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A Detailed Post on Karma and her Twin Dragons

SilverSquid·4/26/2016, 6:37:58 PM·329 votes·27,556 views

Hi there, welcome to one of my indepth Karma posts. This one is about Karma, twin dragons, some HIDDEN DATA, balance and a rework. Feel free to skip to any part, or this whole thread, if you are not interested. For all those who continue reading, let's start with a few basics to warm you up:

If you wanna know why I am doing this, read up on my poem "I used to main Karma".

So now I am here, writing posts every week, complaining and highlighting why Karma (to me) feels bleak, I don't want to be mean, so I try to be constructive, and write in form of analysis, reworks and updates.

If you think that Karma has no problems in terms of design, feel free to disagree with Lead Champion Designer Meddler, who wrote;

Revised Karma's a more functional, healthy champion, but also in many ways a pretty bland one, with a lot of tools on her kit that feel too familiar, even if there's some interesting nuance to their use. I wouldn't say she was weak, I'd certainly agree she wasn't sufficiently satisfying or distinct though.

This becomes increasingly problematic, if you consider that those weren't problems ignored by the rework, but introduced by it. You can also check out Meelan's insightful post about how Karma's update was incomplete from a STYLISTIC point of view. A short summary:

  • Unfinished animations (E used to have a casting animation)
  • No unique dance (half of Shen's dance)
  • No haste animation, on a frequently MS buffing champion (whereas the next champ in line, Sejuani, did get one)
  • Mantra sentence has been cut. She now literally says "Sae Eleisa Tera Vi" which means "Discover the meaning of...". She used to say "Phyla!" (Tranquility), "Jia!" (Pain) or "Saera!" (Magic)

If all of this didn't convince you yet, let me try to paint the picture here.

Does Karma Need a Rework

In terms of power? No. Karma is one of the most buff resistanc champions in the history of league. Nearly a dozen direct buffs and not a single direct nerf, yet she barely ever exceeded the 50% winrate. Karma's kit has so much counterplay to it, that overbuffing is basically a nonfactor. In her current state she isn't and can't become a threat to the game or the meta. Even when having broken items or talents, other champions become more of a problem (tank karma was obnoxious, but not nearly as problematic as tank Ekko and tank Fizz).

In terms of design Oh dear, yes. Karma has no niche. She exceeds in nothing. She has poke, burst, sustained damage, a shield, a heal, decent mobility, CC, group protection, group utility, true vision, slows and decent waveclear. She needs CDR and mana, because she needs to spam, she has decent base damages, but penetration will leave her utility lacking, her W requires tank stats and RW encourages that, while she could use AP in every aspect of her kit, but doesn't scale excessively with it. So even her builds are all over the place. To be a decent champion, one needs propper strenghts and weaknesses. Not having clear weaknesses makes enemies frustrated and clueless, not having propper strenghts makes finding a reason to pick her a chore. Without them, champions aren't tangeable and feel bland.

This was one of the problems with her rework in 3.5 Instead of highlighting Karma's strengths as a battlemage with enchanter qualities, Riot added range, CC and group protection. They failed at giving her direction. They made most Karma fans not even recognize Karma anymore. And they also took away her fanweapons.

And this is more of a problem, than you might think. Let me show you:

Visual Identity

Lux --> Light. Annie --> Fire. Sona --> Music. Malzahar --> Void(lings). Xerath --> Electricity. Karma --> ....

Every champion has a weapon, that defines them. This is to give them clear roles, while also allowing future champions to be different to them. It would be really boring, if all mages had just differently colored "magic". It ought to have a certain flavour. Watch Necrit's amazing video for more info on visual identity.

Karma doesn't have anything. Is it "soul magic"? It doesn't feel or play like it. It's just colors. But what if I told you, that she USED TO have a weapon, that propperly replaced her lost fans. That wouldn't leave her feeling "empty". Weapons, that could be seen in her concept art down below. Take a quick gander!

