Damage in the game is already outta this world

Liofa·Nov 3, 2016·60 votes·2,510 views

So why are there so many increases in damage options in the masteries for next season? I'm already taking 80% on squishies with a Q auto with viktor when I'm behind, it's already crazy enough.

53 Comments

EndlessSorcererNov 3, 201612 votes

[Designer 1] Hmm, some melee champions are still able to lane against ranged champions.

[Designer 2] Add a couple more offensive masteries. Make sure ranged champions will be able to proc them on cooldown but melee champions can only use them once during an all-in fight.

[Designer 1] I'll toss in a couple subpar defensive masteries too. Then they can't say we didn't help them.

DarkfireAMNov 3, 20163 votes

Don't understand the downvotes. Upvoted because of accuracy.

EndlessSorcererNov 3, 20164 votes

I didn't throw in an obligatory "Nerf Yasuo".

It was to be expected.

GULAG 4 UNov 5, 20161 votes

"One does not simply refuse to upvote a nerf Yasuo comment or thread on the boards"

DengedenNov 3, 20166 votes

They're nerfing fervor and armor pen damage, soooooo

Blue101Nov 3, 20167 votes

[slayer-jinx-unamused] This is just incorrect.

Fervor is getting a buff if anything, because it will affect damaging abilities and be able to critically strike.
Armor pen will be even better at increasing your damage after level 12, especially against people who've built no armor.
They've not touched last whisper or black cleaver.

The time to kill in this game is ALREADY to low. It looks like Riot wants to lower it further, which I find quite unsettling.

ProfDrDeathNov 3, 20166 votes

No, it is correct. The Fervor change is mostly a nerf - before, the maximum damage per auto was 112 (8 x 14), whereas now only gives 60 AD. Unless you have a combined Crit Modifier of 87% (Crit Chance x Crit Damage Bonus (1 or 1.5 with IE)) or use abilities with a combined AD ratio of 0.87 per auto-attack, the damage is lower than in S6.

ArPen is weaker early, which is generally good. Also, since the actual value depends on the hittee's level, it curbs ArPen snowballing somewhat.

And lastly, on topic of the mastery changes and added damage:

In Ferocity, the high damage increases now all compete with each other - Getting Double-Edged Sword means you won't get Battle Trance or Bounty Hunter.
Fresh Blood is mostly good in lane and offers a miniscule damage increase later, especially since you'll proc it only once or twice in a teamfight. It also competes with Feast for lane sustain.
Greenfather's competes with Dangerous Game and Bandit, which makes it a tough choice.

Wolftastic33Nov 3, 20162 votes

{quoted}

No, it is correct. The Fervor change is mostly a nerf - before, the maximum damage per auto was 112 (8 x 14), whereas now only gives 60 AD. Unless you have a combined Crit Modifier of 87% (Crit Chance x Crit Damage Bonus (1 or 1.5 with IE)) or use abilities with a combined AD ratio of 0.87 per auto-attack, the damage is lower than in S6.

ArPen is weaker early, which is generally good. Also, since the actual value depends on the hittee's level, it curbs ArPen snowballing somewhat.

And lastly, on topic of the mastery changes and added damage:

In Ferocity, the high damage increases now all compete with each other - Getting Double-Edged Sword means you won't get Battle Trance or Bounty Hunter.

Fresh Blood is mostly good in lane and offers a miniscule damage increase later, especially since you'll proc it only once or twice in a teamfight. It also competes with Feast for lane sustain.

Greenfather's competes with Dangerous Game and Bandit, which makes it a tough choice.

Greenfather's will be great for Assassin's though, especially Rengar

HyperiönNov 3, 20162 votes

Don't forget about Khazix :)

TyrekGoldenspearNov 3, 20161 votes

And Garen :)

SpoofghoulNov 3, 20161 votes

it is a nerf for on hit builds but a buff for everything else

since it now also increases your AD scaling ability damage and it works with crit and lifesteal

rtbf76109271Nov 3, 20165 votes

i agree nerf viktor

ShadòwNov 3, 20165 votes

well... still way better than the Tank Meta back in 2015

SpecterVonBarenNov 3, 20163 votes

2015 was the closest we've ever been to a truly balanced game once the big offenders were dealt with. Then Riot decided to throw all of it completely out the window.

