The boards: New champs are overloaded and all need to be gutted

chipndip1·Jan 15, 2019·33 votes·9,350 views

Riot: Fine, we'll remove some of the extras from Irelia.

The boards: Why are you removing the disarm and shield damage from Irelia?

I mean, the fuck else do you do? This is LITERALLY what you guys ask for all the time.

Removing Zoe's Spell Thief

Removing Akali's Obscurity

Removing Yasuo's Windwall

And a bunch of people saying to outright revert reworks on a regular basis

Why the hell are you guys complaining about "removing unique things" NOW? You guys ask for it nearly every day.

79 Comments

Edge of DaybreakJan 15, 201936 votes

Let’s continue boards tradition. Different people want different things. The guys complaining about the removal are not the people asking for that thing to be removed.

EedatJan 15, 20199 votes

This is the typical excuse and its complete bullshit. You can see one opinion be 90% upvoted on the front page then the exact polar opposite being 90% upvoted on the front page literally days later. The board community isnt that big and I see an awful lot of the same names around.

Let's be real. It's people hiding behind the anonymity of the voting system to endlessly bitch, moan, cry, shitpost, circlejerk, and witch hunt no matter what changes are made or no matter what meta it is. All this board does is bitch and cry and shitpost. Thats it. Any reasonable attempt at discussion about anything the boards has decided 'is bad' (think Fizz, Zed, Lee Sin, Zoe, Duskblade, etc) is immediately downvoted into the dirt while straight up shitposts raging while offering zero constructive feedback are immediately on the front page

Edge of DaybreakJan 15, 201910 votes

Considering some of the topics ive seen id estimate around 500 people travel to gameplay but yes many of the topics are made by the same people with the same points. As for the bullshitness what else is there to say it’s obvious stuff. Its about as relevant as saying the boards shares one opinion because a specific audience upvoted a thing. There is a lot I could say but I gotta do stuff and I cant lurk if I put in effort.

saltranJan 15, 20192 votes

It was way worse on 2017, the Gameplay Boards was almost a Mordekaiser mains private club.

Moody PJan 15, 20194 votes

2019 will be a Volibear mains private club

Abibyama IIJan 15, 20192 votes

kargishJan 15, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Abibyama II,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rMRN6IZw,comment-id=000100000001000000000000,timestamp=2019-01-15T21:17:58.167+0000)

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FTFY

Sire HippingtonJan 15, 201914 votes

So we once again act like boards is a single player?

I'm all for removeing Zoe's Spellthief, i'd love to see atleast some sever changes to windwall, and i don't mind Akali returning from obscurity to normal stealth, and i certainly want many reworks reverted. I also think the new champs ult should be scrapped befor he hits live and it's to late. And i also do like irelia loosing her anti shield and don't mind her loosing the disarm.

Stop acting as if the players that complain about the irelia changes are the same that want all those other things.

3TWarriorJan 15, 20191 votes

I think he should be changed to copy Q's. They're less problematic and equally diverse

IAintDariusJan 15, 201911 votes

I can't tell if you are completely aware you are stirring shit over random accusation you made up or are just mentally insane and actually believe you are talking to a hivemind.

Velzard of KozJan 15, 20196 votes

It's chipndip you'll eventually learn that he considers himself a unique individual who fights against the hivemind (even though he is frequently on top of the Boards) and is extremly above all while all the other people are the same thing he can bitch about like little child.

saltranJan 15, 20191 votes

r/Iamverysmart vibes

HügöJan 16, 20191 votes

Just watch his posts on the board and you would love that there would be an ignore function.

Hayaishi2Jan 15, 20199 votes

The boards are not a hivemind. When will people learn this?

I'm all for Zoe having spell thief if every champion is updated to keep up with her. If Riot can't deliver that and insists on releasing more abominations then said abominations should be gutted.

chipndip1Jan 15, 20192 votes

{quoted}

The boards are not a hivemind. When will people learn this?

I'm all for Zoe having spell thief if every champion is updated to keep up with her. If Riot can't deliver that and insists on releasing more abominations then said abominations should be gutted.

