https://i.gyazo.com/a1b8ffd0b07d83049b8ba6338fc56cdf.gif Yeah well... you are a tank, you arent supposed to kill me in 1 combo because you finished a Sunfire Cape https://openclipart.org/image/2400px/svg_to_png/222252/feels.png
Marshbouy18 votesI just want to point out that 2 months ago this post would be at -10 right now
Weathered14 votesTo be fair he is two levels ahead of you. Tanks ahead of adcs is always aids.
Penns31 votesI mean, its not exactly rare for a top laner to be ahead in exp of a champ that has been laning 2v2 in 1 lane lol.
Ralanr5 votesWell yeah, and since they have higher base damage per level then they're going to hurt more.
Plus if it's an ADC vs sunfire, it's going to hurt a lot because ADCs don't have scaling magic resist per level.
Penns7 votesBut the question is... why cant tanks just tank and be cc machines? I dont see why they also need to burst carries down. They should win 1v1 against adcs until late game but not by bursting them down almost as fast as assassins without the risk of getting crit 5 times and dying.
Ralanr20 votesBut the question is... why cant tanks just tank and be cc machines? I dont see why they also need to burst carries down. They should win 1v1 against adcs until late game but not by bursting them down almost as fast as assassins without the risk of getting crit 5 times and dying.
Because we actually have to fight people like Riven in top lane. We need to fight, and possibly win.
If a tank is just a durable CC machine (and I'm talking shit damage) them they'd basically be regulated to a support role. And no offense, but if that's what you want then on behalf of every top/jungle tank main I say fuck you.
Penns1 votesThey could just farm top and then be useful later with cc, which is basically what they do now even if they lose, or get some new mechanic that makes them useful without damage. But I guess that would require a pretty big tank rework.
Ralanr7 votesThey could just farm top and then be useful later with cc, which is basically what they do now even if they lose, or get some new mechanic that makes them useful without damage. But I guess that would require a pretty big tank rework.
The damage is what helps them farm top anyway. Honestly if the time it takes for a tank to kill you, everyone else does it faster.
IMO you need to reduce damage across the game in general because it is getting ridiculous.
Teémò4 votesyou don't pick a tank to destroy them, if your to tanky for her she can't snowball the idea of tanks is to just farm and then get to team fights and roam, and that is actually what tanks are in basically everygame they're there to absorb the damage not do the damage too, that's why with party quests in other games the idea of teamwork becomes absolete, why should I play with friends when I can solo kill it because I don't need them xd.
Ralanr7 votesYou don't pick a tank to absolutely destroy, nor do you pick a tank to just have an entire laning phase of getting absolutely shat on as an early/mid game class.
Apocalypsic1 votesBut in all honesty you should worry about the champs with inbuilt armor pen top lane when you play tanks
Ralanr2 votesAll I can think of is Darius, who is worrisome.
Aptest3 votesyeah, about that...
most people do not wants to play someone who's entire experience in lane is to stand there like a mook and wait for teleport to come online and then sacrifice his own tower for a maybe play that comes once every 4 min.
That shit's just boring.
ZephyrDrake2 votesBut the question is... why cant tanks just tank and be cc machines? I dont see why they also need to burst carries down. They should win 1v1 against adcs until late game but not by bursting them down almost as fast as assassins without the risk of getting crit 5 times and dying.
because then they'll be able to essentially make you unable to do anything by locking you down constantly or they'll just be completely ignored once they use their combos on you since why would you care about them? they need damage to be relevant threats. I also have no idea why you even let a Naut get that close to you to begin with
Dreadlocks2 votesHe was only 1 lvl higher when the fight started. :)
rtbf2216514122 votesTo be fair he is two levels ahead of you. Tanks ahead of adcs is always aids.
I mean, this assumes the tanks damage are scaling harder than ADC per level, which is dumb in itself.
Weathered9 votesWell... they do. That's why adc's are a duo lane, they don't depend on levels they depend on gold income and farm. A tank with a two level advantage has that much more advantage because tanks inherently have bad scaling and good base stats, which is increased from leveling.
rtbf2216514121 votesWell... they do. That's why adc's are a duo lane, they don't depend on levels they depend on gold income and farm. A tank with a two level advantage has that much more advantage because tanks inherently have bad scaling and good base stats, which is increased from leveling.
I didn't say it was false?
