So Varus and Katarina are the only ones with Grievous Wounds built-in. Is it a toxic mechanic?

darkdill··4 votes·934 views

Grievous Wounds seems to be seeing less and less availability with each update made. Fizz lost it, Tristana lost it, and now Miss Fortune has lost it. Presently, only Katarina and Varus have GW, with everyone else needing to buy Morellonomicon or take Ignite.

Is Grievous Wounds a toxic debuff? Believe me, if you could remove it with Cleanse, it'd be a lot less annoying.

14 Comments

Phife5 votes

Thing is if your champion is soley based around healing ones self, and 3 champs on the other team counter pick you, you're fucked from the get go. DrMundo Swain Warwick Fiddlesticks Aatrox Mordekaiser Nasus Shen Trundle Soraka Volibear

Are all basically rendered useless because of one debuff you cannot remove simply by tapping your heels, you need cleanse / mikaels / qss and im going to be honest with all of you, none of these champs will buy a Qss under and circumstance.(maybe aatrox :/)

darkdill3 votes

Soraka can remove GW with her ultimate.

Phife1 votes

oh, thats right... i forgot about that.

insaiyanbacca1 votes

well i mean fiddle will usually build a zhonyas same with swain so i would think they could just zhonya's through the grevious wounds if need be, plus fiddle could just silence kat to stop hers same with raka

Phife1 votes

i guess morellos doesn't apply with every spell cast.

Laughing Fish2 votes

it makes healing champions very difficult to balance. Take Mundo for example. If you make his heal strong enough to be relevant with Grievous Wounds, it will be OP against champions without grievous wounds. If you make it weak enough to be balanced against champion without, it would be under powered against champions with grievous wounds.

Rueian1 votes

you can cleanse it. also there were far more champions and there used to be an item that had grievous wounds on it. also grievous wounds used to stack. Tristana used to be able to E + Ignite and literally stop you from healing.

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

I don't think you can cleanse it from Katarina or Varus, acutally. It would just be refreshed immediately.

Katarina will refresh Grievous Wounds with every dagger thrown. I suppose you could Cleanse the effect after the last dagger hit you, but by that point you are generally safe anyways.

Varus' E constantly applies Grievous Wounds to anyone standing on the ground where it landed.

Rueian1 votes

mechanically you can cleanse it, it just doesn't matter because it reapplies. If you are fast enough and happen to have cleanse and a heal, you could get the heal in between the refresh time though.

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

That would require godly timing to do intentionally though, even without factoring latency. Katarina throws out a dagger every 0.25s and I think Varus' E checks every 0.25s or 0.5s.

Laughing Fish1 votes

He is not saying you actually could pull that off. He is just saying mechanically it is possible to, as you technically removed grievous wounds completely, and then got it back .25 seconds later.

djjomon1 votes

I wouldn't say it's a toxic mechanic, just restrictive. It's great when you know you need it, but if you're either playing Blind, or need the champion for other strengths, GW holds them back.

One of those power budget things. Remove GW on MF, give her more power elsewhere. As for whether or not this is a good pattern, we'll see. Maybe a heal meta will eventually happen, and Riot will figure it out

Jakojo1 votes

I'm finding it hard to understand their justification of removing Miss Fortunes GW's. On-hit I can see it being somewhat oppressive but other than Varus she was the only carry that could deal with Soraka/Sona/Nami and Taric (to a degree) bot lane. Not only that the only other GW option is an ability power item. They shouldn't bring back Executioners Calling but try to rework something that can have an active that has GW that is an AD item.

EndlessSorcerer1 votes

IIRC, Grievous Wounds from the game will allow Riot to rebalance healing abilities.

Grievous Wounds can be said to have resulted in an odd state of balance for healing: if it is reduced it is too weak, if it is not reduced it is too strong. Though they may allow Ignite to keep Grievous Wounds since it is single-target and on a long cooldown.

If they no longer have to account for Grievous Wounds, healing abilities can be more consistently balanced.

I might be wrong, but I believe that this is their intention. Have to see how it will turn out though.

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