Rito's at it again... 4.5 Patch Notes... AMAZING!

Luner Hunter·Apr 3, 2014·1 votes·2,204 views

Leona

The correct play against Leona in lane is to poke her down to make her engages riskier, but her high defensive stats and health regen were mitigating this a little too much. By reducing the bonus armor/magic resistance on Eclipse, Leona's a slightly more viable in-combat target. Plus, if she doesn't get a kill, that combat damage will stick harder.

General Base Health Regen/5 sec 9 ⇒ 7 W - Eclipse Bonus Armor & Magic Resistance 25/35/45/55/65 ⇒ 20/30/40/50/60

As if nerfing relic shield into the ground wasnt bad enough (and they NERF IT AGAIN) they nerf her hp/5 and mr/armor bonuses from her W because the average scrub cries that shes "OP" when shes been the same since well before halfway through season 3...

Aether wisp and Forbidden Idol... MORE AP MIDLANER SHIT for "supports" awesome i'm sure morgana and annie will love these! now wheres my hp/5 cdr or AD/movement speed item for them AD TANKS out there that go bot?

Face of the Mountain Combine cost 185 gold ⇒ 385 gold Total cost 2000 gold ⇒ 2200 gold Health Regen/5 sec 25 ⇒ 20 Health +375 health ⇒ +500 health

FARTHER NERF the item and make it cost more... FUCKING AWESOME never touching this item again till its actually VIABLE TO USE AGAIN!

Aegis of the Legion Recipe Rejuvenation Bead + Cloth Armor + Ruby Crystal + Null Magic Mantle + 670 gold ⇒ Rejuvenation Bead + Ruby Crystal + Negatron Cloak + 600 gold Total cost 1950 gold ⇒ 1900 gold newMagic Resistance +20 magic resistance removedArmor +20 Armor

Locket of the Iron Solari Recipe Aegis of the Legion + 600 gold ⇒ Kindlegem + Aegis of the Legion + 50 gold Total cost 2550 gold ⇒ 2800 gold Health +300 health ⇒ +400 health newMagic Resistance +20 magic resistance removedArmor +20 Armor

so... basically removing all traces of any reason why a tank would want to use this item while making it more expensive... awesome and now i have another reason to buy vissage... its hp / cdr / hp/5 / greater MR / better passive... but isnt that why they nerfed vissage cuz it was a must buy???? well now it certainly is seeing how its 50 gold cheaper!

24 hp/5 (due to vissage's passive) vs 10/hp 5 55 mr vs 40 mr 10% cdr vs 10% cdr 400 hp vs 400 hp 20% increased to all healing vs crummy shield + 20 mr 10 hp/5

.... to even try to balance this out the old runic bulwark should be re-added for the armor side of this item like it USE to be in season 3

honestly I'm losing all hope in Riot and League of Legends due to their haphazard ways of nerfing shit for LCS and scrubs

++ rengar gut (i never really played him but that was a gut to his assassin role)

++ heal nerf (the fuck? 475 hp for 2 ppl instead of 375 for 5?) "rito say heal too toxic"

++ fuck with exhaust and extending its cd

++ nerf armor runes only give +4 to all champs (rito REALLY hates tanky supports)

~~++ nerf mr runes give nothing to all champs~~ edit i miss read the scaling MR tweak(rito REALLY hates tanky supports)

++ reduce armor everywhere for no reason (locket/armor seals)

++ jack FQC up 200 gold for 10 ability power

http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/attachment.php?attachmentid=801098&d=1381829455

23 Comments

Icy Hot ShotoApr 3, 20143 votes

And here we have the wild Rager in its natural habit, a forum. Watch as it rages over simple things without thought and even makes a poll that is only useful to them! Now lets enjoy it's peaceful ending called "rito REALLY hates tanky supports" as it flees into the tall grass to escape Rengar as he searches for his favorite meal!

Luner HunterApr 4, 20141 votes

I put plenty of thought into it, but, as we can see you disagree which is fine. Alas your cute little rebuttal is more so thoughtless than my original post and even entertained me a bit due to the fact I read this first in a British accent then re-read it in The Crocodile Hunter's voice.

AmarøkApr 3, 20143 votes

You also forgot about the MASSIVE Gragas nerf. Tried to play him yesterday it just wasnt the same.

