What if Riot changed all her damage from magic damage to physical damage (Not the scaling, just the damage output). It would give her an interesting niche and it would mean that all those AD/MR items that are all the rage right now wouldn't be good against her. It would also give her a real niche that no other mage has.
TyrekGoldenspear22 votesI mean, getting hit by rocks would sound like it would deal physical damage as opposed to magic damage. It certainly wouldn't be completely out there.
SpecterVonBaren5 votesAnd we already have Corki who's a marksman that does mostly magic damage. Why not have a true physical damage mage?
50000000000000001 votesWe already have 
(artillery mage) and 
(battlemage).
That said, I wouldn't mind having more mixed damage within classes.
I'm not sure if this is going to be a buff, though. Taliyah wouldn't be able to buy any armor pen items, since she has no AD scaling, but all armor pen items have AD scaling on them. Black Cleaver passive sounds amazing (if the change were to happen), but she can't make use of that AD. Her only build option would be to stack AP without any penetration.
ReZisT Lust1 votesautos
50000000000000001 votesIf she build AD, her autos will do damage, but her spells won't. If she builds AD/lethality, her autos will do decent damage, and her spells will do pretty low damage.
The itemization just doesn't support a physical damage AP mage.
ReZisT Lust1 votes
i can see this being ok
SpecterVonBaren1 votesThe solution (Outside of just manning up and buying Last Whisper anyway) is to give her very small AD scalings on her spells so it's not just her autos.
SpearKitty2 votesI mean, getting hit by rocks would sound like it would deal physical damage as opposed to magic damage. It certainly wouldn't be completely out there.
But they're maaaaaaaaagic rocks. Duh.
50000000000000001 votes
what about her magic tentacles
ReZisT Lust1 votesher gods
SSJTribe1 votesAgreed, I think this would be awesome. On the same note, how about 
who punches the ground and headbutts people but deals magical damage.
ReZisT Lust1 votesbut the sense of touch is so magical
Teridax688 votesOn one hand, I like this, because it makes thematic sense and could open up some funny itemization paths and power quirks. On the other, I also feel that might be confusing, since AP is generally associated with magic damage and AD with physical damage, so an AP-scaling physical damage mage is going to lead to a lot of players stacking MR and realizing it's useless against her.
On a more abstract level, though, I think it's worth questioning what damage types really do right now: the conceit is that AP = magic damage = abilities = burst, and that AD = physical damage = basic attacks = DPS, but there are so many exceptions to those rules that everything sort of blends into each other. Some of the game's most prominent assassins, i.e. burst casters, are AD physical damage-dealers (e.g. Kha'Zix, Talon, Zed, etc.), and DPS champions like Cassiopeia, Ryze and Swain, plus heavy autoattackers like Ekko and Diana, are all AP. Some random abilities like Miss Fortune's Q, Tryndamere's E and Akali's E all deal AP-scaling physical damage, and AD champions like Corki and Shyvana are known for dealing a ton of magic damage, often more than physical.
At this point, it feels like damage types are allocated more based on which class the champion belongs to, than based on what could work on them, which isn't what's the most obvious, either, with cases like Alistar (who smacks you around with his bare hands and horns, but deals magic damage), Kindred (who kills you with magical death arrows, which deal physical damage) and Taliyah (deals magic damage to you with rocks) all being examples of function over form. It feels like some champions get allocated their damage type on a coinflip, and despite the heavy limitations this often imposes on what they can and can't build, there isn't really a good explanation for why they're intended to be built only one way and not the other. Even though League is a game deeply entrenched now in its damage types, plus its associated resists and counter-resists, I think it might be useful if Riot eventually reexamined that system and either set some clear guidelines to make it more intuitive and meaningful, or perhaps even got rid of it altogether.
ImNotGio3 votesDon't forget; Yorick's Ult deals magic damage, but scales with AD.
Teridax681 votesThis too, I missed quite a few actually (there's also Garen's ult, which is the only source of magic damage on a heavily physical damage-based character, plus Camille's on-hit magic damage on her ult, on top of her physical and true damage, though neither technically scale). This just reinforces the idea that damage types are all over the place, and while I guess that some are added to avoid champions getting counterbuilt by armor too hard, it just makes itemization more confusing as a whole, particularly since often those damage types have been added rather gratuitiously (Camille, again, doesn't need armor-ignoring magic damage when she already has true and max health damage at her disposal).
