There is too much True Damage in the game now

darkdill·May 4, 2018·147 votes·25,963 views

Between Conqueror, Ignite, the upcoming rework to Infinity Edge, masteries, and a bunch of Champions with built-in true damage, building resists is becoming a wasted effort. All of this is meant to kill tank metas, but in the end I think it's just going to keep power-creeping until everyone has to either have true damage or suck balls. And this is also going to make resist-tanks like become weak and ineffective compared to high-health Champions like .

Riot, slow down on the sources of true damage. You're adding WAY too many by this point.

136 Comments

Dope SoloMay 4, 201852 votes

"Lets nerf ADCs - by giving them true damage. Bwhahahahahahahahahaahah suck it".- Riot's unbalance team.

[zombie-brand-facepalm]

ColteMay 4, 201828 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dope Solo,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vzKEqI4P,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-05-04T02:27:58.082+0000)

"Lets nerf ADCs - by giving them true damage. Bwhahahahahahahahahaahah suck it".- Riot's unbalance team.

[zombie-brand-facepalm]

the moment riot was sold to tencent it became a made in china balance team

[slayer-jinx-wink]

5000000000000000May 4, 20187 votes

I don't think they stated they want to nerf ADCs overall. It's moreso to nerf ADC damage towards squishies.

saltranMay 4, 20184 votes

They wanted the most to nerf their 2 items power spike and increase the overall cost of crit and they did it, guess they are not nuking adcs and that's why ppl is angre here.

HàrrowRMay 4, 20183 votes

Well i've seen people demand that adc can't buy lifesteal,can't be mobile,should delete crit out of the game,should always instant lose a 1v1 no matter how badly you played or how far you're behind. Hell i should have screenshotted every time someone said that the game will be balanced when you can kill the support and his carry 2v1 with an Assassin or a Juggernaut,i remember one Garen main or something saying that if he charges at you and your support you shouldn't survive it without the help of your entire team,i mean,i'm not even lying....if that was the case there'd be literally no reason to take any class besides a Juggernaut or an Assassin,but i guess this kids just want a power fantasy for their class,not real balance

KhristophorosMay 4, 201836 votes

The things you're talking about are small time.

https://puu.sh/AeYEu/35822f23d3.png

darkdillMay 4, 201877 votes

Velkoz is a case where his high amounts of true damage should be unique to him, not something that the majority of the roster can get in on the action with.

KhristophorosMay 4, 20185 votes

I think the only champ who has that much true damage is Yi, so what's the problem?

darkdillMay 4, 201820 votes

The issue is that we don't need more Champions getting added to the super-high-true-damage club.

DoktorKaiserMay 4, 20182 votes

Vayne ?

5000000000000000May 4, 20186 votes

Vayne currently does most of the damage through high crits while staying safe through invisibility. The silver bolt procs only work against tanks. After crit changes, this will hopefully/likely change, though.

DoktorKaiserMay 4, 20181 votes

True but her, Fiora and Yi do considerably more true damage than the rest of the roster.

My Waifu VanillaMay 4, 20184 votes

Champions with true damage in their kit that do more than the other like 95% of the roster? Who would have guessed?

KhristophorosMay 4, 20184 votes

Nah the majority of Vayne's overall damage will always be physical. It always has been.

Risen29May 4, 201832 votes

I dont like true damage and %health being sprinkled everywhere. Seems like every champion is getting it over time. As if being on items wasnt enough.

Its a lazy way to deal with issues. These things should be put in kits where it makes sense from a design or thematic standpoint, not just because everyone needs some abitrary tank killing amp in thier kit.

XonraMay 4, 20182 votes

"Its a lazy way to deal with issues."

Literally everything Riot does these days. I mean go back and look at how many instances of "We were looking for the quick fix that would allow us to go back and solve the problem in the long run" type of comments Rioters have made. They are just wanting to throw out band-aid fixes for LCS and ignore things most of the time until preseason, when they end up getting distracted overhauling random stuff and messing with the jungle.

DameshiMay 4, 201822 votes

Not sure why they are going true damage on IE instead of crits ignoring bonus armor. This makes it better against tanks and not against squishies... which is the goal is it not?

True damage just makes it better against everyone.

sho ayaneMay 4, 201815 votes

Tank supports are very weak. Tank top lane are very weak.

People still complain about tanks and that we are in a tank meta, ok boys. xD

DestructoDaveMay 4, 201811 votes

{quoted}

Tank supports are very weak. Tank top lane are very weak.

People still complain about tanks and that we are in a tank meta, ok boys. xD

Its because people base their entire perception of the game on pro play. Most of these people apparently dont play solo Q, because if they did they would never see tanks. You know how often i see an actual top lane tank when Im not filled and playing one? RARELY. Every single game is some kind of bruiser/dps champion up there.

