The problem with CertainlyT

LVL 5 PORO··37 votes·2,813 views

Let me just say, this isn't a "lets bash CertainlyT" thread. If that's what you want, please leave. Instead, I want to discuss and highlight the common problem between all of his creations. They have all been described as cancerous, toxic, and bad. But why? Truthfully, I think CT is a good(?) designer, his concepts are original, but I don't think they are ever executed well. The common theme between all of his creations, in my opinion, is that they are all 100% unfun to play against. At their core they are unique and revolutionary, but they show little regard for the nature of the game. I think everything he makes would be top notch, if at the end, he asked, "is this fun/fair to other people?" No? Scrap it. Yes? Keep it.

I think Tahm is a similar case. Is he overpowered? I don't think so. But his ability to save a carry is infuriating to play against. Which has left many people asking for nerfs. Not being able to eat CCed targets, less tankiess, less damage, etc...

What do you guys think about CT and his creations?

88 Comments

Keevalroy35 votes

He's produced some of the most obnoxious, obscenely toxic, unfair, broken, and flat out bullshit creations in League, and they were only getting worse as time went on and his ego continued to swell. The only, and I mean ONLY thing I've ever liked from him so far is giving Hurricane a reason to exist on someone other than Kayle with Kalista, even though I don't consider her a champion because nothing that poorly designed belongs on the roster.

I hesitate with my stance on his Caitlyn project, and it hurts to say it looks promising, but maybe he's actually learned how to read and accept player feedback for a change. I still don't trust him, I hate everything he's created with a burning passion, I despise his impact on design where Riot sees value in loading champions with 36 passives as a standard, as well as his attitude of "I'm right, you're wrong, deal with it, I'm a genius," but I can hope that he's in a sense grown up as a designer with Caitlyn's rework being absent of all of his toxic trademarks.

A Miss Fortune10 votes

I agree, I think CertainlyT's past of making toxic, overloaded, broken, and overpowered champions makes it difficult to look at Caitlyn or Graves and say that they'll be balanced. Aside from that text error where Caitlyn had a 90 second snare I think she looks balanced but I'm afraid she'll become even more oppressive in lane than she is now.

Vistha Kai2 votes

I'm pretty sure a trap lasting 2 seconds with 90 second snare was a typo, more than anything.

ADepressedLeona2 votes

{quoted}

He's produced some of the most obnoxious, obscenely toxic, unfair, broken, and flat out bullshit creations in League, and they were only getting worse as time went on and his ego continued to swell. The only, and I mean ONLY thing I've ever liked from him so far is giving Hurricane a reason to exist on someone other than Kayle with Kalista, even though I don't consider her a champion because nothing that poorly designed belongs on the roster.

I hesitate with my stance on his Caitlyn project, and it hurts to say it looks promising, but maybe he's actually learned how to read and accept player feedback for a change. I still don't trust him, I hate everything he's created with a burning passion, I despise his impact on design where Riot sees value in loading champions with 36 passives as a standard, as well as his attitude of "I'm right, you're wrong, deal with it, I'm a genius," but I can hope that he's in a sense grown up as a designer with Caitlyn's rework being absent of all of his toxic trademarks.

This is kinda what I picture CertainlyT in the office late at night, wondering why people hate his champions

http://ib4.huluim.com/video/40007255?size=476x268&region=us

Mordepool7 votes

{quoted} as well as his attitude of "I'm right, you're wrong, deal with it, I'm a genius," but I can hope that he's in a sense grown up as a designer with Caitlyn's rework being absent of all of his toxic trademarks.

Just think about who he just reworked if you don't recall the reaction from the community. Mordekaiser fanbase verbally abused him and rightly so ( not saying verbal abuse is ok, I'm saying we had very legitimate concerns and feedback that was ignored). If he didn't grow up from the whole Community showing him he was wrong. Well that would be depressing.

He did come out and apologize which was a step in the right direction but Even that showed his arrogance by blaming PBE testers

SnugglePuggle9415 votes

I hate him, as he has produced the most cancerous, overloaded, stupid champions in the game. Especially Yasuo. Sure, they can be marked as "creative," but are still stupid.

