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Any Rioters alive on boards today? No? Well anyway, can someone explain the logic behind this?

NathanusMaximus··4 votes·1,087 views

So Riot, I was just wondering something.

What was the thought process behind this? Why give the most movement speed to melee champs with gap closers and instakill potential?

Then give the lowest movement speed to champions with no instakill potential and some of which have no escapes?

Not sure I understand that.

Always talking about balancing the game. Perhaps a big step could be just levelling all the movement speeds of champions? Set it to about 330/335 for ALL champions.

Look at it. Look at the ADC's in 325 and the melee instakill gap closers and stuns in 350+. You have effectively given the melee champions free tier 1 boots. Why? You have given them a free item and its insane.

Why not just level the movement speed?

EDIT Kat NEEDS NERFS!!!! Her general start is tier 1 boots and pots. She effectively already has tier 1 boots so buying another pair gives her a disgusting amount of movement speed. That is why she has such massive map pressure and that is a good direction to go in to nerf her.

11 Comments

Takanuva1 votes

just from what im seeing, ranged automatically beats out melee cuase, well, range. melee get kited for days unless they have some sort of gap closer. hence the gapclosers. at this point, an adc has to rely on their team to peel and protect the carry. if we did change all the ms stats to 330-335 for all champs, soloq MIGHT " " equalize. meanwhile, the pros kite the melees even harder, thus reducing available options. pantheon has a base ms of 350, but even then i feel so slow, your melees only have an effective gap closing range. give a ranged carry an ability to attack them out of that gapclosing range, and you might as well grab a margarita, you not going to catch the adc, might as well enjoy your 0/23/1 kda

NathanusMaximus2 votes

The game in its current state is just bashing on ADC's completely. Not sure what patch this happened but tanks have become insane and ADC's feel useless with the super camp early game by top laners and junglers. They are too slow.

People always assume having ranged attacks makes up for it but it doesn't.

Pantheon for example. If I play as Ashe, second longest attack range in game behind Cait (Excluding scaling Trist and Jinx rockets). If I try to attack Panth with Q to slow him, I am in his stun range. Stuns me and its gg. If Ashe has the second highest attack range and Pantheon's gap closer is the same range as her autos, how do other ADC's feel?

I understand it to a point. And I kinda get it, like some ADC's have escapes that add to the kiting or whatever.

But having free boots? Plus an extra 10 movement speed on TOP of that? That;s excessive man.

Udyr has 350 movement speed. Which is boots plus 5 movement speed. That in itself, is hard to kite. Then he has a tenacity ability that reduces the slow duration or something, that makes it harder to kite. Then he has a speed boost, RIP!!!!

Some champions I get why they have more speed, but some are broken.

There is NO reason for Udyr to have THAT much movement speed with his already super strong kit.

A standard Udyr build for end game has like Zephyr and Tri and tier 2 boots and it all adds up to like 500 and something movement speed. You can NOT kite that! Once he catches you and lands the stun, you're dead.

Sir ArmaMalum1 votes

See that's just it though, if you could kite everyone as an adc, what could kill you? Udyr is 100% melee, if he couldn't catch the squishy on the team he would be completely useless because that would leave him fighting your tankier teammates and you wailing on him from the safety of your ranged autos. Feels great for you sure, but not so much for all the melee champs.

Trick1F3 votes

{quoted}

The game in its current state is just bashing on ADC's completely. Not sure what patch this happened but tanks have become insane and ADC's feel useless with the super camp early game by top laners and junglers. They are too slow.

People always assume having ranged attacks makes up for it but it doesn't.

Pantheon for example. If I play as Ashe, second longest attack range in game behind Cait (Excluding scaling Trist and Jinx rockets). If I try to attack Panth with Q to slow him, I am in his stun range. Stuns me and its gg. If Ashe has the second highest attack range and Pantheon's gap closer is the same range as her autos, how do other ADC's feel?

I understand it to a point. And I kinda get it, like some ADC's have escapes that add to the kiting or whatever.

