Why Tanks like Mundo, Rammus and Malphite became stronger with 5.22.

Irelia Bot··1 votes·1,214 views

Last Whisper and the items it builds into only effects bonus armor

BotRK no longer counters tanks as well as it did. that 2% current health might seem meh but it does add up.

The % damage reduction keystone

How does the armor pen change impact the game? I'll give an example of armor effectiveness in 5.21 VS 5.22

5.21: level 18 mundo has 86 base armor and 100 bonus armor Ashe has Last Whisper and the % armor pen mastery

armor pen would be in this case leave (1*(1-.35)(1-.06))= 0.611 % of the armor on the target

This in turn means that mundo has (100/(100+(86+100)*0.611))= 100/213.646 or 46.80639937% damage taken or 213.646% more effective health

5.22: level 18 mundo has 86 base armor and 100 bonus armor Ashe has Lord Dominik's and the 7% armor reduction from masteries

100/(100+(86+(100*.6))*.93) = 100/235.78= 42.412418356% of the damage is taken or an effective 235.78% more health

While the new one starts preforming almost as good at 200 bonus armor (5.21: 36.4% of the damage is taken VS 5.22: 34.3% of the damage is taken.) it takes a total of 518 bonus armor for the item to catch up with the old LW in the given situation.

This is the math behind why tanks became stronger with 5.22.

If it ain't broke don't bother to try and fix it.

16 Comments

MaIevoIent1 votes

when I play tanks now, I get bursted super fast.

dangopee1 votes

Either you are exaggerating or the above math is wrong. Hint: math isn't wrong.

Irelia Bot1 votes

Then do the math and show me where I made mistakes

long story short with 86 base armor and 100 bonus armor

5.21 with 35% total armor penetration from LW (86 + 100)(1-.35) 186.65= 120

100/(100+120) = 45.454545% That is the % of damage being taken

5.22 with 40% BONUS armor penatation from Dominik's 86 + (100*(1=.4)) 86 + 60 146

100/(100+146)= 40.6504% of the damage being taken

Does that make it easier to understand the effectiveness of % armor pen now?

dangopee1 votes

Are you talking to me or him?

Irelia Bot1 votes

was talk t oyou since you said the math was wrong

dangopee1 votes

No I said it is not wrong. I'm agreeing with you, disagreeing with the person I replied to. Switch to discussion view.

Irelia Bot1 votes

my mistake I miss read.

BubonicBite1 votes

so.. the keystone that adds up to 80 damage if you continually autoattack(unless im mistaken any spells and autos on anything stack it up and damage only applies to champions), the additional .5% to double edged sword, additional 2% to bounty hunter(yes you do have to stack it..) vs havoc, the additional 1% armor penetration from masteries, minus the 7 attack damage(19 if you want lifesteal instead), as well as the extra 5% armor penetration on either one of the last whispers new paths, all for a normal adc build doesnt even slightly make up for it?

yes tanks got new masteries but still... they have to choose between one form of tankiness or the other being either hp+hp regen and summoner spells cdr or armor/mr and healing/shield bonuses. tanks did lose the 3% missing health per 5 seconds, 4% damage reduction from aoe ap damage, 10% less damage from critical strikes, etc if they wanted to go roughly 24-27 points into tank masteries..

unless they also changed the mechanics behind armor pen.. your damage to tanks isnt affected negatively if at all in most situations..

ThePartyLeader1 votes

I feel like a mention to the 4-8% damage reduction that can't be countered by penetration should have been mentioned. Like a mastery giving you 4-8% increased effective health is big.

Irelia Bot1 votes

That is another factor that I should have mentions but it is not the biggest culprete. I will edit it to include that though.

MaIevoIent1 votes

Then again, i rarely stack armor I usually just stack hp.

BluePolarizer1 votes

Did you take into consideration the 15% damage amp?

Vistha Kai1 votes

The way the damage amp works right now makes it not a variable.

qetzel1 votes

Don't forget veteran's scars. That is another 6% EHP boost.

Vistha Kai1 votes

Only until the next patch once it turns into a flat HP bonus (Was it +40HP?).

Dominick Destine1 votes

I am no math expert... and I'm lazy , but the numbers in the OP seem to make sense to me.

The problem is; You are only taking an edge case. How about you compare a Malphite with 300 armor pre patch vs. a Malphite with 300 armor post patch? the difference will not be as egregious, thus your argument falters hard whenever we don't take an edge case as the core premise.

You mentioned it towards the end of your post (500 armor is what it takes) but you also fail to mention that access to armor penetration has been made easier for ADC across the board (Black Cleaver made more appealing to ADC, Last Whisper much better build path, etc.). You are looking at it in a way that heavily favors tanks.

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