ZzEslIolZQ10 votes

Has never made a champ that hasn't broken the balance of the game. Therefore he's a good designer. Yeah go out of your way to praise him. CT is a terrible designer. Innovation means producing even under limitations, CT doesn't have limitations, he just does w/e the fuck he wants.

Naramiel9 votes

Most of his champions are so unfun to play against that it feels like he started the design with that goal in mind. He definitely makes some champions that are fun to play AS, and that have some interesting ideas in them, but it seems odd that Riot never even tries to consider what effect they'll have on the game as a whole.

Shroom Junkie8 votes

He makes them fun but overloads them in the process.

Slamurai Jack7 votes

You'd be surprised how hard it is to make champions that don't feel like bullshit to play against. When was the last time that honestly happened? Velkoz maybe?

ProfDrDeath3 votes

...And even Vel'Koz sometimes feels like pure unrefined horsecrap to play against.

Slamurai Jack6 votes

I'm still honestly of the opinion that Vel'koz is overall the strongest champion released since the end of season 3 but is skill gated hard enough that it isn't very obvious. But he honestly just feels absurdly strong to me. His kill pressure in lane is on par with assassins, his self peel and retaliation is more than enough to deter most attackers, he has a strong laning phase overall, he's arguably the strongest mid game mage in all of League, and he doesn't really fall off either. He's seen pretty limited LCS play and the only time we've seen him in recent memory was by TIP Gate. And I'll be honest, as a frequent Vel'koz player myself, he clearly didn't really know what he was doing. His combos were sloppy, his positioning has horrendous, and his ults were baffling.

Gentzer2 votes

SBENU played it in LCK against Faker's Azir and did WORK!

SBENU still lost but that was more because the team threw the game by having their carries be caught HORRIBLY out of position.

Kitten of Evil2 votes

His ultimate is also not a projectile Yasuo and he can kite absurdly well. I love my little void monster if for no other reason than the tears of enemy Yasuos and juggernauts.

48983507DEL11 votes

Braum was okay. I forget if he came before or after Vel'Coz tho. Bard was also fair; he's like Shaco tho, in the right hands he feels like he has no counterplay, when really he has tons.

V3rdAnt6 votes

I want you to read what you type before you post it. From a game design standpoint, nothing he's made has been in the same universe as balanced. Also, what you say makes no sense. First you say he's a good designer, then you go on to outline exactly why he's a garbage designer.

"I don't think they are ever executed well" "They are all 100% unfun to play against" "they show little regard for the nature of the game"

This is why he should have been fired a long time ago. Also, Tahm is broken as fuck.

t0ad54 votes

{quoted}

I want you to read what you type before you post it. From a game design standpoint, nothing he's made has been in the same universe as balanced. Also, what you say makes no sense. First you say he's a good designer, then you go on to outline exactly why he's a garbage designer.

"I don't think they are ever executed well" "They are all 100% unfun to play against" "they show little regard for the nature of the game"

This is why he should have been fired a long time ago. Also, Tahm is broken as fuck.

If they were smart enough to have canned him, think how well the game could be going. Heck, I bet Morde wouldn't have been removed at all, if they removed CertainlyTerribad.

Excitidly Insane2 votes

Development

Tahm Kench was designed by Zenon.[1]

Can't blame CertainlyT for Tahm.

ZT Xperimentor6 votes

I agree he has good ideas, but he needs to learn to spread them out, instead of jamming 7 abilities into a single champion, he could make 3 out of the set. Yasou is an obvious example, having 3 passives ontop of 4 abilties; at least kench isn't as over-bearing or overloaded. Is kench balanced? Compared to his other champions (kalista, yasou, ext) yes; compared to the champions that've been around since the beginning (brand, mundo, ext), no.

Zair Umbras1 votes

3 passives..? Shield and double crit... What's the third?

Mael bro10 votes

[{quoted}](name=Zair Umbras,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=tRWjYbHr,comment-id=000b0000,timestamp=2015-11-06T13:55:22.657+0000)

3 passives..? Shield and double crit... What's the third?

