Yup. Kalista is IMMUNE to melee.

Cenobite Azaziel·Nov 22, 2014·91 votes·7,639 views

Played against her as shaco jungle. I can get ONE hit. After that she started playing DDR alone and could not reach her.

114 Comments

DirewolfiezNov 23, 201447 votes

After that she started playing DDR alone and could not reach her.

Upvoted because of this sentence.

WeltalllNov 23, 201422 votes

Right this champion kit is just retarded best mobility of all champs

a slowing E with unlimited possibility of dmg Reduce her mobility or supress the slow effect of E but she just can't have both

FeathermaneNov 23, 20141 votes

If her winrate comes out at 42%, will this statement still apply?

KrandelNov 23, 201410 votes

Yes. As of now, Kalista is still fairly new, so, of course, more people are going to lose with her then win. Once more and more people start to get better as her, that win rate is going to go up.

And even if it doesn't it still won't invalidate the statement. I, personally, haven't had too much trouble with her yet (I've beaten a Kalista twice already.), but I can tell that she could potentially be extremely toxic to lane against, especially if she goes top. There are a number of things she has in her kit that just makes it very difficult for a melee champion, and even some ranged champions, to lane against her.

Don't get me wrong, I like Kalista. I think she has a very unique kit that I might enjoy, but she's in the same boat as Lee Sin in that she has too much power for a high mobility champion.

FeathermaneNov 23, 20148 votes

What exactly does Kalista have? She has an exponge-like mechanic in Rend, and her passive. Her kit isn't very plentiful at all in terms of laning. In other words, all anyone has to say about her laning is: she is ranged, therefore she is hard to deal with. If she gets picked in a competitive setting, it will be purely based off her engage setup potential in her ult.

It's a whole different matter that melee-sympathizers regard all ranged champions as having an unfair advantage. Where is the obverse outcry against Irelia, who invalidates anything a ranged champion can throw at her? She garners sympathy for her 'numerous nerfs' while maintaining an untouchable status top. Kalista is still being experimented with, but she is already condemned with no basis other than anecdotal experiences and prejudice. She awaits the same treatment as Ryze, who was perfectly fine for a long time, just one of a a circle of viable champions who got nerfed for no palpable reason other than: 'my life bar visibly drops when he hits me', which is apparently unacceptable for melee mains accustomed to needing at least four team members to bring them down.

MessaigaNov 23, 20146 votes

The problem doesn't arise when a champion is ranged. The problem arises when said champion is ranged, and very difficult to get within fighting distance of (and, as per melees, this range is about 1/5th of most ranged champions). When ranged champions going top lane reduces the diversity of picks greatly (as with any champion that has reduced pick diversity in the past cough LUCIAN cough they probably deserve a nerf of some sort, and maybe even compensation to push them back in a lane where they'd be healthy for interactions. If there had to be something nerfed about Kalista, they should just remove the 25% bonus when dashing backwards. Perhaps then she would be slightly touchable.

SearingDarknessNov 24, 20142 votes

By some of your logic we should overhaul Nasus and Veigar right? Unlimited damage possibility

WeihGuyNov 23, 201411 votes

You and everybody else man

Mizu The SergalNov 23, 20148 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

SleepyLionCubNov 23, 20149 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

Liss? Liss has skillshots. so, no.

SloaneWolfNov 23, 201416 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

Liss? Liss has skillshots. so, no.

To be fair, her ult is targeted, and at that point she doesn't really have skillshots unless you have a cognitive deficit.

LeeDarkNov 23, 20144 votes

So, what you're saying is that what Kalista needs to beat ANYONE is a Banshee's, but what we need to beat her is a champ that can eat the Banshee's bubble and then immediately lock her down afterward?

Or Akali, and even then, you're using all three of your dashes.

FeathermaneNov 23, 20143 votes

And as we all know, Akali's dashes are a finite resource, and once used, they're gone forever. Trundle

DeathByWaffleNov 23, 201434 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

The fact that you must play certain champs in order to win is faulty reasoning in the first place.

SalidfingersNov 23, 20146 votes

Rock, Paper, Scissors...

Keep playing with paper your going to get cut.

OyddAWqJ5rNov 23, 20149 votes

Just like "your" and "you're."

Keep playing with "your" and you're gonna get cut.

ProjectRay12Nov 23, 201417 votes

Grammar Nazis have no power here, OFF TO THE VOID WITH YE

DeathByWaffleNov 23, 20142 votes

Rock, Paper, Scissors...

Keep playing with paper your going to get cut.

