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87 Comments

Sdars13 votes

Cho'gath has been getting nothing but buffs for years now. Every "nerf" they make to him comes with a boatload of buffs that more than compensate.

Zero Skill Tank13 votes

Right, which is why he sat on one of the lowest winrates for past few months...

[zombie-brand-facepalm]

Xonra3 votes

Yes and now that he has better synergy with items instead of him being good but having worse itemization, suddenly he was able to sling-shot up. The guy isn't wrong.

Malza12 votes

Those look far higher than prehotfix Singed and he's more annoying to play against cause of the 1 hit kills with ult

Where's the hotfix homie?

TwitchInMyPants5 votes

{quoted}

Those look far higher than prehotfix Singed and he's more annoying to play against cause of the 1 hit kills with ult

Where's the hotfix homie?

Gotta get Cho into worlds somehow, kappa

AmenPerson11 votes

Singed had a 5% pick rate. Cho'Gath Jungle has a less then 1% pick pick rate.

The problem wish Singed was that anyone picking up Singed was winning.

With Cho'Gath, it's just the people who know how to play Cho'Gath that are winning. He needs no nerfs honestly.

https://i.gyazo.com/6a354922884fffdce2663f2eacf5b45d.png

Malza9 votes

{quoted}

Singed had a 5% pick rate. Cho'Gath Jungle has a less then 1% pick pick rate.

The problem wish Singed was that anyone picking up Singed was winning.

With Cho'Gath, it's just the people who know how to play Cho'Gath that are winning. He needs no nerfs honestly.

https://i.gyazo.com/6a354922884fffdce2663f2eacf5b45d.png

Yet Cho was still being picked way more in Diamond 1+ than Singed is/was.

Xonra2 votes

I dunno I've yet to lose against a (new) Singed, and I've yet to win against a (new) Cho. Terribly small sample size with one person, but Singed is just "ignore him, he won't kill you anyways" champ that is annoying as balls. Cho one shots anyone that isn't a tank, and still doesn't die.

Zero Skill Tank10 votes

ChoGath needs nerfs, but overbuffed Cho is not nearly as game ruining as overbuffed Singed, so I guess Riot prefered to wait and see if people can adapt to new Cho and learn to counter him.

Penns43 votes

Idk Singed is kinda annoying, but Cho presses Stoneplate and then point and click deletes a carry.. xd

DoktorKaiser14 votes

If Cho gets to a carry he might as well be rewarded with a kill, he is BY FAR the easiest champion to kite, I mean he takes half the fucking lane lol

hi ace5031 votes

Flashes

Righteous glory

Knock up and slow in his kit

Huge amount of health and shielding with locket

If he really wants to get somewhere, he will.

DoktorKaiser29 votes

You cant put flash as an argument when enemy ADC also has flash as a summoner spell. His Q is hard to land on any decent player and all other things you mention are literally walking to enemy. Kite. Him. You cant miss CC on him even if you are the worst player in the world. Now if you dont have much CC then its your teams fault for picking the comp. I am not saying that Cho is fine now, his E is broken, but if you get eaten as an ADC you deserve it 150%

Pierce The Veal27 votes

Shhh, opposing your adc overlords will only get you downvotes.

Torterra622 votes

while you shouldnt put flash in that arguement righteous glory is enough to get you close to the enemy carry

Votable Jester9 votes

Actually flash does have relevance because of two things.

1: Cho can queue his ult so that even if the enemy adc flashes in response, it will have already started (and thus hit them even after flash).

2: Cho can silence, preventing them from flashing.

Orangesilk3 votes

His R is melee range targeted, this means the animation hasn't even STARTED before he has a valid target, this queuing thing is literal bullshit, lying through your teeth. However, it, like most point-and-click instant abilities doesn't break from the enemy flashing, it's like flashing out of an auto attack.

Votable Jester2 votes

So yeah, you queue it up and flash into range of the enemy. They flash quickly in response, but the animation has already started because you set it to cast as soon as you were in range. You hit them and they blew flash.

What part of my comment was lying? My point was the ult hits (likely killing them) even if they flash in response. I never sayed they weren't able to flash during his ult. It will just hit them regardless of the flash (like an auto attack as you said).

Jet Sett2 votes

Once Cho is big enough his Q is only hard to hit on champs with decent amounts of MS. Otherwise it's practically free on most anyone.

LiteUpSketchers6 votes

{quoted}

Once Cho is big enough his Q is only hard to hit on champs with decent amounts of MS. Otherwise it's practically free on most anyone.

His Q doesn't scale with size tho.

junglerboy162 votes

Actually, you can count flash to a certain extent for the simple reason that the Cho is flashing when they choose to, and the target champion has to flash reactively. Also, instantly repositioning can make predicting his placement for aiming skill shots and CC slightly more challenging. Basically an offensive flash has more benefit than a defensive flash because it gives one player greater agency over the situation than the other, by however small a margin it may actually be. The less skilled the two players are, the bigger the advantage to the aggressor, since the target has a greater chance of surviving the faster they can react and analyze the situation.

It is an incredibly small advantage, but it still effects the outcome in Cho's favor.

Rins Thigh Socks1 votes

{quoted}

You cant put flash as an argument when enemy ADC also has flash as a summoner spell. His Q is hard to land on any decent player and all other things you mention are literally walking to enemy. Kite. Him. You cant miss CC on him even if you are the worst player in the world. Now if you dont have much CC then its your teams fault for picking the comp. I am not saying that Cho is fine now, his E is broken, but if you get eaten as an ADC you deserve it 150%

Flash is 400 units.