ShadòwNov 3, 20161 votes

2015 was pure BS.

Tank Support, Tank Top, Tank Jungle and Tanky Mid-Laners.

that was the worst META ever.

Pawn of heartsNov 3, 20164 votes

LMFAO and here I am wondering if riot can adjust and nerf all the champ damage by 50% so we can enjoy and seeing more fighting instead of just getting wash by a couple seconds

SwaggyMcGhee420Nov 3, 20164 votes

Yes, lets make every single bursty assassin and mage useless while making Maokai and every other tank with sustain OP.

Pawn of heartsNov 3, 20161 votes

well the nerf will also including these champions,

but of course idc about champion balance now; it's not my problem. it Riot.

SwaggyMcGhee420Nov 3, 20161 votes

Yeah there would have to be tons of balancing changes.

CarnariusNov 3, 20163 votes

well, new fervor will be absolutely broken on champs like riven. no idea if it will even matter though, as damage in this game reached unbelievable levels

a special oneNov 3, 20163 votes

bullshit

TeCoolMageNov 3, 20163 votes

Whenever someone who's AD complains about magic damage, it's usually because they haven't accepted the lord and savior into their life

item 3156

softest boyNov 3, 20161 votes

I rarely play AD, and unlike Zhonya's, I can get this and just feel so much safer and tankier. It's honestly too strong in certain scenarios because penetration cannot weaken the shield it provides. Please don't buy this item. I hate laning against a Zed with maw. T-T

KaiokoNov 3, 20163 votes

The tank masteries are competing with the squishy ones quite well. Getting an extra 35% of your health is no joke.

it be lìke thatNov 3, 20161 votes

they said i could be anything when i grew up...

so i became the rift. Zac

ragdollomegaNov 4, 20162 votes

The problem stems from damage vs damage really. The more damage a champion can get away with outside of items (masteries, runes, kit), the more likely shit like tank yasuo and tankko will pop up.

TNHA BaritoneNov 3, 20163 votes

#STEPS INTO TIME MACHINE

Boards: Let's nerf damage altogether

Riot: Due to overwhelming feedback that we've received over the last season, we are reducing all damage by {insert percentage}. [Include a statistic about damage].

A few Months later

Boards: This game is so fucking boring. There's no burst and assassins do not assassinate anymore!

Boards: Riot's so-called "statistics" are heavily fixed and do not represent anything but a lie.

Boards: No one even asked for this

Boards: Petition to increase damage!

Boards: Unpopular Opinion (even though it probably is a popular opinion) - Damage is too low.

Laughing Fish makes funny post about damage in M&G and rallies the entire Boards into an unprecedented onslaught of damage threads

DrahcirNov 4, 20161 votes

upvoted because people will always be mad.

God RaijinNov 3, 20162 votes

I mean they are adding some tank masteries that actually give tank stats like armor and mr too. But Idk I honestly just feel like them lowering early armor pen (lethality) and adding all these damage masteries, is just like them jerking it and playing wack-a-mole with their game, They solve a problem and invent a new one, just to wack it again.

Big LincolnNov 3, 201623 votes

a whole 8 armor/MR for standing by your turret vs 5% increased damage for 2 different masteries and 7.5% for another one plus 10-28 damage every first auto plus 3% current hp from bush

maybe if tanks got scaling masteries and riot abandoned this fucking stupid "damage outscaling defense" philosophy there wouldn't be much an issue

RalanrNov 3, 20164 votes

I think they keep that philosophy because in season 1 tanks were unkillable and that was apparently boring (I didn't play then so I don't know).

I'm sure Riot can keep the philosophy but still just shorten the gap so it isn't that wide.

MelvearNov 3, 20162 votes

{quoted}

I think they keep that philosophy because in season 1 tanks were unkillable and that was apparently boring (I didn't play then so I don't know).

I'm sure Riot can keep the philosophy but still just shorten the gap so it isn't that wide.

Back in S1, tanks weren't the issue as much as bruisers. Champions like Cho'Gath and Garen could rampage in team fights and pretty much 1v5 when they got a little fed. I remember the garen build back then: Boots of Swiftness, IE, Sunfire x4 (before unique passives existed)

KeepeNov 3, 20163 votes

Garen Tee hee

item 3135 item 3068 item 3009

And A Real HieroNov 3, 20161 votes

Spin 2 win, till they die, if you justice they will cry.

