in Challenger. And you think that because I, and the people like me, want to be in Challenger and try hard, we should all just stay away from the system designed to reward us for trying to get better? I mean, really. If you aren't in the competitive bracket to be competitive, why don't you just play Normal Draft Pick, or Team Builder?

To be honest, as I've said before, you should always give your best in everything...

But the reason I have a problem with posts like the OPs is that he IS including people who are 'just having a bad game' in that 'people not being competitive by trolling'. There already are systems in place to catch griefers. Griefing falls under the 'assisting the enemy team' flag or the 'intentionally feeding' flag. But, people get caught up in the competition and start assuming everyone who isn't doing exactly what they think they should are trolls, and ask for systems to be put in place to address the problem they see... but the problem they see isn't really a problem, it's just people who aren't as good as them, or who are on tilt, or who have been bullied until they just give up, or who are just having a bad game for the most part.

I've made friends with several people who were getting flamed by most of the team for trolling. I'd either defend them privately or publicly, and they'd see that and befriend me. When I looked at their play and performance, for the most part that was exactly it. Either they'd gotten a really good luck streak and had risen beyond where they belonged and just struggled until they fell back to where they belonged, or they'd just been having a bad game or a bad string of games.

If the match history extends back far enough(I don't think it does though), you'd be able to see in my games entire weeks where nothing went right. I fell from Gold 1 to Gold 5 in a week at one point. And every single game I was underperforming. If you judged me based off of those 20-30 games, it'd look like I was trolling by the OPs standards. But really, I was just trying to figure out what it was that was making me do so bad... I was desperately triyng to figure it out... playing defensively wasn't helping, going aggressive wasn't helping, trying different champs or different roles didn't help, going to play something else for a few hours to calm down didn't help.... nothing helped. And during that, when players insulted me for my performance, it just made me do worse because I was already aware I was doing badly and these people were kicking me while I was down. My ALLIES were kicking me while I was down. It was a horrible feeling - one of the worst I've had while playing any game. Then suddenly things started working again and I climbed right back up to gold 1 with like an 80~% winrate. It happens. That's why we have to be careful who we call trolls... because sometimes, we all look like trolls by our performance alone.

SachabotJan 3, 20151 votes

Ah, yes, I did just find that quote.

No, I said they should be punished for playing poorly, i.e. having their MMR gradually reduced.

And that's stupid, you are correct. I retract my earlier statement. Give me a moment to amend.

MindspeakerJan 4, 20151 votes

{quoted}

The top post is about people not being competitive by flaming, leaving, and trolling, versus not playing well.

EDIT: Apparently it is about not playing well in addition to everything else. That is stupid.

You say this and then tell him to not play ranked because he doesn't play the way you think he should:

Kinda hypocritical.

Now. If a player is just having a bad game, I don't think they deserve to be reported. But this guy isn't saying "report people for not playing well" he's saying "Why bother going into ranked if you aren't there to try?" Admittedly, he's not conveying that very well.

But that's a mentality I agree with. I'm not a pro, and I never will be. But that doesn't mean I don't want to be in Challenger. And you think that because I, and the people like me, want to be in Challenger and try hard, we should all just stay away from the system designed to reward us for trying to get better? I mean, really. If you aren't in the competitive bracket to be competitive, why don't you just play Normal Draft Pick, or Team Builder?

i never said anything of the sort.

My whole stance is if you cant handle the randomness of solo que stay out of it .

If your a "serious" player you need to put up with people who realize this is just a video game and play mainly for fun just as we have to put up with serious ocd players who think this is the pro circuit and that meta and team comp are actually important.

If i couldn't handle the serious ocd player they n i would stay out of solo que . But with mute they are easy to ignore so i don't

Riot says all you need to do for "communication" is effective use of pings so that's what i do. Personal i wish they would just take the chat option out of the pre post and in game. would solve alot of problems..

I said in many other posts before just in it for the skin and could care less about rank if fact once i qualify for the skin there are no prizes after that so it means even less to me .. I manage not to have problem getting it so all this post and all post like it blaming others the client lag ping whatever are just excuses to me.

If you play enough games and know how to effectively carry your team you'll end up where your supposed to be .

SachabotJan 4, 20151 votes

You did. I quoted you. Would you like me to screenshot it instead, and post that here? Cause I did that, just in case, although you didn't edit, so I don't know why you're denying it. It's literally right there. And you know what? You do have the right to play ranked and not care about ranking (although that defeats the purpose in my opinion). But those of us who care have a right to care, and it's because we care that we're vocal about it. And you mute us, so what's your issue? I don't see why you try to make a point when the rest of your point is how little you care about those of us who aren't totally apathetic.

This post isn't about a guy having difficulty climbing. If you had checked, you'd know that the OP is in Diamond, so I don't really think he's having a problem there. His problem is that people are not caring enough to even try, and he's bewildered as to how they got so high with that attitude, because in Diamond one guy probably doesn't carry unless it's a team effort to make him carry, in which case he wouldn't be having the problem.

SachabotJan 4, 20151 votes

http://prntscr.com/5oa4zm

Here's your screenshot, too.

MindspeakerJan 4, 20151 votes

{quoted}

You did. I quoted you. Would you like me to screenshot it instead, and post that here? Cause I did that, just in case, although you didn't edit, so I don't know why you're denying it. It's literally right there. And you know what? You do have the right to play ranked and not care about ranking (although that defeats the purpose in my opinion). But those of us who care have a right to care, and it's because we care that we're vocal about it. And you mute us, so what's your issue? I don't see why you try to make a point when the rest of your point is how little you care about those of us who aren't totally apathetic.

