Increase the Lethality on each of the 3 end-tier Lethality items but make it a unique NAMED passive.

MissingKayo·Feb 20, 2017·32 votes·2,497 views

And make the passive on Dirk named the same as well.

There used to be only one flat armorpen item (Ghostblade at 20).

Having 3 Lethality items that goes up to 2.25x the power level of old Ghostblade by 18 completely defeats the point of making it scale in the first place to be healthier.

If people want to buy all 3 items for the actives, they can. But they should only get the Lethality from one of them.

Ghostblade is being nerfed from 20 to 15 Lethality on PBE to fit the rest.

So instead, buff all 3 to varying levels between 25-35 depending on how strong the rest of the stats or actives or passives are, but make it unique.

And an even nicer addition would be making all the other abilities share the same cooldown (GB active, DB sweeper and true damage, Edge shield) the way Hextech items do.

So if people want to buy one of them, they have to trade away the benefits of the other 2 basically.

For any AD casters that are hurt too badly by this change, they can use individually separate buffs to themselves afterwards. Not relying on abusing Lethality.

82 Comments

dunder killFeb 20, 20174 votes

There used to be only one flat armorpen item (Ghostblade at 20).

Wrong. The old BC had 15 flat armor pen. LW also didn't just affect bonus armor. It used to be 35% total armor

MissingKayoFeb 20, 20173 votes

I meant in S6. Like right before the Lethality change. Old BC/LW hasn't been a thing for a while so I didn't count it.

Asayake 5150glowFeb 22, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I meant in S6. Like right before the Lethality change. Old BC/LW hasn't been a thing for a while so I didn't count it.

item 3156 had 10 flat pen, item 3147 already existed for about half a season or so.

OleandervineFeb 21, 20174 votes

Lethality is Bloodrazor and Rageblade all over again. EXACT SAME. They're even nerfing Varus in response to his power with Lethality. You'd think Riot would see these patterns emerge with their stats and fix the stats instead of ruining the champions who are abusing them. Because then when they actually gut the stat, those champions are screwed.

KilanostFeb 21, 20173 votes

If you can't stack lethality, it would fall off too hard.

MissingKayoFeb 21, 20172 votes

No, it wouldn't.

Lethality is for killing squishy champions. The ones that don't buy armor anyways. You're not supposed to be good at killing anyone else if you go Lethality.

KilanostFeb 21, 20172 votes

I think you're considering this on assassins more than you are how its used by adcs. The lethality changes were made to help ADCs more than anything because they adcs were complaining they were underpowered. They were....early game. Late game crit/LW builds were devastating but often games were decided significantly before that point. Lethality offered them a trade off between late game power and early/midgame power that made sense given the dominance of early game champions. If lethality isn't able to be stacked, there are two other pen options and both suck for adcs:

black cleaver: BC doesn't work for adcs because they have to sit there stacking it for it to be effective. It soon will only give 40 damage. So the hit adcs would take to damage would be massive compared to other items and would require them to sit there auto attacking 6 times before getting the full benefit. Sounds like a recipe for a dead ADC.
LW item: LW item only works off of bonus armor and doesn't offer the utility adcs need mid game to survive. mid game tanks might have 60ish bonus armor. LW would only reduce 30% of that. If its upgraded, then 45. But you end up with less total AD, and much less utility which means you can't use the pen well anyway. However, this works well in conjunction with stacked lethality late game as the 45% bonus armor gets taken off first when tanks approach 200ish armor, and the stacked lethality can make the difference allowing them to do relevant amounts of damage.

Additionally, making a stacked lethality build path available, broadens options across the board which makes for interesting decisions as the game progresses. Before the lethality changes, I knew the exact build path of every adc in bot lane before the game started. As a result I never had to make a tough build decision as to what to build to deal with the possibility of a bot lane threat as it played into the other team's overall power. If you remove that variability, it becomes boring again.

Also since oyu suggested making it unique and putting it all on one item while simultaneously suggesting people buy the other lethality items for the utility, consider that once you get ALL the lethality from a single item, there is no longer a reason to continue down that build path given the gold cost of the items no longer matches what you get out of it. You can't lower the cost of all the lethality items to account for this diminished value because you'd simply allow people to build their lethality item with the full 35 lethaltiy as you suggested even faster. You think khazix is bad now, imagine if what you suggested actually happened.

