Extreme mobility with burst

You are right the entire assassin, mobile fighter, deceptive burst mage, agile ranged fighter genres should be ignored because ADCs want to be completely untouchable when they misposition.

I think this can be refined a little: I think extreme mobility that guarantees target access and front-loaded burst are bad to have together, because the combination carries no counterplay. I'm absolutely fine with an opponent initiating on me from two screens away, so long as they give me a proper chance to fight back, and I'm okay with getting one-shot if I had seen it coming beforehand, and could have done something to stop it. Having a champion jump you without warning, and then burst you down before you can react, is not interactive at all, and is what feels terrible to play against.

While counterplay doesn't entirely work like this, I think it's useful to think of it as a resource you basically have to allocate somewhere along a champion's combat timeline: it's absolutely fine for an initiation to have no counterplay, so long as their actual fighting pattern has extra amounts of it, and it's okay for a champion to have really reliable and strong damage if they give you additional means of interacting with them at other points in time, or other ways of beating them that most champions don't have. This is why I think the Assassin Update fundamentally failed, because it didn't really put that in action: sure, many of the reworked assassins have some more counterplay now, but it's not well-defined enough, and in many cases it's still lacking. There are still plenty of champions who can reach their target near-instantly and kill them just as fast when fed, with Rengar being a prime example. Had the developers taken a more decisive stance on assassin design and properly parceled out counterplay on assassins, he would have been reworked completely differently.

Another part of the assassin update that I think showed a misunderstanding of assassin counterplay is the generalization of Camouflage as a mechanic: the entire purpose of stealth is to be able to attack whenever, wherever and without warning. If your champion needs to announce themselves before they can attack, you might as well make them visible, and give them untargetability instead. Rengar especially is a champion whose ult is supposed to be all about letting him get to whichever target he wants from pretty much any distance, and take them by surprise. Giving stealth champions like him, Twitch or even Evelynn a reveal radius just waters down their fantasy, and doesn't particularly add the most interesting counterplay when more could be done to make their damage less reliable. Stealth champions as a whole should be given the most reliable target access in the game, but should pay for it with really unreliable, interactive abilities that force them to pay particular attention during fights, while allowing their victims to outplay them. Meanwhile, other assassins like Katarina should do perfectly fine with massive upfront burst, but should also highly telegraph their moving into position to get you, so that you can escape them if you play your cards right.

Until last year, i loved playing against it.

I dont mind as long as its not grouped up with durability, then I have problems. A fed kat can fuck and get bursted down. A fed WW/ Hecarim not so much.

It's annoying to play against but the playstyle has its place as long as there are weaknesses.

Cleverly disguised assassin salt thread

SHALL WE

I completely agree with you, there are two main problems with most assassins/divers: 1- They can punish other champions mistakes so much harder than other champions can punish their own. 2- If they get nerfed to avoid this, ADCs become unstoppable killing machines due to their excessive damage and lifesteal.

The champion designs suck, but they do partly because the damage creep forces them to.

Yasuo, Fizz...I agree.

The original

Agree, it's frustrating at times but most of the champions with high mobility and burst would be useless without it. Katarina without her Shunpo can't do anything and she'd be virtually useless as an assassin. The same goes for all assassins, most fighter's only have one mobility spell with a couple exceptions being Riven, Yasuo is a whole different story to talk about so don't lump him in with everything else. Basically without high mobility+burst champions, it would be near impossible to punish champions that can only be bad if caught out of position.

https://s23.postimg.org/4g7v742ez/lblanc.png

Thing about mobility is that it makes laning very safe as you can run away easy dieing less, and makes you able to run down enemies just too many +'s that it be crazy to not use a non mobile champ. I just lost a game where the whole enemy team used mobile champs except for 1, and it was not fun.

Agreed, dammit i hate it.

Who are you asking? ? ? ? ? ?

Only when the champ isn't an assassin.

Well there's some varying definitions of extreme. For some, Ahri's 3 fully controllable dashes and move speed every time her main spell is used is extreme. For some, Yasuo's enemy restricted spam dash that is only functional in lanes is extreme. For others, things like Zed/LB having safety nodes that stick for extended diving periods and having more than one of them is extreme. And in another mindset, Master Yi right clicking around running as fast as Rammus is extreme.

All of these abilities have entirely different windows of usability, yet they fall under the same definition and to gain access to their burst they all require combos. Personally I think its a problem when their burst is high enough to where an immobile champ that lands everything on them isn't able to outtrade them or at least give them a threat of dying.

Not my fault your adc wants to be 10 feet away from their team.

Disagree.