Every time Yasuo is played in the game, the itemitem 3087 is automatically placed in users inventory.

ZT Xperimentor4 votes

His ultimate gives him an extra +50% armor penetration that stacks with any he's already gotten from his; runes, masteries, & items. Which lasts for somewhere around 15 seconds, and is on a 30 second cooldown. One of the easiest champions to reach true damage potential without actually having it, not to mention he get's guaranteed critical hits with 2 items. Yeah tanks are insta-killed just as fast as carries are facing him, he needs some meaningful nerfs.

Keevalroy5 votes

he needs some meaningful nerfs.

He needs a full scale rework is what he needs, but I'm all for nerfs until then.

Zair Umbras2 votes

His ult is not a passive on top of the 50% only affecting BONUS armor, similar to the new LW. He's not the first to have a secondary effect on his ult. Ali has huge damage resist, plus it removes CC, and it gives him a large amount of Attack Damage (most don't ever notice that), Cho's true damage ult also gives him health or heals him when he kills enemy champs now, Galio's ult taunts then does a very large amount of damage, Lulu's give a large health boost and knocks up every enemy unit around her target, Ryze gains CDR passively from his R on top of his abilities becoming AoE AND he gets a decent amount of spell vamp, Nasus's gives him health and shreds people's health around him by a % and gives him AD for doing such, Vayne get a large AD steroid from hers on top of a 2s CD stealth and increased movement speed towards champions...

I can really go on when it comes to that. Tanks aren't instakilled by him anyways. Ninja Tabi and Randuin's can both reduce his damage by 10%, that's already after taking into effect that his Q does 75% damage on crit and his regular AA's only do 90%.

ZT Xperimentor2 votes

Hmm who has bonus armor, oh tanks. You're also claiming these buffs to tanks are going to stick from the pbe and make it to live; which is laughable at best considering riot said it was the marksmen update. You also missed the point of the original comment's sarcasm if you've never played against a good yasou.

That -10% auto-attack damage & -10% critical hit damage is negligible; when half his damage is from abilities (his dashes & poke/tornado apply on-hit-effects like criticals but don't count as auto-attacks as seen against a thornmail), and the fact that the infinity edge (which nearly yasou rushes for 2~3rd item) nearly triples his critical hit damage instead of just under double. As well as a blade of the ruined king, which deals nearly 10% of their current health as bonus on hit damage, which makes health shields more of a detriment than a benefit against him.

You're also ignoring the fact armor has significant diminishing returns while attack damage doesn't, it will always be biased in favor of the assassins & carries unless the tanks are oppressively buffed.

Zair Umbras2 votes

No, Yasuo's Q, just like Ezreal's and GP's Q's, counts as an AA and is reduced by both Ninja Tabi, Randuin's, and will proc Thornmail. The only time they won't is if his Q hits a target BEFORE the tank because it only applies on-hits on the first target.

You also seeem to neglect that most tanks have a base of 85-100 armor. 100 armor is 50% reduction and 80 is about 44% reduction. Even if you build no armor, his damage WILL be reduced by 40-50% just by your base armor unless he has ArP in his runes or he builds a Youmuu's.

IE also does not triple his critical hit damage. His current crit damage is 180 and then with an IE, it goes up to 225%. That's an overall boost of 45% of your total AD added to crit.

BotRK is being nerfed to do 6%, down from 8%....

Yasuo's damage is never from his Dash anymore ever since they nerfed it from 100% boost to 50% boost in damage.

Soooo yeeeaaaah. Tanks are inherently good against Yasuo regardless of if they build anymore armor than Randuin's and Ninja Tabi since that's 20% reduced damage on his Q and AA's which already only do 75% and 90% when critting, so his AA's do 225% of his total AD and his Q does 1.875 of his max AD. Reduce that by 20% and his AA's do 1.8xAD and his Q does 1.5x AD with 100% crit and an IE. Then tack on the 40% reduction after that since we'll say he's ignoring all 90 of that bonus armor from items and his R and his AA's do 1.08x AD and his Q's do .9x AD on crits.