ImNotGio2 votesThere's also Morde, with some of the most random scalings ever. Mace of Spades: First/Second Strike: (+ 50 / 60 / 70 / 80 / 90% AD) (+ 60% AP) Third Strike: (+ 100 / 120 / 140 / 160 / 180% AD) (+ 120% AP) Siphon of Destruction: (+ 60% AD) (+ 60% AP)
LSmaster165 votesThis actually seems like a really cool idea to make her more unique as well as matching thematically. Also, not needing to get sorc boots would open up mobility boots as a potential option which might be interesting.
SpecterVonBaren1 votesHhm... I did think about the fact that she wouldn't build Sorce Shoes anymore but I thought people would get Lucidity boots, but with Mobi's she would be more capable of roaming, now that you bring it up.
Teridax681 votesMobi's coupled with her passive could make her one of the best roamers in the game, and Lucidity would put a lot more emphasis on her control. Opting into Merc Treads/Tabi could also be tremendously useful if she's faced up against a bursty champion, as she tends to suffer against those types. Considering how Taliyah's a mobile control mage first and foremost, it would make sense for her to relax her damage itemization a little in favor of more utility.
Anu3isII5 votesThe problem is that you can't really afford to buy any Penetration, and Armor as a base stat is much higher than Magic Resist in general.
You would have a small damage advantage in the Early Game. Then, after your opponents get some levels and Base Armor, your Damage will be extremely low.
SpecterVonBaren1 votesDoesn't stop AD casters from dealing damage. Jhin deals a lot of damage with every auto, even without a pen build thanks to just how much AD he can get. Taliyah could also itemize into a Black Cleaner for fast armor reduction with her multi hit spells.
RavenMagus4 votesYes, but they build armor penetration + AD.
Taliyah can't build armor penetration + AP.
SpecterVonBaren2 votesWho says you need to build pen at all? There's only two sources of flat magic pen from items, one isn't bought by most mages anyway 
and some mages prefer 
over 
. In terms of percentage pen it would just mean she would build a 
item or , which isn't that different from how 
builds 
even if he's going AD.
Votable Jester1 votesCorki still has plenty of AP ratios, so the AP on Void Staff isn't wasted. Also Liandry's is becoming a much more popular item now.
The main advantage physical damage has over magic is that it is generally a constant, high output. Taliyah wouldn't have that advantage because that advantage comes from AD scaling autos, and Taliyah wouldn't have much ad for autos or even want to auto often.
It could work if they put some pen into her kit though (like Corki). For instance if they made it so her E shredded armor rather than slow or something, that may work.
ReZisT Lust1 votesi auto alot as taliyah i like how q so doesnt mess up my autos much and the ms helps me move around and is why i buy nashors on her
EchoZeero3 votesThat sounds like a very sensible idea, I like it. We need more "out of the box" concepts.
ReZisT Lust1 votesevery time shaco places a jitb and it activates a nother shaco with a half of his stats pops out and helps attack what he wants or all run away on his command*[slayer-pantheon-popcorn]*
ReZisT Lust1 votesYou sir or madam ^ should work for riot [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]
SpookyNeedle2 votesAP means ability power, meaning her power comes from her abilities. So an ability power champ doing physical damage is a neat idea and I like it. But it might cause clarity issues
TricolorStar2 votesAP means ability power, meaning her power comes from her abilities. So an ability power champ doing physical damage is a neat idea and I like it. But it might cause clarity issues
Kindred, Kalista, Darius, Garen, Draven, Kled, Vayne, Talon, Riven, Olaf, and Illaoi all have only AD scaling abilities. Wouldn't be weird or unclear at all.
BluePolarizer2 votesSo if she still has AP ratios, that means every pen item is going to be bad on her.
DemoGuide2 votesThere is already mage that deals physical damage: 
An Undead brat1 votesWhat pene items would she buy...?
SpecterVonBaren2 votesBlack Cleaver would be pretty good as a later buy since she has multiple hits from her Q and her E if she knocks someone into it, meaning she could shred armor rather quickly.