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/zrHgmN6uoto/maxresdefault.jpg

Yes, that's right; the twindragons in her crest were to be used as her casting animations, forming around her hands and shooting at her foes. This should've been apparant in her LORE too. And guess what: It already was IN THE GAMEFILES. And thanks to the user URACLE I found out too! Here, take a look:

New Friends from Long ago

http://i.imgur.com/foJ6eeR.png?1

This is Ouro. He's been in Karma's data since her rework. Of course he doesn't have an official name, but that's what I call him. And he inspired me to give Karma a propper rework. Currently her kit seems so rushed; no proper passive, W is stolen from LeBlanc, her kit's stat synergies are all over the place, she has nothing unique in her kit and she doesn't have a niche. She even gets outdone as a "jack-of-all-trades utility mage" by Lulu.

I tried to make her fit somewhere. For that, I used Karma's twindragons Ouru and Boros to create a thematic identity and the idea of karma (punish evil doers, protect the weak) to compose a damage/health manipulating mage, akin to her current form, but more distinct and cohesive.

Before we do this, a short note though:

http://cdn.muslimmatters.org/wp-content/uploads/ouroboros-design.jpg

The ouroboros (...) is an ancient symbol depicting a serpent or dragon eating its own tail. [It] often symbolizes self-reflexivity or cyclicality, especially in the sense of something constantly re-creating itself, the eternal return, and other things such as the phoenix which operate in cycles that begin anew as soon as they end.

Ouroboros is the serpent that bites its own tail and probably the origin for both the infinity symbol ∞ and Yin-Yang ☯. Arguably it could've also inspired the Ionian crest, which is why I think it's so fitting to name the twindragons after him. They symbolize balance, infintiy, wholeness and duality.

Both, for stylistic and gameplay reasons, Ouru and Boros need different colors. Here are my suggestsions;

Name - Ouru color / Boros color Classic - Turquoise / Purple Traditional - White / Black Sakura - White / Green Sun Goddess - Yellow / Green Order of the Lotus - White-Gold / Pink-Gold Warden - Light Blue / Metal -Silver

And now to the more interesting stuff; actual game design!

Creating a Kit

Currently, Karma's "Gathering Fire" is a joke of a passive. Nearly every other passive in the game adds something to the character and sets the ground theme, like Anivia reviving, Brand setting people ablaze, Thresh collecting souls, etc. (just imagine them without those). Being aggressive and hitting enemies as much as possible doesn't only NOT fit Karma's character, it is also SO underwhelming thematicly, that Karma mains usually wish it would be just nerfed and moved to the ultimate, in order to give Karma a real one.

This is where Ouro and Boros come into play. They make for a nice passive! They could grant Karma their power, but in alternating ways. I imagined them as whirling from Karma's crest to her arms (right for Boros or left for Ouru), whenever she casts a spell. It makes sense to give Karma's spells different properties, depending on which dragon she uses. So every spell must have two possible bonus effects. For her passive itself it would make sense to give it an effect that makes her deal and take more damage or deal/take less, depending on the active dragon. This would be a double edged sword, and while she can control it, her enemies can play around this as well, as alternating spells is rather predictable. The distinct colors (see above) should telegraph those ups and downs to the enemies and Karma alike.

To not make this passive feel like a restriction though, Karma needs a way to freely decide on the bonus effects, so at least one spell in her kit must enable easy switching of stances. Lastly, her mantra can unleash both effects to increase the flexibility even more, but also create some nice play around duality. It asks you to spot situations in which both Ouro and Boros can use their potential, to have a huge impact. Creating these situations or preventing them is a game that Karma and her enemy both can partake in.

Getting More Specific

I have chosen Q and E as Karma's most dualistic abilities. One is a damage ability and one defensive, adding either effect to them makes them really interesting to play around. This leaves W for a "bridge" ability, to allow for double offensive or double defensive moves (Q-W-E) using either dragon for the first and third spell.