You can't update a 140 champ roster at the same time. If a new champ is updated, and the resounding response is "Gut this shit", then what do you think Riot's going to do?

Hayaishi2Jan 15, 20195 votes

{quoted}

You can't update a 140 champ roster at the same time. If a new champ is updated, and the resounding response is "Gut this shit", then what do you think Riot's going to do?

uhm..

Pretty much the same thing i wrote?

Gut them all, gut Zoe, gut Irelia, gut Sylas when he's released.

chipndip1Jan 15, 20191 votes

{quoted}

uhm..

Pretty much the same thing i wrote?

Gut them all, gut Zoe, gut Irelia, gut Sylas when he's released.

Then you can't make the claim that you want lesser characters to be improved on. You simply want better characters sabotaged.

Hayaishi2Jan 15, 20195 votes

{quoted}

Then you can't make the claim that you want lesser characters to be improved on. You simply want better characters sabotaged.

Because Riot AS YOU SAID YOURSELF can't improve them.

So either everyone is OP or no one is.

They could also stop releasing champions and work on the ones we already have, god knows a lot of them could use their ideas, but Riot isn't willing to do so.

They should also prioritize champions with VERY outdated kits instead of going out of their way to rework champions like Ezreal whose kit in Riot's own words "Has aged well"

chipndip1Jan 15, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Because Riot AS YOU SAID YOURSELF can't improve them.

I never said they can't. I said it takes time.

They could also stop releasing champions and work on the ones we already have

Irelia is EXACTLY this and you guys don't stop crying for reworked champs to be gutted. You don't really have a point.

Hayaishi2Jan 15, 20193 votes

{quoted}

I never said they can't. I said it takes time.

Irelia is EXACTLY this and you guys don't stop crying for reworked champs to be gutted. You don't really have a point.

Except there is. If every champion is the same quality wise we wouldn't have such a huge disparity between them.

SirsirJan 15, 20197 votes

I'm not going to defend the boards, because you're right. But the Irelia change is bad... Its a placebo nerf instead of handling the real problems. If they lowered her overall passive damage, or take 50 off her Q range, it would actually help. They are just dancing around the problem. ba dum tish

EedatJan 15, 20196 votes

OmG nEw ChAmPs FuCkInG bUlLsHiT oVeRlOaDeD rUiNiNg ThE gAmE fIrE rItO tRaSh BaLaNcE tEaM

same board:

OmG dOn'T bUfF vOlIbEaR oR GaReN bUlLsHiT sTaT cHeCkS zErO sKiLl kEeP tHeM gUtTeD uNtIl ReWoRkS

BârdJan 15, 20193 votes

The Voli/Garen buffs added a great deal of skill expression though.

Moody PJan 15, 20194 votes

I agree buff them more so we can have more, uh, skill expression :^)

RaiyzaJan 15, 20196 votes

The shield damage needs removal. That's just broken. Not one champion should have everything Irelia does.

Riot has been overloading new kits. Champions now have ways of getting out of ANY bad matchup.

Take Irelia.

Shields? nah, bonus damage on those. Skillshot CC? Nah, Crazy ass mobility like Yasuo. Burst damage? Nah. Damage reduction brah. Range? NAH. LONG RANGE STUN. Poke? Nah, self sustain and again, crazy mobility.

OHminusJan 15, 20195 votes

Every single day, I go to http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com.

Every single day, I see a chipndip post complaining about the boards hivemind.

Every single day, I scroll down the comments with my bowl of popcorn, knowing top comment is along the lines of "boards isn't made up of one person and different people want different things".

These posts are becoming redundant at this point.

VekknaJan 15, 20194 votes

OP picked up Riot's garbage habit of using "unique" and "toxic" as synonyms.

You know some other things that were "unique?" Veigar's enemy AP ratio. Old Irelia's win-for-losing E. Yorick's targeted AI zoning. Old Poppy's ult. Old Urgot's Q. Old Ashe's income passive. A variety of unique buff/debuff auras. Soraka's mana battery. Everything about old Evelynn and Katarina. Sejuani's old slow passive.

