Unpopular Opinion: People complain about League's balance while not knowing enough about balance

chipndip1··28 votes·9,634 views

People constantly get on Riot's case about balance in the game being bad, and the game revolving around "a few top tiers that Riot just cycles around", right? If that's the case, why are people complaining about the new changes Riot's introducing?

Let me break this down so it's easily understood:

  • When people normally talk about a balanced game, they're talking about how different characters in the game should have a "relatively even" chance of performing well. The better the balance, the higher the odds that any individual character in the roster won't be significantly outclassed by someone else. To achieve this, even if there's slight advantages here and there, most match-ups need to be as close to 50/50 as possible.

  • When people talk about balance in a strategic game, that's when things become a bit different. It's not necessarily about "every individual piece being as strong as any other piece" more than it's about the bigger picture of strategies and compositions that should be balanced and lead to fair shots at winning the game. If you pick up a team comp of 4/4 healers, odds are you're not making it too far in whatever game you're playing. If you skip out on healers entirely, you can't clear large scale boss fights because you'll run out of sustain. If you have no tank, the second some enemy does a high burst damage attack, your party's wiped out. So on and so forth with this example.

The thing about League is that solo queue's been balanced like a fighting/racing game for a long time, where people just expect to pick their favorite champion and just do well into almost any odds all the time. All AD team comp? I'll pick Pantheon. No tank? I'll pick Pantheon. No scaling because my bot lane's Lucian and my mid's LeBlanc and my jg is Hecarim? I'll pick Pantheon. I'm support? I'M GOING TO PICK PANTHEON.

Riot has been tasked to balancing the game as it's meant to be played (a strategic game) as well as how people like to dick around in solo queue playing it (as a game where you style on nerdz so hard your mom makes you uninstall). Naturally, this leads to balance issues. You can't have a strategic game where everyone has similar odds to win in most situations while resembling any sort of balance, because then, on a holistic level, the game's now unbalanced. If we're able to magically clear a whole RPG with nothing but healers, sure the healers have an equal shot to win as anyone else...but that's not a balanced RPG because now the healers are significantly stronger than the other units on a holistic level. The healers now can cover their own weaknesses that would otherwise make you want to balance your party out. Then you have to do this for every other class. THEN the game becomes a big fiasco of "who's the most efficient at doing everything enough" rather than actually balancing the roster.

Translating this notion to League, let's say Orianna's odds of winning against lane opponents can be close to 50% for most of the roster. Remember that time in season 6 or 7 when people were complaining about how busted Orianna was when she had a 50% win rate and 10% pick rate, simply because she had no match-ups where she'd legitimately LOSE, and thus Riot nerfed her resistances so she'd have to have her ball on her to have decent resistance stats? It's kind of like that. Sure, Orianna wasn't super oppressive, but she was imbalanced because, strategically, you could just always pick Orianna. It's the same reason Maokai was reworked, because when you needed ANY tank, you could always pick him. A balanced League of Legends would see that, sometimes, you being stubborn about playing X simply because you want to/like to means you've significantly increased your odds of losing by being either stubborn or unwise with your champion selection.

People complain that Riot's gone off the deep end when it comes to balance for ages, Mordekaiser and sometimes they're right Mordekaiser. However, for changes in this direction, Riot's actually HELPING League's balance by sharpening and carving out niches for champions so that you can answer champs that may be generally powerful with stronger counter-pick options, which increases presence for more of the roster and allows us to have answers for certain picks without just abusing the ban button. These changes are largely healthy for the game. I honestly think we'll need more changes like them in the future.

82 Comments

Nyarlathοtep9 votes

Riot's actually HELPING League's balance by sharpening and carving out niches for champions so that you can answer champs that may be generally powerful with stronger counter-pick options

Wait so you are advocating the current changes that renekton, kata and kled have ( poppy's is oke maybe the slow unneeded, blitz i guess oke considering he is blitz) on pbe? How exactly? Renekton supposedly is countered by armour. Tanks (being the primary class that stacks armour) are supposed to NOT be so hard countered. Renekton can already shred their armour on e. There is no reason for him to be capable of outright destroying shields. Irelia dealt bonus damage and got it removed. Why in heaven does renekton get a better version? He can literally destroy it instantly. And its a point and click. I mean shields can get cancerous but there are other ways to reduce their obnoxiousness. Like a portion of w damage being penetrated through the shield or cutting the shield in half.

