TO RIOT: lane diversity IS NOT game diversity

rawiazam1··2 votes·694 views

if a champion/ class x can go top,jung,mid anad bot and do good in all those lanes, that's doens't mean that the champion is diverse or the game is diverse. Quite the opposite, that means that champion x is op in a sense that no class can win him. the thing that determines who can go to a certain lane is who playes that lane and not the lane itself, we are likely to see that every lane has it's two opposite classes where one counters the other cause of that's how this works.

top (fighters, vaguards and skirmishers): fighters counter tanks's early, tanks counters skirmishers's and skirmishers counters fighters's. jungle: everything goes there cause there is no clear fighting over something between the laners. mid(mages, assasins and fighters(some)): assasins counter most of the mages and some classes of mages coutner asssins ( there are 60 mages, so it's a diverse class gameplay-wise) and fighters coutner assasins. bot(wardens, enchanters, merksmen): since bot is the duo lane, it's more per duo, but usually marksmen counters enchanters and enchanters counters wardens and wardens counters marksmen. NOTE: this only applies in the early game, since in the lane who counters who changes, and lanes are all about early game.

SO if riot shoves a champion in every lane that doesn't mean that the game is diverse or the champion is diverse, that means the he is frusturaiting to play against and is unfair.

what happened to champion diversety where you could play the same champion glass cannon, tank and bruiser. that is diversity, not shoving a class to every lane. and what happened to your classes "guide" and how you choose the design around the champion: https://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/gameplay/dev-blog-classes-subclasses

i miss those days

4 Comments

DuskDaUmbreon4 votes

Just because a champion can go to multiple lanes and do well doesn't mean they're OP or oppressive, nor does it mean they're diverse. It just means that they're able to go to multiple lanes.

If I take Ahri top, mid, and jungle, but build her pretty much the exact same all the time, and do the same thing with her each time, that's not diversity. That just means I'm taking her to three different roles.

The champion is diverse if they actually do different things in those positions. If I take Nasus top to splitpush, jungle to bring a strong slow and armor shred to multiple lanes, while being a strong objective-taker, mid to have strong waveclear/poke as full AP, and support to use exhaust 2.0 on their ADC and have an extremely useful %armor shred (possibly with Rylai's, Font of Life, and Ardent to also give a decent AS boost, AoE slows, and an okay heal), while also making it harder to dive, that's a champion being diverse. He's filling multiple roles in different ways (Splitpush top, utility/objective control jg, AP AoE DPS mid, durable utility and anti-dive support) not different lanes the exact same way (AP mage/assassin mid, AP mage/assassin top, AP mage/assassin jungle).

However, let's say that, for some reason, Nasus is viable as all four of those. Is he actually reducing diversity? It all depends - Is he crowding out other choices? Is him being picked enabling other champions to be his ally or opponent? If the first is yes and the second is no, then, yes, he would be. If he has a significantly higher than average winrate in any of those lanes, then, yes, he could be.

We do have to note something, though: Just because a champion can do something doesn't mean they're good at it. And just because they're oppressive in one place doesn't mean they are everywhere else. Wukong has a 53% winrate top, but a sub-50 one jungle. He's not oppressive jungle, but he's clearly too strong top. Also, Nasus support is unlikely to be ever viable outside of a rare counterpick, so even if he could, he won't be good there.

I...kinda went off on a tangent. But...I'll sum it up as best as I can:

  1. Being in a lot of lanes, or even every lane, doesn't mean you're diverse, nor does it mean you're suppressing actual diversity. It just means you're useful in more than one lane.
  2. Being able to do a lot of things means you're a diverse champion, but you could be suppressing diversity overall.
  3. Just because Riot removes diversity from a champion's kit doesn't mean they're suppressing diversity, they could be doing so to increase overall diversity (see 2)
rawiazam11 votes

{quoted}

Just because a champion can go to multiple lanes and do well doesn't mean they're OP or oppressive, nor does it mean they're diverse. It just means that they're able to go to multiple lanes.

If I take Ahri top, mid, and jungle, but build her pretty much the exact same all the time, and do the same thing with her each time, that's not diversity. That just means I'm taking her to three different roles.

The champion is diverse if they actually do different things in those positions. If I take Nasus top to splitpush, jungle to bring a strong slow and armor shred to multiple lanes, while being a strong objective-taker, mid to have strong waveclear/poke as full AP, and support to use exhaust 2.0 on their ADC and have an extremely useful %armor shred (possibly with Rylai's, Font of Life, and Ardent to also give a decent AS boost, AoE slows, and an okay heal), while also making it harder to dive, that's a champion being diverse. He's filling multiple roles in different ways (Splitpush top, utility/objective control jg, AP AoE DPS mid, durable utility and anti-dive support) not different lanes the exact same way (AP mage/assassin mid, AP mage/assassin top, AP mage/assassin jungle).

However, let's say that, for some reason, Nasus is viable as all four of those. Is he actually reducing diversity? It all depends - Is he crowding out other choices? Is him being picked enabling other champions to be his ally or opponent? If the first is yes and the second is no, then, yes, he would be. If he has a significantly higher than average winrate in any of those lanes, then, yes, he could be.

We do have to note something, though: Just because a champion can do something doesn't mean they're good at it. And just because they're oppressive in one place doesn't mean they are everywhere else. Wukong has a 53% winrate top, but a sub-50 one jungle. He's not oppressive jungle, but he's clearly too strong top. Also, Nasus support is unlikely to be ever viable outside of a rare counterpick, so even if he could, he won't be good there.

I...kinda went off on a tangent. But...I'll sum it up as best as I can:

  1. Being in a lot of lanes, or even every lane, doesn't mean you're diverse, nor does it mean you're suppressing actual diversity. It just means you're useful in more than one lane.
  2. Being able to do a lot of things means you're a diverse champion, but you could be suppressing diversity overall.
  3. Just because Riot removes diversity from a champion's kit doesn't mean they're suppressing diversity, they could be doing so to increase overall diversity (see 2)

that's my point, if a champion is viable in every role, it's rather unhealthy and not diversity. if u did well on ahri that doesn't mean that ahri is strong in every lane since she has less than 50% winrate except mid. but if a champ has 50+ winrate in more than 2 lanes, it's a clear indicator of something wrong

DuskDaUmbreon1 votes

{quoted}

that's my point, if a champion is viable in every role, it's rather unhealthy and not diversity.

That's not what I said at all. I said "doesn't mean you're diverse". It's diversity-neutral. The problem is when you're dominating any number of lanes.

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