This post isn't about a guy having difficulty climbing. If you had checked, you'd know that the OP is in Diamond, so I don't really think he's having a problem there. His problem is that people are not caring enough to even try, and he's bewildered as to how they got so high with that attitude, because in Diamond one guy probably doesn't carry unless it's a team effort to make him carry, in which case he wouldn't be having the problem.

That my whole point . I have said it a couple of times in this thread. If he is upset that people are not caring then in stead of whining people are not caring enough they go find a team that cares. Then they wont have to worry about people not caring anymore.

{quoted}

Everyone has the right to ranked no matter their skill level. Again its just a video game . If you want to be ocd and take it "serious"

stay out of solo que and form your own team.

{quoted}

** If you don't like the way I and other like me play** i have one suggestion for you ...

STAY OUT OF SOLO QUE AND FORM YOUR OWN TEAM.

If actually read both those sentences ** I'm not saying he cant play in solo que im saying that he needs to put up with people "not caring" or Not being serious" as much players like me have to put up with them taking it serious**. as i explain in my last post.

I don't troll and yes i rather kill a champ rather than be killed but i am not going to not play who i want to or play a role i don't want to just to "win" especially after i have qualified for my skin.

I play and try but fun is always more important to me than "winning" is. Maybe if they offered more prizes after gold people would care more . as it stands anything after gold really means nothing.

its like running a race and someone giving you a prize...... and then saying OK go run there race again but this time with no prizes.

proud and bronzeJan 1, 20152 votes

{quoted}

what's the point of doing anything if you're not going to give it your all

fun. the point of a video game is fun and doesn't necessarily involve doing your best all the time or any of the time.

EleshakaiJan 1, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=proud and bronze,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=HzGqV6RX,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2015-01-01T09:40:55.754+0000)

fun. the point of a video game is fun and doesn't necessarily involve doing your best all the time or any of the time.

I give my fun my all. That's what makes it fun. I put my heart into it so I get fun out.

proud and bronzeJan 1, 20152 votes

{quoted}

I give my fun my all. That's what makes it fun. I put my heart into it so I get fun out.

that sentence barely even makes sense to me. i dont think that is how fun works.

if a song comes on the radio and you want to sing along to it, you belt it out 100% strong? and if you do a silly little dance with that song you bust your ass and put your full heart into that silly little dance because what would be the point otherwise?

sounds exhausting to me. but I guess that proves my point. different people have fun in different ways.

EleshakaiJan 1, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=proud and bronze,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=HzGqV6RX,comment-id=0001000100000001,timestamp=2015-01-01T17:56:58.036+0000)

that sentence barely even makes sense to me. i dont think that is how fun works.

if a song comes on the radio and you want to sing along to it, you belt it out 100% strong? and if you do a silly little dance with that song you bust your ass and put your full heart into that silly little dance because what would be the point otherwise?

sounds exhausting to me. but I guess that proves my point. different people have fun in different ways.

One doesn't have to belt a song out to give the song their all. Some of the most amazing performances I've ever heard have been by someone singing quietly. But when I do sing along with a song, yes, my heart is in it and I am doing my best to actually sing along with the song. I've never danced so I dunno about the latter. But the point is, if you're not putting your heart into it, you're not getting everything out of it that you could and as such it's a waste of your time. We only have so much time to live, might as well enjoy it to the fullest.

SkullDuggery19Jan 3, 20152 votes

"People should all be like me, then everything will be ALL better!"

Your comments make me sick. You excuse away any behavior that isn't "dirty language." If you are so opposed to dirty language, I think you are the one who needs to grow up. You shouldn't play a competitive game. Go play one of the many single-player games if you don't know how to act around people. If you want to do "whatever you want," then why the fuck are you playing a game where you are teamed up with 4 other people? Your logic is incredibly dumb, and contributes to the toxicity of this game.

The "only child" spoiled ass "I can do whatever I want" player is the most toxic one there is. This game requires teamwork, not whatever you fuckin want. Get your head out of your ass, and come down off of your high horse.

EleshakaiJan 3, 20152 votes

{quoted}

"People should all be like me, then everything will be ALL better!"

Your comments make me sick. You excuse away any behavior that isn't "dirty language." If you are so opposed to dirty language, I think you are the one who needs to grow up. You shouldn't play a competitive game. Go play one of the many single-player games if you don't know how to act around people. If you want to do "whatever you want," then why the fuck are you playing a game where you are teamed up with 4 other people? Your logic is incredibly dumb, and contributes to the toxicity of this game.

The "only child" spoiled ass "I can do whatever I want" player is the most toxic one there is. This game requires teamwork, not whatever you fuckin want. Get your head out of your ass, and come down off of your high horse.

who said anything about dirty fucking language? Swears and dirty language aren't a problem at all? Shit man, I swear all the time... it's not about the language you use, unless you're stepping into territory that is inacceptable in society like the n-word, it's about treating others with respect.

I will NEVER report anyone for the language they use(again, unless they're stepping into territory that is offensive for the language alone but that's another story), I will however report EVERYONE who mistreats their allies. If you can't treat allies well, go find a solo game, you'll be happier there... or I guess you wouldn't, 'cause you wouldn't have anyone else to blame, would you?