It will probably dissappoint some people to read, that I removed the tether. For multiple reasons. Firstly, as a bridge ability it fails. It usually acts more like a one-way-street than a bridge, favouring being in the middle and making one combo straight up better than the others. Secondly, with the twindragons and an ally/enemy function it gets overloaded too quickly. And thirdly, I wanted to remove as much CC as possible anyways. Why? To allow Karma to be more powerful in terms of damage/protection and give her a clearer identity, with pros and cons.

Lastly, I must note, that I tried to take away the power of mantra and spread it more evenly into Karma's kit. Karma should be about mastering all of her spells, offensive and defensive, repeatedly making good decisions and not just landing a single impactful spell once every 1-2 minutes. Thus all her abilities - or twindragon effects, to be precise - will scale with ultimate levels, making her overall stronger when reaching lvl6, symbolizing balance; over one sidedness. It also makes R feel more like a tool than a half-hearted ultimate design.

Take a look at how it turned out!

FULL REWORK

!!!VALUES ARE HIGHLY TENTATIVE AND DEBATABLE!!!

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/CChg6tOAmqk/hqdefault.jpg

http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/6/68/Gathering_Fire.png/revision/latest?cb=20130929122919 P - DUALITY

Karma carries Ouru and Boros with her at all times, but only one will be active at any given time. If Ouru is active, Karma gains 5/10/15/20 extra resistances. If Boros is active, Karma's next ability will have 5/10/15/20 extra magic penetration EDIT: I have been convinced, that bonus magic damage on AAs might make more sense. Additionally Karma's next spell will have bonus effects depending on the dragon it was cast by. After casting a spell, the other dragon will become active and whirl around Karma's hand (Ouru left, Boros right). All of Ouru's and Boros' effects scale with Mantra levels.

http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/a/ad/Inner_Flame.png/revision/latest?cb=20130929122920&format=webp Q - INNER FLAME

25% Slow removed Ouru: Hitting enemy champions heals the lowest nearby ally by 30/40/50/60 plus 5/7/9/11% (+1% per 100AP) of their missing health. _EDIT: Too good on tanks. This makes more sense: by 20/40/60/80 (+1 per 50AP) increased by 3% for every 1%hp the target is missing. Boros: Hitting enemy champions deals 10 extra magic damage for every champion they have killed this game.

http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/4/45/Soulflare.png/revision/latest?cb=20130929122923&format=webp RQ - SOULFLARE

50% Slow removed Ouru and Boros travel to target location applying all their effects and Inner Flame's damage in the area. After 0.75s the area explodes applying all effects again.

http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/0/0c/Focused_Resolve.png/revision/latest?cb=20130929122918&format=webp W - DRAGON'S CREST

Target ally/enemy takes 10/13/16/19/22% (+1% per 50AP) less/more damage from all sources for 4s. Ouru: Surrounding allied champions are healed for 15% of the damage the target takes, up to 50/100/200/300. Boros: Surrounding enemy champions receive 15% of the damage the target takes, up to 50/100/200/300.

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/2/2a/Renewal.png/revision/latest?cb=20130929122922&format=webp RW - DRAGON'S BLESSING

Ouru and Boro both apply their effect in the area, but with no hard cap. Additionally, the area's size increases by 100/200/300/400 units.

http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/c/c4/Inspire.png/revision/latest?cb=20130929122920&format=webp E - INSPIRE

MS buff moved Ouru: The targeted ally also gains 45/50/55/60% bonus MS for 2s. Boros: The shield errupts, dealing 80/110 /140/170/200 (+0.5AP) magic damage to enemies in a 300 units radius (this equals 3 teemos or roughly half his attack range)

http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/4/40/Defiance.png/revision/latest?cb=20130929122917&format=webp RE - INSURGE

Increases the damage and shield by 30/90/150/210 (+0.4AP), increases the damage-radius to 600 units and speeds up all hit allies.

http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/7/76/Mantra.png/revision/latest?cb=20130929122921&format=webp R - Mantra

Probably needs a CD adaption Karma's next basic ability within 8s profits from both Ouru's and Boros' power and becomes easier to apply. Mantra's cooldown resets if a nearby ally dies.

