Rioter in charge of the MYMU?

Votable Jester·Nov 29, 2016·2 votes·425 views

Can anyone tell me which Riot employee was in charge of the MYMU? I'm specifically looking for the one in charge of the item changes (removal of mana regen pretty much). I'm asking for the summoner name btw, just in case anyone for some reason would give the person's actual name; that's not really helpful for noticing him on the boards.

Just want to know so I can ask him about it again if I ever see him on the boards/anywhere else in the future.

Oh and sorry if this isn't in the correct board. I just considered gameplay the right location because i'm asking about the guy for gameplay-related reasons.

15 Comments

LostFr0stNov 29, 20161 votes

What do you want to ask? They had a huge forum Q+A back then; you couldn't find your answer in the Rioter rundown of those posts?

If you tell me your specific question I can try to find the exact post for you^^

Votable JesterNov 29, 20161 votes

Well I did ask then.

I asked about why they felt they needed to remove mana regen from mage itemization. They responded by saying that the continuous sieging was toxic, so I asked what about it made it toxic. They said that it put the enemy in a situation where they cannot retaliate/do anything to solve it. I replied by pointing out that you can set up a flank on the sieging team, send someone to splitpush, poke back, or focus on engaging on them. At that point it basically devolved into them saying that that wasn't enough counterplay and that it was toxic while I argued that some mages are designed around sieging until you have the advantage and then take tower.

Basically we disagreed about the toxicity of sieging for an extended period of time, and neither side would admit defeat.

Oh yeah, I also argued that arbitrarily deciding that this gameplay element was toxic when many in the community disagreed (I was not alone) was unreasonable. I then pointed out that it seemed like he just personally disliked poke mages in general, at which point he stopped responding.

I just want to know the name of the guy so I can ask him about his view on the subject after some time has passed, and also so I know to be wary of this guy touching anything mage related again.

btw I know I was stubborn there as well, but I still feel that his line of thinking was unreasonable. At the very least, I responded to the points he made in rebuttal. I also don't think I was terrible rude even while I was stubborn.

LostFr0stNov 29, 20161 votes

Ahh I see. I remember that circle actually. It wasn't just one person that made those changes, it was a whole group of people in conjunction with constantly comparing the items to the needs of the mages they were working on and the class in general.

Big thing was that they wanted to add the cool new catalyst passive for sustained battle mages but they didn't want it to be abused by long-range or artillery mages stacking regen.

The new tear passive was another thing they wanted to make powerful, but if regen was the go-to resource it would lose its niche for reducing spell-cast costs since regen would still be better.

The biggest goal of the whole update was to make sure that mages would no longer fight for the support AP items so they upped the mana pools of the intended damage mages and increased the base regen of the enchanter class.

side note: I don't think 'flank' or 'splitpush' was the obvious/intuitive thing that came to mind when people faught a siege comp either. People just know that the game kinda stalls once you get to their inhibs. They wanted to make an obvious point where the mage had to back and there was an opening for the opposing team to act if the mage's team didn't help out.

Votable JesterNov 29, 20162 votes

That goal really failed then. Support AP itemization is still quite suppressed, and if anything rises much above the rest, mages will jump back on them.

My other issue at the time was the general reduction in AP on items in compensation for CDR. I personally always reached 40% cdr before using runes and a Morello or Athene's, so the whole change was just a complete reduction in AP. This also assisted in the rise of Rylai's, because with the initial burst lowered and the loss of a high-AP item ( item 3157 ), mages needed ways to keep their enemies around for another attack

The whole MYMU was just a giant nerf with the exception of those mages who were updated in it, and even they received nerfs later.

I'm fully aware that there were many people involved in the changes as a whole, but there was at least the single Rioter who was talking about it with the playerbase.

The mana change did work out decently, though I'm not convinced that it actually solved any problem. Mage itemization was also cut down, and AP was lost pretty much everywhere.

I simply remain unconvinced that the change from high AP items to CDR everywhere was a good one. Mages should at least have the option to focus on single rotation burst if they want to, but high AP items are vanishing left and right; first Zhonya's and now Rylai's. I'm in full agreement that those items needed nerfs, but they just narrowed mage builds to a single path; full CDR and slow spam.

Riot's been doing this quite a bit recently though. They really have been hypocritical/straight up lying. They say they want build diversity and won't enforce the META, yet here we are with weakened bot turrets, armor-pen items nerfed, mana regen crippled, etc. I personally don't mind many of the changes, but I do miss being able to reach significantly high levels of AP or being able to stay out of base for an extended period of time without blue buff.

LostFr0stNov 29, 20161 votes

Well, that's what they've been trying to fix really; the 'ol support problem. That's why they have all these "scales with shields and heals" passives which basically ups the supports' scalings without giving them real AP.

They also didn't want everyone to be balanced around needing a item 3165 or item 3174 first; that made it so when facing an AD you'd have to auto lose lane since you rushed item 3157 and had to forego the cdr you need to waveclear effectively. The item was built to survive, yet it took so long to build that many would die multiple times under tower before it would get completed; by then it was too late. They lowered the AP since it was overall a utility item and they could trade it for better pricing.