You're the one who doesn't know how to act around people. I don't care what someone does, there is no action they can take in a videogame that is so severe they deserve to be insulted or ostracized for it. It's a game. Treat it as such. And no, I am NOT saying you shouldn't give it your all... I've said numerous times that you should always give everything your best, but that you should remember that the game itself isn't what matters. The people you play with and against are far more important than the game itself. And if you can't treat them with even the most BASIC of human decencies, then you don't deserve to have allies, just to be blunt.

It's not about 'being like me' it's about 'treating people with respect'... but I guess that, in a way, IS being like me. But I don't think very many people would argue that treating people with respect isn't a good thing.

SkullDuggery19Jan 3, 20151 votes

You are so pompous and self righteous it's sickening. You act as if these SUBJECTIVE rules you set should be so easy for everyone to abide by.

What is "treating people with respect?" Some would say that constantly dying and typing "lol, itz jus a game, hurr durr" in chat is disrespectful to their teammates. That is the point; what you find disrespectful, someone else may not. What you find perfectly ok, someone else may not. The rules are currently skewed so that people who dick around in game are not punished for it, yet people who bitch at them are. Some agree with this, some disagree, but acting as if everyone should just be like you is seriously missing the point.

Also, the whole "itz just a video game" logic is ridiculously stupid and immature. GTFO with that bullshit.

EleshakaiJan 3, 20153 votes

{quoted}

You are so pompous and self righteous it's sickening. You act as if these SUBJECTIVE rules you set should be so easy for everyone to abide by.

What is "treating people with respect?" Some would say that constantly dying and typing "lol, itz jus a game, hurr durr" in chat is disrespectful to their teammates. That is the point; what you find disrespectful, someone else may not. What you find perfectly ok, someone else may not. The rules are currently skewed so that people who dick around in game are not punished for it, yet people who bitch at them are. Some agree with this, some disagree, but acting as if everyone should just be like you is seriously missing the point.

Also, the whole "itz just a video game" logic is ridiculously stupid and immature. GTFO with that bullshit.

Again you bring out the 'everyone should be just like you'. No not at all. There are dozens people on this board who I think have very healthy attitudes that differ from mine. There are potentially hundreds of thousands of players in this game that have perfectly healthy attitudes that are not identical to mine. I don't WANT everyone to be a copy of me.

The verb respect has a number of meanings, but only one of them relates to this(since the rest serve purposes in different situations): to show regard or consideration for.

While I agree that at a deep fundamental level how you show respect for people varies based off of culture, personal differences, etc. there are certain standards that are universally agreed upon.

One of these is that insulting someone is not showing consideration for them. It's pretty straightforward really. I'm not asking you to kiss anyone's ass or to mirror your behaviour to mine. I'm asking you to STOP INSULTING PEOPLE. How are you getting so offended by me asking you to STOP INSULTING PEOPLE? I'm sure if I went to your parents and told them that you were getting offended by someone asking you to STOP INSULTING PEOPLE they would be ashamed of you. It's such a simple concept. You're turning it into this overblown thing... but literally the only thing I'm asking of you is to show enough respect for the people you play with to NOT INSULT THEM. That's it. That is all.

Insults are disrespectful. This is not subjective, this is prettymuch fact. You are showing someone that you do not respect them by insulting them.

As to your final point, nowhere did I say 'itz just a video game' I said League of Legends IS just a video game. And that is a fact. Unless you are at the very top levels of play on a pro team, it IS just a video game. It's a hobby. A pastime. A form of entertainment. That's what it is. It's not life or death, it's not your profession, it's not your life's worth. It is a game. Again, this is a FACT. It's not some form of justification. It's not an excuse... it's a fact. League of Legends IS a video game.

SkullDuggery19Jan 3, 20151 votes

What is insulting? Is saying "Graves you r feeding" an insult? There is lots of room to be subjective here.

Football ans soccer are just games too. People argue for hours about them, and don't even play them. The whole "its just a game" thing is seriously immature, the only topic on this board is this game. This stupid statement allows you to be dismissive of anyone who disagrees with you, because "why you so mad, itz just a game." You are a troll, and one that I find particularly disgusting.

EleshakaiJan 3, 20152 votes

{quoted}

What is insulting? Is saying "Graves you r feeding" an insult? There is lots of room to be subjective here.

Football ans soccer are just games too. People argue for hours about them, and don't even play them. The whole "its just a game" thing is seriously immature, the only topic on this board is this game. This stupid statement allows you to be dismissive of anyone who disagrees with you, because "why you so mad, itz just a game." You are a troll, and one that I find particularly disgusting.

You find me disgusting because I have ethics. Those without them can rarely tolerate those who have them.

I am telling you to treat people well, and you get mad at me. That says a lot about you, ya know?

I tell you to avoid treating people badly over their performance in a video game, and you call me disgusting. That says a lot about you too.

SachabotJan 3, 20152 votes

I don't know why you bothered responding. He's not using any sort of logic, or attempting to debate. Instead he's just attacking random parts of your posts using pretty words to sound intelligent. He's just a troll, albeit of a higher class than you would normally find. If you examine his posts, it's nothing but empty words designed to anger you.

SkullDuggery19Jan 4, 20151 votes

We are having a discussion about the ethics of this game. If anyone doesn't agree with your ethics, you tell them they have an anger problem, or some other ridiculous excuse to be completely dismissive of their post. This is what disgusts me. How does it feel when people make snap judgements about your character over forum posts? That is exactly what you do when you tell people they have "anger issues" or they should "seek professional help." You are a troll.

Your definition of treating people well is not the same as mine. I am more offended by the guy who wastes my time than the one who calls me names. We are different people. You need to understand that not everyone is like you, or wants to be like you.