Aftermath - If You Want further Information

I originally tried to let Boros deal current%health damage, to really equalize the battlefield, depending on your choices, but it made her too strong against tanks and too generalistic... and not just good against "badies" as it was supposed to. This Q effect would give Karma the identity as an anti-snowballer and make rampaging carries more vulnerable to her. Fortunately it's mostly in a skillshot, that is telegraphed and can be dodged/bodyblocked, so Karma should not become stronger for free if others do well, just give her priority targets. On another note, this should also justify why Karma could instagib the Noxian general in her lore.... because he supposedly had killed a hundreds of people beforehand!

RQ is pure duality. Double dragons, double effects, double procs. For all those who think the faster follow-up explosion might be too strong, consider this; with a 50% slow everyone can escape THE CENTER of current RQ with no boots in 1.5s. Removing the slow should make everyone capable of escaping a SPOT ON RQ in 0.75s. Numbers are still up for debate, but just so you understand why this probably isn't as strong as it looks.

W is probably confusing at first, because it does many things. It always deals the increased damage on enemies, no matter what dragon used. Just the aura changes. If a certain amount of damage was transferred to nearby units, they won't benefit from it anymore, but the crest (damage increase/decrease) will always last the full 4s. Another thing this ability does, is to allow for "damage support", a lot of decision making, group protection (if all get hit, the ally taking the hits can heal the others) and some return damage. This, in addition to the RQ and E changes, should make Karma more short-ranged, or at least allow her more power in her direct vicinity.

RW is kept rather simple, to not make the W tooltipp unreadable. For teamfights this should still prove potent enough though.

E might make some Karma fans happy, because shieldbomb is back, and others maybe worrying, because the speedup is now conditional. Be assured that using the speedbuff can be guaranteed if you are mindful of your passive and have either W or R up. W-E or E-W will always grant you the desired effect of damage reduction, shield and speedbuff.

RE, again, is rather simpel, but should give Karma another, reliable damagetool and retain her group mobility, that she always had (in Old Karma with RW, New Karma with RE).

The mantra reset is very experimential and I am not 100% sure about this. It fits the thematic of getting back at someone for killing good people (what karma/Karma should do) and gives Karma fair windows of power, instead of raw stats, as her old passive did.... but it might become REALLY obnoxious with its anti-snowball nature and probably prevent a final deciding teamfight from being won. Might be good, might be bad. Alternatively one could use the cooldown reduction from her current passive, but it interacts weirdly with Boros' W aura. Let me know what you think!

Thoughts about Lore

I imagined this version of Karma to be the final stage of enlightenment Karma, compared to current Karma, who is just starting out. The idea was, that the fight with the Noxians had unlocked her connection to the twin dragons and with training and meditation she learned to master them. The twin dragons are supposed to be similar to the tentacles Illaoi is using; not the entity itself, but represantations wielded by the worthy.

http://img01.deviantart.net/9433/i/2015/156/b/8/karma_by_wikimia-d8w45dj.jpg

Karma's strong conviction and desire for balance allows her to use the power of Ouru and Boros and channel them through her soul, performing all their wonders. Fully opening up to them and casting her mantra symbolizes reaching a full connection and their full potential. So my proposed version is more similar to Spirit Guard Udyr, as it paints Karma as the person she can become after mastering her arts. Essentially, current Karma would be canon.

Summing Up

Thanks for reading! This took me literally over two month to create, write, compile, format and correct, but I can only imagine how hard and exhausting it must be to read through it. If you really didn't skip anything, you have my deepest respect and honest gratitude.

Please offer me your kind criticism, positive or negative, and remember to keep it civil and constructive :).