Kled on the other hand is mostly weird. Personally i dont believe he needs that like at all. When i play him (or played) i always felt that he is good. Not op or up. However as a popular boards dweller there were always some people calling him obnoxious. And i kinda understand why. No suddenly reducing heal by 60% is just TOO much (which is the same for kata too).

Besides do we (or you rather) really want hard counters? Do you really want to rely that much to your jungler (something that is out of your control) when you get countered. Do you really want League of Counterpicks? Because if it does come, you are royally screwed if you are first pick.

chipndip12 votes

{quoted}

Wait so you are advocating the current changes that renekton, kata and kled have ( poppy's is oke maybe the slow unneeded, blitz i guess oke considering he is blitz) on pbe?

Honestly? Yes.

The game's needed answers to shield stacking and healers for a long time now, and you can't put that answer on a hard scaling pick like Irelia because they don't need it. Things that don't scale as hard numbers-wise are better options to put these mechanics on, and ironically enough, that's what nearly all of these candidates for these types of changes are.

Does it mean they might need power shaved off elsewhere? Perhaps, but I still support the changes for these champions.

How exactly? Renekton supposedly is countered by armour. Tanks (being the primary class that stacks armour) are supposed to NOT be so hard countered. Renekton can already shred their armour on e. There is no reason for him to be capable of outright destroying shields.

  1. Shields =/= Armor.

  2. Renekton being "countered" by armor died with Conqueror and Shojin's addition to the game.

  3. Renekton bullies EVERYONE early. The point is that he's out-scaled in team fighting situations. You kind of have to let go of previous understandings of Renekton's power curve and how he fairs into tanks at this point because they're outdated.

Irelia dealt bonus damage and got it removed. Why in heaven does renekton get a better version?

Because he doesn't scale as hard as Irelia does.

Kled on the other hand is mostly weird. Personally i dont believe he needs that like at all. When i play him (or played) i always felt that he is good. Not op or up. However as a popular boards dweller there were always some people calling him obnoxious. And i kinda understand why. No suddenly reducing heal by 60% is just TOO much (which is the same for kata too).

It's not necessarily that "Kled needs anti-healing". It's that "League needs anti-healing, and Kled's the current chosen answer for that." He only applies it to one person, and only if he completes his Q on that person. If anything, it's way more controlled than Kat's ult, which puts it all over the place.

Besides do we (or you rather) really want hard counters?

Absolutely hopeless lanes all over the rift? Not necessarily.

A stronger emphasis on drafting properly? Yes and I'm very consistent on that topic. Ask Moody P if he shows up here. We should be able to draft proper answers to situations.

Nyarlathοtep2 votes

The game's needed answers to shield stacking and healers for a long time now,

You know where else we need answers? At obnoxious stuff. Things that are simply unfun to the max. But i guess no one cares for fun factor.

Renekton being "countered" by armor died with Conqueror and Shojin's addition to the game.

True but in addition to that, renekton falling off died with conq and shojin introduction to the game. He kinda falls off but not that he becomes irrelevant. He remains a solid threat to a good chunk of the backline and a solid frontline most of the times. Conq makes sure his damage will remain relevant and shojin makes sure he will q constantly.

Because he doesn't scale as hard as Irelia does.

This doesnt give him the right to outright destroy them. Like i say again, its a point and click that also deals high damage, procs conq and pta and stun for a good duration. Thats just too much.

It's that "League needs anti-healing

True but they could just buff GW in the first place. Giving stuff like this on an already strong laner is kinda stupid. Like how the fuck will a maokai survive vs kled? He relies on healing to tank. Conceding lane is his only option but if the other lanes are doing poorly you are royally fucked. Or aatrox. Kled already has the upper hand in the match up. Now he will also be able to essentially remove that extra (40%-70%) healing. And unlike maokai he falls off. Now he will even have stripped his only stuff that enables him to teamfight on a basic ability. You cant even get away from kled because he is rather sticky with his e.

A stronger emphasis on drafting properly? Yes and I'm very consistent on that topic. Ask Moody P if he shows up here. We should be able to draft proper answers to situations.