"Treating people badly" is subjective, especially when it comes to this video game. Even someone with a pedantic understanding of English semantics should understand that.

Go watch sports with people and constantly remind them "its just a game." See what happens.

EleshakaiJan 4, 20152 votes

{quoted}

We are having a discussion about the ethics of this game. If anyone doesn't agree with your ethics, you tell them they have an anger problem, or some other ridiculous excuse to be completely dismissive of their post. This is what disgusts me. How does it feel when people make snap judgements about your character over forum posts? That is exactly what you do when you tell people they have "anger issues" or they should "seek professional help." You are a troll.

Your definition of treating people well is not the same as mine. I am more offended by the guy who wastes my time than the one who calls me names. We are different people. You need to understand that not everyone is like you, or wants to be like you.

"Treating people badly" is subjective, especially when it comes to this video game. Even someone with a pedantic understanding of English semantics should understand that.

Go watch sports with people and constantly remind them "its just a game." See what happens.

I see now why we cannot come to any sort of agreement.

Apparently your 'ethics' are inherently selfish. You don't give a shit about anyone but yourself... that's why trolling bothers you. It's not that they're disrespectful, or mistreating you, it's that they have the GALL to waste your time. How dare they? You are the center of the universe, are you not?

You don't care about treating others well because they have no value to you. They are just there to help you spend your time well. Damn, times like this I wish this forum had a blacklist feature... reading this last post by you almost made me sick to my stomach.

How about this... how about, for both of our sakes, we just agree not to respond to each others' posts? That way you don't have to deal with someone you consider a troll... and I don't have to deal with someone I have a hard time recognizing as having value to society.

Best wishes, good sir. I hope you find happiness, although - since the world doesn't tend to cater to one individual unless that person is unfathomably wealthy - I doubt you will. More the pity that. Either way, I wish you the best.

SkullDuggery19Jan 4, 20151 votes

More self righteous obnoxiousness from this jerk. Your posts contain absolutely no value, as all they do is say "you should just be like me." You give them no thought, except for how to paint the person you are talking to as below you. I bet you have a non-existent social life, as I know for a fact that most people don't want to be around someone like you.

I don't waste other people's time either. Just because my opinions are different does not mean they are selfish. Also, you aren't exactly Ghandi either.

How about instead of posting redundant statements in a hopeless effort to be cute, you take someone else's problems seriously before you post. Don't dismiss them, or brush them off. Not posting a response would be better than what you do, which is why I'm calling you on it.

You don't know shit about "the world" or what "the world" wants. Please stop with the armchair psychiatry.

EleshakaiJan 4, 20151 votes

{quoted}

More self righteous obnoxiousness from this jerk. Your posts contain absolutely no value, as all they do is say "you should just be like me." You give them no thought, except for how to paint the person you are talking to as below you. I bet you have a non-existent social life, as I know for a fact that most people don't want to be around someone like you.

I don't waste other people's time either. Just because my opinions are different does not mean they are selfish. Also, you aren't exactly Ghandi either.

How about instead of posting redundant statements in a hopeless effort to be cute, you take someone else's problems seriously before you post. Don't dismiss them, or brush them off. Not posting a response would be better than what you do, which is why I'm calling you on it.

You don't know shit about "the world" or what "the world" wants. Please stop with the armchair psychiatry.

My last word: If your ethics tell you its okay to insult people, there's something wrong with your ethics. Simple, concise, final. Take care.

SkullDuggery19Jan 4, 20151 votes

If you consider ethics to be allowing yourself to judge others, then you are right. That's not what I consider ethics.

Simple, concise, final.

proud and bronzeJan 1, 20154 votes

you are talking about trying to force people to play a video game the way you want them to play. its a video game. people can play however they want.

its like in CoD when someone is running around with a riot shield or quickscoping. yes its going to make it harder for you to win the game. but they have the right to play however they want. if they are having fun with it, then good for them.

instead of wanting to force everyone to play the game your way, you should strive to have fun no matter how your team plays. your enjoyment of the game shouldn't be dependant on each of your teammates giving 100%. its a video game not the Olympics.

people take this game way too seriously.

RaptameiJan 1, 20155 votes

[{quoted}](name=proud and bronze,realm=NA,application-id=cIfEodbz,discussion-id=HzGqV6RX,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2015-01-01T09:34:09.779+0000)

you are talking about trying to force people to play a video game the way you want them to play. its a video game. people can play however they want.

its like in CoD when someone is running around with a riot shield or quickscoping. yes its going to make it harder for you to win the game. but they have the right to play however they want. if they are having fun with it, then good for them.

No, they do not have the right to play however they want. This is a team game. They ruin the match for 4 people on their team if they don't play to win.

MindspeakerJan 1, 20153 votes

{quoted}

No, they do not have the right to play however they want. This is a team game. They ruin the match for 4 people on their team if they don't play to win.

I disagree with you is the ocd meta sheep who only concern is the outcome of the game who ruin it . This is a video game its played for fun.

You want to be ocd meta sheep winning is all that matters .

Stay out of ANY solo que and go build your own team.

proud and bronzeJan 1, 20152 votes

{quoted}

No, they do not have the right to play however they want. This is a team game. They ruin the match for 4 people on their team if they don't play to win.