I mean hell case in point. The last game I had was riven vs. Darius. Game before that. Trundle vs. Trynd. Fiora vs Kayle. Etc. Thats how most solo Q games look.

Automated RivenMay 4, 20186 votes

The issue with tanks is largely that they are too powerful in lane pre six. (as in you pretty much cannot deal meaningful damage to them through boneplating, second wind, dorans shield) toplane is pretty much Dshield second wind or you lose lane. Now that being said. tanks do die to fast in teamfights as well. So some power should be shaved off of laning and 1v1 potential and put into teamfights.

SpongebobIsLifeMay 4, 201814 votes

duskblade doesn't do true damage anymore.

darkdillMay 4, 20182 votes

Noted.

Bob the ToastrMay 4, 20189 votes

Duskblade is physical damage now

IfnethMay 4, 20189 votes

Yeah, true damage should be rare and define champions' kits. These changes threaten to make it common--and boring.

BattalionMay 4, 20187 votes

It was said a few years back, and I'm clearly paraphrasing:

" True damage is a crutch mechanic and should not be put into the game in large quantities..."

Someone on the balance team years ago.

Or at least rework some of the true damage to be a new sort of damage, basically like adaptive damage, but the damage type is based off of what resistance type your opponent has less of. That way you're doing a good amount of damage still, but there's counter play. that's just my thoughts. I'll call it "Altered Damage" for the example:

So instead of: Infinity Edge: 20% damage is dealt as True Damage

Something like: Infinity Edge: 25% of your damage is dealt as Altered Damage

Altered Damage Allows increased damage to Tanks, by passing their highest resistance and going straight for their weakness, without making their purchases partially invalidated. The above percentages are just based off of arbitrary numbers. In reality it may actually have to be something like:

1.0% True Damage = 2.0% Altered Damage 20% True Damage = 40% Altered Damage

Since Altered Damage is giving an increase to 40% of your damage, that is still resisted, where as True Damage is non-resisted damage. It's just something to think about. I'm not a game dev, I also haven't run calculations.

Edit:

Altered Damage & True Damage can even be used simulatenously to benefit each-other, to create a minimum amount of damage dealt (true damage) as well as increasing the ceiling of potential damage (altered damage).

20% True .D becomes ** 10% True .D + 20% Altered .D**

DestructoDaveMay 4, 20186 votes

Even now, some of the best "tanks" in the game don't even build tank. You got singed as the highest win-rate tank who rushes and builds AP/health items. Malphite is next and hes mostly a dmg/burst tank. Most "pure" tanks are pretty mediocre and garbage nowadays.

Probably just have to start going damage and focus on blowing people up.

AirKingNeoMay 4, 20182 votes

??? Malphite builds full tank

Singed is broken because Reverie

DestructoDaveMay 4, 20187 votes

{quoted}

??? Malphite builds full tank

Singed is broken because Reverie

Hes still more of a burst champion damage champion, which is why he ranks so highly. Armor gives him damage. You get into the real tanks, the mao's/nauts/etc and they are much farther down.

Malphite is up because you can damn near 1 shot squishies with a full combo and ult. Especially if you go more damages like Iceborne, etc.

darkevilshadow17May 4, 20185 votes

RIP item 3110

GhaelWindsMay 4, 20185 votes

Let's not put ignite on the same category as conqueror and ie please and thank you.

MirrorUMay 4, 20183 votes

I've always said that true damage was only designed to break the game, and it always has been. Think about it, true damage is literally designed to unstoppable so what's the point of having def if you're gonna put things like true damage in the game?

ΤohruMay 5, 20182 votes

True damage is healthy for the game in moderate amounts such as Twitch poison or Corki gattling gun. It start to break when you add champions with high amount of it such as Camille hitting you for 700 true damage against squishies in late game or Vayne/Fiora melting tanks with %max health true damage while giving these champions nearly no draw backs and in some cases allowing them to have nearly no counterplay.

MirrorUMay 5, 20182 votes

Except it isn't healthy especially in twitch, we've seen how he snowballs purely because of true damage, his relative mediocre hitting turns into destruction of your whole team in 2 seconds because of true damage, not only is that ridiculously unhealthy for the game but it makes it holy unbalanced.

AkumuMay 5, 20183 votes

Didnt they once say that they would keep the sources of true damage rare? So much for that.

DraehlMay 5, 20183 votes

While I agree with you, OP, it could be more simply stated:

"There is too much Damage in the game now"

darkdillMay 14, 20182 votes

No one would take that title seriously, and it isn't specific enough. True Damage in particular is reaching an overload.