Greetings, SilverSquid

299 Comments

IxtaliKing4/26/2016, 8:58:28 PM28 votes

I actually really like this, nice work Silver :).

P - Reintroducing duality via her passive is a nice touch, I was thinking of posting an idea for a similar new passive and a new resource earlier, but I like your idea more xD.

Q - That boros Q is frighteningly fitting for Karma, it would finally give her a thematically fitting identity. The Ouro Q adds some interesting depth to the skill and I'm sure would please old karma fans.

W - I like this W, it makes use of her crest (which I like) and it seems like a suitable replacement for that tether.

E - Offering a choice between the speed boost (Ouro) and shield bomb from the jump without mantra (boros) is an interesting idea, I like it.

R - Getting resets when an ally dies kinda makes sense from a thematic stand point, I just can't tell whether this would be either too weak or too strong in some situations. I'm imagining her whole team dying and her going on a (broken?) mantra fueled rampage, or nobody dies and she gets only one mantra. This rework seems like it might actually be a good opportunity to reintroduce her mantra charges.

MargaretThatcher4/26/2016, 11:26:06 PM9 votes

Hey, i know i am not saing much but... i have seen you in the forums since the karma rework. I love all the effort you put in the work, how you try to make karma what she was before, what everyone that remember her thinks when someone says karma.

I just want to say thank you for this great job, keep it up. I am not an avid karma player, but i really liked the old one,you make me remember the old days.

Rhyto4/27/2016, 2:14:24 AM8 votes

www.riotgames.com/careers

Go...please go now and just....do it! T_T.....

TNHA Baritone4/26/2016, 8:09:13 PM6 votes

I love the names. I REALLY do. Ouru makes my pp hard tbh I love your ideas....Supp karma would be so much more fun with the changes too

Quepha4/26/2016, 11:33:50 PM6 votes

Riot has already talked about the many inherent problems to "polarity" kits like the one you described.

This champion kit has an even more poorly carved out niche than live Karma. So many different effects scattered all over the place means that most of it will have to be balanced down to microscopic values.

You've also completely dulled the effects of her mantra, none of the mantra spells sound very exciting and most notably RQ sounds like a complete waste of a cooldown.

Voluug134/27/2016, 12:37:47 AM6 votes

I feel Mantra should go back to have 2 stacks.

Why?

Because that way Karma couldn't be so dependant on a single ability's burst (which leads to either a binary or unhealthy rotation).

Old Karma's biggest point was the fact you could use 2 mantra'ed ablities for way more flexibility and adaptability, and all the mantra choices were strong when used correctly in most situations. Also it means that her offensive is way way less burst and more defensive and sustained, befitting her more frontline mage persona instead of yet another squishy psedobursty pseudopoke Lulux clone.

EDIT: Give her back her fans and make Ouro and Boros be attached to them, she uses the fans as magical focus, tie in lore she uses the enchanted fans as conduits for the extremely powerful forces of Ouroboros.

Rico Nasty4/26/2016, 8:16:35 PM5 votes

This seems to pigeonhole her more into a supportive role, could we maybe add a little damage to her Q and/or W? Plus, she needs that slow on RQ. It makes it so that the AoE explosion thingy after the initial casting can actually hit stuff.

Grief Me Please11/3/2016, 12:41:10 AM3 votes

Yo! I honestly can't even begin to say how happy I would be with these changes! I've always wanted a champ to have an alternating spell system, and Karma would just be perfect for it!! I hope rito looks at this!

invisiblecat14/26/2016, 10:33:45 PM3 votes

Dragon's crest is a little too strong, at 600 AP a 34 % damage buff if a little insane, and with the other forms of damage and utility she has in her kit she will just do SO much damage (Riot has shown this is really bad on ranged champion since Ahri had hers removed, and so has DFG been remove, but Fizz can have it since he has to dive in in order to use it properly)

Also to add on, the ally champion dying reset thing is a great idea, but since you have protection for your team and some comps don't die too often this will be too situational.