But guess what?! A bunch of that was removed for being toxic, unhealthy, or lacking clarity regardless of whether it was unique.

There's plenty of room for debate about what constitutes unique, healthy design and unique, toxic design. Moreover, there's room to debate whether a new design is healthier and/or more unique than an old design. Irelia happens to be a very good example of a rework that achieved the literal opposite of Riot's stated gameplay goals. There is no universe in which the new Irelia is healthier or easier to balance than the old one, even if her old passive, W, and E were challenging to balance.

And there's a huge difference in magnitude between soft-counter advantages like shield damage and a disarm, versus hard-counter auto-win buttons like Shroud and Windwall.

chipndip1Jan 15, 20191 votes

{quoted}

OP picked up Riot's garbage habit of using "unique" and "toxic" as synonyms.

Before assuming what mechanics I like and don't like, you should probably ask my opinion on them. A commentary on a thing doesn't necessarily mean I'm in favor of those things. I'm commenting on people crying for champs to be gutted, then we see like 4+ threads on "Irelia's unique parts being removed".

VekknaJan 15, 20191 votes

I'm not sure what your likes and dislikes have anything to do with your OP or my response.

I'm commenting on people crying for champs to be gutted, then we see like 4+ threads on "Irelia's unique parts being removed".

Yes, then you went on to give examples of skills that are popularly reviled as toxic.

The response is different because there's no popular consensus that Irelia's shield damage and disarm are particularly toxic and have no place in the game. You're just lumping Irelia together with your examples and labeling them all as "unique," which is why you seem to think the player responses can't coexist. To the contrary, it is entirely consistent to keep Irelia's shield damage and delete WIndwall.

It's also consistent to want Irelia gutted and be mad about her "nerfs" that buff her universal power as compensation for losing very niche/situational power.

Personally, I wish they could keep the sort of niche power they're removing from Irelia. But I suspect that she's been enough of a balance challenge that Riot has to start by removing some variables and flattening her power level before they can properly tune her.

chipndip1Jan 16, 20191 votes

{quoted}

I'm not sure what your likes and dislikes have anything to do with your OP or my response.

Cause you don't know if I agree or disagree with Riot's decision. All you know is I disapprove of all the backlash for the (potential) removal.

Some things should be removed at times. You have no idea whether I particularly care for these specific mechanics, so you shouldn't push the narrative that I'm defending them or not.

Yes, then you went on to give examples of skills that are popularly reviled as toxic.

Aight, you can't have it both ways.

If you add something new to a champ that's highly inconsequential, there's no real point to its existence outside of tacking on unnecessary power, like the shield damage passive.

At the same time, noticeable mechanics that are unique to a champion constantly get berated for being "toxic". It happened with Fiora's vitals, Illaoi's tentacles, Yasuo's windwall, and the list goes on.

If you actually give a crap about unique champion identities, you can't ALSO have a hate boner for every new mechanic that actually makes a game play difference.

The response is different because there's no popular consensus that Irelia's shield damage and disarm are particularly toxic and have no place in the game. You're just lumping Irelia together with your examples and labeling them all as "unique," which is why you seem to think the player responses can't coexist. To the contrary, it is entirely consistent to keep Irelia's shield damage and delete WIndwall.

So remove her ability to dash? Is that your solution? "Keep the shield damage and remove the diver's ability to dash"?

Irelia's concept revolves primarily around the dashes. You guys said she's overloaded and needs to be dealt with? Aight, but they aren't going to screw up her dashing mechanics because that's what she revolves around. The result is removing the disarm and shield breaking passives.

This IS what the general outcry of the boards wanted. They wanted Irelia to be less overloaded, so here we are tinkering with making her less overloaded. Just cause you wish for something doesn't mean the logistics will be favorable. That's why people say "Be careful what you wish for".

It's also consistent to want Irelia gutted and be mad about her "nerfs" that buff her universal power as compensation for losing very niche/situational power.

I don't see how the disarm's all that niche but aight.

Personally, I wish they could keep the sort of niche power they're removing from Irelia. But I suspect that she's been enough of a balance challenge that Riot has to start by removing some variables and flattening her power level before they can properly tune her.