Sir ArmaMalumApr 3, 20143 votes

There are so many reasons why you are actually legitimately wrong here, ask me why any one of these things listed is actually not a bad change and I will answer. Other than that, give it time and you may actually be able to eventually see the logic, as I can tell you do not right now. =)

Luner HunterApr 4, 20141 votes

err nerf perfictly fine champ's W cuz people cry shes "FotM", "op", 35% pick rate, 53% win rate! logic: since other traditional supports aren't worth using and a player who is good with leona can win half their games she needs a nerf

armor runes: since some people dont want to make a armor/mr page but still want the tankyness of making an armor/mr page we will nerf the armor runes and +4 all champions insted of either having them actually make a page and stop crying or buffing the champs that should actually of been buffed with the +4 armor and leaving armor runes alone

locket: armor and mr hp/5 oh noes it means that you can build defense for you and your team? must nerf and leave the players the better option of building visage which was nerfed because people bought it all the time - plans for another nerf to visage soon -

i fail to see where any logic was applied to these nerfs.... and i could link you the patch notes where rito posted that vissage was nerfed due to the fact people bought it alot due to its good stats... matter of a fact here is that link

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-41-notes

Spirit Visage

The cooldown reduction for Spirit Visage is to reduce its high gold efficiency for almost all tanky champions, **especially since many were **just buying Spirit Visage as part of their “core” tank build, regardless of the enemy team composition.

Cooldown reduction reduced to 10% (from 20%)

another instance of rito changing items where they they wanted just cuz

"We really like Spirit of the Spectral Wraith’s healing passive, so we decided to make it a staple passive on every Spirit item. " aka just cuz they wanted too! not because it gave any balance to anything... actually it hurt the more tanky junglers who didn't do alot of damage added to the fact that the change before that removed the hp/5 off of all the spirit items that hurt the more tanky junglers anyways

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-41-notes#patch-Jungle-Items

Sir ArmaMalumApr 4, 20142 votes

err nerf perfictly fine champ's W cuz people cry shes "FotM", "op", 35% pick rate, 53% win rate! logic: since other traditional supports aren't worth using and a player who is good with leona can win half their games she needs a nerf

Statistically when a champion breaches a 50% ratio they are unbalanced. Now, being unbalanced is actually a good thing, in a concept known as Perfect Imbalance. However, Leona's CC potential and natural tankiness was a direct counter to the current trend of mage/caster supports. This in itself isn't a problem, but when Leona becomes the 'go-to' support in most cases and eliminates versatility there is a problem. She was perfectly fine and she still is, she's just brought down a bit more towards the rest of her support brethren.

armor runes: since some people dont want to make a armor/mr page but still want the tankyness of making an armor/mr page we will nerf the armor runes and +4 all champions insted of either having them actually make a page and stop crying or buffing the champs that should actually of been buffed with the +4 armor and leaving armor runes alone

Fun fact. You actually have slightly more armor (0.31 to be exact) when you have flat armor runes if you factor in the +4 to all champions. The intent behind this change was to provide more viable choices of seal options. Flat armor seals were downright necessary for most roles, and I think almost anyone here will agree. Now you can actually have playtsyle choices define rune choice, which is what they were supposed to be. And also, if everyone receives a flat increase the benefit is only against non-player elements. So the only ones complaining about 'everyone has the benefit of a tank rune page' are jungle mobs.

locket: armor and mr hp/5 oh noes it means that you can build defense for you and your team? must nerf and leave the players the better option of building visage which was nerfed because people bought it all the time - plans for another nerf to visage soon -

The intent behind this was actually a combination of reducing the number of components (so it doesn't screw you while you're waiting for the combine gold) and defining the item's use case. When do you want to buy Aegis/Locket? Usually it's when your team is having trouble with AoE and/or magic damage. So instead of giving armor to something anti-magic, they just gave it another reason to get it for its own niche. Not to mention with the higher stats in final Locket build and decreased cost in Aegis I would actually call this more of a buff. A change yes, a nerf no.

vissage was nerfed due to the fact people bought it alot due to its good stats

If you read a little bit closer you'll see: --"The cooldown reduction for Spirit Visage is to reduce its high gold efficiency for almost all tanky champions, especially since many were just buying Spirit Visage as part of their “core” tank build, regardless of the enemy team composition."-- What they mean is that if they build Visage because they actually wanted MR or the regen effect then that was a player choice that can reap a benefit for strategic advantage, and that's good thing. They did not approve of the fact that people were not 'choosing' to build Visage for it's MR or it's regen effect, they were just building it to build it. It's the same thing that happened to Force of Nature.

