Phreak : "Here's the thing: Ahri didn't have a real weakness."

Malix Farwin·Feb 3, 2015·111 votes·7,328 views

: "Sorry Ahri you cant be like me. Only room in the game for 1 champion with no weakness"

123 Comments

OnanThaManFeb 3, 2015131 votes

LeeSin : That was close, a dirty mana user almost made it to our level. Zed : I know right?

TheSaltyScourgeFeb 3, 20159 votes

Lmao.

Agent TatsuFeb 4, 20155 votes

Riven : Hey guys, I was thinking instead of my place, we could head over to Rengar's tonight. Don't worry, he promised me he wouldn't try to kill us all again.

Ser GarlandFeb 4, 20153 votes

Rumble : Did someone say a manaless party?

Agent TatsuFeb 4, 20156 votes

Renekton : I'm in! Vladimir : Can i come? Rengar : No. You stay in lane.

Deadly MittensFeb 4, 20158 votes

Comparing Diamond average solo/aranged win rates since 5.2 Ahri : 58.2%/59.7%
LeeSin : 46.5%/50.7%
Zed : 47.1%/51.2%

Don't worry Zed and LeeSin she's not on your level

U4fyn2vZzWFeb 4, 20154 votes

Yasuo : Word, I wasn't invited?

KING OF MASKSFeb 5, 20153 votes

Garen ,crashing the party: DEMACIAAAA!!!

manbearswineFeb 5, 20152 votes

Thresh :what?

JunkοFeb 3, 201531 votes

As somebody who plays both Zed and Ahri and love(d in case of Ahri) playing both. I call total BS on everything Phreak said. Then there is Lee Sin, and Thresh, and Kalista(i also play her).

RetillinFeb 3, 201530 votes

Well that is just Phreak being Phreak. Either his understanding of the game is 93% above everyone else or 93% below everyone else. I just can't help but think he lies in all of his "balance" posts. He has been called out on it many times and just brushes it off as if that person is an idiot and should be lucky to talk to him.

lojicianFeb 3, 201527 votes

I feel like he's just biased sometimes.

"It doesn't matter if vayne facerolls your favorite class when she goes into their lane, it's a team game. Just 2v1 her."

"Randuin's omen doesn't leave counterplay for adcs. Clearly the lategame dps specialists with dedicated babysitters who teamfights are completely centered on should be able to 1v1 everyone at all stages of the game."

Hinagiku33Feb 4, 201516 votes

Ahri before had the weakness of "needing to land her skillshots". Riot removed this weakness intentionally and is now somehow surprised? It's like they forgot that the reason they forced Ahri into the assassin role in the first place was because kite-mage Ahri could pop W and zip around a fight with RRR to deal a bunch of guaranteed damage without getting caught out. And now they explicitly stated that they want to go back to this play style and did not expect the exact same thing to happen...

I'm not surprised really. These are the same people that said Janna was the ideal bar for a healthy support (after a Q nerf to remove her ability to go mid) and have been nerfing her ever since.

2pudge1cupFeb 3, 20158 votes

Did he really say that? Her only mobility being gated by a ~100s cd ult seems like a fairly significant weakness.

Malix FarwinFeb 3, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Did he really say that? Her only mobility being gated by a ~100s cd ult seems like a fairly significant weakness.

well her Q also has mobility but she does have far more weaknesses then zed does like no sustain, less wave clear and uses mana

2pudge1cupFeb 3, 20152 votes

I haven't played in a while so I could be wrong but I don't remember Ahri's orb having any mobility attached to it. Like I said, I could be wrong, however.

kitcat300Feb 3, 20156 votes

Ahri was changed last patch

Q - now gives an MS buff when cast

W - slight base damage buff, cast time shortened slightly, fires won't attack a target that will die mid flight

E - 50% AP scailing from 35%, damage amp removed

JJI744Feb 3, 20152 votes

{quoted}

I haven't played in a while so I could be wrong but I don't remember Ahri's orb having any mobility attached to it. Like I said, I could be wrong, however.

Understandable, it was just added last patch.