Other than this I LOVE the change ideas

Edge of Daybreak4/27/2016, 3:40:29 AM3 votes

@ SilverSquid I think on issue with the passive is that it feels like I am playing a miniature version of invoker where I have to keep track of what spells I use and what order I use them in to get the benefits I want out of them which to me feels like it would be restricting. There is a good bit of hidden power too as the dragons naturally give benefits then you have mantra W doing all kinds of things at once.

I have to agree with Quepha on the RQ. I dont see why I would really attempt to use the RQ skillshot when I can have an aoe nuke that is instant and shields + haste my team. Then you gave her shield bomb naturally. That is not okay. I can only imagine how awful it would be to play a melee against karma knowing that if I get anywhere near her minions I could get slapped with an instant damage nuke. I am sure that I would know it's coming due to passive showing me but what am I going to do about it? Then the RW. I love what you proposed but only because I feel that would be broken to put that on say the enemy tank or your tank. The healing / free damage would be a lot with no cap. Heck if you put if on a squishy and they get bursted your team heals for 15% of that with no cap.

Oh small thing about the wording on Boros Q. Is that 10 extra damage being calculated by that specific enemy champion or the entire enemy team combined?

Other small thing. Mantra reseting when an ally dies. That could be a little much but with the CDR removed from the passive I guess that could work.

Oh this argument about karma having no niche is a little odd mainly because pros did pick her for the AOE haste. It functions similarly to sivir in that case giving her an on demand initiation button for the team. Sure you can buy coin but a decent shield + haste that you don't have to buy is great team utility to say she has 0 niches is just false as the only champion that can do that similar thing as easily is sivir and it's going to be on a much higher CD than karma.

MunchCrunchLunch4/26/2016, 9:42:01 PM2 votes

I like when people come up with concept. but I don't like when they get specific to what the abilities and the kit is. actual game developers know how the kit will interact with the other 130 champions more than anyone.

Grief Me Please3/17/2017, 1:20:55 AM2 votes

every day that goes by without this being a thing in game is another day of sadness :D

SaltyKracka4/29/2016, 11:26:48 PM1 votes

Sorry, but Riot's never going to just put a flat+scaling damage amp/block into the game.

And they got rid of the shieldbomb for a goddamn reason.

It Hertz When IP4/27/2016, 6:37:26 PM1 votes

My first question: the Boros damage on Q, is that per champion killed or per UNIQUE champion killed (a.k.a hard capped at 50)? Either way, I'm having a hard time seeing why I would ever want a tiny flat damage buff over a %missing HP heal to allies. Then again, I'm heavily biased towards supports, so maybe that's it.

Second question: With two heals in her basic abilities, one of which has the potential to heal for a LOT in teamfights, I'm worried Karma is going to straight-up outperform LoL's other healer choices (this proposal already, as far as I can tell, matches or exceeds Soraka's non-ult healing). With all the hate for sustain supports in Riot these days, I wouldn't want to see these proposed heals put in only to have their numbers nerfed into obscurity. (Side question: will the W healing scale from damage taken pre- or post-resistance calculations? also I would limit target choice to champions, unless you WANT Karma to throw W on Dragon or Baron and heal her whole team for ridiculous amounts.)

Overall this rework does a lot towards giving Karma a dedicated theme, but it doesn't seem like you met your stated goal of defining her identity in gameplay. Proposed Karma still has poke, burst, sustained damage, a shield, two heals, decent mobility, and decent waveclear. The primary functions removed were all of her CC, which would give her extremely limited peel, and her true vision (which TBH felt underwhelming and could easily go).

Also just wanted to note that at ranks 2 and up, proposed W gives a greater boost to allied damage against a target than Vladimir's ultimate does, along with applying it (also at ranks 2+) to a wider area. The only place Vlad's ult exceeds Karma's W here would be in duration (5s vs 4s).