Oh well.

VekknaJan 16, 20191 votes

Cause you don't know if I agree or disagree with Riot's decision. All you know is I disapprove of all the backlash for the (potential) removal.

Which is why I literally never said a single word about your personal opinion. You're responding to something that was never said.

At the same time, noticeable mechanics that are unique to a champion constantly get berated for being "toxic". It happened with Fiora's vitals, Illaoi's tentacles, Yasuo's windwall, and the list goes on.

Yes or no question: Can Fiora's vitals exist without dealing % max hp true damage?

The answer is yes. Now you should understand how something can be unique without being toxic.

Irelia's concept revolves primarily around the dashes. You guys said she's overloaded and needs to be dealt with? Aight, but they aren't going to screw up her dashing mechanics because that's what she revolves around. The result is removing the disarm and shield breaking passives.

The result is to leave the problem completely intact and, nerf all the way around the actual problem, and then make the remaining kit even more toxic with universal damage and utility buffs. Riot trolling by calling an obvious buff a "nerf."

So remove her ability to dash? Is that your solution? "Keep the shield damage and remove the diver's ability to dash"?

In your world there's nothing that exists between 0 and 100? You realize the old Irelia had a dash. Old Irelia had a reset mechanic. Old Irelia did not have three dashes against the same living target. Wrap your mind around that. I know I'm expecting a lot here.

If we want to tune Irelia's godawful dash spam down from 100, we don't tune it to Mordekaiser 0. Maybe we tune it to 66 by putting a cooldown on marking the same target. That keeps her group fighting power at par but reduces her single-target burst. That lowers her single-target burst to diver level instead of assassin-tank level. Sounds fair.

Another option would be to reset Q's cooldown to .75-1 second on minion kill so she can't 1-shot entire waves with Qs in 2 seconds.

That's why people say "Be careful what you wish for".

I wanted a Zyra midlane buff and got 1-shot plants instead. I wanted a new passive on Lissandra and got a super high-budget passive that does literally 0 damage in most games. If there's anything I've learned from playing League it's that Riot is better at creating problems than solving them.

I don't see how the disarm's all that niche but aight.

Think about the number of silences and spellshields in champion kits compared to the number of kit designs that do anything to negate auto-attack damage. There are two dodges and one auto-attack block. Amumu's entangle is the only other disarm currently in the game. So yeah, it's pretty niche in the sense that it barely exists anywhere else in the game.

chipndip1Jan 17, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Which is why I literally never said a single word about your personal opinion. You're responding to something that was never said.

You saying that I think "toxic" and "unique" kit elements are synonymous paints a narrative that I'm in favor of certain mechanics that people generally think are "toxic". Rather than trying to assume what I think, just ask. If you weren't assuming, then don't lead others to assume, either. You have no idea what I think is toxic in the game or not without asking.

Yes or no question: Can Fiora's vitals exist without dealing % max hp true damage?

Objectively? Yes.

Would that be smart? No.

If you can't grasp why Riot used % max hp true damage for Vayne and Fiora, especially at this point, it's probably a waste of time trying to explain it now.

The result is to leave the problem completely intact and, nerf all the way around the actual problem, and then make the remaining kit even more toxic with universal damage and utility buffs. Riot trolling by calling an obvious buff a "nerf."

If the problem's the dashes, then you're saying the problem is Irelia as a concept. You can't just gut the dashes. That's literally what she does. Her whole game play pattern is dependent on her dashing resets.

In your world there's nothing that exists between 0 and 100? You realize the old Irelia had a dash. Old Irelia had a reset mechanic. Old Irelia did not have three dashes against the same living target.

Yeah.

And old Irelia was garbage.

Healthy champion =/= Garbage champion.

If we want to tune Irelia's godawful dash spam down from 100, we don't tune it to Mordekaiser 0. Maybe we tune it to 66 by putting a cooldown on marking the same target. That keeps her group fighting power at par but reduces her single-target burst. That lowers her single-target burst to diver level instead of assassin-tank level. Sounds fair.