RPS=/=LoL

RPS is a game literally and entirely based upon the idea of counterpicking.

LoL is not.

manbearswineNov 23, 20142 votes

Rock, Paper, Scissors...

Keep playing with paper your going to get cut.

RPS=/=LoL

RPS is a game literally and entirely based upon the idea of counterpicking.

LoL is not.

Well not exactly,there are two problems with kalista: 1)she mostly counters immobile champions and skillshot reliant ones,both already struggle in the current meta,kalista is just going make that problem even worse. 2)Riot has openly stated they are against wins in champ select,kalista is an offender on that regard as well.

idiotic egocentric trash designed by an egocentric idiot. all later released certaintlyT champs(that is,not darius) were created in a vacum in complete disregard to their impact on the meta,gameplay,or balance in general.

DioBrandohNov 23, 20143 votes

Rock, Paper, Scissors...

Keep playing with paper your going to get cut.

Ok, so melee fighters are the paper to Kalista's scissors. Whos rock then? Mages? Their spells get dodged for days unless they're Ryze. Tanks? Lots of them have a skillshot cc and their targeted cc is limited and even then Kalista can cleanse your first with an active to resume kiting. She wrecks ADCs, kites supports. Assassins are the closest thing I can think of that's a threat to her and hell I'm pretty sure she could kite Akali even. Zed she can definitely kite as well as someone like Talon. So basically she's good against the majority of characters.

Even if Assassins did just DESTROY her early on the thing is she gets really powerful mid-late. She only gets kitier as the game goes on and she has massive burst on her Q and her E will deal tons of damage over an extended period. Also Infinity Edge crits while doing so. #balance

KIeiNov 23, 20145 votes

I disagree, if you shut her down early game she's not as powerful. I landed all my bubbles with nami because the enemy Kalista was that predictable. Watch her move and you'll get used to where she's going.

DayblazerNov 23, 201411 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

The fact that you must play certain champs in order to win is faulty reasoning in the first place.

Except the fact that half of league plays "certain" champs based on winning.

Axel BeoulveNov 23, 20142 votes

thats the sad truth i never see anyone else besides like what 12 champions and maybe a Taric but only when i play him

Auz the RipperNov 24, 20142 votes

Stay strong brother

They are simply blinded by Taric's radiance and cannot see

JunkοNov 23, 20147 votes

I love playing unpopular champions and kicking the enemys teams ass.

DeathByWaffleNov 23, 20141 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

The fact that you must play certain champs in order to win is faulty reasoning in the first place.

Except the fact that half of league plays "certain" champs based on winning.

That is not an argument. That is an observation of Riot not having been successful in balancing champions such that everyone is viable. I don't blame them for it, since that is a really hard thing to do, but I do hold them responsible.

Ideally speaking, every champion should be similarly viable.

DayblazerNov 23, 20143 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

The fact that you must play certain champs in order to win is faulty reasoning in the first place.

Except the fact that half of league plays "certain" champs based on winning.

That is not an argument. That is an observation of Riot not having been successful in balancing champions such that everyone is viable. I don't blame them for it, since that is a really hard thing to do, but I do hold them responsible.

Ideally speaking, every champion should be similarly viable.

Riots philosophy in general seems to be about counterpicks. Whats the counterpick to mobile champs? champs with hard cc. Every player makes decisions on champions based on either how fun they are or based on what their opponent/team has taken. And riot hasnt done a horrible job on making as many champs as possible viable. Maybe not optimal.. but they are viable.

ModWulf HelhammerNov 23, 20143 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

The fact that you must play certain champs in order to win is faulty reasoning in the first place.

And why shouldn't you play certain champs in order to beat her? It's called counter picking. Say all the champions were cards, and Kalista was a Queen card. The only ones that can beat that are King and an Ace. If you think picking a 10 is going to beat the Queen, and then wonder why you lost, thats your problem

DeathByWaffleNov 23, 20142 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

The fact that you must play certain champs in order to win is faulty reasoning in the first place.

And why shouldn't you play certain champs in order to beat her? It's called counter picking. Say all the champions were cards, and Kalista was a Queen card. The only ones that can beat that are King and an Ace. If you think picking a 10 is going to beat the Queen, and then wonder why you lost, thats your problem

That's a stupid argument.

The reason why counterpicking is boring and dumb is because there is neither skill nor choice involved. They pick champion A, so you pick champion B. Where's the fun in that? Not only that, but why is it fair that I NEED to pick a certain champion in order to win instead of being able to based on the merit of my own skill?

