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am never playing a game with an ally chogath until you fix him.

MunchCrunchLunch··4 votes·675 views

I know these kinds of posts are loathed in general. but I had to say this, chogath is unworkable, he doesn't work anymore, with a game thats about shielding sustain .

chogath used to be a lane bully season 5 and early season 6. scaled like shit because its too easy to dodge Q with tier 2 boots. and even if he lands the Q. what does he do? have an amumu jungler hoplefully to combo him.

he dies too easily. he sucks against all meta ad carries because of bork. not only that he just sucks in general. his damage sucks. if he uses a combo and he doesn't kill anything because of shields. he loses.

what the fuck does he do? he just walks up to people and hits them. he neither has engage. and he turned into one of the top 3 weakest laners. he might be worse in lane than jax nowdays holy shit. I haven't seen a chogath win lane since January of last year.

he can't beat tanks because almost all tanks have more dps and can actually team fight. fighters shred him and dodge his Q easily. he has 0 ways of dealing with ranged champions.

he literally sucks at everything. he doesn't do 1 thing right.

I believe last game was the 15th or so game this season that I lose with an ally chogath. because the poor bastard can't do shit in lane. team fights late game skirmishes or anything if the enemy has a walnut sized brain and tier 2 boots. and early game he can't do shit because his giant ass hitbox get hit by everything and he has no way of dodging or avoid getting hit.

hes like the least terrifying champion to get fed. a fed janna has more impact than this bull in a china store. he can't hit anything but the ocassional flash R that doesn't work most of the time

chogath has no method or mastering involved.

annie might not have mastering. but she has a method. use her passive and ult in team fights. thats her method. chogath has 0 method but hope that the enemy is a kled with no boots to get Qd by him and hopefully team has a wumbo combo. he has no control over anything

Hes a giant Trex that doesn't only have tiny arms but tiny feet as well. and a mouth that opens ones every 60 seconds.

12 Comments

Sakuri Ono3 votes

There's nothing wrong at all with offering criticism of a champion or mechanic you take issue with. I would be cautious now and in the future though of using thread titles that 'potentially' target and anger specific player bases. While not outright offensive, the tone of 'I will never play with X' puts people on the defensive immediately. So maybe try for something more neutral in the future.

[slayer-jinx-wink]

That said, I don't know about the high-end of things up at Ranked. But in casual I've seen Cho'gath do some pretty mean things. He doesn't always have to 'go in'. The long duration on his Silence already gives him a playing card most champions no longer have access to. And the damages on his roar and stomp aren't anything to sneeze at either when he lands. I've always felt Cho makes a better Off-Tank than a Direct Tank; although I guess these days that would be more the Fighter/Bruiser label wouldn't it? XD

In games where your opponents do not have much front line he can be a nightmare to deal with. Especially with his newer stacking mechanic. He gets pretty healthy by around the mid-game turn and if you're the one having to engage/peel for your team the taking in excess of 800+ true damage right out the gate does you no favors.

He's antiquated, certainly. Personally I see no point in his spikes outside of lane since most of the good ones just like to wait for ability cycling while meat-shielding their carries from blockable poke. So maybe we'll get something of a micro-rework down the road.

Until then, try to at least give them half a chance. We can all do poorly with anyone on the right day. Statistically we're bound to find those 'weird, chained failures' that paint negative lights that are hard to toss.

MunchCrunchLunch1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sakuri Ono,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vgRwknob,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-06-16T07:27:09.670+0000)

There's nothing wrong at all with offering criticism of a champion or mechanic you take issue with. I would be cautious now and in the future though of using thread titles that 'potentially' target and anger specific player bases. While not outright offensive, the tone of 'I will never play with X' puts people on the defensive immediately. So maybe try for something more neutral in the future.

[slayer-jinx-wink]

That said, I don't know about the high-end of things up at Ranked. But in casual I've seen Cho'gath do some pretty mean things. He doesn't always have to 'go in'. The long duration on his Silence already gives him a playing card most champions no longer have access to. And the damages on his roar and stomp aren't anything to sneeze at either when he lands. I've always felt Cho makes a better Off-Tank than a Direct Tank; although I guess these days that would be more the Fighter/Bruiser label wouldn't it? XD

In games where your opponents do not have much front line he can be a nightmare to deal with. Especially with his newer stacking mechanic. He gets pretty healthy by around the mid-game turn and if you're the one having to engage/peel for your team the taking in excess of 800+ true damage right out the gate does you no favors.

He's antiquated, certainly. Personally I see no point in his spikes outside of lane since most of the good ones just like to wait for ability cycling while meat-shielding their carries from blockable poke. So maybe we'll get something of a micro-rework down the road.

Until then, try to at least give them half a chance. We can all do poorly with anyone on the right day. Statistically we're bound to find those 'weird, chained failures' that paint negative lights that are hard to toss.

am not targeting the player. I feel bad for them for liking to play a champion that is so useless.

I never said the player sucked. the champion just flat out sucks. the chogath player has very little control over a game or his/her champion

you have a champion that doesn't win lane anymore. scales worse than tanks fighters and divers. and even worse than pantheon and renekton. the best thing he can do is cheese underleveld mid laners and adcs with his ult mid game.

when a champion reaches the state champions like garen and chogath are in. you wonder how on earth are they not updated already.