There's no way using R and E to mark a specific individual will flow well in a team fight if people just get "mark immunity" for X seconds out of nowhere. You're too busy thinking from your selfish perspective to look at it from the Irelia player's perspective.

Another option would be to reset Q's cooldown to .75-1 second on minion kill so she can't 1-shot entire waves with Qs in 2 seconds.

They're already nerfing her Q on minions.

I wanted a Zyra midlane buff and got 1-shot plants instead. I wanted a new passive on Lissandra and got a super high-budget passive that does literally 0 damage in most games. If there's anything I've learned from playing League it's that Riot is better at creating problems than solving them.

Be careful what you wish for.

Think about the number of silences and spellshields in champion kits compared to the number of kit designs that do anything to negate auto-attack damage. There are two dodges and one auto-attack block. Amumu's entangle is the only other disarm currently in the game. So yeah, it's pretty niche in the sense that it barely exists anywhere else in the game.

Its application isn't niche, though. It just makes everyone not AA, and damn near anyone in this game will need to use AAs. Tanks, fighters, marksmen, and so on. The removal of the disarm will allow top lane fighters to beat her down in lane even harder than they do now, which will promote counter-picking her. It'll ALSO allow marksmen to defend themselves against her, meaning she's weaker into those targets if they're properly peeled. If you guys think Irelia's op and needs to be gutted, congrats. She's officially been powered down if these changes go through.

3TWarriorJan 15, 20194 votes

for one, the three that you mention break fundamental rules that every other champion has to follow

compare that to irelia's bonus damage against shields? That's literally the most unique part of her kit and the only things that could EVER be wrong with it unless they intend to break it are the numbers involved with it...seriously

yasuo can block over half of all projectiles in the game and has a basic ability that rivals ultimates in power, actually exceeding them in some cases

Akali's "true stealth" obscurity breaks a fundamental rule all "invisible" champions have to follow: turrets reveal them no matter what so that they can't just dive you whenever they want to...

Zoe...did you seriously just say there was something wrong with demanding changes to a champion that BREAKS THE MOST POWERFUL THINGS IN THE GAME? Ignite has over 3 minutes of cooldown. If zoe is lucky, she can use it THREE TIMES in one engage, though extremely rare. Her ability also depends upon luck how effective she can be in any given situation. Know something strange? They did account for the power of some actives: such as teleport but didn't consider the others? She can do an absurd amount of true damage when the situation favors her and is one of the only AP mid laners that can run ignite

#I can understand the change to irelia's ultimate because it is just oppressive to her opponents, but the shield damage was currently her most unique kit mechanic (which is saying something when she's a reset monster...), maybe her E's 2 location prompt, but why would they remove her shield damage when it has next to no impact on the game?

They are actively ignoring problems because they do not want to redesign problems that they create...She can do too much and is too mobile to accompany that versatility...number changes are not going to fix her unless she is ridiculous to even attempt playing

chipndip1Jan 15, 20191 votes

{quoted}

for one, the three that you mention break fundamental rules that every other champion has to follow

compare that to irelia's bonus damage against shields? That's literally the most unique part of her kit and the only things that could EVER be wrong with it unless they intend to break it are the numbers involved with it...seriously

So don't complain about removing Irelia's shield since there's no precedent of being able to gain bonus damage to shields specifically before now. Simple.

3TWarriorJan 16, 20192 votes

"no precedent" Every champion has damage, most champions can break shields

specifically, it is not unhealthy for her to break a shield because ANYONE can do it. She does it efficiently, but that is because it is part of her kit to do so and gives her an advantage against shielded champions, whether tanks or those shielded by a support

it is a powerful passive useful ONLY against shields and ONLY while the shield is active, able to do 48 - 204 (+ 48% bonus ad)against a shield, practically invisible otherwise at 16 - 68 (+ 16% bonus AD)

and those only occur at max stacks

the starting value is 4 - 17 + 4% bonus AD

#Instead of addressing her mobility, versatility, or advantages over other classes, the change to her passive targets one of the only things unique about her with next to no impact on the game

The ultimate is a step in the right direction simply because it is unfair for auto-attack based champions, but it should be reconsidered when the proposed changes are as powerful as thresh's ultimate, who is based and balanced around his utility...

chipndip1Jan 16, 20191 votes

{quoted}

"no precedent" Every champion has damage, most champions can break shields

specifically, it is not unhealthy for her to break a shield because ANYONE can do it.