Honestly, Tanks can destroy Yasuo if they had the sustain, but most of them do not have the sustain nor do they build properly against him. Randuin's is rarely purchased because people forget it affects his Q and who buys Tabi anymore? Nearly no one because they don't realize how powerful it is.

ZT Xperimentor1 votes

Uh huh, got a video to back up those claims?

Zair Umbras1 votes

To back up that claim..? You need a video of a Rammus, Malphite, Darius, Garen, Mundo, Gragas, or some other random tank beating Yasuo with the new items to believe that my numbers that I calculated right in front of you that you are completely able to check for yourself?

I mean, if you don't believe me, you can run the numbers yourself and double check my math if you want to and even check the wikis and such.

ZT Xperimentor1 votes

Rammus & malphite are the last of the pure tanks left that are remotely viable anymore; since the juggernaut rework, garen & darious have become bruisers with their durability & damage buffs, but I haven't seen much of mundo though (shrug).

-Randuin's omen also got a heavy nerf when it gained the anti-critical passive; it used to be 80 armor but it got dropped to 60, health was lowered by 50, not as impactful but still a nerf. -Frozen heart also had a significant nerf; its armor was dropped from 100 to 90 which wasn't so bad, compared to the passive attack speed slow being dropped 5%. My beef with this item in particular was that even in it's hayday, it was just a 20% attack speed slow, which has an unnoticeable effect against most carries or assassins; carries were often out of range and assassins usually didn't rely on auto-attacks. Not to mention one of the weakest attack speed items still gave 20% (the zeal) which is roughly 1/3 the omen's cost, practically negates it. -Thornmail got nerfed as well, going from 20% reflection damage (which was again negated by a single item, bloodthrister) to 15% +25% of bonus armor. While it's nice tanks finally are getting rewarded for building defensive, it made this item worse than before unless you stacked over 300, but diminishing returns become clearly apparent around 200. Again only strong on champions with built-in armor steroids like rammus & malphite. -Sunfire cape has been more or less unchanged, lowered cost by a 100 I think was all that happened to it; either way good health but mediocre armor on top of an aoe damage passive. A favorite though not as useful as it's jungling counterparts or as powerful as other health/armor items. However I don't think it should be buffed as it would just be abused by bruisers instead of being helpful for tanks. -Deadman's plate has definitely become a core tank & bruiser item; giving more health than the omen, and more armor than the sunfire cape, while granting a conditional slow & movement speed buff. I'm surprised it wasn't nerfed like the 3 of the other core armor items. -ZZPortal uhhh well it has a nice boost to armor & magic resist with health regeneration, but the point-runner passive isn't that useful late game, and it's easy to loose the gate once someone finds it. I figured it'd be invisible until walked within melee range or something (shrug), anyway it's a lackluster item against ad assassins like yasou & zed.

I was dismissive of your previous comment as you sounded like you had a know-it-all attitude, and it was boring me (as several posts in the forums are like that :/ ). I believe your numbers, but there's a key flaw in the tank vs assassin duel; tanks can be just as money dependent for an item they can scale with, like an assassin (thornmail on thresh, sunfire on amumu, deadman on braum, omen on nautilus, ext.). It's not that tanks don't scale late game, it's that they can't keep up more often than not; most assassins can farm quickly or get kills quickly (which is why I hate yasou, he can do both with a fart), which gives them more items quicker. Tanks have pitiful farming and rarely can solo someone to death (unless it's a first-timer or a bad dive), so by the time they've finished rushing 1 item, most assassins & carries have 2 completed. And it'll only get worse until the assassins & carries have capped out, 6 fully completed items, then the tanks & supports start catching up. Like I said, armor (& magic resist) have significant diminishing returns (200 is ~65% reduction, but 300 is ~70%, have to dig up the post for exact numbers later), but attack damage doesn't; and when the infinity edge is nearly tripling the physical damage despite being a first item, it's painful for tanks to catch up. Sure tanks may not be insta-killed, but dying before they can even get a full rotation of their 3 primary abilities is still too fast. Feels like trying to stop a razor blade from cutting a paper towel, by defending it with a paper plate, know what I mean? I've heard they're increasing gold income across the board, but I still have the feeling tanks & supports are going to be the most behind.