**Most importantly, you never addressed what gameplay issue you were hoping to solve by your suggestion which leads me to believe you have some sort of qualm with current game play but cant quite put your finger on it and as a result decided to point your finger on the biggest and most recent change you can think of. **If you can't accurately point to a game play problem in your post, then maybe what you're suggesting is a non-issue and you're just coming off a tough, salt-invoking game.

Why don't you delete this thread because, frankly, no one here sees any point in your post (no identifiable grievance you are trying to solve), a suggestion to fix an unidentified issue that makes zero sense, nor any evidence that you have a well rounded concept of what makes for good gameplay and balance. Then, collect your thoughts, identify the issue you have a problem with, and clearly state that issue with a possible solution that makes sense in the setting of current game play needs and balance.

mic drop.

MissingKayoFeb 21, 20173 votes

Nice wallpost and mic drop for a load of meaningless and incorrect horseshit.

KilanostFeb 21, 20173 votes

Just because you have a difficult time comprehending words, doesn't make what I say meaningless, incorrect, or horseshit.

Seriously, what problem are you trying to address??? You didn't identify a single one.

NineTailedMysticFeb 21, 20173 votes

The fact that ADCs shouldn't use Lethality in the first place.

KilanostFeb 21, 20171 votes

See my post immediately above this one to the other person that has your mistaken ideas about lethality.

NineTailedMysticFeb 22, 20171 votes

Mhm. And Lethality still shouldn't be for ADCs. It gives them far too much power early, makes them far too effective at eliminating squishies, and makes it so they no longer fulfill their Tank busting niche...oh wait it does. There is no trade off for building Lethality to Crit. "muh late game tho". There isn't a late game anymore. I like the analogy I've seen someone use here before, "Crit builds are a mountain in power but you have to climb the mountain to get there. Lethality builds are a skyscraper. Not as tall, but they take the elevator".

ADCs didn't need a shift in power to early game, the game needed a meta shift to late game.

MrHaZeYoFeb 22, 20172 votes

Feel free to see me toast him above :)

MrHaZeYoFeb 21, 20173 votes

I read the 1st part and saw Lethity was buffed for ADCs and stopped reading.

Leth was for Assassins, not ADCs, they get Last Whisper, Bruisers get BC.

KilanostFeb 21, 20171 votes

I posted this to some other moron and since you seem to share his delusion, I'll c/p the post here:

lethality is a stat that was born from armor pen which, is an assassin stat in the following sense: Lethality was created from armor pen to nerf armor pen's early game dominance due to the overall strength of assassins abusing the stat. HOWEVER in no way was armor pen/lethality solely an assassin stat. The creation of lethality for assassins was meant to curb their strength and provide counterplay. In no way was it a label that was meant to signify "THIS IS AN ASSASSIN STAT." You are confusing the reason why Rito said that lethality was created for assassins. It was never, ever meant as a stat strictly for assassins, simply that without changing from armor pen to lethality (aka, nerfing its early game) assassins had too much strength and therefore the lethality stat was created with curbing assassin strength in mind.

If Rito ever wanted stats to be class specific, they would have started making class specific items. The fact that these do not exist is proof that everyone sitting there saying "lethality is a stat that should only be used on assassins and is abused by adcs" is a complete moron. As another bit of evidence contrary to your ridiculous argument, try to find a single instance where any rioter has ever said anything to the effect that lethality should only be built on assassins.

There cost/benefit trade off to lethality on ADCs. Stop bitching and learn to play around it.

Also when you make claims about things, lethality being a stat created for assassins in this case, dig a little deeper before you start using that claim completely out of context as you, and most of this thread, have been doing.

MrHaZeYoFeb 22, 20173 votes

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/preseason-2017/assassins

"Current AD assassin items barely do more than increase the raw damage output of their wielders. While items still need to pack a punch so assassins can close out their kills, we're updating them to include more tricks to help assassins set-up, stalk, and ambush—not just burst."

"Flat armor penetration's been changed to Lethality. They're pretty much the same thing, but the bulk of Lethality's penetration scales with your opponent's level. This makes it less snowbally, meaning we can give Assassins more of it than we could flat armor penetration!"

Yep, I'm moron, NEXT.

Also you know why I know Lethity wasn't meant for ADCs? Because the top 3 abusers who are ADCs (excluding Quinn who is more a top laner and Graves as he is more of a jungler - neither got bot anymore) Completely just pushed out the rest of the class.

Jihn, Varus, and Miss Fortune. There is no other ADC atm, Cait, Jinx, Ashe, Ezreal, Vayne, Twitch, and even Draven have been pushed out of the game these last couple patches on the heels of the main 3. So for something that you think was meant to help ADCs it seemed to create more of a lack of diversity then ever before.

