Boards›Gameplay

These Refund numbers are DISGUSTING

La Bello··328 votes·13,553 views

http://i.imgur.com/1YHW1Wv.png

https://youtu.be/Yq2i6RDmbNc?t=223

I mean who even did the math on these returns? 100IP PER level 3 Mark, Glyph and Seal **regardless **of its original cost????

AT ITS BEST you are getting a EVEN return with the 100IP costing runes and at the WORST we are only getting back 12% of what we payed with those runes that costed 820.

THIS ISNT EVEN COUNTING THE ORIGINAL PRICES SOME OF US PAYED BEFORE THE GREAT RUNE PRICE REDUCTIONS

** THE REFUND SHOULD NOT BE STATIC. THIS IS ACTUALLY AWFUL AND PUNISHING TO PLAYERS WHO BOUGHT INTO THE ERRATIC PRICING SYSTEM OF RUNES.**

Im going to be SEVERELY disappointed if that teased pricing doesn't change or the refund numbers dont get adjusted before this thing hits. Shame on you Riot. You guys are better than this. treating us like layman who cant do simple math.

So in other words those rune refund ratios are a huge Scammaz. STOP TRYING TO LOWBALL US.

EDIT: We had a similar thread long ago addressing this issue that gained a bit of traction where the exact same concerns were voiced and feedback was given.Either Riot didnt notice or they ignored similar criticism then.

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/sVWxEjuQ-if-these-proposed-ip-refund-suggestions-were-to-become-a-reality-it-needs-price-adjustments-imo

392 Comments

Rocnation9851 votes

If you bought runes before the start of season 7 im sure you have already gotten your Ip's worth of usage out of them. Be grateful you're being compensated in the first place. The most complained about thing , was players who spent RP on rune pages and it seems to me like riot is properly rewarding players with epic skins for that.

Shaponja7 votes

skins? i bought a pack of 2 rune pages when they were on sale for RP. Do you know what i could get?

Ravenhale7 votes

Epic Skins are 1350 priced skins. Not a bad deal for rune pages that were only 595 RP to begin with.

Blackwindy19 votes

I bought these runes for permanent use. PERMANENT USE. They didn't have a sticker on them with an expiration date.

Raoul39 votes

Did you get a good use out of the runes you bought? Did you use them?

Yes?

Then be happy you get anything for them! They didnt have to give you anything. They could have just said "sucks to be you!" They didnt. They said "even though you used them all the time since you bought them, we still give you sth. back"

And what do you do? You cry! "WHAAAAA, THE FREE STUFF YOU GIVE US IS NOT ENOUGH, I WANT MORE FREE STUFF!"

Frost Hellfire31 votes

Yeah that isn't anywhere near what is fair but it's better than nothing at all.

La Bello137 votes

the hell is up with that attitude?

"hey your'e chopping my arms off but at least your'e not chopping off my legs too :)"!

I hate it when people try to rationalize or enable corporate greed (that's how you end up with shit like Time Warner Cable).

I dont know about you but I have limits and this right here passes it. Riot REQUESTED feedback so here mine is. Im... Not...Happy.

Limrick36 votes

What. It's free stuff, it only costs IP, which you get just for playing the game. And they aren't obligated to refund at all. You bought the runes to get an edge in-game, and that's exactly what you got. There was no guarantee that they will always be relevant or even exist at all. And they're opening a shop geared specifically towards older players that have tons of IP. Riot is being far more generous than most game companies, yet you still complain?

La Bello71 votes

what am I not allowed to have an opinion on a game I've invested countless hours into? A game that I've supported both monetarily and inadvertently ?

I hate that "its free so you cant complain" excuse( I bet you would complain if someone gave you a free car keying). Its not that black and white and you know it.

Hell its not even "FREE" its a REFUND. a REFUND on TIME,EFFORT and MONEY the latter of which is basically impossible to get back. Don't let companies just tread all over you bro because they will the minute they figure out they can.

Companies need YOU to not the other way around. Its okay to be assertive on certain matters.

Limrick21 votes

You aren't "working" for the IP, you're playing a game. If you see that as work, that's on you. Most games don't reward you just for playing with anything other than entertainment. You literally cannot spend money on runes, they're IP only, which is free. There is no reason to complain about being given free content.