But having free boots? Plus an extra 10 movement speed on TOP of that? That;s excessive man.

Udyr has 350 movement speed. Which is boots plus 5 movement speed. That in itself, is hard to kite. Then he has a tenacity ability that reduces the slow duration or something, that makes it harder to kite. Then he has a speed boost, RIP!!!!

Some champions I get why they have more speed, but some are broken.

There is NO reason for Udyr to have THAT much movement speed with his already super strong kit.

A standard Udyr build for end game has like Zephyr and Tri and tier 2 boots and it all adds up to like 500 and something movement speed. You can NOT kite that! Once he catches you and lands the stun, you're dead.

Shhhhh, go away. Go away quietly. You're absurd.

Pryotra1 votes

I'm going to invalidate all of this with a simple post that in lane, Ranged will shit on melee, with the exceptions tending to be assassins/heal based melee tanks or ranged champions that simply need help in a general sense.

For example, take a Kayle and but it against any regular melee top laner. Now do Vayne. Now do Quinn. Now do Ryze. Now do Jayce. The very fact that these champions have access to a ranged auto attack means that they will win lane 9/10 times.

Range is a huge advantage. So huge that Ranged ADC's are the only class in the game that has been 100% required on both teams in every single meta or team comp since beta due to the sheer fact that they can easily take towers at range and do incredible sustained damage when given gold compared to every other class in the game.

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb1 votes

lol. Which is why 2 adc is normal in games now. They're so weak, that people are now running 2 of them in their teams so they can lose, right?

Melee has an inherent need to move faster than carries because carries can get in a bunch of free damage first. Gap closers exist for the same reason. Melee needs to be able to outdamage range when they get close enough to do damage, because again, range can get free damage before they even get close enough to do damage.

Don't try to 1v1 panth as ashe. He's a fucking counter. His role, and kit, are both intended to counter her. Udyr has nothing to deal with slows on his kit. He is one of the most kiteable champs in the game.

GroundRuleDouble1 votes

Balancing doesn't mean making champs the same. The champs that are immobile have other advantages and the champs that are immobile have other disadvantages. For example, Annie is a counter to Kat. Annie is immobile and Kat is mobile. If Annie stuns Kat, she can burst Kat to death in less than a second.

Ironclad Dragon1 votes

Thanks for pointing out that extra comma. I've fixed it.

Takanuva1 votes

heres the thing though. they do get kited, and as ive mentioned, a solid teamcomp that has an idea will peel for their comp, even udyr can get kited and focused. another thing you have to realize is they WANT that early camp. when late game hits, a traditional will be SO strong because adcs scale HARD off of items. even if pantheon gets that stun, his burst is just that, if the adc survives, they just dps him down and continue onward. adcs arnt meant to wreck early game anyways, theyre meant to farm, kite, ward up, and teamfight when they can. the point of an adc is to sacrifice things like survivability and such for pure dps/ sustained burst. when you watch lcs, theres some moments where they are passive, and some where they go full blown, becuase they know where and when champions spike/peak and will follow up accordingly. tenacity is incredible, but even high tenacity doesnt help when your chain cced and focused.

hgjkdlsaf jeldvb1 votes

Kat does need nerfs, though her ms and gap closing aren't what make her too good. It's the resets.

IcyPepper1 votes

Well, I'll be honest here.

Other than a few tools, an adc is supposed to be relatively immobile with little utility (sure, you got Ezreal and others, but even a caught-out Ezreal can die to a gap closer) compared to other classes because of their purpose. The adc class is supposed to scale into the late-game, so they have the weakest start (hence why they get supports) and they're supposed to be easier to catch and die in 1v1 early to mid game.

325 movement speed doesn't matter once you have 400 AD with on-hits, 2.X attack speed, and 15-20%+ lifesteal.

That's why peels are important. Adcs are supposed to be easy to catch, making them reliant on their team. Otherwise you'd get multiple adc's in a game (and the reason why you don't is the teamfights... just trust me here).

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