Weathered3 votesMy point was that it makes sense and is not "dumb in itself".
Ralanr5 votes...no that's not dumb. That's intended because ADCs scale shit with levels and scale better with items.
That's why they are in a duo lane to get more money!
rtbf2216514121 votes...no that's not dumb. That's intended because ADCs scale shit with levels and scale better with items.
That's why they are in a duo lane to get more money!
Even with items they have issues tanking down tanks when they should be able to melt them easier than other roles?
Ralanr5 votesThey need the right items to melt down tanks. Not building to fight a tank is like building all MR against a full AD team and complaining about how you keep dying quickly.
rtbf2216514121 votesThey need the right items to melt down tanks. Not building to fight a tank is like building all MR against a full AD team and complaining about how you keep dying quickly.
Duh? Even then?
Ralanr3 votesWell idk, not many people build LDR until their 4th item. Which is usually when they're behind as an adc.
When the enemy adc does build it, tanky champions do start to fall. Granted not as fast as others, but that's kinda the point of a tank.
rtbf2216514121 votesWell idk, not many people build LDR until their 4th item. Which is usually when they're behind as an adc.
When the enemy adc does build it, tanky champions do start to fall. Granted not as fast as others, but that's kinda the point of a tank.
Well yeah. The point was they do a lot of damage for tanks though.
Ralanr4 votesNot really. When comparing how much a bruiser hurts 1v1, tanks are actually weaker. It's just that squishy characters don't notice the difference because they die easily to everything.
Sort of how I don't notice the difference between a late game MF and Jinx.
rtbf2216514121 votesNot really. When comparing how much a bruiser hurts 1v1, tanks are actually weaker. It's just that squishy characters don't notice the difference because they die easily to everything.
Sort of how I don't notice the difference between a late game MF and Jinx.
We are comparing how much tankiness they have and how much damage they do with that tankiness?
Ralanr4 votesIt's relative. To an ADC, practically anything hurts. It's not that tanks are doing too much damage (though I won't disagree that Maokai's %max health damage is too reliable) it's that ADC's are so fucking squishy that NOTHING does not seem like piss poor damage.
Everything is dangerous to a glass cannon. That's the downside of being made of glass.
rtbf2216514121 votesIt's relative. To an ADC, practically anything hurts. It's not that tanks are doing too much damage
Go Malphite AP and tell me otherwise.
Ralanr6 votesGo Malphite AP and tell me otherwise.
Ok, I'll build full AP Malphite and burst people 1v5 because I went FULL AP DAMAGE AND NOT DURABILITY
"I'm going to argue that tanks are doing too much damage by providing an example of a full damage build tank!"
That's dumb. That's really, really, dumb.
Ralanr3 votesI think your stupid for not realizing it's his scalings that are an issue. I never said he's scalings were an issue. I honestly don't think Malphite should have 100% AP scaling on his ult.
Especially when he shouldn't even build AP in the first place. Outside of he should have no AP items and just go armor/mr.
I'm talking about bases on tanks being high for a reason. I actually do not give a shit if they have low bases (Which normally, they do! Or at least should! Only have decent scalings on abilities that are hard to hit!). Their AP scalings should not be high at all, but because they are, their full AP builds are very squishy.
But this isn't even about tanks building damage, so why bring that up like it was a part of the discussion?
Ralanr4 votesIt's an extreme example that presents his scalings and shows how much AP he needs to do even a little bit of damage. You really that slow?
Except we weren't even talking about them building damage in the first place. People are complaining that tanks do too much damage while building full tank.
Ralanr3 votes"Yeah well... you are a tank, you arent supposed to kill me in 1 combo because you finished a Sunfire Cape"
Read before you post. This was OP.
I did read. I argued against that because base damage are high for a reason and squishies are squishy (plus the Draven was also very far behind).
I don't get why you brought up going full AP Malphite in arguing tanks do too much damage. Full AP supports even hurt.
LuxannaVeritas6 votesLet me input my own two cents here.
Tanks, in theory, are meant to be defeated when 3-4 people on the enemy team are focusing them in the late game. They should NEVER fall to a single opponent when even or ahead, with the only exception being 
(because Vayne).
With that being said, tanks should not have enough damage to fully 100-0 their LANE opponent. For instance, a duel between Wukong and Maokai around level 10 should go in no one's favor because Maokai would get Wukong somewhat low, and Wukong would not have enough damage to get through his defenses.