I think you are wrong. its only loosely a team game. its not the olympics. its not the world series. we are not a bunch of professional competitors. we are a bunch of old kids playing a video game. the primary goal of a video game is fun. the difference between winning and losing is only in your own mind. its imaginary.

therefore it doesn't ruin the match for me if one of my teammates is trolling. im playing for fun and it is easy to have fun in this game even without winning. it is a fun game. if you relax and adjust your attitude a little bit, you can have fun in losing or troll matches too.

SexyTaylorSwiftJan 1, 20151 votes

This right here is the reason NA will never again win :D (If they ever did, didn't exactly follow the LCS dudes before this season).

MindspeakerJan 1, 20153 votes

The reason they don't respond is becase no problem exists .

Riot has stated There is no enforced meta

Riot has not stated that there are any rules difference between normal and ranked there for one is not more competitive than the other

just one example technically I can buy a new champ and try it out in a ranked game if i want there is no rules against that .This is supported bythe fact that new champs are available for ranked play as soon as they are released.

The only problem here is people who take this video game way seriously and have anger management issues becase they expect 4 other random people other people to share in their opinion.

This is a just video game its played for fun **not just the outcome **and **ranked is just normal's with prizes . **

Personally I just play ranked till i qualify for the victorious skin most of the time i jut instalock who i want to play , let everyone fight over lanes and just take what ever is left over then mute everyone and just use pings .

Depending on the other players i am usually above average to better even though i don't act as ocd and stressed out as others if stats mean anything to you.

Another reason i can jsut look at it as a video game is personally I don't have a ego that needs stroking or need to prove anything to anyone by saying

"Here me i am (gold diamond master challenger whatever) "Listen to me becase i am so much better than you peons below me" . like i see so many doing on here

Which is also one of the reason i post on a alt

If you play enough games you will end up where your supposed to be . Those who blame everything but themselves (client, lag , ping, afk , other players etc) usually deserve their rank.

If you want to take this seriously and get stressed out over the out come of a video game i have one piece of advice for you ....

                                                                                       **STAY OUT OF SOLO QUE AND FORM YOUR OWN TEAM.**

kromon1kJan 1, 20152 votes

Personally I just play ranked till i qualify for the victorious skin most of the time i jut instalock who i want to play , let everyone fight over lanes and just take what ever is left over then mute everyone and just use pings .

Then you are the cancer that needs to be wiped out of this community. Normals are for instalocking your favorite champ. Ranked is for playing to win. The one and only purpose of ranked is to win. I'm sure your teammates love it when you instalock double mid and then proceed to lose the game for them while refusing to communicate.

MindspeakerJan 1, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Then you are the cancer that needs to be wiped out of this community. Normals are for instalocking your favorite champ. Ranked is for playing to win. **The one and only purpose of ranked is to win. **I'm sure your teammates love it when you instalock double mid and then proceed to lose the game for them while refusing to communicate.

Personally i think the same of your type of player which i term as the "meta sheep" . People who rage if there is no jungler or if there is two acd "people who think meta is the be all and end all to the game .

Riot has stated using pings is enough of communication - "so that is not refreshing to communicate"

You will not lose simply by not playing meta

Show me where riot has stated those comments until then you have the right to your opinion but it its worthless to me as mine is to you and totaly disagree with you.

Riot has never given me a warning for anything and i still get my victorious skins so i must be doing something right :P

kromon1kJan 1, 20152 votes

I'm not a "meta sheep". I don't rage when someone picks something off norm. What I'm saying is:

If somebody wants to play sona top in ranked because they main sona and have hundreds of games experience on her as a solo laner, that's perfectly fine.

What is NOT FINE, and should result in bans, is when someone gets mad that top lane is the only option left, locks in first time sona, and goes 0/7 in lane while yelling at their teammates about how "going off meta ain't reportable".

Basically, I hate it when people use the excuse "I'm just going off meta" to justify trolling or not trying.

MindspeakerJan 2, 20153 votes

another broken record ....your getting tedious to.

1 There is no official rules difference between normal and ranked the are the same. (if you disagree post a link to where riot has said other wise)

2 There is no meta enforcement so you can play in champ and any role legally (if you disagree post a link to where riot has said other wise) Do not point to your "interpretation" of the code.

This is supported by the fact that if riot releases " champ x" and i buy "champ x" the minute she was released i can go in to a ranked game to try them out and play her on any lane i want.

So you see the simple act of buying sona and trying her out top lane for the first time in ranked is not being a troll.

That is perfectly acceptable there are no rules against that .

if i say I am just going off meta that is not being a troll that is just stating a fact. .

If they do bad there has to be "intent" to grief. Just doing "bad" in ranked without "intent to grief" is not banable

unless in extreme cases of abuse where the person has specifically made their "intent" is clear.

Intent is only something Riot can figure out with all their data on that person.

kromon1kJan 2, 20151 votes

You're still not understanding my comments. You really should learn to read and understand what people are saying before you reply to them.

1 There is no official rules difference between normal and ranked the are the same. (if you disagree post a link to where riot has said other wise)

Ah the old "I'm right unless you prove me wrong" argument. I'm sure you were the star of your school's debate team. You state that ranked games are not competitive, yet you offer no evidence to support this claim. An absence of a comment from Riot affirming that ranked is competitive is not direct evidence to prove that ranked is not competitive. Let me ask you something. Can you find a link to a Riot post stating that ranked games are not competitive? Because unless you can, saying that ranked games are not more competitive than normal games is a baseless statement. The simple fact that Ranked queues have an elo ranking and end of season rewards, whereas normals have nothing is a clear enough indication that ranked is meant to be more competitive than normals. You are claiming that ranked and normals are not different, which makes no logical sense. If they were not different then what is the point in ranked existing. If you don't believe that to be true, please provide a Riot source that states that ranked is not competitive. In this case, the burden of proof is on you, not me.

