Why is Nullifying Orb only effective vs magic damage?

Z3Sleeper··91 votes·19,073 views

I mean, I expect the counter-argument to be because then AD Assassins that need to face dive for kills would get cucked, but what about Diana Fizz Ekko Akali Katarina ?

Why can't it just be a shield vs the primary damage type of the champ that triggered it like Camille 's shield?

You can see in the buff bar that a champion has this rune, and it's something you have to consider when playing an AP assassin, so I think it would be fair for the same to have to be true for AD Assassins.

Edit: Noone has mentioned this yet but I just realized every ADC would then take this. Pretty sure this is the reason it doesn't block physical damage. I personally think this is a good candidate for the ol' melee only tag then, since as someone mentioned, it's designed for those with weak laning (and imo riskier champs, which tend to be melee).

Edit 2: Apparently it procs on non-champion damage and blocks that damage (which would mean if it blocked physical it'd block tower shots). So... remove that... That way it only works vs champs like I kinda assumed was the intent.

75 Comments

AirKingNeo3 votes

who even builds maw lmao

2Charmnot2Charm28 votes

You don't need to build maw when sitting on hexdrinker is good enough.

Troll for Trump3 votes

No one gets hexdrinker either...

ZackTheWaffleMan17 votes

false

Troll for Trump2 votes

True. There's generally not enough AP that you couldn't just deal with through nullifying orb.

More importantly, games end too fast for you to waste gold on something like hexdrinker. On top of that, most jglers are AD and will just skewer you through the shield.

Unless the enemy team has 3 or more APs the item isn't good. And that should rarely happen.

Nut on my Butt4 votes

Plenty of scenarios happen where you're laning against an ad mid laner, gain a significant advantage either through exp or a kill. They buy hexdrinker, then you just straight up can't fight them and they get a get out of jail free card for their mistakes. Armguard doesn't quite hold the same strength, but it's good that they made it cheaper.

It's not built to counter a team of magic damage, it doesn't need to, it's only 1300 gold. And it's typically not purchased at later stages of the game.

idk if I agree with the OP at all, but your post almost makes it sound like you aren't playing the same game.

Troll for Trump2 votes

I've just never felt the item have that much impact playing as or against it in stopping the snowball.

I have always felt the annoyance in getting a delayed power spike when I DID get the item.

Nut on my Butt1 votes

It's effective enough that even Katarina players consider the item occasionally because of her AD scalings, though that kinda fell off after her shunpo ratio and cd nerfs last year.

Ok sure but why1 votes

I dunno, that life steal and spell vamp are a real blast to have

NaturesMayhem2 votes

What am I looking at?

SpecterVonBaren1 votes

What am I looking at? A Dunsparce getting choked?

XHonourX1 votes

Took me too long to figure out it is the emoji meme... maybe a bit too long.

SenorBobbers26 votes

More like why is it in Sorcery at all - a tree dedicated to "Empowered abilities and resource manipulation"

FutureCreator6 votes

So assassins can get the free damage stats early game and still have defensive options :)

My Waifu Vanilla4 votes

All those assassins that go down sorcery right? I'm playing an assassin....I'm taking electrocute. If I want defense I'll go resolve secondary for chrysalis+bone plating (bone plating on it's own already does better than nullify) instead of sorcery which gives me absolutely nothing useful since celerity got gutted and the only other option is Scorch which is mediocre at best.

Wildlife11 votes

{quoted}

More like why is it in Sorcery at all - a tree dedicated to "Empowered abilities and resource manipulation"

it should be on resolve, cause its about defenses and resitances

Nut on my Butt1 votes

It scales with ad and ap though. Resolve stuff that does scale often scales with defensive stats.

Dope Solo16 votes

AD bias.

ChaddyFantome3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dope Solo,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rUhA5mFI,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-06-24T17:06:43.198+0000)

AD bias.

because AD champs are the only ones that can use it, apparently? [zombie-brand-clap]

koshkyra2 votes

That isnt what he was saying.

ModAcademy Kayn14 votes

The reason that Riot has stated, is that when they did it for both damage types, the shield was either always too weak, or mandatory on everyone. By limiting it to one, they can have an even ground/niche for the rune.

Z3Sleeper5 votes

So long as Celerity, Absolute Focus, Waterwalking, Transcendence, Scorch and Gathering Storm exist I highly doubt it would become mandatory for secondary users.

Primary users however I said somewhere else have Manaflow and Nimbus to choose from as well. Some NEED nimbus. Idk about Manaflow though.

ModAcademy Kayn9 votes

You underestimate the strength of a free shield that works against anything.

Z3Sleeper2 votes

I moreso underestimate the viability of taking a shield when you have mana-deficiency or lack of much needed mobility for your ultimate.

PS: Downvote wasn't me.

Dope Solo1 votes

How about giving us a choice then? AP or AD?

The Yetii Rider4 votes

Going to give you the actual answer: because the shield can be procc'd by any source of damage, not just champion, and if it blocked physical as well it would reduce the threat that turrets pose to champions who do not build armor.