I am perfectly fine with top-lane tanks being able to duel ADCs and mages and WIN, because unless you are ahead dueling a tank is STUPID in the mid-game. They're supposed to be tanky, AND have enough damage to successfully clear in top lane. With Nautilus, he clears with his Riptide. That skill has a reasonable amount of power. His ultimate and Q are mostly used for trading, so those are supposed to have good amount of damage as well. Take the damage away from those skills, and you're basically relegating him to a support tank, which he SHOULDN'T be.
Late game, when Draven has all of his items and the rest of his team, he should have more success against the Nautilus. In short, tanks that belong in the top lane are justified for having that kind of damage, because otherwise they wouldn't be able to lane against skirmishers, juggernauts, and divers.
rtbf2216514121 votesLet me input my own two cents here.
With that being said, tanks should not have enough damage to fully 100-0 their LANE opponent. For instance, a duel between Wukong and Maokai around level 10 should go in no one's favor because Maokai would get Wukong somewhat low, and Wukong would not have enough damage to get through his defenses.
Yet this is where the issue lies?
Either way, they are still doing too much damage.
Ralanr3 votesTanks don't 100-0 their lane opponent. It's much more grindy (though not as grindy as you'd expect).
rtbf2216514121 votesTanks don't 100-0 their lane opponent. It's much more grindy (though not as grindy as you'd expect).
May not be 100 but it's ridiculous.
Ralanr4 votesHonestly I blame the damage creep. But I'm also a Sion main and he's suppose to have good damage for a tank.
BluePolarizer1 votesADCs have absolutely no trouble dealing with tanks once they have items.
A 4 item ADC against anything except Rammus or Malphite is going to chunk them hard in a few autos. Shit, I've been 6 item Jarvan or Hecarim and still died to a team with 4 item (non-Vayne non-Kog) ADC just because 
is already a full DPS build - any extra items just make it easier to BURST tanks rather than MELT them.
rtbf2216514121 votesADCs have absolutely no trouble dealing with tanks once they have items.
A 4 item ADC against anything except Rammus or Malphite is going to chunk them hard in a few autos. Shit, I've been 6 item Jarvan or Hecarim and still died to a team with 4 item (non-Vayne non-Kog) ADC just because
Dude, I've done a 1 v 5 as a tank and came out winning. I beg to differ.
Tanks just need 
BluePolarizer1 votesgets 1 shot by Syndra. I don't know what elo you play in tho, but since I don't see a badge, I think it's the elo where AD Soraka and Rengar ADC can stomp and where people go to make montage videos.
rtbf2216514121 votesgets 1 shot by Syndra. I don't know what elo you play in tho, but since I don't see a badge, I think it's the elo where AD Soraka and Rengar ADC can stomp and where people go to make montage videos.
Because Syndra is clearly an ADC.
BluePolarizer1 votestanks don't get to itemize against 1 champ only in any realistic games outside bronze/silver.
rtbf2216514121 votestanks don't get to itemize against 1 champ only in any realistic games outside bronze/silver.
If the team is mostly AD, why not build that?
If they are mostly AP, you clearly would build differently.
I swear you can't understand anything.
BluePolarizer1 votesYou talked about 1v5. In typical elos the enemy team won't be full AD.
I'm looking forward to the next smurf montage video from your elo tho.
rtbf2216514121 votesYou talked about 1v5. In typical elos the enemy team won't be full AD.
I'm looking forward to the next smurf montage video from your elo tho.
I never said that team was full ad. Great strawman yet again. Mostly = all confirmed.
LordGeovanni2 votessure a melee class sclaing harder than a ranged class is bad because why would you want melee to ever be a thing while you can stand in a safer place and claim more skills
Sraeg201313 votesAll I can see is an ADC with 0 kills, multiple deaths, behind in CS, a 
, 
and maybe a , possibly 
or .
Pretty sure anybody who haven't lost their lane can 100-0 that.
The Bardic Gay11 votesThe Nautilus is clearly ahead and used every single spell in his kit, hell, he even used one twice.
Draven lead his own axes into melee range. He deserved absolutely every single thing that happened to him there.
Critmaster Garen9 votesyoure not supposed to 1v1 the tank who locks you down with cc.
especially not on a champion like draven who relies on constant movement to be fully effective.