Zair Umbras1 votes

With LW only affecting the bonus armor, tanks are actually doing incredibly well right now, especially since the only thing you really need to beat most AD champs is Tabi and Randuin's now. They can't ignore your 80-100 base, which is 40-50% reduction.

It wouldn't surprise me if ADC's started to build Cleaver over LW with how LW works now. If you're, say, Vi. Vi has about 85 base armor at 18. Say she has 9 from runes, Tabi, Randuin's, and a Deadman's. That's 159, so she'll have a total of 244 armor. Cleaver at max stacks reduces that by 30% for the entire team. That's about 170 armor left. The new LW does 40% of the bonus, meaning the bonus armor would total 95.4, equaling out to 175.4. With two armor items and Tabi, a Cleaver does more ArP than a LW. It's not until you get into THREE items that a Cleaver would be beaten.

Running numbers properly, Cleaver's 30% shred of the 85 base armor is 25.5. The 10% LW has above Cleaver would have to equal to the 25.5 armor. That means they need a minimum of 255 BONUS armor before LW becomes a BETTER item.

If we look at the squishiest of tanks, Sion, who sits at 70 armor the 10% would need to equate to 21, which is a bonus of 210 armor. That would require another armor item or for him to build bigger armor items like a FH and a Thornmail with Tabi.

Also, 200 is 2/3rds reduction. Equation is Total Armor divided by Total Armor Plus 100, TA/(TA+100), same formula is used for MR. The 300 would be 3/4ths, 75%.

Armor shred overall has been reduced dramatically and a tank that gets ahead at all -should- win their lane when against an AD champion since the AD champion (Not counting Fiora and her True Damage) can't just build a LW to counteract the LARGE amount of base armor a lot of tanks have. Like Renekton has a base of 25 that goes up to 90 at max level, gaining 3.8 per level. Forces AD champs to get the Cleaver just to do damage to these merciless tanks and while Cleaver is a great item overall, it's going to become to new LW.

Really though. The 15% damage boost the new LW gives will be good against the armor stacking tanks since a tank with more than one armor item.

Just to run numbers to show about what you'd do between the new LW and a Cleaver... With 170 armor, you have about 63% reduction. At 175, you have about 64% reduction. One might think, 'Oh, only 1% difference! That's not a big deal!', well, the Lord Dominik's LW gives 15% boost in damage. That damage amp is reduced to 9.6% after armor. That means you'll be doing about 8.6% more damage with the new LW compared to a cleaver. About 9% more, but you have 15 AD less.

Now you look at your damage to squishies. They won't have much armor if any at all.... But Ahri has a base of 80 at level 18... Which your little LW won't be touching. A Cleaver would reduce that 80 though on top of reducing the 45 from Zhonya's. So 125 with the item, that's 87.5 armor taken into affect with the Cleaver, whereas the LW is 107. 87.5 is about 47% reduc. 107 is 51%. Difference of 4% and that's -if- they have Zhonya's.

Squishier target! Other ADC's. Draven gets up to 81 base armor... He likely won't have more than just the 9 from runes, bringing him up to 90. With a LW, you'll bring that down by 3.6, which is about 86.4. With a Cleaver, you can bring it down as far as 63. 86 is about 46%. 63 is about 39%. IF you have ArP in your runes, you can bring it down even further by another 19, which is always shiny.

I should note because of how reducs work too, if you have some one on your team with a Cleaver, plus a J4 or Wu, some one who can reduce the person's armor, well, the reduction is of the total armor, but it doesn't reduce the base, it adds a minus to the bonus armor, thus heavily reducing the effectiveness of your LW's 40%.