ADs aren't suppose to turn on until 30mins into the game, they are inherently weaker then any other class in the game for a reason, as they are strong late game. Thus the reason you see them go bot lane with Supports to help them through the early - early mid game.

I agree ADs did indeed need a QoL buff, but they aren't weaker then they were before, everyone else is simply stronger, so much damage creep in this game, which is being addressed on this next patch. Now the talk is Varus needs a nerf, the same dude who has been basically useless bot lane since Season fucking 3, because Lethailty was buffed to much. So Varus will take a hit, then Leth will eventually be nerfed and Varus will sit at the bottom of the food chain once again. At least before he was viable mid lane, he won't be after they kill him then Leth and buff assassins in a different way (individual buffs more then likely).

But explain to me how these changes help the Marksmen class in general?

Now lets talk about the other champions that aren't Assassins nor ADCs that just got strong as balls.

Jayce, Riven, J4, Quinn, Graves, Panth, and Wukong. You can argue they are somewhat assassins, but in reality you don't look at them as assassins as Talon, Zed, Kha'Zix, Shaco, and Renger.

Jayce, like Varus can now 75% you from a mile away. Riven can now do Riven things but hit you harder then ever. J4 is a glorified AoE burst assassin now. Quinn can 100-0 from a flank before you even realized she was there. Panth ults in with EoN active and destroys a person before the EoN spell sheild and his passive sheild are popped. Graves can Q>Ult you dead and Wukong can WEQ one person dead then Ult and half health the other 4.

Don't even get me started on the champions these buffs were meant to help.

Talon, Zed, Kha'Zix, Rengar, Shaco, and Nocturne.

KilanostFeb 23, 20171 votes

Your argument that lethality shouldn't be able to be used by ADCs continues to be absurd. Prior to the new rise in lethality, i could go to bot lane with any tanky jungler, let the adc auto me for a good 3.-5 seconds for free, and then wipe them off the map. No trade should be that drastically in one side's favor unless it is an assassin getting off a combo (well according to riot. I still think assassin gameplay is a toxic game element given the fact that you can't peel against most assassins).

Additionally, I continue to challenge you to find an article where an rioter says "Lethality is not meant for/should not be build on adcs." Just because Lethality was created with assassins in mind does not mean that the use of lethality by adcs is an abuse.

If you want to nerf the stat, nerf the overall stat, not a class that wants to use it to be relevant earlier in the game. Also, your post identifies the real problem with the stat and that is that they gave entirely too much of it.

Here's a list of lethality numbers and sources:

Precision: 8.5 lethality Lethality reds and quints: 24 lethality Duskblade: 15 Ghostblade: 20 Edge of Night: 15

Total of 82.5 lethality. If you hold an unfinished dirk, you can get 92.5 lethality.

Now, lets look at another pen build equivalents: This is the same reduction as a fully stacked black cleaver on a 308.3 armor tank. Except black cleaver armor reduction goes down as the target's armor goes down. Lethality does not.

This is the basis of my argument. People keep saying they want to nerf lethality for adcs. No, the real problem is that as of 7.3 lethality as a stat is way over-tuned. Nerf the stat, not a class's interaction with it. In addition, its interaction with BC/LW items is also a bit over tuned. A possible fix would be to apply half of the lethality before BC reductions and half after. Then if you're an assassin who wants the straight lethality build, you get the full benefit but if you're someone that is building lethality early and then throws a BC on top of it or is attacking someone with full BC stacks, you get less of a return on that lethality.

Now to address your issue with the rise of jhin, varus, and mf with current lethality builds: No matter what the state of the game, there have always been 3-4 dominant adcs. This cycle is jhin, varus, and mf. Though, jhin has been meta for a long time. Jhin and varus's rise to power has more to do with the safe distance they can do damage from given the current strength of assassins, than it does their interaction with lethality. Again, assassin strength with lethality is the issue here, no adc strength with lethality. Even MF with her ulti can fall into this category. MF also has the added benefit of being able to apply cleaver stacks to multiple players very quickly with her ulti. Again, a seeming abuse of the cleaver, lethality interaction.

Side note: Pantheon is absolutely an assassin. Play him more, you'll see. He's just a less sneaky assassin.

