Because when your whole team is behind and the only way to comeback is to split push. you get ganked by 5 people half way. even though all of them are fed and it takes one or two to kill you. but they give no shit since they don't have to worry about other lanes. I mean cmon I used to thrive on split push comebacks and it just never happened since 5.22. why do you make someone stronger just because they are stronger. you are discouraging comebacks.
shark music36 votesI'm consistently amazed by how good Riot is at implementing scary changes that really do make the game better and more fun, but, yeah, having minions kick you when you're down was a terrible concept that makes the game far less dynamic and interesting. Easily the most fun destroying idea I've ever seen implemented in any game, and I played FF XIV on launch day. Really though, this idea is so bad, there's no way it can last. They will have to repair this horrible misstep sooner or later.
BluePolarizer30 votesPatch 5.24:
We thought we'd like to separate the great laners from the merely good laners. Now missing 1 CS means that enemy minions get +1 armor, encouraging you to not miss CS.
Shroom Junkie9 votesPatch 5.24:
We thought we'd like to separate the great laners from the merely good laners. Now missing 1 CS means that enemy minions get +1 armor, encouraging you to not miss CS.
AFK's for 5 minutes Rejoins Goes back to lane WHY WON'T THESE F*CKING MINIONS TAKE ANY DAMAGE??!?!?!?!
Knoyle1 votesEveryone now lane bullies you if you are NOT a tanky champ so they can at least force you to back and have their minions be buffer than yours.
Bârd1 votesDont forget all minions gaining 2% lifesteal for every 10 CS on their team!
BluePolarizer1 votesbut but but all these low golds talking shit to bronzes and silvers say that if you are "bad and don't have perfect CS" you deserve to lose!!!
Alaylia3 votes[{quoted}](name=daft kitty,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kc3EEQEJ,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-11-29T23:01:26.850+0000)
I played FF XIV on launch day.
Oh god.... You'll be ok I promise. Don't think on the horror
SirHeavyScrotum4 votesYeah I agree I trust the game devs at Riot but having played this change I really don't like it =/
rescued2 votesYeah... I died from minions yesterday trying to defend the base. Plus they take forever to kill. ;_; it's terrifying.
TDubH9 votes... You're jumping on the bullshit band-wagon. the changes affected how minions took and did damage to other minions. The team with a level advantage will have minion which take less damage from enemy minions whilst they do more damage to enemy minions (Note, not towers or champions) meaning that minions are the same ease to kill as a champion as they have been.
Aheadatime1 votesWhile I agree with you, and there's no way "Rescued" died from minions outside of a horrible misplay, there's a side effect of the minion change that could contribute to what he's saying. If the enemy minions take less damage from and do more damage to your minions, it's more likely that you'll be faced with a super wave if you're not paying attention to one particular lane. This could (with lane mismanagement, horrible positioning, or straight trolling) increase the likeliness of getting killed by a minion wave.
TDubH1 votesThat is true, especially if enhanced with super minions, super waves are not fun... however people i see are treating the wave mechanics like losing increased the minions health or armor straight up, which aggravates me.
Jeddy0178 votesYou know,I honestly can't tell the difference.I truly can't see how much of an impact these new minion changes had on my games.
Taarki10 votesI just played a game where we were up 4 towers and all 3 lanes were almost always pushed to the enemy turrets with a monster wave or near close to a monster wave. It was super easy to take them down in a 1-3-1 splitpush. This change really isn't good.
flibitydoo7 votesSo you know how in the midgame when your team is sieging mid as 5...
and the enemy team is sieging mid as 5...
And the game's basically turned into aram for 10 minutes...
and there are those sidelanes, that nobody (in bronze) goes to clear?
well, with the new minion changes, the team with a level advantage will have their minions slow push harder than the enemy minions (pushing slightly harder if they have a turret advantage too, scaling based on number of turrets taken over their enemy). Note that the minion changes only affect minion damage dealt and damage received against other minions- they are just as easy to waveclear/push out as they were before. What's changed is that the creeps will naturally fight closer to the losing team's towers.
As a result, the team that's behind get's to farm up harder to make a comeback.
and the winning team get's the opportunity to siege more often, or otherwise risk the enemy team catching up.
Interestingly enough, in Dota 2, when the Barracks (the Dota 2 equivalent of an inhibitor) are destroyed, all the minions in that specific lane get stronger and they give less gold/exp on kill. This is because the lane autopushing is actually a huge advantage for the team getting pushed into as it allows them to farm up in the safety of their base. Dota 2 acknowledges this by decreasing the gold and exp values so that the losing team doesn't gain an advantage for losing an objective.
Xonra2 votesYou know,I honestly can't tell the difference.I truly can't see how much of an impact these new minion changes had on my games.
You are full of it since your match hostory shows you havent even PLAYED on this patch to know. Good job lying to get those upvotes though.
Jeddy0171 votesNow that is a complete lie.It's probably because you can only see my Ranked games & I haven't played Ranked since the season ended. Try checking Lolking or something.
Nunya Bezwacks6 votesCAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLED IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
I FUCKING TOLD YOU SO!!!!!
Sorry had to get that out.
My Waifu Vanilla4 votesI mean you can still easily split push against the newer minions since Champions still do and take full damage from minions even with their "lead buff". That being said the minions do absolutely nothing to someone along the likes of Viktor who will still just E every single wave for its entire health bar which in itself will drag games to the 40 minute mark without side lanes auto pushing as well. There is a reason no one liked the Ziggs meta back in the day because it was impossible to push against waveclear....now they have to waveclear all 3 lanes when behind so you can MAYBE seige against these "unseigeable" comps.
