We need another Rod item

Linna Excel··2 votes·586 views

DFG is going away. Good bye DFG. With its passing, I feel we are going to need another rod item for AP mages, some AP junglers, and maybe a really fed support or two who can kind of turn into a second AP mid (zyra/annie).

So let's talk about that.

What are good options for a DFG replacement?

Option 1: Buff Rylai's If you ask me, Rylai's seems to be a good candidate for turning into a rod item. item 1058+item 1011 = 120 AP, 400 Health, and the current rylai's passive. It'd be a little be harder to buy as you'd need to wait for the 1600 instead of a biggest expense of 1000, but rylai's is almost a rod item as it is.

Option 2: turn DFG's build components into a new item Let's be honest, CDR is nice on a lot of champs. Getting rid of DFG kind of eliminates a CDR option for a few champs. So there is something to say about a item 1058+item 3108 item being kept.

Option 3: a second item 1058 with an active One thing about DFG was that the active made your play a little more rich as you've got an additional spell of some kind. Maybe we need a new active effect of some kind. A targeted slow perhaps? Maybe a toggle that increases the mana cost and damage of your spells; item 3042 for mages. A zhonya's that can target enemies (pause button)? A temporary speed boost for escaping or chasing? There's a lot of options here.

Now for some what ifs. There would be a number of options and outcomes based on component items. Let's take a look at those.

**A. ** item 1058+item 3113 This item would be interesting for old school champs who can't move as well as the few AP champs who want to chase/kite Evelynn. I could see riot trying to fiddle with something like this to make it work.

**B. ** item 1058+item 3057 There are some champs who would really, really love this. Fizz for instance. Maybe a little too much. In fact I think they all just got nosebleeds.

**C. ** item 1058+item 3028 Not happening, mentioning it for completeness. It'd be too OP.

**D. ** item 1058+item 3070 Almost as bad as the last item, but now Soraka, Anivia, and Cassiopeia now want to have a four-way with me. Ewwwwwwww. It might work if it were more of a niche item like seraph's embrace but I think it'd need a passive or active effect that most AP mid players would look at and go meh. This is highly doubtful.

**E. ** item 1058+item 3114 Hmm. Pretty much this one is stuck in the same boat as the last item. Might not be an automatic no way from riot, but it'd have to be extremely niche if they wanted to do it. It has too many stats and only manaless AP champs would be turned off by it. I'd love to see something like this, but everyone else who plays an AP mid would too. So I doubt this gets made unless they can come up with a passive or active effect that turns people off or makes it cost inefficient so most players can't afford to get it.

**F. ** item 1058+item 3145 Spell vamp sucks, therefore this is the best candidate of the bunch up to this point. If the completed item lost spell vamp and gained something like a fully charged Ahri's passive, I might see this working in game if only because it'd be a little bit niche. Single target AP champs wouldn't really benefit from the sustain and this would limit them from getting it a tad.

**G. ** item 1058+item 3024 Lots of stats. Maybe too many. Bump the rod down to a wand and give it a passive of spell damage you inflict slows AS and I could see this as a great AP tank/brusier item, maybe a support item, or a niche AP mid item. Crap. Now I really want to see riot try this out.

**H. ** item 1058+item 3067 A little bit of CDR and health is always good. Not OP. Depending on the passive/active not a rush item either unless you are behind. I could see this as a viable combo and it fills the "we need a CDR item" need I mentioned above.

**I. ** item 1058+item 1043 Huh? This would be more of a niche item and probably would need an onhit effect of some kind to make it work. However if riot wanted to do a big AP on-hit item, this is certainly the way to go. Teemo, Kayle, and Evelynn would take a look at this item. Maybe Orianna, KogMaw, and Lulu or Poppy might toy with the idea. ADCs with viable AP builds might also take a look into it.

**J. ** item 1058+item 1038 The biggest hybrid item ever! Riot hates hybrids and forces most champs with duel scalings to pick one or the other. I'd love to see it and it'd be interesting on some champs. If the end product was just raw stats, I could see it being made. If the end product didn't have a great passive effect, I could see it being made. I want to see this tried at least.

6 Comments

Drunk Rummate1 votes

item 1058 item 3211 would be really cool or maybe item 1058 item 3136 but that would probably be super OP

Linna Excel2 votes

I think the first would be good, but I also don't think riot wants too many AP+MR items. Abyssal isn't really bought much and Athene's has almost lost all of its MR. The second almost got put on my list, but like you said it's OP. I think it'd be too much since most mids build item 3020 + item 3135 and tanks are already complaining about those. I could see it if we lost sorcerers shoes, but not if we don't.

Drunk Rummate1 votes

yeah thats exactly what i was thinking with regards to pen

more than anything I'd like a high AP item with 20% CDR so that I could build Tear as a standalone mana item or eschew a mana item altogether on champs like Ahri.

I also think a 15% CDR item with AP would be interesting becuase it would let us get to 40% efficiently without buying ionians.

Angry Monster1 votes

you got to be kidding.

Togekiss241 votes

Not bad ideas, but I do have some criticism:

Option 1 Isn't the point of that item to give mages an accessible defensive health item that works with their stats AND improve survivability? It's hard enough to build defensive items on AP carries without sacrificing damage as they only have a few options compared to AD carries or bruisers. A higher damage ratio plus a higher cost (that would come with the high price of NhR) would kind of be ridiculous.

Option 2: Not much on the build, but on the statement of CDR. Do you remember that item 3174 anditem 3165 exist? Both items also come with good passives that are useful given certain situations, and aside from a few champs like Veigar, most mages didn't need DFG to pull off insane burst attacks, it only made their already insane burst even more insane. You can pretty much tell I'm indifferent to DFG's removal, right? :P

Otherwise, it would be cool to see a toned down replacement with that build.

Option 3: The slow idea kind of sounds like item 3092 . When deciding on a new item, I think we need to consider what mages need at the moment. What items are missing from their pool that they would benefit from, and how would the item synergize with what's already out there? I'd love to hear thoughts on this.

For instance, I REALLY like your "what if" on option A, because movespeed items for mages are not largely accessible outside of item 3100 , an item that only a few set of champs fully benefit from to begin with. I also really want to go Sonic speed with Lissandra

Other than what I mentioned above, I'm tuned into your ideas.

Linna Excel1 votes

And Riot went with option A. Not bad.

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