aka just cuz they wanted too! not because it gave any balance to anything... actually it hurt the more tanky junglers who didn't do alot of damage added to the fact that the change before that removed the hp/5 off of all the spirit items that hurt the more tanky junglers anyways

Radical jungle changes were what the spirit stone change was meant for. Now if you got bit in the rear by the transition I'm sorry, but you weren't the only one. However, I will flat out disagree with you, tanky jungles are much better off with SS of the Ancient Golem. They shouldn't be healed as much because they don't do as much damage sure, but they shouldn't be taking as much damage.....

Your turn my good man/ma'am

Luner HunterApr 4, 20141 votes

Your turn my good man/ma'am

read up above your post a bit I've already addressed the 0.31 additional armor and what I think of it.

She was perfectly fine and she still is, she's just brought down a bit more towards the rest of her support brethren.

"the rest of her support brethren" are in the fucking garbage at the very moment in time and that's the issue! If you drag her down the the same level as the rest of the traditional supports she wont even be able to CC let alone tank!

However, I will flat out disagree with you, tanky jungles are much better off with SS of the Ancient Golem. They shouldn't be healed as much because they don;t do as much damage sure, but they shouldn't be taking as much damage.....

Lets Use Volibear For This

his base dmg at lvl 3 is 64 where you should have a spirit stone (earliest)

so... that means ss does +20% dmg and leaching 6% of the total dmg which is 76.8 dmg with out damange reduction and lets round it up to 77 and ignore any armor or magic resist of the target to tip the scales in favor of the new jungling passive! so 6% of 77 dmg is 4.62 hp leached so lets round that to 5 pts!

and Spirit of the ancient golem does 30% dmg and leaches 6% so the non reduced damage is 83.2 so we'll round it to 83! at 6% leach you get 4.99 so lets round that up to 5 pts.

SotAG use to give +14 Health Regen per 5 seconds which if you take into account

voli's 0.6 attack speed (with his E's passive attack speed) you would get about 40 pts per 5 seconds! HOWEVER this doesn't include the damage reduction that armor/mr gives the mob hit which reduces the damage that voli's AA will do which reduces the amount of life that is leached, NOT TO MENTION that there HAS TO BE A TARGET alive long enough for voli to hit it 8 times within 5 seconds to reach that 40 hp/5 with the new SotAG....

Now lets talk about tanking where you seem to be atleast a bit confused as to what they do... a TANK is suppose to TANK DAMAGE for the team and WITH NO SUSTANE FROM THIS ITEM UNLESS THE PLAYER IS HITTING A JUNGLE CREEP AND NO ARMOR SINCE IT WAS REMOVED THEY WILL BE TAKING THE SAME AMOUNT OF DAMAGE AND RECEIVING NO DEFENSIVE STATS! it would be more viable for a tank to take spectral wraith for the passive HP/MR regen, CDR, and the passive gold for kills/assists than to take SotAG!

As you said "Your Move"

Sir ArmaMalumApr 4, 20141 votes

...who actually made armor runes were too tanky which results in your armor/mr page being atleast 3.69 armor lower than it use to be which is "compensated" by giving 4 armor to each champ...[snipped for space]

So what I'm understanding is that you do actually agree all champions needed an armor buff to function, which was shown by everyone requiring flat armor seals before. But you don't agree that armor seals should have been brought down just to keep that armor level close to the same. I can understand why you feel that way, but I still repeat, the main intent behind the change was to bring other seals into play for more diversity and player choice. Now an argument could be "why not just buff the others" but that leads to power creep and that's a serious concern.

"the rest of her support brethren" are in the fucking garbage at the very moment in time and that's the issue! If you drag her down the the same level as the rest of the traditional supports she wont even be able to CC let alone tank!

I agree with you traditional supports could be in a better spot than they are now, but I contribute that more towards a meta-pain than anything. And, individually, I simply disagree that they are "fucking garbage". Seemingly weaker sure. But Leona being a league ahead of them would be a problem whether they were popular or not, her effective capacity for lockdown is pretty much unrivaled and as such she needs to be watched more closely than most other cc machines.

Lets Use Volibear For This...[Snipped for space]

Alright your math is sound, I'll give you that point. Old spirit stone gave more health back than current.