But thats straight up shit. I really cant understand your thinking process. These changes just make these lanes entirely dependent on jungler presence. In yoloq thats unreliable. Or something that is common. What if there are 2 lanes that need continuously jungler help? Like kled vs maokai and yasuo vs xerath. The jungler cant be at both lanes at the same time. And then ofc is the fact that dragon is close at bot.

chipndip11 votes

{quoted}

You know where else we need answers? At obnoxious stuff. Things that are simply unfun to the max. But i guess no one cares for fun factor.

Obnoxious stuff like heal spam, mobility creep, and shield stacking? Funny enough, those are the three pillars of one of the worst metas of League, ever.

True but in addition to that, renekton falling off died with conq and shojin introduction to the game. He kinda falls off but not that he becomes irrelevant.

Why should he fall off to a point of irrelevancy? Him not being Pantheon doesn't mean he doesn't fall off.

True but they could just buff GW in the first place.

Then that just ruins healing champions outright at the low, low price of 800 gold.

Giving stuff like this on an already strong laner is kinda stupid. Like how the fuck will a maokai survive vs kled? He relies on healing to tank. Conceding lane is his only option but if the other lanes are doing poorly you are royally fucked. Or aatrox. Kled already has the upper hand in the match up. Now he will also be able to essentially remove that extra (40%-70%) healing. And unlike maokai he falls off.

  • Aatrox needs no charity rn.

  • Maokai and all top lane tanks need attention rn, regardless of if this is a good idea or not.

  • You can just pick someone that doesn't rely on drain tanking to fight Kled with.

But thats straight up shit.

Maybe it feels bad for you at the time, but there's times where you probs made someone else feel bad in turn.

I really cant understand your thinking process. These changes just make these lanes entirely dependent on jungler presence.

That's what junglers are there for, for starters.

In yoloq thats unreliable. Or something that is common. What if there are 2 lanes that need continuously jungler help? Like kled vs maokai and yasuo vs xerath. The jungler cant be at both lanes at the same time. And then ofc is the fact that dragon is close at bot.

Learn to play back when you don't have advantage.

Z3Sleeper1 votes

{quoted}

Do you really want League of Counterpicks? Because if it does come, you are royally screwed if you are first pick.

It already exists, it's called top lane.

abca986 votes

UnPOpuLaR OpinIoM

8Belthazor85 votes

Riot often needs half of a year to nerf something even if it is absolutely broken but they do nerf it eventually which proves it was broken. If it wasn't actually broken then they would't nerf the shit out of it. When a champion becomes so broken 1, there is no counterplay against it 2, a gold 1 player can win lane 10/10 against a diamond 1 player with it, then it shouldn't take 6 months to balance that champion. However, Riot usually doesn't give a damn unless it effects pro plays too. There is no need for excuses, the balancing team does a pretty bad job. How many times do they change/release something just to patch it again and again about a billion times before it reaches a somewhat acceptable state?

hoganftw4 votes

The sad truth is that team comp doesn't matter anymore especially in soloqueue. The only win condition now is that you stomp lane you win game. There's no strategy and it's harder to throw now more than ever. League always used to get meme'd on regularly for "Oh first blood gg" snowballing but its at its absolute peak where it's reality.

General Esdeath 4 votes

I'd read this if Tahm Kench didn't run wild in top for 3 patches

"he's getting nerfed read pbe hehe xddd"

yeah I know, that's why I said 3 patches

or if their solution to "X does too much damage and Y can't even keep up" wasn't "buff Y" then maybe I'd read this

Riot's balance team is the single biggest joke of the gaming industry, rivaling EA. And given how things have been lately, that's a bold statement I'm ready to make.

chipndip11 votes

[{quoted}](name=General Esdeath ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vKvAfyNH,comment-id=0011,timestamp=2019-07-06T04:56:53.635+0000)

I'd read this if Tahm Kench didn't run wild in top for 3 patches

"he's getting nerfed read pbe hehe xddd"

yeah I know, that's why I said 3 patches

or if their solution to "X does too much damage and Y can't even keep up" wasn't "buff Y" then maybe I'd read this

Riot's balance team is the single biggest joke of the gaming industry, rivaling EA. And given how things have been lately, that's a bold statement I'm ready to make.

Kench doesn't even have a 52% win rate on u.gg, nor is his pick rate all that high. He's not bad top side in solo queue, but I don't think it's a national emergency like people are making it out to be.

