What's better? Counter-play or Balance?

SymbolicFear·Dec 14, 2015·1 votes·428 views

Just vote below which you think is more important.

8 Comments

TehNACHODec 14, 20152 votes

As if the two are mutually exclusive.

To be honest though, I'd much prefer a balanced game that requires player skill to come through than a game where every champ has similar skill curves and the game is decided entirely on the numbers and macro strategy of the game.

SymbolicFearDec 17, 20151 votes

Thank you, this is exactly how I feel about it. I feel as though the overly simple champions have much higher numbers and are more impactful than those who have massive skill caps. Mostly due to the tanks lately. When a tank can solo an entire team, there is a massive problem with that.

ScurvyNaveDec 14, 20151 votes

I honestly can't vote for either because I believe that counter-play is a fact one has to consider when thinking of balance and is therefore part of it.

Counter-play is what we as players of the game can control. I can be clever and fight Illoai from range or what for her cool downs before getting close to fight. Thats counter-play, you're countering the play style of another champion by your own wits,knowledge and skill.

Balance: is the raw champions and tools that riot gives us, the player, to work with. Generally some tools are better at somethings than others. A hammer and a wrench can be used to hit things but a hammer does a better job. Just like how A Caitlyn adc is a better tower taker than a Twtich adc.

Riot balances the game but Counter-play is on our shoulders. Riot just has to make sure we have room to counter whatever nonsense champion design comes up with next.

SymbolicFearDec 17, 20151 votes

The issue is that Riot isn't balancing the game. They are focusing entirely on counter-play. They only update the game for the top 1% of players where they should be updating the game for at the very least the top 25%. Counter-play in my opinion isn't a substitute for balance. Lets imagine there is a new juggernaut champion who has a passive that kills any champion within 300 units of it after 5 seconds yet has no gapclosers and has a max movement speed of 350. It may be overly susceptible to kiting, but in a game where champions have stuns and roots with such long durations, that champion would be massively overpowered, not to mention the fact that due to it being top lane, 90% of top laners would be forced to completely give up as they are melee and can't get close enough to farm or harass.

I honestly believe that juggernauts are ruining the game due to their massive strengths and their only having the weakness of kiting.... Except for Darius cause he just instantly deletes any ADC due to his pull.

The game should be centered on the skill of the individual, not the power of the champion they play.

ScurvyNaveDec 22, 20151 votes

I agree, they are focusing too much on counter play which isn't an excuse for balance only a small tool for it.

Jungle Lux GodDec 14, 20151 votes

In my opinion counterplay is much better than balance.

Any developer can design a game where its characters have counterplay associated with them. No developer can design a game where its characters are balanced. That alone makes it better to have counterplay than balance because it's something Riot can control while balance cannot be controlled by Riot.

SymbolicFearDec 17, 20151 votes

I don't feel the same. I find that counter-play isn't a substitute for balance. Yes, counter-play needs to be a factor, but not the main point of champion design. Riot needs to be balancing the game better rather than just creating champions that are able to 1v5 easily when ahead. For example, the juggernauts. Darius has a pull that makes slaughtering ADCs incredibly easy when his only weakness is kiting. Kinda defeats the purpose. League of Legends is more about who has the stronger champions rather than who has more skill lately.

Jungle Lux GodDec 18, 20151 votes

I agree that counterplay isn't a substitute for balance. Yes, Riot does need to be balancing their game, but at the same time counterplay needs to be the forefront of champion design simply because you can't design champions to be balanced on a large scale the same way they can be given counterplay.

It's physically impossible to balance a game with over 120+ champions, but it is possible to give all 120+ champions sufficient counterplay that they can afford to be a little bit imbalanced because the better player will still win regardless.