An Undead brat1 votesInteresting.
DaNinad1 votes[{quoted}](name=Sexy Bisex Plant,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=s1w6dBVg,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2017-03-15T05:36:17.472+0000)
What pene items would she buy...?
The better question is, what wouldn't she buy
An Undead brat1 votesAny Lethality item, because she didn't have an AD scaling, so it would be absolutely wasted gold and item slot.
DaNinad1 votes[{quoted}](name=Sexy Bisex Plant,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=s1w6dBVg,comment-id=000700010000,timestamp=2017-03-15T22:23:28.595+0000)
Any Lethality item, because she didn't have an AD scaling, so it would be absolutely wasted gold and item slot.
Or maybe ad taliyah would be secretly op you never know
An Undead brat1 votesMore like secretly weak pick because she does not have good bases for that, but if those were higher, she would be good while also losing her AP scaling pysical damage dealing mage theme, thus instantly adjusted by Riot to fit it :D
DaNinad1 votes[{quoted}](name=Sexy Bisex Plant,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=s1w6dBVg,comment-id=00070001000000000000,timestamp=2017-03-15T22:31:14.921+0000)
More like secretly weak pick because she does not have good bases for that, but if those were higher, she would be good while also losing her AP scaling pysical damage dealing mage theme, thus instantly adjusted by Riot :D
don't diss my jam
An Undead brat1 votesC'MON AND SLAM
Serika Zero1 votesThis would be a NERF bro.
Let me explain you why:
Top lane champions right now:
You probably noticed by now. But there's just a few APC there.
namely: (which might even go for the AD-AS build, so, not ap), (not meta), (not meta, usually feeds by proxy farming) and (tho, been a while since i've seen him top).
So, very limited champion pool when it comes to APs in the top lane.
A similar thing happens in the jungle, where like the only AP jungle is what? Rumble and Diana jungle? You could argue that elise is an ap jungle, but her scalings are very bad :(
Then there's the bot lane which is generally made out of a marksman and a support. There are 2-3 damage dealers apc supports (Brand, zyra, annie). This is why your change will nerf her. It will be very difficult to fit in Taliyah in a team comp. To begin with, the biggest limitation for the likes of Jayce, Zed, Talon mid are that you will most likely go into a full AD comp where the enemy can just stack hp and armor, building very efficiently against you. You almost always want to bring some treathing magic damage (AP) from a role, and that role is usually the mid lane. As the other lanes don't really have many AP champions in them.
SpecterVonBaren3 votesYou say all this as if we don't live in a meta where Rammus can be picked into an all AD team and still get burst down almost instantly without accomplishing much.
inplane1 votesI don't think Riot would do that with 
because she's already a complicated champion who has enough gimmicks that makes the enemy scratch their heads in confusion. It would also add hidden power because of the odd itemization. Her creator, Riot Zenon, mentioned that he is hesitant to add or change anything to 's kit because it would add too much hidden power.
SpecterVonBaren2 votesLots of champs have different damage outputs from what you expect though. It'd be MORE consistent rather, since it would be all of her spells instead of like a lot of other champs that have one out of three damaging abilities deal magic damage.
LordGeovanni1 votestaliyah has less hidden power and more simple power that teams can take advantage of in a straight forward way. and if thats a bad thing adcs have far too much of that
inplane1 votestaliyah has less hidden power and more simple power that teams can take advantage of in a straight forward way. and if thats a bad thing adcs have far too much of that
I'm just paraphrasing what 's creator has discussed with mains. He said that adding more mechanics and knacks for her would create too much hidden power, which is bullshit in my opinion because is one of the few new champions who do not have a passive on her abilities unlike and 
.
LordGeovanni1 votescammile doesnt have passives on her abilities..... im pretty sure
inplane1 votescammile doesnt have passives on her abilities..... im pretty sure
Was thinking of , but I meant 
. Brainfarted.
LordGeovanni1 votesunderstandable People keep saying cammile is over loaded when she has literally nothing extra on her kit only her second q is powerful and he e is easy counterable if you know what to look for but people didnt know what to look for so they got it nerfed several times.