Addressing your claim that ADCs shouldn't be relevant until 30 minutes: This is absurd and exactly the reason why we saw people playing ziggs bot lane immediately before the lethality buff. ADCs should have the late game build path as an option available to them, but should also have a build path available with a trade off in late game power for early game strength. Most games are decided significantly before the 30 minute mark and most of the time spent playing afterwards is just going through the motions of winning while the enemy team sits in denial that they've lost. If ADCs can't be useful before this point, then people may as well go back to playing ziggs bot.

Additionally many of the champions you say are too strong with lethality are also building BC. Again this becomes an over-tuned interaction between BC and lethality and LW items and lethality. J4 has the additional abuse of armor reduction in his kit. This is also the abuse you can see when watching Sirhcez play lethality garen. He has an on-kit armor reduction which is basically a free BC passive which is entirely too strong with a lethality build.

In closing, my point is simply that you can't see a stat get stronger, watch 2 classes use said stat, and say that only one of the classes should be nerfed. In reality, the stat itself doesn't necessarily need to be nerfed. However, its interaction with other armor reducing items should be. (Again, watch Sirhcez play garen. It makes this issue unbelievably obvious).

My suggestion is to change where it is calculated into the armor reduction order-of-operations. This way you can allow the stat to be strong by itself, but not over-tuned when combined with other items providing armor reduction.

MrHaZeYoFeb 23, 20172 votes

"Additionally, I continue to challenge you to find an article where an rioter says "Lethality is not meant for/should not be build on adcs." Just because Lethality was created with assassins in mind does not mean that the use of lethality by adcs is an abuse."

The Quotes I gave you, state they were intended to help ASSASSINS. They weren't changed to help ADCs.

"Now to address your issue with the rise of jhin, varus, and mf with current lethality builds: No matter what the state of the game, there have always been 3-4 dominant adcs"

Your right every role as had dominant elite picks every meta, but never have they been so one sided before down bot lane. Those 3 are actually pushing the others way and far away. Ya they still get played but they don't do nearly as much as the other 3 at dam near every stage of the game. Twitch sneaks up on Jihn, opens up from stealth and Jihn looks at him and 3 shots him like "oh you a late game Twitch?"

Your right they get a lot of safty from being far away, but I mean Cait, Jinx, and Trist (3 champs with good AA range (Trist late game)) still don't do nearly as much.

"Side note: Pantheon is absolutely an assassin. Play him more, you'll see. He's just a less sneaky assassin."

Panth is classified by Riot as a Diver

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/ed6WE8va-champion-subclass-list-custom-version

"Addressing your claim that ADCs shouldn't be relevant until 30 minutes: This is absurd and exactly the reason why we saw people playing ziggs bot lane immediately before the lethality buff. ADCs should have the late game build path as an option available to them, but should also have a build path available with a trade off in late game power for early game strength. Most games are decided significantly before the 30 minute mark and most of the time spent playing afterwards is just going through the motions of winning while the enemy team sits in denial that they've lost. If ADCs can't be useful before this point, then people may as well go back to playing ziggs bot."

Yep I agree, doesn't change the truth now does it?

Cait, Luc, Corki, Ashe, MF, and Draven are your ADC lane bullys, even before this season or the one prior unless they got fed AF they were still weaker then their counterparts - Top/Mid, some Junglers

"Additionally many of the champions you say are too strong with lethality are also building BC. Again this becomes an over-tuned interaction between BC and lethality and LW items and lethality. J4 has the additional abuse of armor reduction in his kit. This is also the abuse you can see when watching Sirhcez play lethality garen. He has an on-kit armor reduction which is basically a free BC passive which is entirely too strong with a lethality build."

Although I've always enjoyed full AD assassin J4 top/mid it was never a problem up until a couple of patches ago, he used to full off, now he doesn't, he just one shots in AoE form.

"My suggestion is to change where it is calculated into the armor reduction order-of-operations. This way you can allow the stat to be strong by itself, but not over-tuned when combined with other items providing armor reduction."

If you've ever read any of my responses about the topic from the last couple of patches I've been saying exactly this, I don't care that ADCs use the items, I don't, my comment here though was that it was meant for Assassins, which is was, it was already mentioned above, I gave you quotes from a RIOT post stating that the Lethility changes were meant to give ASSASSINS a better time. Instead of challenging me to find you posts go fucking find some stating they were for ADCs and post them, I've already played that game with you, its your turn.

Also I never once said ADCs should build Leth, I said I read the 1st paragraph and saw Leth was changed for them which is false and stopped reading. I said Leth was ment for assassins, BC for bruisers, and LW for ADCs.