This is supported by the fact that if riot releases " champ x" and i buy "champ x" the minute she was released i can go in to a >ranked game to try them out and play her on any lane i want.

So you see the simple act of buying sona and trying her out top lane for the first time in ranked is not being a troll.

That is perfectly acceptable there are no rules against that .

I know that this is true. I know that Riot is OK with people doing this. I never said they weren't. Please, for God's sake, learn to fucking read. I only said that this kind of behaviour should be discouraged in order to make ranked a better experience for competitive players. Do you know what the word "should" means? In this context it is referring to something that I believe needs to be there, but isn't. Not a single sentence you wrote actually responds to anything I wrote. You call me a broken record, but every one of your posts is just "fuk meta sheep, Riot says we can play whatever we want".

The simple act of playing sona top lane for the very first time in ranked is not necessarily trolling. It becomes trolling when you pick sona top knowing that you will play poorly with the intent of "getting back" at your teammates for forcing you to go top when you didn't want to. And when you are 0/7 in lane (just as you expected from the moment you locked in sona) and your teammates start bitching at you, you just trow out the old "off meta" excuse and claim that you aren't doing anything wrong.

unless in extreme cases of abuse where the person has specifically made their "intent" is clear.

Like I have said before (again, learn to read people's comments before replying to them) these extreme cases are just that: extreme cases. It's very rare to see a person in ranked continually walk into the enemy team and die. 99% of all trolling is done in very subtle ways and comes with no consequences. If I feel like trolling a game I don't have to walk into the enemy team and die. I can instalock first time sona top, go 0/7 in lane, and then hide behind the excuse "Going off meta isn't reportable, I'm having a bad game". I just intentionally trolled my team with 0 consequences. Something has to be done about this kind of behaviour because it happens all the time. Almost every game I see it, either on my team or the enemy's. Going off meta shouldn't be punished. People who use "going off meta" as a thin veiled excuse for trolling should be punished. But they aren't. And that needs to stop.

another broken record ....your getting tedious to.

You should also learn how to spell. And properly learn to get a point across. Every single one of your arguments is "Riot didn't officially state it, therefore it's not true". If you don't see the logical fallacies with this kind of arguing then you probably shouldn't even have access to a computer, you'll end up electrocuting yourself trying to plug the charger in.

EleshakaiJan 2, 20154 votes

{quoted}

You're still not understanding my comments. You really should learn to read and understand what people are saying before you reply to them.

Ah the old "I'm right unless you prove me wrong" argument. I'm sure you were the star of your school's debate team. You state that ranked games are not competitive, yet you offer no evidence to support this claim. An absence of a comment from Riot affirming that ranked is competitive is not direct evidence to prove that ranked is not competitive. Let me ask you something. Can you find a link to a Riot post stating that ranked games are not competitive? Because unless you can, saying that ranked games are not more competitive than normal games is a baseless statement. The simple fact that Ranked queues have an elo ranking and end of season rewards, whereas normals have nothing is a clear enough indication that ranked is meant to be more competitive than normals. You are claiming that ranked and normals are not different, which makes no logical sense. If they were not different then what is the point in ranked existing. If you don't believe that to be true, please provide a Riot source that states that ranked is not competitive. In this case, the burden of proof is on you, not me.

I know that this is true. I know that Riot is OK with people doing this. I never said they weren't. Please, for God's sake, learn to fucking read. I only said that this kind of behaviour should be discouraged in order to make ranked a better experience for competitive players. Do you know what the word "should" means? In this context it is referring to something that I believe needs to be there, but isn't. Not a single sentence you wrote actually responds to anything I wrote. You call me a broken record, but every one of your posts is just "fuk meta sheep, Riot says we can play whatever we want".

The simple act of playing sona top lane for the very first time in ranked is not necessarily trolling. It becomes trolling when you pick sona top knowing that you will play poorly with the intent of "getting back" at your teammates for forcing you to go top when you didn't want to. And when you are 0/7 in lane (just as you expected from the moment you locked in sona) and your teammates start bitching at you, you just trow out the old "off meta" excuse and claim that you aren't doing anything wrong.

Like I have said before (again, learn to read people's comments before replying to them) these extreme cases are just that: extreme cases. It's very rare to see a person in ranked continually walk into the enemy team and die. 99% of all trolling is done in very subtle ways and comes with no consequences. If I feel like trolling a game I don't have to walk into the enemy team and die. I can instalock first time sona top, go 0/7 in lane, and then hide behind the excuse "Going off meta isn't reportable, I'm having a bad game". I just intentionally trolled my team with 0 consequences. Something has to be done about this kind of behaviour because it happens all the time. Almost every game I see it, either on my team or the enemy's. Going off meta shouldn't be punished. People who use "going off meta" as a thin veiled excuse for trolling should be punished. But they aren't. And that needs to stop.

You should also learn how to spell. And properly learn to get a point across. Every single one of your arguments is "Riot didn't officially state it, therefore it's not true". If you don't see the logical fallacies with this kind of arguing then you probably shouldn't even have access to a computer, you'll end up electrocuting yourself trying to plug the charger in.

no nothing 'has to be done' about that kind of behaviour.

It's your attitude that is making you feel trolled. I'd wager that 99.9% of the people you call trolls aren't actually trolls. It's all in your perspective.