Cho'Gath R is 175.

Unless you're Trist, Cait, or Kog'Maw, you literally cannot autoattack Cho'Gath without putting yourself in his Flash R range.

Which means the only time your argument holds true is when Cho'Gath has high latency and can't queue up spells properly or if for some reason Cho'Gath is stunned for the entirety of the fight while you burn through 10-13k HP.

Void Kaiju8 votes

The champions that make him useless are all out of meta :) Vayne, Kog'Maw, etc. The tankbusters are out of favor in their respective lanes and the tanks are starting to come back into fashion so stuff like this will happen. A chogath will feel completely worthless against a good kogmaw or vayne.

Krinu3 votes

This. Hell, you don't even need a specialized anti-tank character to shred him. Any attack speed based carry with a BotRK will work.

Standgrounding3 votes

Ashe slows his chase/escape too, stopping him right in his tracks.

DuskDaUmbreon2 votes

Not really. He can just flash-protobelt, and do an instant 8x times Ashe's possible max health.

AmetDeCrypt2 votes

unless she builds thornmail

DuskDaUmbreon1 votes

Thornmail wouldn't matter. Cho'gath's ultimate isn't an auto attack. And Grievous wounds wouldn't matter, anyways.

AmetDeCrypt2 votes

(it's a joke)

DuskDaUmbreon1 votes

Ooohhhh....

I'm stupid. :^ )

AmetDeCrypt1 votes

so am I! what a coincidence.

Fear the Kayn6 votes

Cho is immobile as hell though. Singed is basically a Kenyan with gas strapped onto his back.

Dark Nephthys6 votes

Maybe it's because people are still learning all the new changes with Chogath and underestimated that his E is actually useful now outside of just pushing waves. Give people time to learn how much stronger he got and then he'll drop down a bit again and then eventually become trash tier again that almost no one plays. Cho you can escape from and kite him, Signed was running so fast and all he needed to do was hit you with his slow and you can't escape from him. Yes if Cho gets on you, you probably can't really escape either but Cho has a much harder time getting to you for that.

Also Cho Jungle's win rate means nothing unless you show it's play rate. If a champion has an insanely high win rate but basically nothing for play rate then it's not broken but just only their mains are playing them there (that or it could be broken but no one knows about it yet).

Danjeng5 votes

Probably because there are people who stream playing Singed, but nobody really does Cho'Gath gameplay footage (that I know of). So Singed is definitely going to draw more attention.

Cho's been getting multiple buffs throughout the patches, which puts him in a pretty strong spot. Nerfs, such as making his W apply after cast, are compensated by even bigger buffs. E buffs are really good. Anyway, those SInged hotfix nerfs were pretty stupid. If he's too powerful for a whole patch, then nerf him, but hotfix is too rash.

Xonra3 votes

I think it is more a case of, Singed stuff was obvious for what was going to be strong from the changes. Cho however took a sec for Cho players to catch on trying to play him the same way at first, then it spiked when they had the "oooooooooooo!" moment.

LyingOnLine5 votes

Only real difference is the time lag. Singed got hotfixed because his win/playrate spiked immediately. Cho has taken a couple days to build up steam, and now they've got another problem on their hands.

IPromiseTomorrow4 votes

It's ok Yasuo threads shall take the spotlight cho mains Jk

Seriously though with this high WR idk if cho will recieve nerfs soon tbh

He's been weak for so long

And Riot isn't predictable with nerfs tbh Remember Ivern? He took a month to nerf with a 56%WR

SenpaiOnTheRun7 votes

Remember when Singed was weak for 2 years and then got hotfix nerfed the day after he got buffs?

koshkyra4 votes

Ive been saying ChoGath is broken for years now and yet all i hear is "kite you silver idiot"

SloaneWolf24 votes

{quoted}

Ive been saying ChoGath is broken for years now and yet all i hear is "kite you silver idiot"

http://imgur.com/tiAELeQ

Velzard of Koz2 votes

People consider him broken now possibly due to rework to his ultimate and maybe synergy with certain Tank Update items.

FlameanatorX2 votes

But no one (except a couple random scrubs) even thought he was broken until his most recent buff which mostly just changed his E.

Like yeah, if he gets decent ult stacks and buys Garg Stoneplate late game he can one-shot anyone who doesn't kite him, but that's not actually very game changing most of the time. Doesn't work if he gets beaten early game, or if the game ends really quickly, or if you kite him, OR if you have enough peel/shields/defensive itemization that it doesn't actually one-shot you anymore.

Junkο3 votes

I still don't understand why they hotfixed nerfed Singed on literally the first day after the patch.

LyingOnLine5 votes

Because he was obviously busted.

Xonra5 votes

While you are 100% correct, we've seen other champs be quite obviously (and hilariously) busted the same, but ignored. Same with items (cough item 3147 on Jayce is bs now cough)

Divewing2 votes

{quoted}

(cough item 3147 on Jayce is bs now cough)

FTFY

Press R to run3 votes

This is actually quite funny to me. I'm a Singed main, but I have been spamming an e-focused cho'gath build the past few days just because of how broken it feels. I have won 6/7 of the games, 5 of which I was quite fed.l I actually went 28/10 in the best one. All you needs is a triforce and tank items, and you're basically unstoppable.

zaire901 votes

Faced a cho earlier today and that was just the scariest thing ive ever seen. Does he still drop in size after being killed because we killed him (his dead body took up the full lane at this point) but he didnt seem to decrease in size eat all

WolfBV6 votes

Cho no longer decreases in size because he cannot lose stacks.

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