No one has bonus damage to shields. No one ever has. Having it is breaking a "fundamental rule of the game" by that logic.

If the only "unique interactions" that deserve to stay in the game that you don't consider "rule breaking" are the ones with "next to no impact on the game", I don't see why you'd be the one to consult about what's healthy for the game or not. You can't establish any new interactions if you're forced to do the same things over and over again.

3TWarriorJan 16, 20191 votes

#you can create new interactions, but you don't need to FORCE change and SHOULDN'T force changes

Every champion has damage that they can use to break a shield and most champions have something that gives them a mild advantage

mechanics which are devoid of interaction have been periodically nerfed to the extreme or changed

Ashe's permaslow used to discourage any interaction, so they changed that

evelynn's former permanent stealth was too strong, so they nerfed her repeatedly until she was an obscure champion choice to play and her less than optimal kit accommodated for the PERMANENT advantage she had with stealth and sustain

while i'm not a fan of the change, Mordekaiser used to be a lane bully in EVERY matchup with his Q allowing him to poke down opponents instantly if they were in range of a minion while also providing good wave clear. Amid other obscurities, he was a very strong champion even when no one played him, but riot changed him around to be less oppressive to his opponent

Those are some examples of positive changes.

here are champions that have not changed: Yasuo: completely destroys any interaction from ranged opponents for 4 whole seconds to his entire team and has the power to negate even ultimates on a basic ability cooldown

Irelia can do absolutely everything in one kit. she has: sustain, poke damage, zoning, area of effect, range, wave clear, spam, durability and crowd control all in a kit with decent damage and scalings that allow her to build almost as she likes

akali: ignores the one rule that every other stealth champion has followed for the sake of healthy gameplay

Zoe : Every other champion has to wait 3 to 6 minutes for their summoners and usually a minute to 2 minutes for item actives. Zoe only has to wait until an opponent uses their actives or she gets lucky with a minion balloon and in addition to that, a large part of her damage is true damage on top of long-range burst spell

Gangplank: now is a lane bully with very little interaction unless you have ranged auto attacks because he can cause poke damage at will with his barrels before any melee can even get close to his second charge before it is detonated

Let's take an older design for reference: Singed He's never allowed to be "too" strong but has an interesting yet binary gameplay design of "can you follow him or not" , able to take down squishy targets but dealing negligible damage to durable targets. While it could be said that no one can follow singed, that is not true and even during this period, his damage is spread out over a long duration

While Singed has incredible durability, he has next to no map or team battle pressure and in order to build damage, he has to compromise at least a portion of his durability

chipndip1Jan 17, 20191 votes

{quoted}

#you can create new interactions, but you don't need to FORCE change and SHOULDN'T force changes

Every champion has damage that they can use to break a shield and most champions have something that gives them a mild advantage

mechanics which are devoid of interaction have been periodically nerfed to the extreme or changed

Ashe's permaslow used to discourage any interaction, so they changed that

evelynn's former permanent stealth was too strong, so they nerfed her repeatedly until she was an obscure champion choice to play and her less than optimal kit accommodated for the PERMANENT advantage she had with stealth and sustain

while i'm not a fan of the change, Mordekaiser used to be a lane bully in EVERY matchup with his Q allowing him to poke down opponents instantly if they were in range of a minion while also providing good wave clear. Amid other obscurities, he was a very strong champion even when no one played him, but riot changed him around to be less oppressive to his opponent

Those are some examples of positive changes.

here are champions that have not changed: Yasuo: completely destroys any interaction from ranged opponents for 4 whole seconds to his entire team and has the power to negate even ultimates on a basic ability cooldown

Irelia can do absolutely everything in one kit. she has: sustain, poke damage, zoning, area of effect, range, wave clear, spam, durability and crowd control all in a kit with decent damage and scalings that allow her to build almost as she likes

akali: ignores the one rule that every other stealth champion has followed for the sake of healthy gameplay