I don't care if ADs want to build Lethility, but it should be at the cost of being able to build LW/BC. Ever think it went from Flat Pen to Lethility was because Luc, MF, Varus, and Jihn were all doing the Korean build?

Luc made this popular last summer, Ghostblade into Cleaver picking up a Maw, PD, DD, LW, IE, shit like that. You give bruisers and assassins nice items and ADCs will ruin them for you. Ezreal is notorious for breaking other role/chamipons items.

KilanostFeb 24, 20171 votes

So what I see here is that we, despite arguing for 3 days straight, actually agree on this topic pretty much 100% LOL. fml.

But seriously, patheon a diver??? Look at playstyle and build and compare to diver class builds and AD assassin builds.

I would also currently throw Quinn into this category of mislabeled assassins and, to come full circle, i blame this entirely on lethality allowing quinn to destroy even bruisers in a single combo.

MrHaZeYoFeb 24, 20171 votes

Lol well my original argument was that Lethility was meant for Assassins, not that I didn't think ADCs should be able to use it.

I just wish there was a trade-off. You build Leth you can't buy Cleaver or LW. Then ADs would need to choose, do I wanna be strong early and mid but be inherently weaker late, or be weaker early/mid and really strong late.

NuparuFeb 21, 20174 votes

I'm going to note that within your first 2 paragraphs, you were already wrong.

Lethality was designed during the assassin rework for assassins.

KilanostFeb 21, 20171 votes

it was changed from flat pen for assassins kid. the lethality changes recently were for adcs just as much as assassins.

MissingKayoFeb 21, 20174 votes

Needing to use "kid" in a discussion, LMAO

And flat armorpen was meant for Assassins until ranged champions abused it and Riot refused to make it melee only because they're stupid

The Yetii RiderFeb 21, 20171 votes

There are not only melee assassins in this game. There are several ranged assassins as well. Additionally, making it melee only prevents Riot from potentially releasing a pure ranged assassin in the future. Why would they limit their design space like that?

Your idea would cripple assassins for the purpose of making marksmen have more delayed damage, when the whole reason marksmen are building lethality is because games are ending before they can make use of their delayed damage. So you cripple two classes and we have three items that are never bought because they are only good when they stack and can no longer stack.

That's not a solution. You are Olafing the problem and leaving it useless instead of fixing it.

MissingKayoFeb 21, 20172 votes

It doesn't matter if Riot releases a pure ranged assassin. Ranged should not be allowed to use flat pen. The current ranged hybrid assassins can all use crit well.

So what? They are abusing something they don't deserve. Nerf it and nerf them and then rebuff them as needed.

Suggest an actual solution then.

Arsenic SulfurFeb 21, 20173 votes

But Lethality was made to be stacked. This would severely hurt Duskblade's passive, hit the AD assassins harder, and allows lethality to not suck balls late game compared to the standard crit/AS.

AbsoluteSadmanFeb 21, 20173 votes

Yeah lets just put a massive power spike on one item instead of three seperate power spikes

PhDs NutsFeb 20, 20172 votes

35 ~~armor pen~~ lethality on your first item? Welcome to the League of Draven.

I look forward to the ADC threads after that change.

Edit: meant lethality

MissingKayoFeb 20, 20171 votes

No, it'd still be Lethality and thus be enemy-level-locked.

PhDs NutsFeb 20, 20172 votes

{quoted}

No, it'd still be Lethality and thus be enemy-level-locked.

Yeah I guess it could work early, but that's a lot of late game in one item.

Tbh I thought for a long time that item 3147 item 3814 already didn't stack because same unique 15(?) lethality passive

MissingKayoFeb 20, 20171 votes

The curve would probably have to be made exponential instead of linear though to keep the weaker game still weak enough to not be cancerous while not being garbage.

Shuyin178Feb 20, 20172 votes

I thought that too until I looked at it in game and was like, "Why are these allowed to stack....."

WimbledofyFeb 21, 20171 votes

cdr on every item is also a unique passive but it also stacks. the problem is you don't know what a unique passive is.

GuesstheName132Feb 21, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Yeah I guess it would be fine.

Tbh I thought for a long time that already didn't stack because same unique 15(?) lethality passive

They don't since they have the same unique passive. At least to my understanding of how the unique passive work, they do not.

Edit: Went on practice tool to check. They can actually stack, even though they are "unique" passives. If riot wants to make them "unique", then they shouldn't be able to stack. Or remove the "unique" part.