Very few people genuinely WANT to lose, it's not human nature to prefer losing. Generally, in the vast majority of cases, people aim to win... sometimes people just lack the skills to work towards that goal... or things just align against them and everything they try goes wrong. I know, in my past, I've had games where I ended up like 1-10-2 because literally every time I tried to do something, regardless of whether it was clearing wolves, farming minions, or going through our jungle to gather for a teamfight... the enemy was waiting in the perfect position to kill me. Sometimes, sometimes it happens. And sometimes it feels like there's nothing you can do to prevent it except go afk(in the game, they even ganked me one between inhib turret and inner turret when the outer turret was still alive so it wasn't like I was playing 'aggressive'). Not saying you should go afk, but sometimes... sometimes the enemy just has your number. IT sucks when it happens, but it doesn't make you a troll.

MindspeakerJan 2, 20152 votes

{quoted}

You're still not understanding my comments. You really should learn to read and understand what people are saying before you reply to them.

Ah the old "I'm right unless you prove me wrong" argument. I'm sure you were the star of your school's debate team. You state that ranked games are not competitive, yet you offer no evidence to support this claim. An absence of a comment from Riot affirming that ranked is competitive is not direct evidence to prove that ranked is not competitive. Let me ask you something. Can you find a link to a Riot post stating that ranked games are not competitive? Because unless you can, saying that ranked games are not more competitive than normal games is a baseless statement. The simple fact that Ranked queues have an elo ranking and end of season rewards, whereas normals have nothing is a clear enough indication that ranked is meant to be more competitive than normals. You are claiming that ranked and normals are not different, which makes no logical sense. If they were not different then what is the point in ranked existing. If you don't believe that to be true, please provide a Riot source that states that ranked is not competitive. In this case, the burden of proof is on you, not me.

I know that this is true. I know that Riot is OK with people doing this. I never said they weren't. Please, for God's sake, learn to fucking read. I only said that this kind of behaviour should be discouraged in order to make ranked a better experience for competitive players. Do you know what the word "should" means? In this context it is referring to something that I believe needs to be there, but isn't. Not a single sentence you wrote actually responds to anything I wrote. You call me a broken record, but every one of your posts is just "fuk meta sheep, Riot says we can play whatever we want".

The simple act of playing sona top lane for the very first time in ranked is not necessarily trolling. It becomes trolling when you pick sona top knowing that you will play poorly with the intent of "getting back" at your teammates for forcing you to go top when you didn't want to. And when you are 0/7 in lane (just as you expected from the moment you locked in sona) and your teammates start bitching at you, you just trow out the old "off meta" excuse and claim that you aren't doing anything wrong.

Like I have said before (again, learn to read people's comments before replying to them) these extreme cases are just that: extreme cases. It's very rare to see a person in ranked continually walk into the enemy team and die. 99% of all trolling is done in very subtle ways and comes with no consequences. If I feel like trolling a game I don't have to walk into the enemy team and die. I can instalock first time sona top, go 0/7 in lane, and then hide behind the excuse "Going off meta isn't reportable, I'm having a bad game". I just intentionally trolled my team with 0 consequences. Something has to be done about this kind of behaviour because it happens all the time. Almost every game I see it, either on my team or the enemy's. Going off meta shouldn't be punished. People who use "going off meta" as a thin veiled excuse for trolling should be punished. But they aren't. And that needs to stop.

You should also learn how to spell. And properly learn to get a point across. Every single one of your arguments is "Riot didn't officially state it, therefore it's not true". If you don't see the logical fallacies with this kind of arguing then you probably shouldn't even have access to a computer, you'll end up electrocuting yourself trying to plug the charger in.

You have a way of saying lot but saying nothing. everything can be boiled down to

i am ocd and take video games to seriously and think solo que ranked should be treated like the pro circuit

{quoted}

no nothing 'has to be done' about that kind of behaviour.

It's your attitude that is making you feel trolled. I'd wager that 99.9% of the people you call trolls aren't actually trolls. It's all in your perspective.

this is completely my point i been trying to make all along.

When i am in solo ranked i treat it as normal . I have fun first and yes i like to win but I can have just as much fuin in a losing game .

The out come really doesn't matter . If you play enough games you will end up where you a re supposed to be .

I could care less about the actual out come of any single game and i still manage to get my victorious skin and i have never gotten a warning of any kind that's all the proof.

So i have nothing to prove to you.

the fact remains thread like this wouldn't exist if i wasn't right .

If you don't like the way I and other like me play i have one suggestion for you ...

STAY OUT OF SOLO QUE AND FORM YOUR OWN TEAM.

kromon1kJan 2, 20152 votes

{quoted}

You have a way of saying lot but saying nothing. everything can be boiled down to

i am ocd and take video games to seriously and think solo que ranked should be treated like the pro circuit

claps slowly

Damn dude what great debater you are. Just call everyone you disagree with ocd, what a great way to prove a point. I'm not even talking about my self in any of my posts. I'm trying to say that there is a problem with trolls in ranked. There are forms of trolling other than walking into the enemy team and dying over and over. Because you seem incapable of understanding my main point, I'm just going to try one more time, using a story.

I queue up for ranked. I'm last pick. Team wants me to support. I'm mad that I have to support. Instead of playing support I lock in double adc. I pick jinx, a champion that I have never played and know that I suck balls with. But that's OK with me, I want to suck balls this game because I'm mad at my team. In lane I purposely try to fuck up our other adc's csing, constantly die to ganks because I won't place a ward, and don't even try to build properly. When my teammates become upset with me, I just say "I'm trying something off meta". Because I'm not technically walking into the enemy team and dying on purpose, nothing will happen to me. I can do this every single game for a thousand games and never get banned.