: Every other champion has to wait 3 to 6 minutes for their summoners and usually a minute to 2 minutes for item actives. Zoe only has to wait until an opponent uses their actives or she gets lucky with a minion balloon and in addition to that, a large part of her damage is true damage on top of long-range burst spell

Gangplank: now is a lane bully with very little interaction unless you have ranged auto attacks because he can cause poke damage at will with his barrels before any melee can even get close to his second charge before it is detonated

Let's take an older design for reference: He's never allowed to be "too" strong but has an interesting yet binary gameplay design of "can you follow him or not" , able to take down squishy targets but dealing negligible damage to durable targets. While it could be said that no one can follow singed, that is not true and even during this period, his damage is spread out over a long duration

While Singed has incredible durability, he has next to no map or team battle pressure and in order to build damage, he has to compromise at least a portion of his durability

Like, one second you're defending Irelia's shield breaking passive, which no one can do but her, and the next second you're bashing Akali's obscurity, which no one can do but her. This is even before actually delving into the post to respond properly.

Look, I don't play favorites. You apparently do. Going back and forth here won't lead to anything because your biases are already this extreme. If you think you're accomplishing something by sticking up for a useless "unique ability" like Irelia's shield damage while despising a bunch of other unique characteristics that actually create a difference in game play, I'll leave you to do that on your own.

3TWarriorJan 18, 20191 votes

know a key difference between a passive that does damage and the champions I mentioned? You can play around the damage, but you can not play around champions that leave you at their mercy. Akali can not be revealed unless she reveals herself and RIOT HAD TO REWRITE THE BASE CODE OF THE GAME IN ORDER TO GIVE HER "SOME" COUNTERPLAY TO HER ABILITY and even then they still chose not to fix the original issue in the first place: that she does not play by the same rules as other stealth champions

Yasuo holds the flow of the match entirely in his team's favor. Any engage or counter-attack projectile can be nullified by his wind wall and it does not hinder his team members in the same way. He is able to NEGATE the potential of the MAJORITY OF RANGED CHAMPIONS for 4 seconds...

I don't "play favorites" , I notice what is healthy or unhealthy for the game based on the rules that EVERY CHAMPION has followed. Some of these champions, let's say they were playing dodgeball, Yasuo is up, "oh, i'm not out, I pressed W and was immune to all balls for 4 seconds..."

let's say akali's playing baseball, "I can steal that base even though everyone else has to return to their previous base when the ball is caught before it touches the ground"

Zoe is playing poker, "haha! Four Aces!" Other person, "Hey, I have Two of the aces!" "Oh, didn't you get the memo? there are six aces now and two of them are always mine"

#Being creative and unique is one thing, but not if it's at the expense of their opponents gameplay because it provides an unprecedented advantage...

chipndip1Jan 18, 20191 votes

{quoted}

#Being creative and unique is one thing, but not if it's at the expense of their opponents gameplay because it provides an unprecedented advantage...

Somehow, this man believes he doesn't play favorites.

He then says that any unique kit interactions that makes a champion's opponent play differently is "bad".

There's too many examples of why this is complete hogwash for one person to have to go through it all. Whether it's Ivern splitting buffs into two and making bushes anywhere on the rift, to certain champions suppressing or punishing dashes, to champs like Shen that just negates all auto-attacks for his entire team as long as they're near him. Nope, use this bullshit "da rulez" excuse to pick on specific champions while letting others slide, but "We ain't biased out here".

Like, Idk what you're expecting...for me to say "Oh, he's right. The RULES OF THE GAME declare that no champion shall block a projectile attack. Looks like Yasuo is a sin of champion design."? Where's the rule of the game that says "Doing triple damage to shields is okie dokie."?