La Bello30 votes

IP boost usually are not free.

some of us may have bought IP boost back during double IP weekends or older seasons when you still had a massive need for it. so yes. some of us did DIRECTLY SPEND MONEY for MORE IP

Limrick13 votes

That's on YOU, not Riot. IP boosts are completely optional, hell, so are runes.

Your massive hate boner for Riot is kinda getting ridiculous, they're giving us lots of high quality, free content, but you're whining that the massive refunds that no other company would ever do, aren't big enough. Just makes you seem ridiculously childish and petty.

Hella Kaiser30 votes

{quoted}

That's on YOU, not Riot. IP boosts are completely optional, hell, so are runes.

hahahahahahahahahahahaha

oh wait, you're serious. let me laugh even harder.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHHAHA

boy i got harrassed and flamed the first time i got into ranked with incomplete runes... i got rekt because early game advantage thanks to the runes.

saying that you can play league without buying runes is like saying you can play hearthstone without buying card packs...

Limrick6 votes

They are optional, ranked isn't the only mode.

AuraCreed26 votes

You'd get your butt kicked in normals too without runes.

Busty Demoness4 votes

Let me help you out there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FopyRHHlt3M

Ravenhale42 votes

Actually, there was a legitimate grind to get some rune sets. It's not something that you randomly picked up. Like I will never be upset over hextech because it is so random and unreliable. Anything I get out of it is a bonus because it is futile to create any expectations on a RNG based reward system.

But IP was different. There was a direct correlation to gaining IP and buying things with it. Back when I started, I had a good idea how many days it would take me to unlock a certain champion and how many days it would take me to complete a rune set. I'm not calling it work, but it was grinding. To see that go to waste is a little disappointing, but whatever. When I heard refund, I was thinking 50% or something. Realizing that the proposition in place is a flat refund without regard to actual IP spent is disappointing.

But whatever. I had nothing to do with my IP anyways. I seldom add champions these days and horde my IP for chromas that hopefully will never be removed from the game.

Limrick15 votes

If you specifically grind IP that's on you, most people just play the game and spend it as it comes.

You boards people seem to forget that the vast majority of League players are normies that mostly play for fun.

Ravenhale43 votes

Oh, you're one of those that doesn't get past the first paragraph.

bro0rtega6 votes

Ya, it's really sad how in this Information Age, the general populace's attention span is decreasing. Would really like for people to atleast read thoroughly to the conversation they're replying to.

Eedat21 votes

[deleted]

Ravenhale11 votes

If I did my math right, I'm getting like 14,400 IP back...

My HPen Marks were 7,380 IP full set, HPen Quints were 6,150 IP and Lifesteal Quints another 6,150. So... I don't even get the three priciest sets refunded, disregarding the other 19 sets of runes I have.

That's honestly hilarious.

Still 14K is seven chromas, so that's cool.

MonkeyMadness11 votes

So 7 fake lazy af skins that Riot literally whipped up in an afternoon...some consolation prize for the literal months you probably spent farming that IP...

Ravenhale5 votes

Eh, if they refunded more IP I would just buy more Chromas. I can't imagine a scenario where Riot would apologize and remove Chromas from the game.

Limrick6 votes

I've been playing since S5, but okay. Why is everyone so damn toxic?

Hørsegrenades11 votes

{quoted}

I've been playing since S5, but okay. Why is everyone so damn toxic?

Toxic? No, you're just sensitive. My comment is targeted towards the Original Poster

Limrick6 votes

No, it's toxic. I don't mind it, but call it what it is. I've been insulted constantly for bringing a touch of common sense to this echo chamber.

MonkeyMadness18 votes

Dude get the fuck out of here.

  1. you don't know the meaning of the word "toxic" if you think this post is even remotely that
  2. you aren't affected by this because you've only played the game for a couple years compared to the 6 that I've put in (and that's only season 2, some people have been playing since beta)
  3. you are accusing an open forum of being an echo chamber. Literally anyone with an account can access this page and speak their mind, but for some reason, the overwhelming majority of players here think that Riot sucks for doing this. Perhaps the majority is simply speaking its mind and you can't handle that you're solidly in the wrong in the eyes of most people.
Limrick6 votes

I never said the post was toxic, the replies I get are toxic.