But yeah... Other than the return of League of Cleavers, I think Tanks will survive since they can just stack tons of health now. Can't even say GW will be a thing since that item is outclassed by a Cleaver damage-wise, plus it only effects self healing like Mundo, reducing it by 40% while he can gain 20% from Visage and 8% from the defensive masteries, meaning he'll be at about 129.6%, then reduced to 77.8%ish healing effectiveness. Whole loss of 22.3%. Instead of 60% of his healthbar, he'll heal for about 47% of his max health. Loss of 13%. You nulled 13% of his max health over the duration. You... like... You barely scratched it. >> Better off adding to your damage so his 86ish base armor, Tabi, and Randuin's aren't murdering your damage into oblivion while he sits there with 5k health, healing for about 2350 instead of 3k. You nulled all of 700 health with a GW. Want to know what you could've done over that 12s period of his healing to total 700 damage? Well, you could have bought a Cleaver or a Lord Dominik's and smacked him around, but instead you thought 650 health over TWELVE seconds was going to help more than increasing your damage to everyone, including him....

Seriously, 650 over 12s is only 54 per sec. You AA at about 1.5 per sec with the average build on most carries, give or take .2 per sec based on your AS item and boots and if you have an AS steroid or not.

Also. IE adds 50% of your AD to your crits. With 50% crit, that's a 25% average boost per AA. At 1.5 AA's per sec, that's about 37.5% of your AD per sec added on. Sounds like a lot? Well, 50% crit chance by itself gives 50% average boost to AA's, which is a 75% of your AD per sec added. That means the difference between IE and no IE is about 1.75x AD per sec compared to 2.125x AD per sec. With 400 AD with full build and such, that's about 700 DPS vs. 850. A difference of 150 DPS. Add in the 50% armor you won't be ignoring and it's a 75 DPS boost. IE is great, don't get me wrong, but it's not tripling your DPS. In fact, it's barely adding much after armor, lol. This is why Riot is comfortable with saying ER is a good replacement for IE on Marksmen with mana issues, i.e. Corki, Ez, Lucian, and Varus where as ADCs like Cait and Ashe have boosts based around crit damage (Their passives. Cait's headshot does more based on crit chance and crit damage, plus it can crit! She hurts pretty bad....)

On topic. Tanks are doing well. Yasuo won't really be a problem. He might excel against Thresh since the new ArP is additive (The 7% from masteries adds to the 40% from the new LW upgrades), so he can get upwards of 97% of bonus armor shred if it stays the way it does. If it becomes multiplicative, that'll mean he'll ignore 70%ish of armor. I haven't fully tested it given games don't last long enough to do such and customs are -still- limited to 2 people on the PBE. Either way, that's a sad Thresh going from 200 to almost 16 armor where as a 200 armor Vi would only be dropped to 85. lol.

I'll also note, AGAIN, Armor REDUCTIONS will affect the BASE armor when stacked on top of each other, but Armor Reductions do NOT stack well with the new LW since, again, Armor reductions will do the 30% off the base, but it'll add the negative to the Bonus armor, meaning the Vi who's dropped from 200 to 140 will only have 55 bonus armor for your new LW to affect whereas another reduc like J4 or Wu's Q would reduce the 140 by the 20+%.

Tanks surprisingly didn't get the shortest straw this season and ADC's, who are getting the biggest changes, are ACTUALLY getting boned since Cleaver isn't part of their normal kit nor do most of them scale all too incredibly with it whereas champs like J4, Wu, UrGod, Kayle, Xin, etc. who have reducers in their kits get to rip armor to shreds. All those reductions in armor to the popular tank items were all part of the master plan.

lofi n chillhop4 votes

i think that his flair is something that is interesting. but i think that there is definitely a feeling of... well, i just think that having one dude design a whole bunch of champs all in a row got stale. I feel like, there should a rotation of leading designers. three dudes/chicks who each get a turn to lead a champ design. and when they are off as lead designers, they are working with a balance team as a ""grunt" for the first rotation, then as a "grunt" designer with the current lead for the second. then right back to lead for the third. and so on.