AirKingNeoMay 4, 20182 votes

Ignite and Duskblade aren't even part of the issue. Conqueror and IE rework are a result of tanks being broken and Riot slapping a bandaid over it than nerfing tanks. IE should be 12% true damage convert.

DoktorKaiserMay 4, 20184 votes

"tanks are broken"

Amumu trash pick Chogath pretty average at best DrMundo trash unless against 4 AP champs Galio broken in pro play because of global ulti, trash in solo queue Gragas could be decent, but honestly more on the garbage side Malphite the only decent tank imo Maokai pretty garbage Nautilus an actual troll pick at this point Ornn garbage af Rammus picking him should be a new report reason Sejuani decent for pro play, hardly good outside of it Shen good only because you can "gank" bot Singed trash if he goes tank, only good when full AP Sion very very strong in lane, hardly useful outside of it TahmKench I am currently spamming him, very strong in lane and with huge utility, but useless late game Volibear again strong early, useless af late game Zac I think he is actually very decent due to sheer amount of CC he can provide along with spammable long range engage

Meanwhile on team conqueror:

Yasuo unkillable after 3 items once again, 0 counterplay when it comes to builds, either CC chain or die Fiora unkillable after 4 items, 0 counterplay when it comes to builds, can't even CC chain, best drain tanking in the game MasterYi when this guy is one of the top picks in diamond you know what the situation is Irelia can very well kill you at lvl 1 with the amount of base damage she has, super mobile, never falls off late game, even hard counters the ADC overlord just to make sure that you can't shut her down Riven again very strong early game, if she starts snowballing she never stops Tryndamere if you didn't enjoy plain crits at lvl 1 now you have true damage crits at lvl 1

WDG DevourMay 4, 20182 votes

Please tell me your joking? The community cries for years that crit is too OP so Riot convert it to true damage and your still complaining? Lol Riot can never win.

darkdillMay 4, 20182 votes

Riot's changes aren't the RIGHT changes. Their changes are just exacerbating other problems.

LordGeovanniMay 4, 20182 votes

All those high health tanks are bad for the same reason you said except exchange true damage with % damage from long time.

adjothMay 5, 20182 votes

Conqueror needs to be removed, it is stupidly unbalanced and stupidly difficult to balance. And its especially toxic with anyone that with scaling true damage. Either remove the keystone or kill off their damage.

Lolman978May 5, 20182 votes

Funny enough you mention Cho being one of the high health tanks benefiting from true damage buffs yet Cho'Gath can also flash ult the ADC for 3k true damage once he stacks enough

VelvetCrotchMay 5, 20182 votes

They should just remove IE. And add some item like a Spear or Club or Bow or Chain-Knifes like Kratos has. We have enough Swordes in the Game. And IE was always extremly strong and now broken.

Modern ExtremistMay 5, 20182 votes

Yeah...tanks like garen and cho doing 1k dmg with their ults alone is utterly ridiculous..

KZ EngelMay 5, 20182 votes

true damage creep has been so fucking rapid, it's insane

true damage used to be something special that gave a champ tank-busting capabilities Vayne MasterYi

but now literally every bruiser has it, and melee (crit) carries are going to have an insane amount with conq and ie

KRToxicAug 27, 20182 votes

True damage destroys the game. Some champions like Garen, Darius, Cho'gath have the capability to do thousands of true damage at the press of one button while only having to build one damage item (most cases black cleaver). In order to keep those abilities interesting they should scale like rivens alt in the sense that it is an execute but it can be countered by building armor. With the new IE and conqueror champions like Master Yi are able turn 2/3's of their damage into true damage which is uncounterable. True damage does have its place in the game when properly implemented. Champions like Olaf, Twitch, and old Corki (when 10% of his damage was true damage) are good examples of proper implementation of true damage. True damage does not 100% dominate their kit, however it is relevant enough to deal moderate damage to tanks or finish off someone at low health. Old IE did have the issue that in certain situations it would one shot some champions. The best way to deal with that is to add more items which provide armor or crit resistance. Overall dying to damage that I know can be prevented is better than dying to something which has no counter.

SpindanMay 4, 20181 votes

Damn, people actually want tanks to be strong? Tank metas scarred this game quite hard, I think Riot is just trying to avoid them at all costs

ΤohruMay 5, 20182 votes

Tank meta will never be strong in soloQ. A true tank meta will only occur in competitive where you're playing 3-4 tanks. 1 top, 1 jungle, 1 support and maybe Galio mid. This never happen in soloQ because at most you'll see 2 tanks on a team and that's most likely gonna be a top laner and a jungler and as of right now the meta would not shift towards tanks in soloQ if we removed some true damage.

There's hardly any tanks that scrape 50% win rate in top/jungle and those are the roles that most tanks reside in.