Handin Out NapsFeb 3, 20153 votes

Ahri -mana(even though she doesnt really even have mana problems) Zed -Zhonyas -Lissandra -Kayle -Qss -weak teamfights

Pls if you disagree show me your list instead of not thinking and down voting because your going to lose the argument. P.S Ahri's passive is her sustain that q through the minion wave heals a lot more than zeds 0 lifesteal early game and late game its basically the same shit. Don't give me the less wave clear bullshit that isn't a weakness, she HAS waveclear it may not be as good as zeds but it is still waveclear. If her mana is even a weakness which tbh it isn't because she doesn't even have mana problems. Man it looks like Phreak was right Ahri has no weaknesses.

HellioningFeb 3, 201518 votes

A) Counterpicking someone is not counterplaying them

B) I didn't know that you could buy Zhonya's before Zed hits level 6.

C) QSS works on Zed's ult but does nothing to the rest of his damage.

Handin Out NapsFeb 4, 20151 votes

We are saying things that counter I dont see why champions cant be included. Lissandra and Kayle are the deffinition of hard counters to zed. Ahri doesnt have an extremely hard counter (atleast not one that i know of). The point of qss is late game for adc's when zed goes in to kill you he cant stay the entire duration without dying unless he is crazy fed, he must back out and rely on his death marks activation (which qss completely nulifies). Just because you wont have zhonyas at lvl 6 does not mean it doesnt 100% fuck zed in the ass. All you need is armguard to survive his ult at lvl 6, after that you can rely on the safety of your zhonyas. They all seem like valid counters to me. And thank you for actually trying to argue instead of just down voting. And Im also guessing you have nothing to say about how Phreak's statement was true?

HellioningFeb 4, 20154 votes

A) Riot doesn't think that counterpicking someone qualifies as enough gameplay; see the Sona nerfs, where, despite having an obvious counter (Leona or any hard engage whatsoever) they claimed that it sucked too much fighting her when you weren't facing her counters.

B) Late game is generally not a problem for assassins, at least for me. My complaints lie in the early game, where they can get crazy fed because it's not like an ADC can pick up a casual QSS against an AD champion.

C) Because even if he blows his ult and you survive due to your armguard, it forces you to back, giving him more farm time compared to you.

D) Either use bullet points or paragraphs, because a wall of text is hard to read.

E) Thank you.

F) Ahri has several weaknesses; she's skillshot reliant (sure, W and R are autotarget but you can't kill someone with just those), she has mana problems (especially if she's spamming her Q) and she's weak whenever her ult isn't down. I don't think the nerfs were unjustified, but perhaps they were too harsh.

ForgiveColourFeb 3, 20156 votes

Yeah and why dont you play zed an get out of bronze or is another bronze zed holding you back from challenjour? ,gg

tell you what you can actually OMG beat zed in lane but not Azir he never loses his lane unless you play him

Knight SoIaire Feb 3, 201519 votes

azir cant lose a lane but he cant win a lane (everybody beats him at early all inns and if he commiits to fighting he cant escape)

if zed cant win a lane he wont lose either

thats a diference that matters

YlicielFeb 3, 20156 votes

Low mana pool, 100s CD on ult, reliance on skill shots and blue buff, no escape when flash and ult are down, and high item dependence are all strengths for Ahri? Damn, how did I not realize this before?

Cuz1972Feb 3, 201512 votes

{quoted}

Low mana pool, 100s CD on ult, reliance on skill shots and blue buff, no escape when flash and ult are down, and high item dependence are all strengths for Ahri? Damn, how did I not realize this before?

*no escape when flash, ult, ult, ult, q and charm are down.

YlicielFeb 4, 20152 votes

{quoted}

*no escape when flash, ult, ult, ult, q and charm are down.

I don't quite see how charm is an escape, other than slowing down an enemy, but thanks for the q reminder. I don't know how, but I usually don't see the MS boost from it.

Drunk RummateFeb 3, 20154 votes

where did you get this quote from?

Sir ArmaMalumFeb 3, 201522 votes

Here's the whole thing instead of a cherry-picked phrase

Drunk RummateFeb 3, 201518 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sir ArmaMalum,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wgdu1nNN,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-02-03T18:11:01.948+0000)

Here's the whole thing instead of a cherry-picked phrase

thanks for the link. can't say i agree with all of his statements but at least they finally took the time to say something

i still dont understand why it gets posted on Reddit and they don't even bother to copy paste or link the conversation here. It's like we don't even exist.