Mael bro4 votes

http://postimg.org/image/7zav7mcf7/

Quality post mate. Playing against these guys can create some of the most miserable experience in this gameLulu Shaco Leblanc Zed JarvanIV Gnar Tristana

LVL 5 PORO1 votes

Lulu? How can you dislike that laugh? :D

ForgiveColour3 votes

i find it funny how recent champ kit are more cancerous than what certainlyt could make

The Whamboozler3 votes

Well yeah, they (And every other champ in the game) now has to COMPETE with the certainlyT champs. That's a tall order. Most older champs or weaker champs are so outclassed it's not funny and I would wager every new champ designed has their potential kit/stats measured up against CertainlyT's champs as they ask this question "Can X new champ hold up compared to yasuo/thresh/Morde/Darius/whomever". It would be foolish of them NOT to measure people around them, seeing as they dominate the meta often enough.

CertainlyT isn't even a real person... he is the embodiment of power creep.

Zair Umbras2 votes

CT has made Pre-rework Darius, Kalista, Thresh, Yasuo, and he helped with Zyra. Zyra has never been considered overbearing, though Riot seems to have thought otherwise. Yasuo's kit isn't all that overbearing given the fact his crits only do 90% and his Q only does 75% on crits on top of his E having a 6s CD on each target unaffected by CDR or AS. His W is 'slightly' annoying, but you could say the same thing about Braum, yet you won't find a thread complaining about Braum.

I mean, out of all of CT's creations, the only ones that are actually unfun to play against are Kalista when you don't have targeted CC like a Naut or Ryze and Thresh who makes everyone want to cut their wrists because he's got 3 different CC's (Q, E, and that R's 99% slow may as well be a root) on top of a shield and the ability to bring allies to him, plus free AP for no real reason other than 'Why not?'. Yasuo in lane isn't hard to beat and in team fights he's near worthless unless his team has knock ups for him to follow up on. Old Darius was just a lane bully who got kited. Zyra was never overbearing, as I mentioned, and has been nerfed into oblivion despite not having all that powerful of a kit overall.

I dunno, maybe it's just me, but I personally would rather face any of CT's creations over Brackhar's original Tree Trunk Spear Nidalee, GypsyLord's Vi/Ekko, Guinsoo's original Soraka/SivirTheOneVFiveGoddess(I mean her original kit with her toggle W)/NewFiora, Ezreal's Annie/Teemo/Vlad/APYi/KassaWinThe90%Ban/IRELIA, Meddler's Elise, or Xypherus's Riven.

Seriously. >> Ezreal has the worst track record of them all. AP Yi, KassaWin, Satan, Annie, and Irelia.

Retillin2 votes

Release Zyra was VERY overbearing. It was due to high numbers, but still. She was scary strong on release.

Vekkna2 votes

Yasuo in lane isn't hard to beat and in team fights he's near worthless unless his team has knock ups for him to follow up on.

You do realize that he can ulti off of at least one ability from 47 different champs. That's almost 40% of the champs in the game. With 4 other teammates, there is an 87% chance that you will be able to combo off of at least one teammate assuming a pro rata pick rate.

t0ad52 votes

Deleting Morde was CertainlyTerribad.

A Liberal2 votes

Overloaded kits. Kalista should be two champions: One that binds with an ally, gets extra on hit effects with her bound (Sentinel passive), and another that is able to dash every auto attack. Also I don't like that e is just twitch's E but 1000x better, but still.

Keevalroy2 votes

another that is able to dash every auto attack.

In what universe is this a good idea? What the fuck possesses someone to put this on a champion?

A Liberal1 votes

In all honestly, without the rest of her kit it wouldn't be that bad.

Keevalroy2 votes

I completely disagree. At no point should a ranged champion have orb walking tacked onto the kit. You have now created a champion that plays the game for you. That's a giant red flag already, and now let's look to the thematic side of things because that's even more concerning. It makes sense to have a malevolent spirit of vengeance hop around like a kangaroo why?? That fits her theme_ how_??