MunchCrunchLunch3 votesnothing you're saying is relevant or accurate. or even considerate of all the things i mentioned
Ultraboomer4 votesI want to begin by saying that I am in bronze, and I know the game is balanced around plat+, which I am okay with. I would also like to say I haven't played many games since they turned the new minion thing on (if they have). I also realize that it's purpose is to let the losing team farm easier. However, I honestly feel like it makes it really hard to make comebacks in teamfights because it is much harder for the losing team to set up a slowpush in order to give themselves the time needed to fight against the 5 man enemy group. I was trying it earlier and even without the enemy clearign it when I attempted to start a slowpush the enemy minion wave just grouped up and ended up as a mob of 3-4 full waves bashing our inhibitor tower leaving us no time to dedicate 5 people to take any objectives or win any teamfights. Whenever we left to clear waves and potentially get some gold/xp we just ended up getting 3-5 man ganked and we were right back where we started if not worse. This specific case is probably only an issue in lower elo though, because we seem to have no concept of split pushing down here. I am usually on board for whatever changes Riot wants to make, but I can't say that about this one. At the least I can't say it yet, because I haven't really learned how to play around it yet.
BonkMonk4 votesteam behind win an important team fight all lanes pushed all jungle/dragon/baron/rift herald gone can't get any towers/objectives
yeah, not frustrating at all.
Vertanium3 votesThats always been a problem. But I do agree that if a team truly should win, it should be because of thier KNOWLEDGE to push out side lanes then pressure objectives. not have the game do it for them just for winning lanes.
Dunkrius2g3 votesWhat riot is doing is this: Put bullshit right now and fix it all easily when the Season actually begin. You might as well take a big break from this a log in sometime to time.
Lithium Rosa3 votesI'm having difficulties with Nasus, because of minion block I keep miscalculating the time I need to approach an enemy minion, which means when I get there it's dead already.
Lithium Rosa3 voteswait this post is not about minion block? I'm out
Aunuxa1 votesMinion block is just down right terrible right now. Add to the fact the pathing seems glitchy on most parts of the map and we have a case where meele champs without mobility and handicapped right out of champ selection.
Ipressbutton3 votesI think I've had 1 or 2 close games after the preseason patch. They were really satisfying too. The rest have been stomps either in my favor or the enemy teams.
I don't know why they changed minion mechanics and reduced tower defenses. If I wanted faster games I'd play HoTS. I come to league for the 40+ min matches. There are also champions that don't really hit their power spike until the mid- late game transition, and since the preseason I've noticed matches are 5-10 mins shorter. That's assuming one side hasn't completely snowballed to the point where the other team just wants to surrender.
MindWaves3 votes@OP What you also did not touch on was the fact that this completely kills any attempt at wave management. A strategy that has been part of the game since season 1-2. Very poor decision on Riots part.
XTheLastRancherX2 votesYeah smashing creeps with Tryndamere with Shyv, BORK and IE has never been harder. Even with full Fury. Thanks RIOT.
MunchCrunchLunch3 votesit will be when you get ganked by 5 people 3 levels and 2 items ahead of you. And i never played tryn so idk
hopeful41 votesYou cant comeback because you are bad, not because of minion changes. Ive had plenty of comebacks in my games
Xonra2 votesYou cant comeback because you are bad, not because of minion changes. Ive had plenty of comebacks in my games
Hard to tell if you are lying about even playing on the patch like the guy above that hasnt played a game this patch claiming it isnt bad, since you are on an account that hasnt played since May and likely an alt.
RellikDloc1 votesYes, they are worst then ever, my champ will do a double or triple turn to miss an easy kill on a minion that is only behind 1 other minion. Its so dumb.
macromite1 votesthat's probably because you try to split when you don't know where they are. if your smart you can split very hard so long as the enemy is fighting someone else at the time, and then you back off as soon as you lose vision.
Habitz1 votesHonestly someone picking tryn and winning despite their team being completely behind in objectives is toxic to this game. If all you want to do is aa all the minions to win play pacman.
If it's at least harder to do but still possible then perfect, reward the really good splitpushers with a victory. I see good splitpushers as having effective team communication and warding as well as knowing when to back off and do another lane.
KoKoboto1 votessplitpush is lame but yes I agree
Aunuxa1 votesOne other big factor is lack of vision in general because the new warding system. It made comebacks easier when you could see your enemy in your jungles and plan accordingly.
Tatrii1 votesYeah it's getting ridiculous it's pretty much at the point if you're 10 even 5 kills behind it's pretty much over
ahferroin71 votesThe issue with this is not that they push further, it's that they clear the enemy minions faster, which means they have more time to damage towers. The intent was to push the wave to the losing side to ease safe farming. they could have just adjusted the MS of the minions on the winning team to do that without threatening towers to the degree they are now.
Pikmints1 votesOne thing that really gets me is how this buff persists. If it went away after 10, 15, or even 20 minutes, then it would accomplish Riot's original goal of preventing dominant laners from stalling away from turrets yet forfeit the free, global, mid-late game pushing power. It would also return the 4v5 scenarios from impossible to unlikely.
The way it's currently implemented leaves me a little confused. They make turrets a lot more vulnurable, yet implement an auto-push mechanic as an attempt to help people losing lane. "Baron buff is a good thing for your team to get because it lets your minions push to the enemy turrets faster, but your minions globally pushing on their own is a bad thing for you" - RiotMoreOrLess