@Riot, Notice that Riven has never had a META tank build

Mira Arya Enthe··69 votes·3,457 views

For all the bullshit people hate about Riven she has never had a META tank/bruiser build barring on release in S1 when no proper straight AD itemization existed for her. And she has always been reliant on actually scaling with items and gold to do her job, meaning she can be shut down. I think the reasons are obvious.

Shitty base damages for somebody dedicated to doing damage. This means she has to build damage to do damage.

Extremely high scalings make building AD required. Rewarded for building primary damage stat.

No true damage, %HP or built in pen. Meaning she must build pen in order to have pen, consuming another item slot on damaging items.

Only defensive steroid scales on AD. She is again rewarded with survivability by building AD discouraging building tank as the shield is worthless otherwise.

No natural sustain. So she cannot survive extended fights without AD for her shield and lifesteal.

Requires a lot of items. Unlike people specifically designed to reach their maximum potential with 1-2 items Riven scales smoothly higher the more items she buys but also requires constantly more damage items or she falls behind.

Only utility is brief melee range CC. No massive team heals, no massive AoE CCs. Just a melee range .75s stun and a fairly decent knockup. Unlike some Skirmishers/Assassins she doesn't have the team utilities to be good as an off tank.

Ignoring the things people dislike about Riven, these things seem like they would be healthy to carry over into other Skirmisher and Assassin designs. There are other design factors to consider as well, but these are the big ones I noticed. She must build AD to have sustain and shielding, she must build AD to do damage, she must build pen to deal with GA/Zonya/Tabi as well as tanks, she doesn't get %HP pen or true damage tacked onto her kit as 'free' extra damage she must build for damage, she has no team utilities, her CC is very mild and melee range, her defensive steroid scales with damage.

Riven has NEVER had a META tank build, there is a reason for that. She can actually be shut down and there is a reason for that as well.

126 Comments

Malicious Metal35 votes

Tl;DR:

Riot, don't give champions you intend to build purely offensive tools that let them get away with building durable as balls.

Mira Arya Enthe23 votes

Fuck Fiora and Fizz

Ahem. It would be nice if Fiora and Fizz could better be shut down and had to build damage builds. I am pretty sure even most Fizz and Rengar mains would prefer building damage builds.

reaperteaser4 votes

fioras able to get away with tank items?

what is this cheese? i must know!

50000000000000006 votes

Probably referring to the bruiser Fiora build that was nerfed repeatedly until it fell out of meta.

SH Azykan4 votes

item 3748 item 3071 item 3065 item 3143 item 3026 item 3047 ?

Cosmic Warper2 votes

[{quoted}](name=7th Syn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nK07rpiK,comment-id=0003000000000001,timestamp=2017-05-25T12:53:46.430+0000)

item 3748 item 3071 item 3065 item 3143 item 3026 item 3047 ?

Doesn't work anymore. That little bonus AD makes her passive damage tickle.

SH Azykan1 votes

She was able to do that build easily for a long time though. I know it got nerfed, but it was totally her best build for several patches

Cosmic Warper2 votes

[{quoted}](name=7th Syn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nK07rpiK,comment-id=000300000000000100000000,timestamp=2017-05-25T20:39:44.688+0000)

She was able to do that build easily for a long time though. I know it got nerfed, but it was totally her best build for several patches

True. When it was she was probably the most obnoxious champ in the game. Couldn't die and get CCd and ran you down no matter what

KONO RUBICK DA15 votes

Shaco

SpecterVonBaren16 votes

Ekko

HudnofskiBleh6 votes

As an Ekko main, I concur.

Blade of Justic26 votes

With all that said, I still don't like Riven.

Mira Arya Enthe21 votes

I don't like bananas, I hear they are still healthy.

https://i.giphy.com/KYNywoibU1PQ4.webp

Apocalypsic2 votes

Dude Raka is cancer!

Ok though real talk I like this post. I'm biased as a Riven main but to me she is the most balanced slayer class champion in this game.

Mira Arya Enthe12 votes

The most balanced Slayer in the game is Soraka.

DorkunedAuras3 votes

om nom, I like bananas. Just not the things throwing them around.

VoidStaresBack4 votes

But do you like bananas or mac and cheese more?

DorkunedAuras5 votes

I have no idea what you're even doing asking a question you obviously know the answer to.

SH Azykan2 votes

it is mac and cheese right? I mean clearly that is the obvious choice

DorkunedAuras3 votes

I love you. Will you marry me?