Edit: Just read your edit in its entirety, and no, the rune is NOT designed for champions with 'weak laning', as those champions would prefer Resolve for the extra health buff. The rune is designed for tank junglers who have a very slow clear speed and are thus particularly vulnerable to Gromp's high magic damage output over its first five attacks.

Z3Sleeper1 votes

So change it to block only champ damage. I don't think we actually need a rune specifically to counter gromp.

Also, "champs with weak laning (that would like to take sorcery)".

The Yetii Rider1 votes

For what? Why would they want sorcery other than Manaflow Band? Assassins want Domination. Fighters want either Grasp or Conqueror. What does Sorcery give non-mages?

Z3Sleeper1 votes

Transcendence, Nullifying Orb, Celerity, Gathering Storm, Waterwalking.

Sorcery can be taken as a secondary rune path.

Sources:

http://www.probuilds.net/champions/details/Talon http://www.probuilds.net/champions/details/Zed http://www.probuilds.net/champions/details/Diana

My Waifu Vanilla1 votes

Celerity is gutted for 90% of the roster and Gathering Storm and Transcendance come online too late to be useful.

Z3Sleeper1 votes

Yet in alot of those rune builds people were taking Transcendence or Celerity.

Shiphtur: http://www.probuilds.net/guide/show/NA/2811739003/19967304 Bjergsen: http://www.probuilds.net/guide/show/NA/2811976712/50759139

Gathering Storm is also still a staple of ADCs.

flibitydoo1 votes

If it was just a regular shield then it would cuck most ignite users

they'd have to make a completely new shield type that can't eat true damage as well.

FutureCreator1 votes

There is a shield type that only eats physical damage. Camille's passive for example.

Altiverse4 votes

Because god forbid AD assassins would need to buy defensively and not rush Duskblade. /Meanwhile get flamed as any AP champion for not rushing Zhonya against AD assassins, rendering you useless after mana changes.

Jamaree3 votes

Diana is just in a bad place right now.

Z3Sleeper2 votes

It's not just Diana, several others are affected, some more than others. Diana is just the worst case. Updated OP.

Jamaree5 votes

{quoted}

It's not just Diana, several others are affected, some more than others. Diana is just the worst case. Updated OP.

I really don't think people want the other four getting help TBH.

Poske3 votes

{quoted}

Diana is just in a bad place right now.

Diana is in better spot since new runes

OverpoweredSoap3 votes

Its designed to give champions who have a weak laning phase in mid lane to be able to lane or reward them for going in early on which usually isn't their strong point in the game.

It doesn't block all damage because there would be kind of little to no reason not to take it if it blocked both types of damage (though not at both at once, like you suggested).

Z3Sleeper4 votes

Reasons not to take it:

  • Tear Stacking/Mana Hungry champs that want Manaflow
  • You're playing Fiddle, Vlad, Swain, etc who want Nimbus
  • You don't want Sorcery

As for everyone else I don't see an issue with it. It's not a particularly strong shield. Pretty sure Hexdrinker outclasses it by a large margin at all stages of the game.

YumaS2Astral2 votes

{quoted}

Reasons not to take it:

  • Tear Stacking/Mana Hungry champs that want Manaflow
  • You're playing Fiddle, Vlad, Swain, etc who want Nimbus
  • You don't want Sorcery

As for everyone else I don't see an issue with it. It's not a particularly strong shield. Pretty sure Hexdrinker outclasses it by a large margin at all stages of the game.

You understimate how it would be

Remember when Stopwatch was a mandatory option, even though there were many other options that could be potentially better on a particular champion you were playing? It was because Stopwatch was too good to pass up. Imagine if the same thing happened with Nullfiyng Orb.

Z3Sleeper2 votes

A free one-time Zhonya at 6 mins is far more powerful than a 40-120 (+1.0 bonus AD or 1.5 AP) shield.

YumaS2Astral1 votes

{quoted}

A free one-time Zhonya at 6 mins is far more powerful than a 40-120 (+1.0 bonus AD or 1.5 AP) shield.

Doesn't make the shield not powerful enough to be mandatory

The Yetii Rider1 votes

Assuming you're talking about assassins, assassins would probably get more protection out of the heal off Triumph (plus the gold to help snowball) as their secondary. They'll always take Electrocute as their primary.

Hexs Fortune3 votes

Probably to prevent tower diving abuse

LordGeovanni3 votes

Thing is Magic damage is far more overtuned than ad assassin items (to say nothing of bruiser items). Because where assassins get lethality from item 3142 it also has 55 ad compared to the 70 of upper levels of ad and a like comparison would be an ap item with 60-65 ap compared to the upper levels of -90-100 ap items. Where mage players cry that 75 ap is an unusable mage item because they dont ever want to sacrifice any damage for the ultility they want

SpaghettiVase2 votes

I don't understand why nullifying orb has to be in the sorcery tree

Z3Sleeper5 votes

Cuz it falls under "Empowered abilities and resource manipulation". /s

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