They upped item 3089 bonus scaling; if high numbers are what someone is after the item definitely delivers (same with item 3003 ).

Burst build is still there through item 3285 item 3089 item 3135 ; that specific thing was sharpened compared to other available builds now.

I think the cdr options being widened was cool in some cases , but in other cases it didn't really make much sense .

The reason they're removing AP on item 3116 and Blue specifically now is due to locket being gone. Mages don't need a chunk of damage that they used to because the invisible wall they needed to get through just isn't there anymore.

Votable JesterNov 29, 20162 votes

They really just need to have a special stat for supportive abilities.

I'm fine with Zhonya's being made to focus on the utility aspect. I just dislike having fewer high AP items. It feels restrictive having so few choices.

Burst is still there until the lategame where Luden's abysmal AP scaling becomes basically useless. Rabadon's is also the most expensive item in the game, and requires other AP items to be built just to be gold efficient. Void Staff is one of the strongest AP items right now though due to its cheapness and effective scaling with base damage.

Expanded CDR options may be cool for some people, but with the right runes, they're pointless. With all scaling CDR Glyphs and a scaling CDR Quint, you can reach 40% (or 45%) with just Morello. This makes those extra CDR items more of an annoyance for lack of efficiency than a blessing.

The reason why having more AP items is more valuable than having more CDR items is there's no realistic cap in place in the game for AP whereas the CDR cap is absurdly easy to reach.

Again, I understand the need to nerf Rylai's; it's pretty absurd right now. I just mourn the loss of another high AP item. Also Abyssal already lost its shred because of the Locket change. I'm not a huge fan of double dipping, but at least they did these changes over multiple patches making me think that they're not trying to just crush AP into the mud.

The change to Blue is also understandable for the sake of making the game easier to balance if nothing else.

LostFr0stNov 29, 20161 votes

I think that where they'll have to end up in the long run. The new support items are really good in that way.

I think once they get MR and tank itemization in the right spot there might be an opening for Luden's but I doubt it. A mage can chunk a squishy with the spray proc from Ludens.

Deathcap is basically 100% gold efficient even if bought first since everyone runs AP Quints and buys a Doran's ring. It only gets better from there (I don't know why nobody realizes the item is still super good as even a second item (or first on Veigar) the only difference is the passives on the other items like MS or CD.

Yeah Void is op op for sure.

The cry for cdr back then was tied to marksman having just received item 3508 and getting full cdr for free. Mages wanted to run something other than cdr on their runes and sometimes would like to not need to build cdr and trade damage for it while the AD items were so streamlined after their update.

Something about "every champ should be able to reach cap as their fantasy."

I think throwing cdr at everything was the best solution for what the community wanted at the time. They lowered the AP because the mages were getting out extra spell rotations earlier in the game then tied extra scaling to Deathcap making it a late-game AP amp to catch them back up to the AP curve once full cdr was expected. Anyone who can't fit Deathcap now needs to fit Seraph's into their build somewhere or loses a ton of AP.

I think we do need one more solid high-AP item without cdr. Until the assassins settle and they fix the bruiser/Diver/Tank itemization though there's no way they'll be adding that.

Votable JesterNov 29, 20161 votes

Oh and to the side note, Tactics aren't supposed to be so intuitive. The whole point is to outmaneuver your opponent. If it's seriously too difficult for teams to counter a siege, then they simply deserve to lose to it. If you can't deal with your opponent's strategy, which is both common and foreseeable, why should you win?

If the issue is the game stalling at inhibs, then the siege mage clearly wasn't an issue. In such a situation, stalling is to the advantage of the defending team anyway.

LostFr0stNov 29, 20161 votes

They didn't want to make it so teams lost in champ select or were forced to auto-lock their own siege champ. I don't think that's a bad thing really :/ It's just a slight opening (like... 10 secs tops?)

Votable JesterNov 29, 20161 votes

My point is that teams didn't lose in champ select from siege mages. Nor were siege mages necessary to a team comp. Flanking and splitpushing were forms of retaliation that don't require a siege mage.

If you're team can't poke, can't splitpush, can't flank, and lacks hard engage, it's just a terrible comp.

I'm not sure what you mean about there being a slight opening though. Are you referring to the mana regen changes? If so, they basically require the mage to get blue or recall to base to continue a siege once low or oom, and those take more than 10 seconds.

LostFr0stNov 29, 20161 votes

Of course they didn't, but it felt like they did so it warped the meta back then. Many of the changes they're making are feel changes that have minimal actual effect.

Yup, that last part. I remember the days of the 90-minute games; Anivia vs Ziggs or something like it every single game. Once it gets to inhib it takes like 10 seconds (ovc I was counting homeguards, you got me.)

Votable JesterNov 29, 20161 votes

I actually liked long games. They were by far the most intense.

I still say 10 seconds is an underestimate even with homeguards.

LostFr0stNov 29, 20161 votes

Yeah... I had an 80 minute nail-biter this October as Ziggs. Was so much fun :3

Votable JesterNov 30, 20161 votes

Well it's been nice discussing this all with you. It's helpful to hear other peoples' views on matters that are of interest to me. Thanks for the chat :)

LostFr0stNov 30, 20161 votes

Same to you^^ Good luck in your games :)