Enloct4 votes

I'll second you there. As a class that is defined as overloaded asscancer Riven is pretty tolerable. She was annoying back when stuff like Singed and Teemo were annoying. These days I'm glad to fight the Season 1-3 "annoying" champions.

KONO RUBICK DA18 votes

sorry but not true at least in high elo during COC meta riven went for full hp with titanic hydra cleaver and other HP items

of course this was COC issue not riven but i'm just stating a fact

Riven is probably the reason Xypherous wasn't fired yet. Clear niche clear(melee carry fitting with wombo combo teamcomp) counterplay clear strength

First melee carry to be viable while not being feast or famin due to utility+mobility+protection with the AD scaling shield

i love riven, i wish i had the skill to play her

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ece-7OjHAIA

Mira Arya Enthe9 votes

Not for Adrian, Boxbox, Viper, The Shy, Best Riven NA and others. I also never saw it in the statistics. I did see when CotC first came out she used it and sometimes built one more HP item besides Cleaver, or joke off meta builds that were full tank. But never have I seen statistics in any tier of play of her building pure tank as the meta build.

KONO RUBICK DA7 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mira Arya Enthe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nK07rpiK,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2017-05-25T02:08:56.712+0000)

But never have I seen statistics in any tier of play of her building pure tank as the meta build.

it wasn't pure tank it was like item 3071 item 3748 item 3053 then other AD item and while the best riven players may didn't use it, CotC riven had 65% win rate on release of CotC before nerfs and was played by a lot of riven mains i crossed in master with riven in their names

naturally like i say again i'm not trying to manipulate anyone, it was CotC being overtuned but this still made her going for a "tank build"

Mira Arya Enthe9 votes

Wait, who would build Sterakks on Riven... her base AD sucks.

Even that said, a mastery being overtuned resulting in her building slightly more HP than usual and that still not being the most common build, is not her ever having a tank build be meta.

Sun Wu Ryuumoku3 votes

Wait, who would build Sterakks on Riven... her base AD sucks.

https://euw.op.gg/summoner/userName=akirake%C3%AE 3 days ago.

https://euw.op.gg/summoner/userName=bl1ce 2 days ago

https://www.op.gg/summoner/userName=%EB%AA%BB%ED%95%98%EB%8A%94%EA%B1%B0%EC%9D%B8%EC%A0%95%ED%95%A8 25 days ago... i m not even sure if it was the new item 3053 (give 30% now)[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

KONO RUBICK DA2 votes

yeah i saw a lot of riven building sterak but i still didn't continue the argument because objectively riven base ad is low

DorkunedAuras7 votes

A tank build means building a most one damage item then full tank items. This Riven build you're talking about isn't even a tank build at all. It's just a bit tankier than what Mira's talking about. I don't even know why you bothered to chime in here except to essentially expel hot air into this thread just so we can feel vaguely annoyed by your presence.

kasfas4 votes

It's a tank build for riven anyway.

Sir Yamazuki2 votes

{quoted}

A tank build means building a most one damage item then full tank items. This Riven build you're talking about isn't even a tank build at all. It's just a bit tankier than what Mira's talking about. I don't even know why you bothered to chime in here except to essentially expel hot air into this thread just so we can feel vaguely annoyed by your presence.

He said she has never been built as a tank or a bruiser, she has been built as a bruiser multiple times in the past.

Paroe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Metal Malicious,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nK07rpiK,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-05-25T02:07:05.146+0000)

sorry but not true at least in high elo during COC meta riven went for full hp with titanic hydra cleaver and other HP items

of course this was COC issue not riven but i'm just stating a fact

Riven is probably the reason Xypherous wasn't fired yet. Clear niche clear(melee carry fitting with wombo combo teamcomp) counterplay clear strength

First melee carry to be viable while not being feast or famin due to utility+mobility+protection with the AD scaling shield

i love riven, i wish i had the skill to play her

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ece-7OjHAIA

Uhh Correct me if im wrong but fighters are MEANT to purchase health and AD. And a build consiting of item 3748 item 3071 item 3053 item 3111 item 3812 item 3026 is still in line with a fighter.

Those are NOT TANK ITEMS. Period. Theyre fighter items meant to be used by fighters and their sub classes.

KONO RUBICK DA4 votes

Riven is not a fighter

and i watched Some boxbox games and never saw him building items giving HP except black cleaver

Death dance is also not a fighter item

Papa Andrei3 votes

Curious, what would you classify Riven as? Just so you know, Divers and bruisers are subclasses of Fighters.