General Esdeath 1 votes

{quoted}

Kench doesn't even have a 52% win rate on u.gg, nor is his pick rate all that high. He's not bad top side in solo queue, but I don't think it's a national emergency like people are making it out to be.

Win rate is not a determining factor about something being balanced or not.

Ever hear the classic example of a gun vs a sword? The gun has so much advantage but if you waste all the ammo, it's useless.

The gun is Tahm. Early game he just beats you. There's nothing you can do except 2v1 and hope he messes up. Even then, you can't 1v1 him, ever. Come late game he falls off harder than champs should. Renekton, as much as I hate to say it, is a pretty good example of how early game bullies should be. He does so much damage early and has sustain, but late game he has to go tanky or he blows up.

chipndip11 votes

[{quoted}](name=General Esdeath ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vKvAfyNH,comment-id=001100000000,timestamp=2019-07-06T20:53:12.928+0000)

Win rate is not a determining factor about something being balanced or not.

So what metric are you using to complain about Kench top?

General Esdeath 1 votes

{quoted}

So what metric are you using to complain about Kench top?

Experience, kit numbers, the stuff that shows where a problem lies.

chipndip11 votes

[{quoted}](name=General Esdeath ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vKvAfyNH,comment-id=00110000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-06T21:58:49.755+0000)

Experience, kit numbers, the stuff that shows where a problem lies.

Since I have to do it the long way, what metric are you using to determine that Kench is a problem in the first place?

General Esdeath 1 votes

{quoted}

Since I have to do it the long way, what metric are you using to determine that Kench is a problem in the first place?

experience and kit numbers, did you not read that last reply?

chipndip11 votes

[{quoted}](name=General Esdeath ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vKvAfyNH,comment-id=0011000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-07T03:39:03.200+0000)

experience and kit numbers, did you not read that last reply?

No, that's begging the question. Your "experience and kit numbers" assumes that you're already right about Kench being a problem in top lane worth addressing. What indicators about Kench say "Yes, Kench is a balance problem and needs a nerf"?

General Esdeath 1 votes

{quoted}

No, that's begging the question. Your "experience and kit numbers" assumes that you're already right about Kench being a problem in top lane worth addressing. What indicators about Kench say "Yes, Kench is a balance problem and needs a nerf"?

The numbers such as his damage, cooldowns, and mana costs. I don't know what you don't understand about this.

chipndip11 votes

[{quoted}](name=General Esdeath ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vKvAfyNH,comment-id=001100000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-07T09:17:58.410+0000)

The numbers such as his damage, cooldowns, and mana costs. I don't know what you don't understand about this.

Do you know what begging the question means?

Example: We have a cup of water. I say "There's too much water in the cup". The cup isn't overflowing. The cup has no indicators on it. The cup has no measurements on it. You say "Well, I think the amount of water in the cup is fine. Why do you think it's too much?" I then say "Look at how much water is in the cup. That's how I know it's too much."

This is basically what you're doing. You don't use any measurable metric to make your claim, so you can only make the claim and back it up with "personal experience" and reading off that his attacks do X damage at Y rank. Well, I'm a League player, I have MY OWN personal experience, and I can also read that his attacks do X damage at Y rank. What if I'm right in saying Tahm DOESN'T need nerfs (which isn't what I'm arguing but I'm making a point) versus you being right in saying that he does? You have no means of saying otherwise with the position you've taken.

General Esdeath 1 votes

{quoted}

Do you know what begging the question means?

Example: We have a cup of water. I say "There's too much water in the cup". The cup isn't overflowing. The cup has no indicators on it. The cup has no measurements on it. You say "Well, I think the amount of water in the cup is fine. Why do you think it's too much?" I then say "Look at how much water is in the cup. That's how I know it's too much."

This is basically what you're doing. You don't use any measurable metric to make your claim, so you can only make the claim and back it up with "personal experience" and reading off that his attacks do X damage at Y rank. Well, I'm a League player, I have MY OWN personal experience, and I can also read that his attacks do X damage at Y rank. What if I'm right in saying Tahm DOESN'T need nerfs (which isn't what I'm arguing but I'm making a point) versus you being right in saying that he does? You have no means of saying otherwise with the position you've taken.