Also, really? You're going to use an analogy like that? At least try to make it a more sensible one by picking a game that is not so fundamentally different from league.

StephenizgodNov 23, 20147 votes

Ye not immune to melee, just hard to fight against.. The only times ive fought Kalista were top lane as Fiora and Gangplank. As Fiora i trashed her obviously no contest the only times i died in lane were two stupid cocky greedy dives, as Gangplank i would have trashed her but she soulbound with jung Lee Sin and he literally stayed in my lane 80% of the game while our jung made the classic mistake of camping a losing lane (our kalista was like 1/13 or something like that) I didnt feed and i held my own for the most part but its impossible to completely fend off 2 ppl with such high mobility.

In normals its impossible to pick a champ that can fight her unless you just assume its going to be Kalista. Giving Kalista a slow with her mobility is such a huge mistake... thats like if Master Yi had targeted stun... impossible to fight with no counterplay...

Cenobite AzazielNov 23, 20146 votes

I like how people go "Just one hit kill her!"

So now we don't have any need to a balance team. Yeah. CC and bursting work for yi, a melee paper towerl engage with one gap closer and one short move speed burst.

It kinds of screw you up wen it's the ADC that has to be positioned in the back line, and it gets worse with red buff =].

I'm not talking about "Kalista went top and I can't touch her!". I'm ganking and can only hit a single hit or best two on her. My SLOWS means nothing to her. She ignores slows while kiting, better than any mastery tree/swiftens boots. There is hardly any high tenacity (Irealia [guess who was beated to death, mundo, zac ult.... anyone eles?).

Some kits are designed one sided and need the other player to mess up and he is punished because of that ( Darius wreck melee, can get kited but if the ranged makes a mistake... oh boy, he's dead). Kalista get's a free out of the jail card every auto. No hard CC? Sorry, the champion SCREWED YOUR HOLE KIT. Play around it, outplay her... nope. Your CC is good for sh*t now and you can't reach her after 2 autos. Oh joy.

"Oh but vayne has the Q that is similar!"

It has a CD. The slow kicks in right after the tumble, her range is pifious.

Another comparison. If you chase singed you're gonna get some poison on your face. IF you chase the anoying tank. A tank that can be ignored during team fights. Tell me again how pratical is to ignore the highest DPS on the enemy team because chasing her is not worth it.

MTemptyNov 24, 20141 votes

Yes... Yes.... ignore the Singed. This pleases me. --- Singed Mains everywhere.

jmaishereNov 24, 20142 votes

still better than chasing a singed while walking through the poison trail for half the map

warpenguin555Nov 23, 20145 votes

maokai

PatMcGroynNov 23, 20145 votes

She hard counters bruisers so very, very hard, it hurts my soul. The only way for a bruiser to kill her is to build full damage and hope to be able to one shot her (a fed Talon/ Zed/ Fiora type champ), otherwise Kalista will kite the shit out of you.

Zen FuryNov 23, 20144 votes

Warwick rekts her,

Liss. Talon Malz Nault And the list goes on, you might have to do this thing called "work" or "thinking" learn something other then melee

The fact that you must play certain champs in order to win is faulty reasoning in the first place.

Except the fact that half of league plays "certain" champs based on winning.

That is not an argument. That is an observation of Riot not having been successful in balancing champions such that everyone is viable. I don't blame them for it, since that is a really hard thing to do, but I do hold them responsible.

Ideally speaking, every champion should be similarly viable.

Riots philosophy in general seems to be about counterpicks. Whats the counterpick to mobile champs? champs with hard cc. Every player makes decisions on champions based on either how fun they are or based on what their opponent/team has taken. And riot hasnt done a horrible job on making as many champs as possible viable. Maybe not optimal.. but they are viable.

To counter pick kalista you not only need hard cc, you need targeted hard CC (try hitting that dancing baytch with a Nami bubble). That limits you to a very select number of champions. Otherwise, any half decent Kalista is just going to dance around you. And $RIOT help you if you're in a solo lane against her.

RebonackNov 23, 20144 votes

Riots philosophy in general seems to be about counterpicks. Whats the counterpick to mobile champs? champs with hard cc. Every player makes decisions on champions based on either how fun they are or based on what their opponent/team has taken. And riot hasnt done a horrible job on making as many champs as possible viable. Maybe not optimal.. but they are viable.

Champs with targeted hard CC counter mobility.

Unfortunately, Riot has been destroying targeted hard CC since Season 1.