"get the fuck out of here" three times

"What a retard"

"he's a giant puss"

You people are why League players have such a bad reputation, someone has a different opinion, isn't rude about it, and you cuss him out and mass downvote. Words don't hurt me, but I'd appreciate some actual discussion, and not just "fuck off retard".

Ravenhale13 votes

Pot calling the kettle black. Seriously. Your response to my comment was an attack on boards people and was not actual discussion. You didn't come for discussion but to criticize people for being upset at the refund.

Limrick4 votes

I haven't used a single insult at all, but I've been called everything under the sun, but I'm the bad guy. Okay.

How is saying that most players are normies and you guys don't seem to understand that demeaning in any way? The only things I've criticized are incessant whining and blatant toxicity. People who have genuine concerns and aren't just bitching about how much they hate Riot are fine.

Ravenhale11 votes

Eh, I'm not going to say you're the only person guilty of this. But someone coming on to complain about a refund shouldn't be met with a dozen or so comments of "be grateful you are getting something". That's not discussion. That's discipline. That's what you do to a child throwing a tantrum in the candy aisle. Since OP is neither my child nor demanding I buy something for him, it's not my place to discipline him.

Discussion would be along the lines of what do you think is fair?

Now do I think OP deserves to afford Warwick? Eh, I'm indifferent. I don't play Warwick nor do I ever care to. He could be valued at 1 IP and I still wouldn't touch it. But I can agree that an 820 IP rune should not be refunded at the same value as a 205 IP rune. That is common sense. A 10 dollar bill and a 5 dollar bill should not both become a quarter in the new system.

Now I know the argument can be made about IP being something freely gained and that technically all runes are free and a result of playing the game. But those "free" things were not equally "free". IP was an acknowledged currency and could even be bought via RP for those impatient enough to grind through it naturally. And I already stated before that I could literally anticipate the exact amount of time it took to earn runes. And your time does have value, even if it is time spent entertaining yourself with a game.

All of my grinding and runes was done within the first year of my time spent playing the game. I actually don't have any real attachment to that sunk cost and have already stated a couple times that the only difference here is how many chromas I would blow my IP on. But I'm not going to say the proposed deal here is fair or even makes sense. I can acknowledge that and hope Riot will propose something that is more sensible.

thefance6 votes

[deleted]

Spoofghoul8 votes

Nah

People put in many hours to get the IP

By playing so much they also provided allies and opponents to play with and against Without us who would you play vs

No it's not entitled to ask for a better refund then these scraps

The refund is less then my lowest cost runepage Ridiculous

Nobody asked for a full 100% refund then again it would be fair to do that too, i would use em to get all the remaining champions

But they are just pissing in our face at this point looking at the state of game balance currently and now this shitty refund after the horrible shitfest that was season 6 & 7 with all the class updates dumpstering and adc buffs in every single one of the updates

They can fk off if they pull this shit

MonkeyMadness1 votes

If you think runes provide a significant edge, you must be really bronze...or actually professional.

Runes help, but not as much as masteries, and not NEARLY as much as being good on your champ. Also, people spent real money on IP boosts to get runes and on rune pages themselves and we are getting shit in return. That epic skin shard is an insult. I think I bought exactly 4 rune pages with IP. That's roughly 3 epic skins worth of RP, and I'm getting 1. Kewl deal. And I'll end up with a shitload of blue essence, ofc, but not even half of what I'll need for that ww skin...

Limrick3 votes

I never said it was a significant edge, but they give you an upper hand, which is exactly as advertised when you bought them. "Bought, even though you don't spend any real money on it. You got what you payed for, you're getting a shiny new version for free, and you're getting some compensation for sunk cost, I just don't see the reason to complain about it. I appreciate that most of what you said actually has substance, but calling me bronze really doesn't help your case my friend.

If you truly feel cheated, that's fine, you're more than welcome to feel that way. You're right, you aren't being compensated the full price, and it's perfectly valid to see that as an insult. But just as you can feel cheated, I can feel fine about it, and we can both express our opinions without the need for name-calling. (Not just you, every single reply I've gotten bar one has been 80% insults and only 20% substance)

MonkeyMadness2 votes

Actually I paid for 4 rune pages with RP. That's 1 epic skin shard for a champ that own (which is all of them, so not likely one that I play). Epic skins are worth 1350. Rune pages are worth 985. 4 pages at 985 is roughly 3 epic skins. I know where I'd rather spend my money now that additional pages are obsolete...