Gonna say it again slower. We...have...numbers...in...his...kit

Now imagine if the cup had measurement numbers and lines. Every champ has 4 25 mL cups; damage, sustain, resource, and winrate. You can fill these cups however you want but the total water in the all the collective cups can't pass 100 mL. Tahm's damage cup is at 25, his sustain is at 25, his resource cost is at 25, so these cups are filled to the brim and not overflowing. But you're telling me that because the winrate cup is at 15 the others are fine.

See the problem yet?

chipndip11 votes

[{quoted}](name=General Esdeath ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vKvAfyNH,comment-id=00110000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-07T19:24:38.365+0000)

Gonna say it again slower. We...have...numbers...in...his...kit

Now imagine if the cup had measurement numbers and lines.

You literally started this whole back and forth by telling me to not refer to his win/pick rate, so no, the cups DON'T have any measurements on them since you yourself refused them.

Basically, think of it like this: What measurement are you using OUTSIDE OF THE WATER THAT'S IN THE CUP to tell me that the water in the cup is either too much or not enough? No one cares about if we have 1000 liters or 2 drops of water in the cup. The point is whether it's too much or not. What tells me it's too much if I can't refer to the only measurable metric we have to say so?

General Esdeath 1 votes

{quoted}

You literally started this whole back and forth by telling me to not refer to his win/pick rate, so no, the cups DON'T have any measurements on them since you yourself refused them.

The cups have measurements, you might wanna look into how Riot balances champions with power budgets.

Basically, think of it like this: What measurement are you using OUTSIDE OF THE WATER THAT'S IN THE CUP to tell me that the water in the cup is either too much or not enough? No one cares about if we have 1000 liters or 2 drops of water in the cup. The point is whether it's too much or not. What tells me it's too much if I can't refer to the only measurable metric we have to say so?

The numbers, are you trolling?

Luther King Jr V3 votes

Ahri

MrHaZeYo2 votes

I actually enjoyed that season were Solo/Duo was removed for Dynamic. I hate how League, a team game at it's core is played by randoms trying to act like a team.

On topic though, League can't be balanced, it's impossible, and even if it wasn't, Riot wants it to be inbalanced as it allows them to switch the meta to keep the game less stale.

chipndip11 votes

{quoted}

I actually enjoyed that season were Solo/Duo was removed for Dynamic. I hate how League, a team game at it's core is played by randoms trying to act like a team.

On topic though, League can't be balanced, it's impossible, and even if it wasn't, Riot wants it to be inbalanced as it allows them to switch the meta to keep the game less stale.

You're missing the point of balancing.

The point isn't that you're ever going to achieve perfect balance. It's a goal to strive for, even if it's impossible to achieve. The better balance, then hopefully your game becomes a deeper and more rewarding experience.

If the game is one where we know who the best 30 out of 150 champs are and we just wait for RedMercy to tell us what the Koreans are abusing and we cycle through champs like that, that isn't really rewarding. If the game's in a state where we can make active decisions to address each individual match based on the variables in them so we can impact games and win them, that's a more rewarding experience since it promotes critical thinking as well as champion and itemization variety rather than auto-piloting. No game's 100% balanced, but you strive to be in the ways that are appropriate. For a game like this one, you strive for different champs to shine when they need to and falter when they're supposed to, so there's a time and place when each pick is either strong or weak, rather than just giving people even chances to win all the time.

MrHaZeYo1 votes

No, I understand the concept of balancing, and I wasn't incorrect in saying that Riot doesn't want it to be balanced and that it can never be balanced. There is simply to much in this game for that to happen.

chipndip11 votes

{quoted}

No, I understand the concept of balancing, and I wasn't incorrect in saying that Riot doesn't want it to be balanced and that it can never be balanced. There is simply to much in this game for that to happen.

You made a claim and contradicted it in the same sentence...

MrHaZeYo1 votes

How so?

chipndip11 votes

{quoted}

How so?

"I understand the concept of balancing."

"Riot doesn't want it to be and it can never be balanced."

No game on this Earth is 100% balanced. The point is to try to get there. The reason Riot's making these changes is to try harder, so why say they're not trying to?

MrHaZeYo1 votes

I never said they weren't trying to bring the game to a more balanced state, I simply made the statement saying that they don't want a game in which is truly balanced.