However, there was a specific reason why most stats were removed from all Spirit stone items in exchange for a jungle specific interaction. Laners. Remember blue ez with Elder Lizard? How many tops in pre-season did you see with Ancient Golem? That's why the base stats were taken off and replaced with a specifically jungle interaction.

Also, no defensive stats? That's 350 health, 35% tenacity, gold income (theoretical max of 0.6g/sec) and 10% CDR for 2000g total. It's true the tenacity takes a large chunk off of the power budget of this item and makes the base stats seem low, but tenacity is such a limited stat it's not surprising.

Also also....

it would be more viable for a tank to take spectral wraith for the passive HP/MR regen, CDR, and the passive gold for kills/assists than to take SotAG!

Last time I checked current Spectral Wraith did none of these things, except for the CDR.

Luner HunterApr 4, 20141 votes

Last time I checked current Spectral Wraith did none of these things, except for the CDR.

i just looked at it in game compaired to the patch notes in which i pulled the SotAG numbers from... and its completely different sorry about that working with old info apparently

individually, I simply disagree that they are "fucking garbage". Seemingly weaker sure. [Snipped for space]

none of the supports are even nearly as good as their S3 counterparts neither have they even gotten a meaningful buff since the S4 support wide gut cough i mean nerf cough cough i mean tweak... yeah tweak... so even trying to compare them to their earlier selves let alone the the AP midlaners or tanks that go bot would leave them to be considered nothing but garbage

He Who is PaleApr 3, 20143 votes

Are you high?

The values of 9 armor runes got reduced by less than 4 points, a hero with full armor yellows will have MORE armor now, and MR blues got buffed.

Since you seem to have trouble with basic math, I think I'm not going to trust your assessment on whether the various rebalancings are buffs, nerfs, or lateral changes.

Luner HunterApr 4, 20141 votes

i miss read the MR tweak so that is my bad and will be corrected on my op, however you lose 3.69 armor on flat armor runes because people whined that people who actually made armor runes were too tanky which results in your armor/mr page being atleast 3.69 armor lower than it use to be which is "compensated" by giving 4 armor to each champ. The reasoning behind nerfing flat armor runes is... faulty imho, just because all the champs needed an armor buff didnt mean that all the armor seals needed a nerf to put them right back to where they were in the first place (okay you end up with 0.31 more armor hardly anything to mention) its the same kind of logic they used when they gutted the supports ratios but gave them gold! now you have gold but you have to buy a item 1058 to get back to where you were except for the fact that they screwed a player out of almost 4 armor seals (due to the fact that they arent 1.41 anymore and its 3.69 you lost) which cost ip instead of gold

Luner HunterApr 4, 20141 votes

edit also them 4 armor seals you got screwed out of cant be placed into your armor/mr page anyways since your only allowed 9 seals so... that means you have to try to find that 4 armor else where... which means you lose some of whatever else you were using

CaptainWednesdayApr 3, 20142 votes

If you provided anything worth reading, I may have actually agreed with you. I want to disprove everything you've said, but honestly, you seem like the type of Rager who won't listen. Cursing and demanding things gets you nowhere. Now, get off our shiny Beta Forums. Take your rage and filth with you.

Luner HunterApr 4, 20141 votes

i didn't demand shit if you read its all personal opinion on what i believe SHOULD happen not telling rito what to do or not to do because if i had the power to make demands i seriously doubt i'd be gutting things like the summoner spell heal, piratically scrapping locket or other things like that! however i would love for you to disprove me on the whole Vissage > Locket thing as both usualy show up on tanks i seriously doubt droping the extra 15 MR (and thus giving up some of my tanking ablity) to give my squishy ADC 10 mr which will only extend its insta-poping time by 0.002 seconds would be worth it in the current state that the locket is in... and dont even mention that 100-200 pt shield that means nothing late game anyways

CaptainWednesdayApr 4, 20142 votes

If you read why they changed Locket, it would make sense. It provides too much stats for a tank. It was suppose to be an anti-magic damage item. For example, the Locket was suppose to be an item to counter a wombo combo team (Orianna, Malphite, etc.). With the heightened MR and shield that is more useful than you make it sound, you can turn the fight around against a ultimate chaining team.