QuortNov 23, 20143 votes

I played Ashe against Kalista and was very sad because my perma-slow meant nothing since she'd just hop around all day... She's far better at kiting and staying just out of reach than Ashe and that's (as far as I know) supposed to be Ashe's niche. Not to mention her Sentinel vision skill has a superior passive, more up-time, and equivalent range at all levels of the skill to Ashe's Hawkshot at max rank (5500 range). Oh, and Fate's Call, while not global, can be just as good an initiation tool as Enchanted Crystal Arrow, especially because it helps the Oathsworn follow up by putting them in the perfect spot to follow up.

551202Nov 23, 20142 votes

Played against her as shaco jungle. I can get ONE hit. After that she started playing DDR alone and could not reach her.

Kalista 's passive is just a kind of Atk Move, the others marksman can do that too >>> Ashe Caitlyn Corki Draven Ezreal Gnar Jayce Jinx Kennen KogMaw Lucian MissFortune Quinn Sivir Teemo Tristana Twitch Varus Vayne Graves .

DirewolfiezNov 23, 20143 votes

lol Ashe, Varus and Kog'Maw have 0 mobility at all. Literally every ranged champ can kite, yet no champ can kite as well or as safely as Kalista can. See the problem?

BavalNov 23, 20143 votes

Now how many of those can move as far as Kalista can between attacks at higher attack speed values? Say 2.0 as a good benchmark for mid-lategame.

Attack speed = Movespeed for Kalista.

DirewolfiezNov 23, 20148 votes

You're forgetting that regular boots also increase her dash range, making her benefit a ridiculous amount from building Berserker's Greaves. Gotta love CertainlyT's champs and their ability to benefit twice as much as normal champs from building the way they're intended to build.

DioBrandohNov 23, 20142 votes

I disagree, if you shut her down early game she's not as powerful. I landed all my bubbles with nami because the enemy Kalista was that predictable. Watch her move and you'll get used to where she's going.

And tactics like this are only going to work for the first Month before Kalista players realize that their potentially infinite mobility means they can play mindgames and break their patterns to pull an advantage. Sure, if you read her and land your cc you can defnitely kill her. But that didn't stop Ezreal from being OP S2, Corki being OP late S3, and Lucian being OP S4. Strong mobility is still a massive asset. Practically infinite mobility is even stronger.

Hyrum GraffNov 23, 20141 votes

What I've generally gathered is, you need to learn to play against her in a different way than you would most marksmen.

Instead of trying to kill her, your goal is just to zone her and prevent her from dealing damage. So, run towards her. She jumps away. As she's jumping, change direction and go fight the rest of her team. She's coming back in? Make her jump away again, then laugh as she has to walk normally to get back in range (again). Rinse and repeat until her team is dead.

BavalNov 23, 20143 votes

What do you do when she jumps towards you because shes an ADC who can practically never be out of position?

Or jumps around you because its just as efficient for kiting without ever risking being out of attack range?

Or jumps back in with Q because its on a relatively small cooldown with good damage and massive range and procs her passive?

bunglyfeNov 24, 20141 votes

build accordingly to kill her? frozen heart, botrk, randiuns? all have slows available

people just always find something to complain about when a new champion is released because they dont spend time thnking about how to counter them

vayne has infinite mobility when chasing and kiting AND has stealth, she is perfectly balanced

DirewolfiezNov 24, 20142 votes

Nobody is complaining about Vayne because her Tumble has an actual cooldown that isn't lowered by building items she's already supposed to build. Kalista has infinite mobility that doesn't rely on a resource, that has no real CD, and that, like I said, can have its effectiveness increased and "cooldown" lowered by building items every ADC builds.

SerrowNov 24, 20141 votes

I play a 40% CDR Ezreal - my personal build.

I have infinite mobility, granted I can land my Q's (which I don't have a problem with) and I proc my AOE slow from Frozen Fist, you will not catch me unless you have a ton of mobility or a lot of CC.

Kalista is the same way, except she doesn't have a slow, and can't jump walls. If she could jump walls with her dash, then she would be broken, otherwise I feel like she's perfectly balanced as it is.

Maybe limiting the number of stacks she can have with her spears would be a nice touch, because right now she can literally just stack them up and do massive damage as a finisher.

DirewolfiezNov 24, 20143 votes

You're giving up damage for CDR. Kalista doesn't have to give up anything in order to have the ridiculous amount of mobility she has. Also, yes, she can jump walls, look up a video of someone playing her.

EDIT: She also has a slow in her kit...I don't know what you're talking about...

BavalNov 24, 20142 votes

Also, good news! She can jump walls with her dash. It was in the spotlight and everything.