Make Ziggs weaker early but stronger late

astralwit··5 votes·505 views

I find Ziggs' early quite good if they're near minions but nothing special if they play properly. His pushing power is also pretty average early. He's not the type of champion to really solo kill competent laners (unlike Xerath for example who absolutely can) so I think he needs a better late game to make up for it. Some power can be taken off his annoying early game. For example, take 10 damage off Q but make it scale 10% higher with AP.

8 Comments

SB Arneeman1 votes

Dealing 2400 dmg with 1 auto attack to objectives is not exactly what I define as a weak lategame. He's pretty balanced in his current state, it's just that poke/siege mages doesn't fit very well in a hypercarry adc meta.

astralwit1 votes

[{quoted}](name=SB Arneeman,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qHNt51WJ,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-09-22T12:01:50.730+0000)

Dealing 2400 dmg with 1 auto attack to objectives is not exactly what I define as a weak lategame. He's pretty balanced in his current state, it's just that poke/siege mages doesn't fit very well in a hypercarry adc meta.

It's not quite that high and most of the time it hardly makes a difference. You usually win because your team won a fight and those turrets etc. you'd take just a couple seconds slower.

His theoretical damage and useful damage are very different things since you're not playing vs bots. They will waste your CDs, kite, dodge, gap close etc. Moreover, unlike Xerath or Ahri, his Q will usually either be easily dodged in standoffs or hit only the frontline. If I get a Sej. jg though, I agree that Ziggs late is pretty good. She can make you land everything and it's amazing. On the other hand, if they have an Eve or Shaco with a few kills, I'll probably get bursted moments after the teamfight starts even after Zhona's. We rarely have the whole fight area pinked or enough wards.

SB Arneeman1 votes

Ziggs deals pretty good damage to the frontline though, and can kite them well. As long as your melees can engage on the enemy squishies, they are pretty easy to kill since your ult deals a lot of dmg to them. It falls off a bit if they ge locket + redemption, but you can still easily kite with E and W. You don't want to pick Ziggs against all teamcomps though.

Ahris1 votes

Ziggs have a lot of damage lategame

ViciousSummoner1 votes

Ziggs is really weak early game as it is right now. Ziggs doesn't start to become strong until about 1600-1800g. Ziggs' only early power spike is at about 900g when you can buy item 3802 to get mana sustain and at this point you can clear waves easier by doing E + Q combo on the waves. Even with this he's still very weak to most mid laners who have good wave clear, engage, and better burst potential. Ziggs' only redeeming value is that he can break turrets incredibly fast once he gets his sheen/lych bane.

Generally you go item 3165 > item 3100 or you go item 3165 > item 3020 > item 3057 it just depends how well you're doing. Ziggs is also best played with summoner 4 summoner 12 so you can utilize your lane pressure and split pushing. You can play summoner 14 summoner 21 summoner 7 summoner 3 summoner 1 but in doing so you lose a lot of pressure in securing towers just for a slightly better laning phase.

SwiftKitten882 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lego Steve,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qHNt51WJ,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-09-22T22:03:46.966+0000)

Ziggs is really weak early game as it is right now. Ziggs doesn't start to become strong until about 1600-1800g. Ziggs' only early power spike is at about 900g when you can buy item 3802 to get mana sustain and at this point you can clear waves easier by doing E + Q combo on the waves. Even with this he's still very weak to most mid laners who have good wave clear, engage, and better burst potential. Ziggs' only redeeming value is that he can break turrets incredibly fast once he gets his sheen/lych bane.

Generally you go item 3165 > item 3100 or you go item 3165 > item 3020 > item 3057 it just depends how well you're doing. Ziggs is also best played with summoner 4 summoner 12 so you can utilize your lane pressure and split pushing. You can play summoner 14 summoner 21 summoner 7 summoner 3 summoner 1 but in doing so you lose a lot of pressure in securing towers just for a slightly better laning phase.

I'm glad to see even after i have stopped playing mid lane for over a year the exact same Ziggs build and summoners are still the best.

now if only i didnt become complete shit at CSing by maining jungle and support XD

ViciousSummoner1 votes

Ziggs is really just a cheese at this point. You just really only pick him if you want to make it look like you know what you're doing. Team: You're 0-9-0. You: Yeah, but I've got the most towers. Team: ...

astralwit1 votes

{quoted}

I'm glad to see even after i have stopped playing mid lane for over a year the exact same Ziggs build and summoners are still the best.

now if only i didnt become complete shit at CSing by maining jungle and support XD

The most common build is Morello -> Luden's or Liandry's. The Sheen build is probably only if you're vs melees, weak laners or already took your turret and want to roam to take move.

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