DrCyanideFeb 3, 201523 votes

Almost makes you wonder if instead of developing these boards they should have just made the Reddit page official and redirect everyone there -.-

KijinxFeb 4, 20157 votes

Especially considering these boards are a reddit-wannabe, what was the point Riot?

TotalJerkFeb 4, 20155 votes

I'd imagine they're a lot less fond of the boards because all you guys do is rage and insult them. Go ahead and count how many threads on the frontpage of Gameplay & Balance aren't loaded with Riot hate. There was a thread in response to a balance change that was literally just a picture of a guy giving a middle finger with the caption "Fuck you". That thread was upvoted to the heavens.

Who other than a masochist would want to "engage" with assholes like that?

A Slime AppearsFeb 4, 20155 votes

People are assholes because they're tired of Lee and Zed avoiding bans, and misc other things. If they cannot properly address these concerns, can't blame people for the middle fingers. Everyone around Zed and Lee are getting nerfed for things that apply to them, but they remain untouched. This thread is a good example of one such case.

TotalJerkFeb 3, 20151 votes

Zed's weakness is two people. Almost anyone, as long as there's two of them.

Malix FarwinFeb 3, 201515 votes

{quoted}

Zed's weakness is two people. Almost anyone, as long as there's two of them.

then you realize he can all in 1 person and get out with no risk.

TotalJerkFeb 3, 20151 votes

Give me a hypothetical example of a zero risk all-in.

Malix FarwinFeb 3, 201518 votes

{quoted}

Give me a hypothetical example of a zero risk all-in.

W and R

TotalJerkFeb 3, 20151 votes

Okay, if you don't wanna actually think, I'm not going to argue with you.

MeisariFeb 3, 201520 votes

{quoted}

Okay, if you don't wanna actually think, I'm not going to argue with you.

That's all that is required with Zed though

KijinxFeb 4, 20158 votes

The range on his R return is unlimited. You could flash, you could dash. You could even try and give him a bash, if things go south for zed when he ults he's only ever one button press away from safety.

TotalJerkFeb 4, 20152 votes

Thank you for not giving me a literal 5 letter reply.

Anyway, whenever Zed tries to run, have 1 person go for his shadow, and another someone go for him. It's the same strategy as chasing any mobile champion, you don't all just right-click and hope your character catches up.

If you have your squishies stand further back from the front line, he'll have to get closer to make his shadows reach them, which means when he tries to disengage, the switch wont put nearly as much distance between you and him if he ults in and out.

Also, item 3157 for AP champs and item 3140 item 3139 for AD champs makes him a lot less bursty.

not a starburstFeb 4, 201513 votes

Anyway, whenever Zed tries to run, have 1 person go for his shadow, and another someone go for him.

Splitting up while chasing assassins is notorious for being a really bad idea.

A Slime AppearsFeb 4, 20156 votes

"Anyway, whenever Zed tries to run, have 1 person go for his shadow, and another someone go for him. It's the same strategy as chasing any mobile champion, you don't all just right-click and hope your character catches up."

Cool, then after I blow up the person going for me I'll either run away or shadow depending on what the other person is doing (you seem to imply I HAVE to go back to my shadow). If I've blown up one of them the 2nd one isn't going to get me, because I either peace out or he chases me I press R and peace out. Splitting up is possibly the dumbest thing you could do.

TotalJerkFeb 4, 20151 votes

If he's already dived your squishy as someone already stated, He's already taken some hits and blown his ult. This assumes your team actually reacted when he went in.

A Slime AppearsFeb 4, 20159 votes

What? Team? You said his weakness is 2 people, now suddenly he's 1v5ing? Yes, I guess 1v5ing is his weakness, but that applies to everyone no?

AMYS GRAVEFeb 4, 201510 votes

Zed doesn't have to think why should we?

BlackRavenFeb 3, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Malix Farwin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=wgdu1nNN,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2015-02-03T20:57:13.532+0000)

then you realize he can all in 1 person and get out with no risk.

then they pick lissandra and he does 0 damage while being locked down by point and click skills, but hey no counterplay amirite

AMYS GRAVEFeb 4, 20158 votes

her only point and click lockdown is her only defense against zed's ult. you can't take 0 damage and lock him down. that's just false.