3TWarriorJan 18, 20191 votes

"grounded" effects or poppy's defensive circle do not prevent the champion from utilizing their kit. These effects are harshest against targeted dashes, but in most cases champions that rely on dashes have additional tools in their kit to survive with and in cases of untargeted dashes, said champions always have the ability to reposition to their advantage or to target someone not in the area of effect of grounded

grounded does not completely negate their ability to play

windwall: negates the ability to play invisibility: negates the opponent's ability to play, hence why it HAS ALWAYS HAD WEAKNESSES ACCOMPANYING IT BUT RIOT THINKS THAT IT'S A GOOD IDEA TO REMOVE THOSE WEAKNESSES FOR SOME REASON

zoe: summoner spells and item actives, THE MOST POWERFUL EFFECTS IN THE GAME...and she gets them for free with bonus damage tacked on top...how is that fair?

Shen's auto attack circle is very small and lasts for 1.75 seconds while only affecting auto attacks, AND it only works ON TOP OF HIS SPIRIT BLADE. That effect is nothing compared to yasuo's windwall, which affects both auto attacks and abiilties, lasts for 4 seconds, is a larger area of effect, prevents ANYTHING FROM PASSING THROUGH IT REGARDLESS OF ALLY LOCATION, has an instant cast time and i'm sure i've missed something for it...

shen presses a button and if he's on top of his spirit sword, allies are protected from auto attacks. Yasuo presses a button and you have to run away or pray you don't die because only one or two members of your team ARE ALLOWED TO FIGHT AT ALL for 4 seconds

#there are no hard-written rules, but Riot had a system in place for years to keep out intrusive content because it would be like having a gun in a knife fight

you are straw-manning in an attempt to justify reckless decisions. You did not even attempt to look at it how I provided the examples above. You know what ANYONE WOULD CALL THOSE PLAYERS? Cheaters...or you know how they wouldn't call them a cheater? IF THEIR POWER BUDGET WERE SO CRIPPLED BY THE WEIGHT OF THEIR DRASTIC ADVANTAGE THAT IT EVENED OUT AND WAS A RARE EXPERIENCE

yasuo has a 20% play rate and high ban rate, Akali is still banned around half the time, zoe has fallen out of favor, but do you know the reason why? Because there are WORSE problems to deal with

#Riot is spiraling and making dangerous decisions for the health of their game and seem content ignoring any and all feedback to improve designs that they created. Some players want features removed, others want them changed to be FAIR TO PLAY AGAINST

TheLegendaddyJan 15, 20193 votes

it's fine to load champs kits like this...as long as every champ has a ton to their kit and they all feel capable. That is not the case, instead of reworking all of the old champs to bring them up to the same complexity as the new ones. They're leaving them to rot and keep releasing overloaded champs. Higher traffic on new champ releases versus old champ VGU would be my guess. Any decision they make is gonna be motivated by da cash money.

Fízz v2Jan 15, 20192 votes

Idk about the disarm, but the shield damage can go imo.

Riots response to "assassins are falling out of meta because they cant do anything against shields" was basically "alright, we will give this new bruiser extra damage to shields, and this other new bruiser can halve shields xd!"

Exin0Jan 15, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Fízz v2,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=rMRN6IZw,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-01-15T17:51:22.914+0000)

Idk about the disarm, but the shield damage can go imo.

Riots response to "assassins are falling out of meta because they cant do anything against shields" was basically "alright, we will give this new bruiser extra damage to shields, and this other new bruiser can halve shields xd!"

i see it like this. they nerf something dispense buffs against nerfed thing and let it there no matter if reason for nerf or buff dont exist anymore. shield shreding or invalidating abilities should be thing during ardent meta ant not introduce them after shield, enchancers and whole support class nerfs

Free RollJan 16, 20191 votes

Uhm first off they didn't do what people ask per say they are doing it to one mega OP broken champ. Secondly Please stop equating all of the people who abuse irelia crying she is being nerfed with "the boards complaining". This is the problem with people like you, which is failing to realize the "boards" are not some homogeneous group of people, its the sum total of players who all have different likes dislikes etc... some are ADC, some are top mains, some are jungles, some play everything, some like mobility, some hate mobility etc...

Seriously you have to be a mental midget to not understand why the "boards" are constantly disagreeing when its the most obvious certainty that they will almost always disagree. Its thousands of random people with different interests/like/dislikes/styles/preferences all jockeying to promote what they like and condemn what they dislike...DUh.