If you don't see a problem with players being allowed to get away with intentional trolling, then I don't know what to say to you. The behaviour I just described is very common in draft pick when someone throws a fit over not getting their preferred role, and there needs to be consequences.

Walking into the enemy team over and over is not the only way to troll How many times do I have to say it? Actual intentional feeding is very rare. Riot should put in place measures to control other types of trolling that are far more common, as I just described in my above example.

This is the last time I'm responding to one of your posts. It's like trying to argue with a dog. A very stupid dog at that.

EleshakaiJan 2, 20153 votes

{quoted}

claps slowly

Damn dude what great debater you are. Just call everyone you disagree with ocd, what a great way to prove a point. I'm not even talking about my self in any of my posts. I'm trying to say that there is a problem with trolls in ranked. There are forms of trolling other than walking into the enemy team and dying over and over. Because you seem incapable of understanding my main point, I'm just going to try one more time, using a story.

I queue up for ranked. I'm last pick. Team wants me to support. I'm mad that I have to support. Instead of playing support I lock in double adc. I pick jinx, a champion that I have never played and know that I suck balls with. But that's OK with me, I want to suck balls this game because I'm mad at my team. In lane I purposely try to fuck up our other adc's csing, constantly die to ganks because I won't place a ward, and don't even try to build properly. When my teammates become upset with me, I just say "I'm trying something off meta". Because I'm not technically walking into the enemy team and dying on purpose, nothing will happen to me. I can do this every single game for a thousand games and never get banned.

If you don't see a problem with players being allowed to get away with intentional trolling, then I don't know what to say to you. The behaviour I just described is very common in draft pick when someone throws a fit over not getting their preferred role, and there needs to be consequences.

Walking into the enemy team over and over is not the only way to troll How many times do I have to say it? Actual intentional feeding is very rare. Riot should put in place measures to control other types of trolling that are far more common, as I just described in my above example.

This is the last time I'm responding to one of your posts. It's like trying to argue with a dog. A very stupid dog at that.

You're just as bad at debating as he is. You're both responding to petty insults without actually acknowledging each other's comments at all.

That is technically a form of intentionally feeding, and no - you couldn't get away with that 'every game for 1000 games' because after enough reports your file would be reviewed and they'd see that you're doing it every game. People do eventually get caught for that. However, a person who genuinely just tries a random champ because their forced into a lane they don't normally play is NOT actually trolling, regardless of how well or poorly they do. As long as they're trying.

Also, people prone to that sort of behaviour are also prone to other things... anger issues, toxic outbursts, etc. And they're likely to get caught for THOSE issues too. Remember that the new systems DO pay attention to pre and post game chat as well, eventually people will get caught.

But personally, I wholeheartedly believe that I would rather see 1000 people who deserve punishment go unpunished than one person who was innocent get punished. So I prefer systems that require things to be beyond a shadow of a doubt.

SexyTaylorSwiftJan 1, 20153 votes

See, the problem is, Riot is more concerned with banning the people that bitch at these players because they are "toxic" for calling out trolls than they are with banning the trolls. Their logic really is stupid. It's simple, get rid of these players and you get rid of the vast majority of ragers in the game.

EleshakaiJan 1, 20154 votes

{quoted}

See, the problem is, Riot is more concerned with banning the people that bitch at these players because they are "toxic" for calling out trolls than they are with banning the trolls. Their logic really is stupid. It's simple, get rid of these players and you get rid of the vast majority of ragers in the game.

Because most of the people you call trolls are just having a bad game. Chances are people have accused you of trolling before when you had a bad game too, they may not have done it vocally but I guarantee you they've thought that at least once. Same goes for me and everyone else who has ever played this game.

ACTUAL trolling is quite difficult to detect, and we can't just ban anyone who is accused of trolling or else nobody would be left in the game.

SexyTaylorSwiftJan 1, 20152 votes

No, I don't call people that have bad games trolls. It is a really easy difference to notice. If you are having a bad game, and losing lane to a better player (which we all do), you turn into play safe mode and not feed, maybe die to some tower dives or something. If you are trolling because "lolz itz jus a gam nub", you continue to fight the fed enemy and build 100% damage Lee Sin when 0-5.

There is a clear difference between someone trolling and someone that is having a bad game.

No Name 57Jan 1, 20151 votes

{quoted}

No, I don't call people that have bad games trolls. It is a really easy difference to notice. If you are having a bad game, and losing lane to a better player (which we all do), you turn into play safe mode and not feed, maybe die to some tower dives or something. If you are trolling because "lolz itz jus a gam nub", you continue to fight the fed enemy and build 100% damage Lee Sin when 0-5.

There is a clear difference between someone trolling and someone that is having a bad game.

You're assuming the person knows the importance of not dying, csing, and understands which build is more effective when on what champ. I didn't get the importance of csing for I don't even know how long for example. (I just never noticed) It's as if some people completely forget how it was like when they were a noob.

Unless you're playing higher than gold, in which case yeah probably trolling. And so you don't get me wrong, I don't mean someone can reach gold without understanding importance of csing or death, but there's over 100 champs in the game, they may build wrong or don't know how to play some champs effectively or against still.

SexyTaylorSwiftJan 1, 20151 votes

I'm not saying any of that at all. I made no reference to CSing. But I think anyone in ranked play understand that them running into the enemy and letting them kill them is not good.