CoffeeDave2 votes

I worry that one day they will announce that CertainlyT will Rework Nami . Point and click Triple bubbles, infinite bouncing Ebbs and Flows, AP Scaling that matches Ekko and a faster travel speed for her ult....you know what? on second thought...

manbearswine2 votes

[{quoted}](name=L Ange Noir Von,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=tRWjYbHr,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-11-06T03:02:09.522+0000)

Let me just say, this isn't a "lets bash CertainlyT" thread. If that's what you want, please leave. Instead, I want to discuss and highlight the common problem between all of his creations. They have all been described as cancerous, toxic, and bad. But why? Truthfully, I think CT is a good(?) designer, his concepts are original, but I don't think they are ever executed well.

The common theme between all of his creations, in my opinion, is that they are all 100% unfun to play against. At their core they are unique and revolutionary, but they show little regard for the nature of the game. I think everything he makes would be top notch, if at the end, he asked, "is this fun/fair to other people?" No? Scrap it. Yes? Keep it.

You're wrong,it is very easy to come up with something unique and original if you completely ignore gameplay(hell I can do it in 30 minutes),it's not that they are not executed well,it's that they are moronic down to their very core,think about it,what abilities yasuo has which are meaningfully unique? Well his ult,his w,and his e...all of which are incredibly stupid abilities,his w I don't need to explain,his e I probably need no explaining about either,his ult allows for exceptionally obnoxious gank patterns. Now what about kalista? Her truly unique abilities are her passive and to a lesser extent her ult,now her ult is actually probably mostly fine,but her passive is completely retarded. Thresh is basically "My identity is that I am overloaded out of my ass and great at everything",how is anything here good?

I cannot stress it enough: ANY MORON can think of a fun and unique kit if you completely ignore how it is to play against it,no seriously,go ahead,try it,I bet in 10 minutes you can think of something very fun and unique to play as,but horrible to play against.

The defining mechanics of his champions,and what makes them unique,are also what makes them cancerous shit,he's a horrible designer.

*note that thresh isn't as bad,he isn't toxic but crazy overloaded and horrendous to variety,but at least not toxic,also darius seems mostly fine by design,just his rework left him terribly overtuned,certainlyT just fails frequently and miserably compared to other designers,but not 100% of what he does is utter failure.

I think Tahm is a similar case. Is he overpowered? I don't think so.

Well...uh...you think wrong. Tham is very overpowered at the moment and pretty much everyone is aware of it. It's not just that,right now tham is meant to compete with thresh,and for a champion with an identity to compete with something as overloaded as thresh,you kinda need to be overbearing at the one thing you are good at,the refusal to nerf thresh combined with riot wanting to make every new release competitive has resulted in idiotic shit,but this one is on riot,not certainlyT.

But his ability to save a carry is infuriating to play against. Which has left many people asking for nerfs. Not being able to eat CCed targets, less tankiess, less damage, etc...

Well yes,right now he's just too strong,so yeah,should be nerfed somewhere.

BADxW0LF1 votes

In the case of Tahm, he is actually easily countered, especially if you have a blitz or a skarner who is intelligent enough to save their pulls for when you Devour the carry, you can pull them into the thick of battle and instantly shit on them both. Even morgana is a good counter to tahm with her shield. He is easily countered if your team isn't stupid/wasting of their abilities.

Retillin2 votes

If you are playing vs a Tahm as Blitz and you hold your Q to pull when he's grabbed the adc, then Tahm has won lane... It forces you to stop using your main ability to try and counter Tahm's counter ability. Ie he's a passive support that forces your engage support to be passive. If that happens then he won laning phase without DOING anything. And that's why so many people dislike him. And so many pros really dislike him.

Llanite1 votes

I like his works, there is obvious chemistry between abilities.

Everything is tightly packed and there is a 'flow' to follow. I am a martial art practitioner and her designs are more realistic and smoother than typical QWER champs.

People dislike him as his designs require decision making, and no, your ability to hit all 4 buttons in 0.5s isn't a true 'skill', a macro does that faster and more accurate.

Will some continue to hate him? Yes. Will some continue to love him? Yes. You are entitle to your opinion. Will he ever be out of the job? No, he makes the league becomes a better game.

Kaipop2 votes

Certainlyt isn't a gril..

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