Champion Skin1 votes

In games where your opponents do not have much front line he can be a nightmare to deal with. Especially with his newer stacking mechanic. He gets pretty healthy by around the mid-game turn and if you're the one having to engage/peel for your team the taking in excess of 800+ true damage right out the gate does you no favors.

If your team doesn't have a front line or peel then your team would likely have a lot of damage then having Cho'gath blow up one ally will be bad yes.... but he likely had to use Q + ult and maybe also flash to do it.... so now Cho'gath is pretty useful for 9 - 6 seconds and the teamfight will very likely be over by then if one team almost only have damage dealers who will kill or be killed rather quickly so it will end up being a mostly 4v4 where your team should still have plenty and enough damage to still win the fight (however Cho'gath might still be somewhat useful by blocking line skill shots which stop on the first target/champion other abilities he can't really do anything about though)

XOmega WarriorX2 votes

yep.

Big Lincoln2 votes

chogath has no method or mastering involved.

chogath actually has a pretty decent skill curve, issue is he's dog shit no matter how well you play him and no matter what you build

i think at this point he'll prob need to be chalked up for some bigger changes, he has a couple of big issues that riot won't/can't address with quick balance fixes

MunchCrunchLunch1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Big Lincoln,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vgRwknob,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2017-06-16T08:19:52.657+0000)

chogath actually has a pretty decent skill curve, issue is he's dog shit no matter how well you play him and no matter what you build

i think at this point he'll prob need to be chalked up for some bigger changes, he has a couple of big issues that riot won't/can't address with quick balance fixes

if the skill curve is landing all your abilities at the same time thats the flattest one i ever seen

ReySolomon1 votes

True but that's why you build full AP to do as much DMG before you die, I main cho mid got myself out of bronze to silver 2 he's a good champion IMP

Champion Skin1 votes

The main problem with Cho'gath is that he doesn't do much if he misses Q.... especially so if the enemy champions aren't very affected by silences (because of not being ability reliant or already having their abilities on cooldown)

hes like the least terrifying champion to get fed. a fed janna has more impact than this bull in a china store. he can't hit anything but the ocassional flash R that doesn't work most of the time

Since then he doesn't do much and his cooldowns are so long that he can just be ignored which means that even if he gets off the Q --> R (maybe with flash) it will just end up with the fight devolving into a 4v4 since Cho'gath can't do much more before 9 - 5.4 (40% CDR) seconds which is a long time of doing nothing in a fight (at least in lane he can punch his opponent with his E and do a little at least)

DunkinNoobs1 votes

Are you honestly trying to tell me that a champion with an AOE silence, an AOE knockup, and close to 1000 true damage late game is useless? Come on now.

Targon1 votes

Cho'gath's main weakness is that his kit doesn't really fit his play style. He has the kit of an anti-diver but he can't do much if he himself gets dove as his CC is pretty unreliable. His Q is fairly easy to avoid in most circumstances, and the CC silence on his W is most effective against casters but most casters are ranged, which can of course, kite him to death since he has no mobility.

Chumpzi11a1 votes

Rylai's. Lead with the silence. Once there's a slow on it, the knock up lands. Use the giant spike slow zone to keep their carries off yours while waiting for cooldowns. Just build a half item for lane until Rylai's is done. Frozen heart and abyssal mask make you pretty tanky, and ult passive. It's not cho, it's poor itemization and/or interaction between cho and his carries.

Profirix1 votes

I explored maining Cho'Gath for a while but decided that it really wasn't practical given his current state of existence. I disagree that he does 'no damage'. In fact, if built correctly his damage output is pretty amazing, but usually only to one target.

Cho has an identity crisis: hes a CC/disruption tank with AP bruiser scalings and a mish-mash of melee and ranged abilities. Worst of all, one of his abilities is borderline useless in most combat situations (Vorpal Spikes).

At my ELO, Cho'Gath performs fairly well because players are not skilled enough to dodge a relatively competent rupture placement, but as you increase in rank players are more and more mechanically skilled and will dodge rupture 9/10 times. If rupture misses, Cho'Gath does very little until it is back off of cooldown. Cho'Gath excels when fighting 1v1 or 1v2, where someone can initiate more reliable CC and you can follow up with the full combo.

At his heart, his greatest weakness is mobility. Now this would be a fair weakness if it wasn't so prevalent. Almost every single mainstream 'meta' champion played today has very high amounts of low-cooldown mobility. Sion suffers from a similar problem. Though not inherently in a bad spot, Sion struggles to be relevant against high-mobility team comps. This is the reason he is never played.

Adding more power into his kit would probably break him. The one thing that is REALLY holding him back from being a decent champion are his mana costs and his mana pool. Level 1, you can rupture twice before running out of mana. 90 mana cost for rupture is just too high to be useful. Lastly, Vorpal Spikes needs to be completely reworked into a Titanic Hydra-like ability where you activate it and it does major AoE damage and has a short cooldown.

Cho'Gath just suffers from his origins as a relic from an older version of League where mobility wasn't at its core a fundamental principle that essentially decides who wins or loses in trades.

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