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I've always wondered something... Why aren't the daggers allowed to be destroyed if you step on it?

Evenstar·3/27/2017, 4:51:15 PM·85 votes·5,851 views

I wouldn't mind being 100-0 more often by if only her daggers were allowed to be destroyed by stepping on them, much like how you would step on Zyra's seeds and Poppy's passive shield.

That way, it rewards players who avoids her daggers and rewards Katarina for making smart use of her daggers too. Doesn't feel fair that her daggers are lying on the ground for a few seconds and you can't destroy. Walking close to the dagger now just means you'll have to take your chances.

Edit: Surprised this received so many responses. A lot of you are wondering why this was even suggested in the first place... To idea is to punish Katarina through limited mobility (or restricted numbers of Shunpo) rather than lowering her late game carry damage. This would only affect inexperienced Katarina players and make experienced ones strategize harder for a kill. As of now, just by the sight of daggers is enough to zone you out until it disappears off the ground, Katarina just needs to have two daggers on the floor in close distance and she has already created an area to push you away. Instead of backing away, waiting for 3 seconds and losing a few potential cs, on top of letting her push your lane and going to other lanes to roam, might as well take the risk to destroy her daggers and lower her lane pressure.

For those of you mentioning Poppy's shield stays longer on the ground, the duration is the same as Katarina's daggers. And, if you're concerned about thematic in that stepping on a dagger doesn't make sense because it hurts you... Fine, let's turn it in to destroying daggers by AA range. While we're at that, perhaps you could rationalize on how stepping on a hard shield to destroy it makes any sense either.

And lastly, those of you mentioning her daggers has a set amount of time in the air before it lands, that's not counterplay enough. Neither is walking diagonally nor back & forth, that's just like saying how cc screws over every other cancer champion. Either way, even if you do all that, post-6 she has ultimate to damage you. Whether a Katarina picks up her daggers or not, a Katarina jumping in to your face is going to guarantee a kill for her.

96 Comments

Dessem3/27/2017, 5:18:47 PM60 votes

Wouldn't the counterplay feel bad? You try to step on it, she blinks there and wails you in the face. It's clearer now on what to do, which is move away from them.

Think it has to do with clarity of counterplay. Playing against her can feel overbearing, though.

Melledoneus3/27/2017, 7:59:50 PM20 votes

Take a knife from your kitchen. If you are 14 or younger you should not be playing this game regardless. Stick it in a patch of grass. Step on it. Does it get destroyed? Unless you have landmines are where you put the knife, it should not have.

Congratulations. Your neighbors now think you're either landscaping or weird.

Åeolus3/27/2017, 5:27:37 PM18 votes

I mean it might even be easier for her to do damage with them if this was the case as people would try and walk near them.

abca983/27/2017, 5:41:01 PM11 votes

I honestly think the area of the damage when picking a dagger is too big.

SlashStriker3/27/2017, 6:32:36 PM8 votes

Destroying Kat's daggers wouldn't make much sense.

Thematically how do you destroy solid steel by stepping on it? Gameplay wise 4 seconds doesn't seem much as it creates mind games

In comparison Annie Pyromania last eternity until she decides to cast it which gives Annie infinite zone control and gives 0 counterplay

Overlord Forte3/27/2017, 7:04:07 PM7 votes

I'd look at removing her ability to select where she lands in her shunpo when going to a dagger.

I was on the fence about it when that detail came across in her update, as I couldn't tell how powerful it was. After fighting a good dozen or so Katarina's in Masters, it occurred to me the reason why her AOE was so damn massive was that moving hitbox. She can selectively edge a full model's worth closer to you, or away, and hit/dodge more than you can reasonably predict. The effective range to 'stay out of' her dagger pickup AOE is actually much larger than can be perceived, and staying out of that can often take even long range characters out of effective fighting distance.

Acheron163/27/2017, 7:40:39 PM6 votes

Because:

It could lead to a false choice, where you try to step on a dagger and she blinks into it, easily damaging you.
Dagger damage is central to Katarina's damage output. If this was allowed, she would have to be buffed in her basic abilities since her main damage output got even less reliable.

I know it doesnt feel particularly fun to face a Katarina, but she's miles fairer to play compared to her old style (Q you, E on you, W, R, repeat until you or her are dead)

Escheton3/28/2017, 12:32:02 AM5 votes

Because stepping on daggers...is bad. It hurts. Don't step on sharp things.

Stepping on seeds to squish them, makes sense. Stepping on tunnels to collapse them, makes sense. Stepping on glowy, red, sharp daggers to somehow avoid an assassin from stabbing you...wut?

THE RlVER KlNG3/27/2017, 9:22:23 PM5 votes

The only thing that needs to happen is an indicator for the range on them

I've been standing well away from them and gotten chunked regardless, they should work like Gangplank barrels

Such bullshit that she can drop a bunch over a fight and hem you in because the hitboxes are enormous

Chaos Milk Tea3/27/2017, 8:05:05 PM4 votes

Well the whole point is to AVOID the daggers. Unlike Zyra, Katarina can't just activate a dagger and forget about it. She must actively engage and relies heavily on them not only for damage but also survival. Also she can't place them exactly where she wants.

Taliyah Rocks3/27/2017, 5:54:30 PM4 votes

The daggers will always drop behind the first target hit by her Q and will land after one second. If you are not able to dodge that i don't know what else to say. The only time she can arguably kill you is if she catch you in the river or when she has ult.

BLACK REALM GOD3/27/2017, 9:24:50 PM4 votes

i honestly think katarina needs more daggers to pick up. we should give her a passive like zyras and then call her kat the butterfingers.

Cowseed3/27/2017, 11:07:59 PM4 votes

That would be awkward given the fact the dagger lands on the side opposite of Katarina. She'd become hella useless because all you would have to do is run the opposite direction and kill her damage by default.

You were never meant to run to the daggers. You are supposed to run away and this should be obvious if you just imagine the red circle as a pool of blood.

BakedLotion3/28/2017, 3:35:57 AM4 votes

Then people would just stand on top of where the dagger lands while it's falling, and deny her completely and make her useless...

PhDs Nuts3/27/2017, 5:57:23 PM3 votes

Poppy can't blink to her shield to do damage to you. It's a race, and you should know when she'll beat you there. It's not really a viable mechanic for Katarina as long as Shunpo works the way it does (instantly).

Makharya3/28/2017, 5:23:13 AM3 votes

So you'll succeedd against kata if you are far from her dagger or on it . Seems a bit too easy.

Xienwolf3/27/2017, 11:36:05 PM3 votes

I like that it would give you a reason to get close to the daggers, and thus let her jump to it and hurt you more.

But it would make her jukes impossible. Right now she uses W for the speed boost when running away, which also drops a dagger, which she can then jump to and now be BEHIND you and proceed to run the other way. Phenomenal for wasting flashes/ward hops/gap closers or dodging around Singed/Sion pain trains.

Northwake3/27/2017, 10:17:51 PM3 votes

Because then you'd cut your feet, and nobody wants that.

Theorchero3/27/2017, 8:00:53 PM3 votes

One thing that I think should be removed 100% is the fucking ~~auto~~ aa reset on her E.

Khadaver3/27/2017, 9:38:00 PM3 votes

Because if your daggers are placed well you could get punished for it

The Yetii Rider3/28/2017, 2:23:34 PM2 votes

Katarina is difficult enough to play. She doesn't need more counterplay added to her kit. She barely has an ultimate to begin with and her W does no damage.