Luner HunterApr 5, 20141 votes

a ~200 dmg shield would take less than 1 adc's hit, about 1/3 of off any mid laner's Q, or maybe 1 bruiser's hit ... its not very usefull... cuz there is a team of 5 champs and a 200 dmg shield wont do shit to reduce 5 ult's worth of damage

CaptainWednesdayApr 5, 20142 votes

Again, you're missing the point of everything I just said and the item itself. It is an anti-magic damage item. Not to be confused with adc's or bruisers. It is less effective against them now because it wasn't mean to counter them in the first place. Locket is not suppose to be the end all to wombo combos, but it helps more than you think. Paired with Banshee's Veil, Locket of the Iron Solari is a very powerful item for supports, junglers, and even some bruisers that can help curve the damage from a magic damage heavy team or an all-in style team. You're own confusion of what Locket actually is blinding your judgment.

Luner HunterApr 6, 20141 votes

With the heightened MR and shield that is more useful than you make it sound, you can turn the fight around against a ultimate chaining team. [Sniped For Space]

i'm sure there are more than just AP wombo combo ult chaining setups where the whole team isnt just AP or AD but 3 out of the 5 are one or the other which is what USE TO MAKE LOCKET SO GREAT! (e.g.) shyvana/any toplane tank, shaco, yasuo, any ADC, and an ap support) you could build yourself some armor while helping the rest of your team with some MR and HP/5...

Paired with Banshee's Veil, Locket of the Iron Solari is a very powerful item for supports, junglers, and even some bruisers that can help curve the damage from a magic damage heavy team or an all-in style team. [Sniped For Space]

As a bruiser i would think they would build something more... usefull than the new "locket" such as a item 3156 or a item 3065 or even both since bruisers usually buy some form of LIFE LEACH in which case the ramping damage from and the increased healing from would help alot... lets not mention the MR from both items, the additional health and hp/5 from and the spellshield from ! if you need more mr than item 3111 , item 3156 , item 3065 on your bruiser/jungler because your still being instapop'd then the other team is too fed anyways for it to matter! Btw has better stats and is cheaper by 50 gold :)

I have no confusion as to what Locket was originally for, but now, its a shadow of its former self...in which case I have better items to buy...

CaptainWednesdayApr 6, 20141 votes

True, Maw and Visage are great for bruisers. But Locket is a great item for supports and tank junglers. It brings more utility to the team rather than a single player. That is where you're confusion is. Lokcet is a team based item, unlike Maw, Visage, and Merc Treads. Locket is not a shadow of its former self, its where it should be.

Luner HunterApr 7, 20141 votes

thats where your confusion is! as a TANK i want to be alive aslong as possible! if its 50 gold less and gives me GREATER survivability why not buy it? buying my team some MR and me mr/armor made it great to increase MY survivability AND my teams survivability which both improves my role as a tank and my teams ability to win the match! however if i, as the tank, am squishy as hell because i'm ignoring my own tank in favor of more team oriented tank i am only harming the team cuz i cant do what i'm suppose to do and that is SOAK DAMAGE! being a great tank allows me to be a greater TEAM player, a greater ASSET TO THE TEAM, and allows my team to win easier... i'm sure that trumps 20 mr from a passive by me building a bit selfishly with my items... look at it this way what your saying is to buy something like item 3050 on someone like your ADC because it will give him and his whole team AD and Life Leach where that slot would much better put to use building him some more AD and Crit Chance! sure helps the team but a high dmg out put ADC helps the team more

CerbearusApr 3, 20142 votes

She has a 35% pick rate (in almost every game) and a 53% winrate and you dont think she needs a nerf?

Luner HunterApr 4, 20141 votes

oh noes! 35% pickrate thats only about 1/3 and thats due to rito's haphazard way of nerfing the supports since traditional supports aren't viable in their own role tanks and AP midlaners have taken their spot! as for the 53% win rate that might be able to be contributed to her being a well rounded champ that someone with some skill can play well enough to win about 50% of their matches? so what you just said is since its possible for a group of people to win about 50% of the matches with a champion it needs to be nerfed........ that sounds like Rito logic... which is WHY she got nerfed! there wasn't anything wrong with leona! she wasnt "op" or "up" people just kept bitching about the "Freelo" train that never existed, people just learned to pull their head out of their asses and play what was an underrated champ...

Luner HunterApr 4, 20141 votes

20/24 armor/mr page now sits at 17/24 to even try to rectify my page to being a truly hybrid page I now have to drop some MR in an attempt to find some armor >.>