You've clearly played this game for years and thus should know that Riot breaks the game a few times a year, certain champions buffs/nerfs completely changes the landscapes while others are allowed to fly without changes and dominate or are dead for months on end. I imagine with a lot of those changes, they know what the repercussions will be and yet do it anyway.

Even if Riot wanted League to hit this true balanced state, it'd be impossible, there are simply to many variables for that to be able to happen.

Makarakarn2 votes

Not unpopular opinion but okay

WoollyWitch1 votes

[deleted]

Illabethe1 votes

Except if it was, we wouldn't have champs averaging 60%-53% across all elos.

We would have PLAYERS averaging 60% across elos, while the champs themselves would float at 50%.

Xela Syab1 votes

This game stopped being a strategy game about 4 years back. They've added too many levers and moving parts to make the game unfun for casual players and that's the main reason why people have been abandoning this game. It's gotten to the point where they are just funneling diamond players into challenger ranks just to fill queues.

Inari Fox Orrion1 votes

You may not appreciate this, but League of Legends is neither a fighting game nor a strategy game, it's a hybrid of both and that's the appeal. It needs to be balanced like both, or it loses appeal. Don't believe me? Take a look at Yasuo. He's a hybrid of the worst aspects of both a fighting game and a strategy game. He's a hard-counter to almost any ranged champion, and he's a champion that you can't beat if the player behind him is good at Yasuo.

League of Legends is a MOBA. The appeal of DotA, DotA2, LoL, etc. comes from the fact that it's a game where you can think and play. If you have weaknesses when it comes to the former? Pick Akali. If you have weaknesses when it comes to the latter? Pick Yorick. If you have weaknesses when it comes to both, or strengths when it comes to both? Pick Yasuo. Maybe you'll understand why people feed with him. :)

Illabethe1 votes

I think most people here understand the entire premise of what you just said.

However..... even at Masters, there are 20 champions who have higher than 55% win rate on AVERAGE, and 8 of those are above 60% on average. Lower game count considered (but still enough to be statistically significant), that still tells a story that defies the message you're trying to get across: That Riot is doing a good job balancing for the game structure and that players are to blame for what they perceive as imbalance.

Because that paradigm exists, either Riot has to be wrong, or Masters Tier players have to be wrong.

Something I'm assuming here: Masters Tier players are flexible, and play a variety of champions into a variety of situations, and have the best possible team synergies planned that you can have in Solo/Duo Queue.

Yet they still result in 60% Win rate champions.

Those same 60% Win rate champions perform 53-54% in Plat and Below as well, meaning skill level, while dampening the effect of said champs, doesn't omit their influence.

If Talon gets into a game in any Elo, he's going to perform phenomenally. If Katarina gets into a game in any Elo, she takes an insane amount of tasking focus to beat, to the point that even if you DO shut her down, you have no tasking awareness left over for her team. In most cases, she generally cannot be killed before her damage scaling resets her.

(And then there's the fact they want Pyke to have a 1350 HP Threshold on his Ult now, double the gold for a successful ult, in exchange for removing aoes. Or the fact they want shield breaking on a champion that 1 shots anyone who doesn't HAVE a shield. That's not balance. That's avoid me the entire game or you will die. period.)

Śhunpo1 votes

Mordekaiser ? You're essentially saying that in order to balance League there should always be a single pick or multiple picks that are so prevalent you NEED to pick around them no matter what to win; assuming you don't just ban them away just so the game actually feels healthy, fun, interactive and dynamic?

Sorry, I'm not buying it. If this is your argument then honestly they should just revert Ryze back to his URF mode rework and bring back Abyssal Scepter, because even if they did that there would still be more diversity than when Mordekaiser is left unbanned. Oh, and let's also bring back Akali's "Obscure" mechanic, un-nerf Irelia and un-nerf Poppy, because hey why not, you think oppressive picks are fun for the whole family!

You want my two cents on how to balance the game? Stop releasing new champions that introduce new and broken mechanics/features to the game, stop making drastic changes to items and fix the champs who are already in the game. How do you do that last part? By reverting Runes Reforged and removing aspects of specific champion's kits which are inherently unhealthy and unfun to face, such as Vayne's new 50% CDR reduction on Tumble during ult. Honestly, it's not that difficult, Riot just has to not let the small children inside of them overpower them and bring about the next "League of Black Cleavers".