The Lost MarblesFeb 21, 20175 votes

[{quoted}](name=God King Midas,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=npkMq2tH,comment-id=0002000000000002,timestamp=2017-02-21T03:59:52.109+0000)

They don't since they have the same unique passive. At least to my understanding of how the unique passive work, they do not.

Edit: Went on practice tool to check. They can actually stack, even though they are "unique" passives. If riot wants to make them "unique", then they shouldn't be able to stack. Or remove the "unique" part.

"Unique Passive" means that the passive doesn't stack if you buy multiple of the same item.

Unique passives that have names (Rage, Spellblade, Crescent, Immolate...) are the ones that don't stack across different items.

VoidStaresBackFeb 21, 20171 votes

Except for spellblade which has some really weird interactions with itself, namely revolving around IBG.

ZephyrDrakeFeb 21, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=God King Midas,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=npkMq2tH,comment-id=0002000000000002,timestamp=2017-02-21T03:59:52.109+0000)

They don't since they have the same unique passive. At least to my understanding of how the unique passive work, they do not.

Edit: Went on practice tool to check. They can actually stack, even though they are "unique" passives. If riot wants to make them "unique", then they shouldn't be able to stack. Or remove the "unique" part.

you really need to learn what they mean by "unique". If the passive is not named then the only thing that "unique" label does is make it so that you cannot stack multiple of the same items to gain more of that item. It limits how much of a certain stat you can get through items since you cannot just stack the same items to keep getting that one stat. If the passive is named then even if you build another item with that same named passive it just won't do anything, you won't get any extra benefits from that other named passive that the other item has

LankPantsFeb 21, 20171 votes

You'd probably nerf it back to 40% or maybe even 30% to start with if you were going to do this just so the first item doesn't break the game. 40% of 30 is 12, 60% of 20 is also 12, so whether you chose 30% or 40% would just depend on if you wanted to nerf it from where it is now.

ShadowParkerFeb 21, 20172 votes

Why would an assassin ever game more then 1 lethality item if this was the case? Those items are designed for assassins. It's how riot is balancing the AD assassins in the game.

MissingKayoFeb 21, 20171 votes

Because Riot refuses to address ranged champions abusing those items that weren't meant for them, i.e; they will never be made melee-only as they should.

The Yetii RiderFeb 21, 20171 votes

We have several ranged AD champions that are classified as assassins in some respect. Quinn Twitch Vayne Jhin

MissingKayoFeb 21, 20171 votes

And every single one of them can use crit well. They don't need or deserve Lethality.

The Yetii RiderFeb 21, 20171 votes

But melee assassins do need and deserve it. And you would leave them with no items to build, which defeats the purpose of making Duskblade of Drakthar and Edge of Night in the first place.

MissingKayoFeb 21, 20171 votes

The whole point of this suggestion is because Riot is fucking stupid and will never make it melee-only.

The Yetii RiderFeb 21, 20171 votes

And this suggestion would basically make the creation of those items, which Riot did specifically to help melee assassins become relevant, moot. You are throwing Zed Khazix Rengar Shaco Talon into the trash just to deal with a few marksmen who you think shouldn't be able to deal that much damage so early.

MissingKayoFeb 21, 20171 votes

Okay so then what better suggestion do you have that Riot would legitimately consider because they're too fucking stupid to make it melee-only?

The Yetii RiderFeb 21, 20171 votes

The point of lethality is that it is a stat that assassins are supposed to specialize in. There's clearly reward for stacking lethality in the Duskblade passive. Lethality on assassins is like crit on ADCs, it scales with the more you have and is widely beneficial to them.

There's also no way in hell a single lethality item could provide enough armor pen to accomplish what Riot wanted assassins to do and still be balanced.

Lethality is just fine right now. People are crying for no reason.

MissingKayoFeb 21, 20171 votes

Yeah outside of every ranged AD caster abusing it but it's just fine right now and people are crying for no reason.

The Yetii RiderFeb 21, 20171 votes

They aren't 'abusing' it. Ranged marksmen are supposed to deal high amounts of physical damage from range. That's their contribution to the team. So what if they're doing it with penetration instead of crit?

originary91Feb 21, 20171 votes

One lethality item? Excuse me? Are you forgetting old warrior, old BC, old Maw and old armour pen runes? People seem to have forgotten that LW used to give 35% total armour pen too... I remember season 5... Id walk out of my jungle at 25 minutes with a 50 flat pen 41% armour pen Rengar... good times.

EoN is fucking stupid though. Even as an ex-assassin main I insist that that shit shouldn't last for more than 3 seconds.