We need another AP+armor item

Meanwhile AP only has one item worth calling overloaded and AD has a better grevious wounds passive not requiring them to bring their hp to 35%

You could consider really strong but the passive is kinda useless. AD takes towers, takes down tanks because of their penetration items, they get lifesteal, the only spot ap really has is to have some ap on the team so the enemy tank can't just build full armor.

> and flat pen was kinda their thing but now there's lethality, and the lethality items actually have more armor pen than the magic pen ones and come with actives.

The only way to get like 700+ AP to actually burst people down is to build full damage without any defensive items, but even then AD can do the same except with defensive items such as

Also all those AD+AR items...

Before the "mage update" there was so much diversity in AP items. Now its completely awful.

Youre also talking about a 6 item build that costs less than 16000 gold. Thats like, tank-stats cheap. You dont go GLP into Zhonyas if youre looking for raw damage output. Mages can also hit the same 350 AP with 2 items - Morello and Deathcap (and runes and masteries). When youre looking for damage, Morello+Deathcap+Void is the most powerful 3 item spike you can reasonably get (Seraphs + Deathcap + Void gets you more AP at the expense of CDR).

No, you wont end up with a lot of AP if you decide to purchase the 5 lowest AP-giving items in the game. Just like how you wont end up with a lot of AD if you purchase the 5 lowest-AD giving items in the game, or you wont end up with a lot of armor if you purchase 5 of the lowest-Armor giving items in the game.

Riot seems to have this huge hardon for reducing mages AP until mages only get the same amount of AP as AD champions get AD.

Exactly, but AP and AD are not equal. AP is only as good as the ratios of a champion, whereas AD is straight up AA damage and occasionally additional AD ratios.

"Balance above all else."

What everyone here is conveniently forgetting is that the game is balanced around everyone having a MR option. AD and AP champions alike have a very strong anti AP item - but only AP champions have an anti AD item. As a matter of fact there is not a single AD+AR item while AP champions get Zhonyas which is strill super strong with arguably the best active in the game. Seeing how you are familiar with the concept of the game being balanced around itemization you should understand is that AP champions are balanced not only around Sorcerer boots, but also around their enemy having a MR item. AD champions, however, are balanced around non-tanks not having armor items, but AP champions have Zhonyas granting them an inhernet advantage. And while that is clearly an advantage for AP champions it's completely fair: the reason for it is probably that the AD midlaners we have counter several mages in terms of 1v1 so hard that they need Zhonyas to simply survive the lane.

There is no reason to mourn the AD MR itemization, the correct complaint is the lack of AP MR options. Since the Athenes changes AP champions lost an AP MR option which is really awkward for some of them.

{quoted}

AD casters (mages) dont rely on boots as a significant source of damage, and they are balanced around tht, unlike AP mages who take a considerable damage nerf unelss they buy meanwhile it feels like mages are balanced around that 15 Mpen; if they dont buy it, their damage is significantly limited

on top of that, AD casters get multiple defensive/offensive anti-AP hybrid options of (in addition to ),

while AP caster get one of the same - . even more unfair is that mini maw is so powerful that you can buy it and never complete it to receive its effectiveness

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not asking for much, but just ONE more not entirely defense anti-AD item for AP users would feel wonderful

To be fair, most AP mages are ranged, while AD casters aren't. AP Mages already get the safety of range and being inside their team, protected by their support and front line.

Didn't know that Randuins is an AD item, TIL.

No that would be a super bad idea. The way itemization works is generally to balance out some unbalanced behaviour that occur between differet champion types.

AP champions are very weak against tanks as they have mana costs on their damage and generally don't have much DPS (the exceptions are balanced in their kits and not in their items) so that's why there are only 2 MR items for tanks. If there were more they'd simply ignore mages especially seeing how Void Staff works.

AD (carries) are very strong against tanks due to the high DPS their autoattacks provide which is why tanks have a lot of armor options. The "new" last whisper sadly works on bonus armor so that's weird tho.

AD (casters) are much less useful than most mages, but they counter them in 1v1 in midlane which is why AP champions have Zhonyas to survive the lane. On the contrary there are no AD AR items because they'd be somewhat awkward (should they cater to casters or carries? how will that affect the balance of one of those classes and if we then buffed that class would they become too strong against AP?) so AD is balanced around your squieshy opponents not building much AR.

BTW, have you ever played a tank in ARAM against a full AP team? It's hilarious, once you hit 3 items you are basically invincible.

ADs can remove CC using or , or block it using and the only "survivability" mages have besides shields (and only few mages have those) is CC.

No.

Putting yourself in stasis for a shorter duration can actually be a buff, not a nerf.

Skilled players could just dodge an ultimate, e.g. Veigar 2000 stack ult.

How about this: UNIQUE -- STASIS: After a 3 second delay, put yourself in stasis for 2.5 seconds, rendering yourself untargetable and invulnerable for the duration, but also unable to move, attack, cast spells, or use items during this time. You are slowed by 20% during the delay, increasing to 100% by the end.