GigglesO4 votes

What’s funny is all this crazy shit only became a big problem when beefy champs couldn’t just frontline anymore.

People complained that ignoreable tanks were too hard to kill. So instead now we have tanks with too high of damage and everyone else with too high of damage too.

I used to occasionally lose games because I built too many tank items and then the enemy would just ignore me. I didn’t die but I also didn’t deal the enemy any damage.

Leetri1 votes

No, that's not at all what they're saying. What they're saying is that you shouldn't be able to pick X champion every single game and expect to do just as well no matter what. If they have a bunch of tanks you shouldn't be able to just pick LeBlanc and do just as well as if you were against a team full of squishies. You complain about the same champions being picked all the time. You know why that happens? Because they're good all the time no matter what. Not necessarily strong, but at least decent. Against a tank? Pick X. Against an assassin? Pick X. Against a mage? Pick X. They're full AD? Pick X. They're full AP? Pick X. By making champions more niche and having things they're good at (such as busting shields) and things they're bad at it forces people to pick different things if they wanna have a larger chance to win. You don't need hard counters where you auto-win/lose, but at least soft counters so you have to vary your picks up depending on the teams.

Śhunpo1 votes

Yes, and when you have champs like Mordekaiser as he is now there are NO (consistent) COUNTERS. You've essentially created a pick that can be flexed into mid, top and jungle, all while being great in all of those roles and losing basically no matchups outside of niche picks which don't do anything outside of early game.

SAILOR SATANA1 votes

I wanted so much to upvote this cause you said an objective truth but..."unpopular opinion" ruined it :/

chipndip11 votes

[{quoted}](name=SAILOR SATANA,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vKvAfyNH,comment-id=0019,timestamp=2019-07-06T14:48:40.790+0000)

I wanted so much to upvote this cause you said an objective truth but..."unpopular opinion" ruined it :/

Look at some of the replies in this thread. It's not exactly a popular opinion.

SAILOR SATANA1 votes

{quoted}

It's not exactly a popular opinion.

You are still upvoted, so is not that unpopular either, but that wasn't my point anyway. My point was: "Please, please, PLEASE, stop starting your threads with "Unpopular opinion", please. You won't be more special that way, you look just like someone desperately saying "See? I am speaking my mind even if many of you will disagree, how cool is that???", that's just lame. You don't need to state it something like that at all (even when is true), is a fucking dumb trend, pls mercy".

Srsly: u said an absolute truth and I couldn't agree more but...that thing is SO cringe.

chipndip11 votes

[{quoted}](name=SAILOR SATANA,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vKvAfyNH,comment-id=001900000000,timestamp=2019-07-06T17:47:13.852+0000)

You are still upvoted, so is not that unpopular either, but that wasn't my point anyway.

It's almost split down the middle, 25 (including myself) to 20. If this was a popular opinion I'd be upvoted through the roof rn.

Srsly: u said an absolute truth and I couldn't agree more but...that thing is SO cringe.

Are you here to discuss the thread or are you here to discuss my title? Honestly, you getting into a discussion about my title rather than the content of the thread is the real cringe here, if anything. How do two words bother you that much?

SAILOR SATANA1 votes

{quoted}

It's almost split down the middle

So, not unpopular at all.

Are you here to discuss the thread

I already did it, you were 100% right on your point, nothing more to add about it.

How do two words bother you that much?

Cause they are just pretentious BS to feel "special" and "cool". I can throw the question back at you: why you felt the need to add them? To specify that your was "an unpopular opinion" (Btw: 90% of the "unpopular opinion threads" are upvoted like hell)? What added to your original point other than a "look at me, I am not like the others!"?

GigglesO1 votes

Meanwhile same complaint since season 3 tanks just got too much damage while not being beefy enough.

JOOTAROOO1 votes

meanwhile Riot: Why don't we buff Renekton so he can destroy ur shield whole?

PhantomPrankster1 votes

implying this isnt a popular thought

chipndip11 votes

{quoted}

Seeing how this post is 28 : 25, I'd like for you guys to stop pretending like everyone thinks this way.

PhantomPrankster1 votes

{quoted}

Seeing how this post is 28 : 25, I'd like for you guys to stop pretending like everyone thinks this way.

because you are in a place where you get banned for telling people the behavior they do is shitty

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