KONO RUBICK DA7 votes

she's a skirmisher

everything about her is a skirmisher, her mobility, her little hard cc, her damage she spikes into late game as her win rate with duration shows it

she has all the tools a melee carry needs, she has steroids and heavy damage as you can see in this riven video of skyyart she's just a melee carry like yasuo

except that riven brings heavy aoe damage, and yasuo brings anti-ranged champions tools

Mira Arya Enthe11 votes

This is 100% true. She is neither a Diver or Juggernaut who are fighters. She is a Skirmisher who alongside Assassins are Slayers.

Sire Hippington2 votes

and then people say Fizz uses tank builts when he rushes item 3153 +item 3078 ....

KoKoboto1 votes

i love riven, i wish i had the skill to play her

Just practice kek. I went through tons of losses as Riven but I got animation cancelling down. Same with Jayce, Jayce was even harder to pick up (high skill floor if you ask me) but I got it dowwwwn.

Idk you take rank seriously tho so maybe you care about losing

KONO RUBICK DA2 votes

{quoted}

Just practice kek. I went through tons of losses as Riven but I got animation cancelling down. Same with Jayce, Jayce was even harder to pick up (high skill floor if you ask me) but I got it dowwwwn.

i don't really have time to practice a champ like riven right now i have IRL things, later i want to climb in ranked on both my smurf and my main especially by playing ADC darius

{quoted}

Idk you take rank seriously tho so maybe you care about losing

yeah, i want to try to hit challenger this season on EUW it's not that far away from master tier 300 lp

once i get REALLY REALLY bored of the game i might start to train riven

Malicious Metal2 votes

Well, one more week buddy.

Sun Wu Ryuumoku2 votes

Skyyart was really strong at this time...

Azureee5 votes

Idk why people hate carry tops. Like the only one I hate to lane against is Darius and he isn't even a carry he is like a lane bully thing(?) I prefer laning vs Rumble, Camille, Fiora, Riven etc because u trade and u man the fuck up with each other capitalising on each others mistakes. Naut/tank tops are just so boring to lane against compared to the carry tops.

doodlebob6663 votes

Yeah but those traits all also make her impossible to balance between low and high elo, and make her snowballing potential(both for her and against her) pretty ridiculous unless the person playing her is a riven main in high diamond or master/challenger

Mira Arya Enthe18 votes

Riven has a 48.15% win rate in bronze scaling up to 52% in diamond where she is largely played by one tricks boosting her performance. Making her one of the most consistent champions across tiers in the games. Riven's potential and counterplay both scale with the skill of the players in the game, so a Bronze Riven has as much chance of beating a Bronze top laner as a Challenger Riven has beating a Challenger top laner.

Keira Helsh5 votes

{quoted}

Yeah but those traits all also make her impossible to balance between low and high elo, and make her snowballing potential(both for her and against her) pretty ridiculous unless the person playing her is a riven main in high diamond or master/challenger

Not true, it's the mechanics of her kit that cause the disparity, not the overall design of the champion.

Chromatic Eagle3 votes

If this is your attempt at promoting a slayers update, then go for it.

xJLx MCHammer2 votes

She can outrun a Hecarim

She has in her kit, mobility, cc, damage, range, steroid..etc

She really doesn't need any buff. Stop asking

DorkunedAuras15 votes

Nowhere is this post asking for buffs. It's mere statement of fact and ad**mira**tion of a well designed champ.

Mira Arya Enthe15 votes

She really doesn't need any buff. Stop asking

This post never mentioned this

Actually nobody except Rammus and ulted Quinn travels faster from spawn to mid tower than Hecarim without some teleport(TF) or intentional movespeed build. I tested this the other day. Riven only outruns Hec if she leaps over walls, even then it is still slower just skipping an obstacle.

She really doesn't need any buff. Stop asking

I actually suggested Riven nerfs two weeks ago.

Ah the old list their strengths with no context argument. Garen has mobility, CC, damage, range? steroid, manaless, execute. Sion has CC, 'mobility', damage, shield, slows, AoE knockup, harass, Range? self revive and AS steroid. OP?

She really doesn't need any buff. Stop asking

I can't get over this because nobody said this here... ever.

Colgate Gator1 votes

Didn't she enjoy the 6 Black cleaver meta?

Don't downplay your main, come on, let's not play that game.

Automated Riven3 votes

6 black cleavers isn't a tank build tho.

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