Limrick6 votes

That's the area I'm 100% with you on. Not refunding RP, actual money, is bullshit.

Eedat6 votes

I hate it when people try to rationalize or enable corporate greed (that's how you end up with shit like Time Warner Cable).

Also how you end up with "Artifact: The DotA Card Game"

Blitzball Player23 votes

Everybody here is talking old and new players, since many people who use these boards are veterans, but nobody is talking about those stuck in the "not fairly new but by no means old" area. Unlike you all, I don't own every champion- about less than a quarter of the roster. Most of my IP was invested into the runes system. I can't exactly buy new champions and expect to use the same runes for every champion. So instead of buying new champions, I bought the runes needed to aid in fleshing out the strong points of the champion(s) I own. It would be better to go more armor runes on a rammus then having your standard attack damage runes. And since I was committed to top/jungle/support tanky champions, I literally didn't buy any ap runes for over a year until I was forced(cough autofill) into playing more in the mid lane. Not to mention the rune pages that I had to get to be able to switch to the specific runes that I needed. But now that the runes system is going away, I feel like I've wasted countless hours on runes rather than champions.

Sincerely, the many times where I could have had a specific champion to trade with another player.

And don't you dare say that I've made the most of my runes, because that is a weak argument

Drugoth21 votes

I mean technically they don't even have to refund us anyways... so, yay?

Incognonymous17 votes

Jesus fuck, are you fucking serious? I've played since season 2. I'm getting assfucked over my rune collection, and punished for not buying champs with my IP, when buying runes WAS NOT OPTIONAL.

This is some fucking horseshit, right here.

Xenos von Faneli12 votes

Let's also not forget that in the past there were no champ shard or loot chests, so your only way to get new champs was ip, and buying a full rune page cost as much as 3-4 champs. Nowadays people can get a champ just through crafting not to mention having a larger free rotation and more of the champs being reduced in price having been out so long. This is not fair to those of us like me who have been here since Season 2.

Vigopl11 votes

You took something I worked hard for then made them completely useless. Then only gave me 10% of my money back for it. Yea I don't think anyone will be happy with that.

Keylight XD9 votes

Wow that is such bs. Now I wish I would had invested my ip into new champions that I don't usually play rather than "fun" runes. Atleast champion purchases are permanent.

100? I mean cmon atleast give us 50% back

PaladinNO2 votes

Atleast champion purchases are permanent.

In the words of Maokai:

"...for now".

But yeah, the ~28% refund really stings. 153799 IP, including runepage purchases, suddenly turned into 43700 IP/Blue essence/whatever.

I am not pleased.

Keylight XD3 votes

just the crit dmg rune set I bought costs 24-28k ip in total, and im getting 3,6k back? that doesnt sound right. thats less than 15% return... This rune set was never in the meta, but I bought it because it's fun on some champions and I use it to this day in normal games. I play the game for fun like everyone else. The fact that I am punished for investing my IP into runes and not champions is not cool. If you are going to force my hand and remove my runes, then atleast give me the fair trade over to champion purchases...

Julanus7 votes

One thing that a lot of people responding seem to be missing is that not all runes are priced equally.

I forget the exact numbers (and they've all been discounted now), but they were something like.. 200, 410, 820, 1040, 2080.

If anything, each price should refund a different amount. Personally, I'd prefer a full refund, but I don't expect anything like that to happen.. However, something like.. 25/33/50% of the value per rune would be better than a flat 100 per Mark/Seal/Glyph and a flat 300 per Quintessence.

Also, though only mildly related to the topic, does anyone know what, if anything, will be happening with Orange Essence? Seems like the article and even video talked about how Skins used Blue Essence, which is not currently the case, but there was no word on Orange Essences at all. Does this mean they will be converted into Blue Essence, or will Orange Essence continue to work as it currently does?

Jot Te7 votes

It's not meant to be 100% refund....why on earth would you get ALL of your IP costs refunded?

ForFoxSakes20 votes

People dont want a 100% refund, they want a % return for the cost they paid. a 820 rune shouldn't return the same as a 205 rune, even more so for runes that cost signficantly more in the past and T1 and T2 runes which cost quite a bit before the price drops. I have a ton of T2 quints since T3 ones were ridiculously expensive it was either pick up another champ or get a single T3 quint.

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