TeCoolMageNov 5, 20161 votes

Evelynn

item 3068 item 3117

did it better than you

Big LincolnNov 3, 20163 votes

remove that philosophy and adjust tank stats accordingly to adjust for it

season 1 didn't have nearly the amount of armor shred and % damage available

this is my dream

LovelleNov 5, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I think they keep that philosophy because in season 1 tanks were unkillable and that was apparently boring (I didn't play then so I don't know).

I'm sure Riot can keep the philosophy but still just shorten the gap so it isn't that wide.

I don't remember tanks ever being unkillable, but they were a lot tankier compared to now. Some of the bruisers did get out of hand late game, such as Mundo, Singed, and Olaf, but they've all been nerfed a million times since then, along with their itemization/masteries.

Supreme Senpai69Nov 3, 20162 votes

I still hope they change that bush one. It's pretty clearly meant for supports yet to take it they have to give up a significant source of income since it conflicts with bandit.

Wolftastic33Nov 4, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Revan Senpai,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zRfeEdMt,comment-id=000000000002,timestamp=2016-11-03T17:54:58.544+0000)

I still hope they change that bush one. It's pretty clearly meant for supports yet to take it they have to give up a significant source of income since it conflicts with bandit.

And, as I and some others have said: Rengar, Kha Zix, Garen and more will just take it for more burst.

Off Meta EvanNov 4, 20165 votes

i think tanks for sure need more help and buffs but the philosophy of defenses being outscaled by damage is a good idea. Defensive gameplay is extremely boring and cases the game to be boring. i DO however think it should be a slow outscaling and only a small but significant one. but with all the armor pen items out right now. thats not the case.

MonkeyMadnessNov 3, 20162 votes

They are removing one of the most consistent tank masteries, though (Strength of the Ages) in favor of this weird ass shield thing which does NOTHING if the enemy has even the slightest amount of poke.

Ha1manNov 4, 20163 votes

Actually that mastery is great, and SOTA is not a tank mastery, it's an assasin mastery that lets them be needlessly tanky without building any tank items.

Those 300 HP are far less impressive on a 4k health pool compared to a 2k one.

MonkeyMadnessNov 4, 20161 votes

Actually that mastery is great

It's great on champions that can engage with hard aoe cc (amumugasm) but will give you nothing if you are having a hard time getting off that engage.

SOTA is not a tank mastery, it's an assasin mastery that lets them be needlessly tanky without building any tank items.

Dafuq game you playing? If you are an assassin and not running Thunderlords or Stormraiders then idk what to tell you..

Those 300 HP are far less impressive on a 4k health pool compared to a 2k one.

Correct, but only if you are looking at a static health bar. That 300 health gives you better gold value on Cinderhulk, and also contributes to health scaling on champs like Zac, Sej, and Voli.

Ha1manNov 4, 20161 votes

Correct, but only if you are looking at a static health bar. That 300 health gives you better gold value on Cinderhulk, and also contributes to health scaling on champs like Zac, Sej, and Voli.

Partially true since health value is a fairly useless stat.

If that 300 hp is the difference between you being deleted and actually contributing then it's far more valuable despite providing less absolute effective health.

Dafuq game you playing? If you are an assassin and not running Thunderlords or Stormraiders then idk what to tell you..

While sometimes jungle assassins do pick TD, it's still a fairly niche option.

SlaktarTaskenNov 3, 20162 votes

Haha, season 6 was a spamhappy twitchyfinger garbage literally turning league into URF Dota and it seems season 7 will bring more of the same. Good riddance. :)

dunkeroniNov 3, 20161 votes

Because there's a lot of damage reduction options now too.

HazyCloud7Nov 3, 20161 votes

Viktor wont take 80% of your health with Q auto unless he is waaaaaay ahead or 5 items complete one of which has to be lich bane. No idea how someone that plays so much Veigar can sit here and complain about another mage's damage.

invisiblecat1Nov 3, 20161 votes

Riot wants the game this way Tank Meta made games that went on till everyone was level 18 impossible to end (I am still in a game from then) They then made it so season 6 games ended in 20 minutes This is bad since most games are uneven, so they last to 20 minutes, instead of the 30-45 RIot says they should